Rough stuff.

I first thought i should write something about thugs, but not SA thugs but other teams.

But then that won't be true, today's match was a highly physical affair between SA and Samoa, there was not a quarter asked or given.

As early as the 19th minute there was a little slap from Schwalger on Jannie du Plessis, who as you would expect started tapping back. stupidly because Samoa got a penalty for his retaliation. George stowers himself was no angel, tugging at jannie after the fact.

This was the start of niggles, trying to throw players of their game, and by the end of the first half Samoa were leading the niggle count 1-0.

The second half started with players flying into the rucks and mauls and some seriously hard tackles, but to the credit of both team not one shoulder charge or high tackle.

The type of match you expect from these two hard core teams.

In the last quarter of the match things got serious. Samoa starting to play clever rugby, their little Lemi managing a number of breaks and getting close, samoa getting desperate and throwing everything they had into the match.

Their flyhalf Pisi and Wfull back Williams kicking intelligently with the wind behind them crerating up and unders regularly trying to put the boks under pressure in their own half, while in the meantime the engine room was starting to boil over. Eventually it blew with Paul williams striking Brussow in the face with the heal of his hand and brussow goes down.

Now I don't agree it was a red card, I did appreciate the penalty though as we were under pressure on our 22.
Overall this is the type of match I really enjoy, at times I think Nigel Owens didn't have a clue as to what transpired on the field.
samoa got penalised at the tight phases, we were penalised on attack at ruck time and a number of times for technical ussues at the maul.

I am sad that Samoa is going home, they are my favourite team after the boks and they gave their all.

Tofa soifua,
Ia manuia

Yeah Owen's lost it.

I think his physical fitness lets him down.

As everyone knows, when you start to get fatigued, your concentration, comprehension and rational thought are the first things to suffer.

The guy is used to NH paddy field attrition rugby, and is not up to handling the more dynamic SH style.

Why are there no Pacific Island referees represented in the competition?

He seemd to decide before hand he will penalise SA at the rucks on attack and the samoans at the tight exchanges. He never wavered with his decisions.

I can never understand how a referee can only see one team going off their feet, but not the other.

The same thing happened against wales.

They don't release when they tackle, we get penalised
They go off their feet with the belly flop into the ruck, no penalties, we go down, penalty.

The same thing happened again today.

Is it the NH referees, surely we can't be at fault all the time.

This is where rugby has changed for the worse.

In the past, if a player was lying on the wrong side, they'd get a shoeing.
If the front row were cheating too much (boring in etc) then they'd be some handbags between the props and they'd sort it out themselves.
If a player hit an opponent, he'd probably get a few back.

That kind of retaliation kept most things in check.
Anything above and beyond was then dealt with by the ref.


I am not trying to condone violence on the pitch.
Everyone is fully aware of the difference between acceptable and non-acceptable retialiation.... or at least they were for many many years in the game.



I wouldn't have too much of a problem with it if the referees were able to deal with every transgression that occurred... but they can't / don't even when they see it.

On 69 minutes 48 seconds into the game there is a long wide forward pass by samoa, missed by touch judge and referee.

Owesn is in direct line of sight, in fact he is on the ten meter line from where the ball is passed, looking at the pass and ignores it.

I am sorry but he had a very poor game.

another one, we kick an up and under the ball comes down behind the samoan ten meter line, everyone misses the ball, and two players dive to ground to collect, more players pile in all of their feet, but we get penalised.

Once again poor decision.

The sme with samoa on attack at the end of the first half, he is in the way, they pass the ball into him, time is up, so half over.

Now I understand it is not a penalty and play cannot commence there after, but his positional play is poor as well.

Owen looks like he ate all the pies in his bid to look like Daffyd

seriously, hes well tubby for a ref

biltongbek wrote:Eventually it blew with Paul williams striking Brussow in the face with the heal of his hand and brussow goes down.

Nice article but why do SA fans keep missing the part where Brussow struck Williams multiply times on the back of the head/neck?

It was a nice game to watch, shame it had to boil over on a couple of occasions.

Biltong

Your guys probably are off their feet at most rucks, but then what team isn't?

I don't think it's something exclusive to NH refs, as I think a lot of them start with preconceptions of how each team plays and what offences they tend to commit. England get pinged a lot for offside in fringe defence and for obstruction at the maul, and I'm sure we are no worse than anyone else for these offences (remember Nick Easter's comment to Bryce Lawrence about 'that's how everyone does it' when penalised for obstruction in forming a maul from a lineout?)

I think Owens had the most difficult match so far to ref, there was so much going on all over the park and he did what was required, I did laugh at the way he speaks to players sometimes, he's exactly like a school teacher. There were 30 players on the park infringing when ever they could to get the upper hand, some Owens spotted, some he missed, this game was a mammoth battle and tempers were high - I come back to waht a tough game to ref and he did ok in the circumstances.

nathan wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Eventually it blew with Paul williams striking Brussow in the face with the heal of his hand and brussow goes down.

Nice article but why do SA fans keep missing the part where Brussow struck Williams multiply times on the back of the head/neck?

It was a nice game to watch, shame it had to boil over on a couple of occasions.

Exactly. He layed about 4 punches to the neck/head before the retaliation. Perhaps they both should have been sent off?

I agree that a lot was missed in this game.

As well as the case you mention Biltong, there were two occasions where an up and under bounced, then was touched by a player and caught from an off-side position. I saw one on the SA side and one on the Samoan side that were clear. If either one of those had been called, it could have changed the game.

I'm glad some momentum is forming for my long held position that the RWC will be decided by erratic refereeing. The gap between the tops teams isn't that great, and too often the outcome on the day is decided by inconsistency from the whistler. The argument that "teams should adjust to the referee" just doesn't hold water when the referee is going to ping sides for different offences, and change his mind about what is a penalty during the course of the game several times.

Thought the yellow to Smit was very harsh, I've been exactly the same thing not even penalised thoughout the year.

As the pressure builds, are the referees the first ones to fold?

You do have to give a certain amount of respect to Smit for managing to get penalised twice, yellow carded, and never touch the ball in play. A few years ago this would have qualified him for England without a grandparent.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:You do have to give a certain amount of respect to Smit for managing to get penalised twice, yellow carded, and never touch the ball in play. A few years ago this would have qualified him for England without a grandparent.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:You do have to give a certain amount of respect to Smit for managing to get penalised twice, yellow carded, and never touch the ball in play. A few years ago this would have qualified him for England without a grandparent.

few years ago, nah! It would still qualify him today!

Well then I am sure if it wasn't for his age he would do the 3 year residency for england, becuase he did toucht the ball once.

Have you forgotten about the deliberate knock down?

Brutal match, Samoa should be proud of today's effort.. I personally thought they didn't think they'd take SA so close.

Just a question though..... When Samoa were 1 metre from the try line, the video cleary shows JP Pietersen who was part of the ruck and off his feet, tap the scrumhalfs arm whichcaused him to knock it on.

Now surely that is illegal if its a ruck, he's off his feet and he's part of it?

They only way it would be legal were he to be behind the ruck?

The odd thing is that the ref was metres away only and it went to a video ref for the knock on.... yet Owens was fine with it.

If it is illegal then it should have been a yellow card.. perhaps even a penalty try (albeit slightly harsh)... yet given it was under the posts and Samoa were only 8 points behind with 15mins left it could have been a game changer.

Am I incorrect at the above, was his action legal?

Owen's is audibly heard to say he thought it was fine due to some reasoning that is not quite as audible. But clearly he saw it and was fine with it.

It did look dodgy to me.

TheGreyGhost wrote:Yeah Owen's lost it.

I think his physical fitness lets him down.

As everyone knows, when you start to get fatigued, your concentration, comprehension and rational thought are the first things to suffer.

The guy is used to NH paddy field attrition rugby, and is not up to handling the more dynamic SH style.

Why are there no Pacific Island referees represented in the competition?

I agree about Owens. He has certainly increased in size over the last couple of seasons, perhaps he's in a settled relationship

I'm also coming around to the fact that you may be on to something regarding referees deciding the outcome of the tournament. I was very unimpressed by Byrce Lawrence and Barnes, Watson, Clancy and now Owens have all had poor games so far. I'm a fan of Craig Joubert, can't he just referee every game once we get to the knockout stages

That's Owens physical fitness and poor refereeing potentially deciding the outcome of the tournament that I now agree with you on. Should I be concerned

Good B91212, good. Your transition is almost complete. The hate is strong in you. Give in to your anger...

B91212, be strong my friend, do not let the dark side take you.

Listen to your jedi master, the force is strong within him.

Next you will be hearing the greyghost is your father.


"B91212 I am you father"

and then he cuts off your arm with his lightsaver.

Weird, Nigel Ownes look rather buff on Scrum V a couple of weeks ago, there was an article on the Referee's training camp

It's the cameras that make them look cuddly in real life Tuilagi is just a shade over 10 stone.

biltongbek wrote:B91212, be strong my friend, do not let the dark side take you.

Listen to your jedi master, the force is strong within him.

Next you will be hearing the greyghost is your father.


"B91212 I am you father"

and then he cuts off your arm with his lightsaver.

I'm not sure how much longer I can fight it

TheGreyGhost wrote:Good B91212, good. Your transition is almost complete. The hate is strong in you. Give in to your anger...

Yes Master.....

B91212 wrote:

TheGreyGhost wrote:Good B91212, good. Your transition is almost complete. The hate is strong in you. Give in to your anger...

Yes Master.....

your training is not yet complete young jedi, the dark force will consume you