Suarez found guilty of Racism by FA

Gregers wrote:I have been the victim of heightism in the past, does that make my opinion more valid then Soldier?

liverbnz wrote:

dondelero wrote:

liverbnz wrote:

slyadams wrote:

fernando wrote:Liverpool statement
It is also our opinion that the accusation by this particular player was not credible - certainly no more credible than his prior unfounded accusations.

Frankly, an astonishing statement from Liverpool. The sort of thing I'd expect to see on a football message board, not coming out of a club. Who's running that place?

Why? It's stating a FACT. Evra has previous record of "unfounded and exagerrated" accustaions. Those are quotes from the FA following the investiagtion with the Chelsea groundsman. Liverpool's statement was probably carefully worded by a top set of lawyers, so I see no reason for anyone less knowledgable than them to question their professionalism.

Sorry for letting the FACTS get in the way of this bandwagon against Evra but you will find that it was others that made those claims.

With Evra's evidence being as I quoted.

Gregers wrote:I have been the victim of heightism in the past, does that make my opinion more valid then Soldier?

Gregers wrote:I have been the victim of heightism in the past, does that make my opinion more valid then Soldier?

Josiah Maiestas wrote:Funny thing is David Gill is one of the decision makers in this - Man U Chief Exec.

FA have no integrity imo.

dondelero wrote:

liverbnz wrote:

dondelero wrote:

liverbnz wrote:

slyadams wrote:

fernando wrote:Liverpool statement
It is also our opinion that the accusation by this particular player was not credible - certainly no more credible than his prior unfounded accusations.

Frankly, an astonishing statement from Liverpool. The sort of thing I'd expect to see on a football message board, not coming out of a club. Who's running that place?

Why? It's stating a FACT. Evra has previous record of "unfounded and exagerrated" accustaions. Those are quotes from the FA following the investiagtion with the Chelsea groundsman. Liverpool's statement was probably carefully worded by a top set of lawyers, so I see no reason for anyone less knowledgable than them to question their professionalism.

Sorry for letting the FACTS get in the way of this bandwagon against Evra but you will find that it was others that made those claims.

With Evra's evidence being as I quoted.

Well the statement you quote above is relating to the accusations that he did not personally make. So factually although he has been involved he did not make the accusastions hence he does not have a previous record. By the way it was not Evra who decided to give Suarez an 8 game ban.

invincibleILeak (CL-6WF) wrote:I am not excusing what Suarez has or hasn't done, but I would like to point out the difference between being racist and using race as an insult. The FA, Patrice Evra and everybody involved in the case has admitted that Luis Suarez is not a racist, so I think people labelling him one are missing the point of the case.

I'm gutted from a footballing perspective, and not convinced by the judgement if the only evidence is Evra's own, however the best thing Suarez and the club can do now is keep their heads down and just get on with it on the pitch.

liverbnz wrote:

dondelero wrote:

liverbnz wrote:

dondelero wrote:

liverbnz wrote:

slyadams wrote:

fernando wrote:Liverpool statement
It is also our opinion that the accusation by this particular player was not credible - certainly no more credible than his prior unfounded accusations.

Frankly, an astonishing statement from Liverpool. The sort of thing I'd expect to see on a football message board, not coming out of a club. Who's running that place?

Why? It's stating a FACT. Evra has previous record of "unfounded and exagerrated" accustaions. Those are quotes from the FA following the investiagtion with the Chelsea groundsman. Liverpool's statement was probably carefully worded by a top set of lawyers, so I see no reason for anyone less knowledgable than them to question their professionalism.

Sorry for letting the FACTS get in the way of this bandwagon against Evra but you will find that it was others that made those claims.

With Evra's evidence being as I quoted.

Well the statement you quote above is relating to the accusations that he did not personally make. So factually although he has been involved he did not make the accusastions hence he does not have a previous record. By the way it was not Evra who decided to give Suarez an 8 game ban.

I never said it was. Regardless of whether Evra made previous accusations or not, evidence he has given in the past has even been labelled 'ridiculous' by the panel and IF this case has been decided on Evra's word, then there is a likely litigation case on it's way for the FA. FSG do not take racism lightly, in fact they have a very strong stance against it in Boston. If they felt Suarez was guilty of racial abuse they would have been the first to sanction discipline on the Uraguayan.

As it is, we should wait to see the actual reasons for the verdict instead of believing what the press are printing.

invincibleILeak (CL-6WF) wrote:I think there is a huge difference between a racist and somebody who uses an insult using their race once in a heated environment and so too does the law. I do not think that it is acceptable at all, I just think labelling Suarez as a racist is not what the charge was.

dondelero wrote:

invincibleILeak (CL-6WF) wrote:I think there is a huge difference between a racist and somebody who uses an insult using their race once in a heated environment and so too does the law. I do not think that it is acceptable at all, I just think labelling Suarez as a racist is not what the charge was.

Fair enough but not sure if this subject can be dealt with so prescriptively. If one customarily insults another by referring to their race in a heated environment as you suggest, do you not agree that this is evidence of racism. Why else would a person need to use someone's race to insult them?

That said in Suarez's case it is probably a case of culture and upbringing as mentioned before, he was brought up to view certain people in certain ways. He probably just needs to be educated and learn to view other races more positively.

liverbnz wrote:Too many people on here don't have a clue what they are talking about. Stop phucking reading newspapers and believing whatever the hell suits your pathetic little agendas. Luis Suarez has not admitted, in the public realm at least, to using any specific word. Neither 'negrito' or 'negro', so can people please stop stating that as if they know it happened. Wait until the report comes out.

Secondly, Liverpool Football Club's statements since the verdict would have been carefully orchestrated by sports lawyers that are likely to be a the top of their industry. This is not some Mickey Mouse rebellion to show some fake solidarity. The club clearly believe that Luis Suarez is not guilty of the charges and verdict brought against him. In fact, by their stance it seems likely they will be taking this the whole way to the High Court if that's what it takes.

I've said it before, and I'll say it one more time as this is a very important factor in this case and anyone that knows the history of Boston may be able to attest. FSG would NOT be backing Luis Suarez if they felt he was in any way guilty. In fact, on speaking to some Boston Red Sox fans, they would have been the first to discipline him, and severely, with the possiblity that he may not have stepped foot inside Melwood ever again. Boston has a very shady history with race relations, and FSG have taken a very, very strong stance against it. These are people that have made billions of dollars from making smart business decisions, and supporting or at least being seen to support racism in any form would not rank high in any list of clever moves in the business world.

As for the players show of solidarity last night, the majority of the UK yesterday, that's 62 million people, were lining up to stick the knife into a 24 year old, and yet when a few dozen people want to support him, and express their beliefs in the matter, I find it absolutely stunning that people actually have the gall to criticise it. I mean, wtf sort of world do some of you live in? Would you not support your family, friends, team/work mates if you felt they were unjustly treated? And all the more if it felt like the whole world was out to crucify them?

I just have to laugh at those jumping on their high horses about this racial abuse charge, yet almost within the same quote claiming that Luis Suarez is a racist or Liverpool Football Club are supporting racism. Does anyone not see the irony in that? And I'd near bet my pension that the vast majority of people have laughed at a homophopic, sexist, racist or secterian joke and thought nothing of it.

Lastly, and most importantly, if it is found that Luis Suarez is guilty of racial abuse, and by guilty I mean beyond reasonable doubt, then fair enough, he fully deserves the sanction and probably a little more. But as yet, the facts are not clear.

WHEN the Luis Suarez race row took two months to reach a conclusion, the last thing I expected as the verdict came was another can of worms to burst open.
But ever since the Liverpool striker was handed an eight-game ban for racially abusing Patrice Evra, that's exactly what has happened.

What a mess it has become. Yet what an avoidable one it could have been had things been handled differently.

If Suarez is bang to rights then, yes, of course he should face a lengthy ban. Yet the way the Independent Disciplinary Commission — and subsequent FA statement — went about things has in many ways muddied the waters even more.

All we know so far is that Evra accused the Liverpool forward of racial abuse and the verdict has been reached on the back of that.

Clearly you would imagine there must be more to it than that — so why now does everyone have to wait until the written judgment is delivered for a full explanation? In my book, any grey areas could have been so easily avoided.

Any Merseyside calls of a witch-hunt would have been nipped in the bud. Instead, given the lack of public evidence regarding the exact details of the case, there is still a huge sense of mystery.

Surely it would have made more sense for the written proof, which everyone is waiting for, to have been published on the day of the verdict.

Whether people agreed with their findings would have been irrelevant.

The fact is that no one could argue over the clarity of the decision because the ins and outs would have been there for all to see.

The FA have admitted the written judgment, when it's delivered to Liverpool, will be made available in the public domain.

At that point, of course, we will discover their reasons for the eight-game ban. But we could have known that NOW if they had gone about things differently.

Now all we've got is another bout of name calling from Liverpool to the FA and it's not doing anybody any favours. As I said, if Suarez is guilty as charged, then some could say he is lucky to have escaped with the suspension he has.

But, at the moment, I have to say I think the punishment — on all public evidence — is ridiculously harsh because it was based only on what Patrice said he was called.

Look, I am all for racial abuse carrying the strongest possible punishment but, come on man, let's see that evidence.

All Tuesday's decision has done is give fuel to the sceptics who reckon the race card has been played here — and it's so stupid, so easily avoided.

Let's get one thing straight immediately. I am not calling Evra a liar, far from it, because something obviously went on.

But as it is, this could be said to have opened the way for any black player who might have an axe to grind to accuse others in a similar way — and that sets a very dangerous precedent indeed.

It has paved the way for any player to accuse another of anything.



I'm not for one second saying Patrice didn't have a legitimate case. I'm just worried about what less trustworthy players might get up to.

And I'm not going to stand here and say — on what we know so far — what should or shouldn't happen.

But if they have proof, then let's see it and let's see it now.

If there was TV evidence then tell us. Let us know how they reached that verdict at the same time they delivered it. We haven't seen any film of the incident. Perhaps that suggests there isn't any.

If Suarez is as guilty as the commission found then fine — he deserves his punishment.

But, for heaven's sake, let's see the proof because until that's out there, the rows will only get worse.

And the sad thing is they could have all been avoided in the first place.

Macclads (formerly Hero) wrote:Here's where I stand on the issue as a Man Utd fan but not one that has blinkers.

Luis Suarez is not a racist, he made 'allegedly' a comment at Evra that whilst concerened a normal term in his home country was deemed to be considered racially offensive in this one.
Now I understand the whole 'well if someone from Germany came to the UK and drove down the motorway at 200mph he'd not a have a leg to stand on in the courts', but there has to be an amount of understanding that the reported word in question that he was meant to have used is NOT considered in any shape or form racially motivated in Uruguay. He may have used it in a derogative or aggressive manner but that does not make him a racist, he just used a term that is considered racist in this country.

liverbnz wrote:It's up the page a little cf

VivaPaulScholes wrote:If Evra did insult Suarez he should also be banned but why is it that Liverpool are only bringing this up NOW. Where was it when your own Gerrard, Bellamy, Diouf, Finnan have used foul language at players and referees? Just to suit you lot.

VivaPaulScholes wrote:If Evra did insult Suarez he should also be banned but why is it that Liverpool are only bringing this up NOW. Where was it when your own Gerrard, Bellamy, Diouf, Finnan have used foul language at players and referees? Just to suit you lot.

Ent wrote:Suarez has admitted using the term - this is nailed on. They have shown in the past, which many have dragged up with delight and ignorance, that when it's a case of one persons word against another they do not jump to conclusions.

After 2 months of prep, an independent panel (including a prominent qc), took 6 days and found him guilty.

Liverpool have now dropped one part of their ridiculous statement (they no longer wish for evra to be punished). I expect them now to apologise to evra over their libellous statement. I'd also like their rationale for appealing, it's a lenient punishment and the fa have been thorough.

VivaPaulScholes wrote:Would you say Gerrard deserves a fine/ban after the insult he used at Luis Nani last season or other players? Or is it because it's a United player and the rules are diffrent. It really is sickening to see Liverpool and United fans who claim to be against the racism but it looks like each wants to get one over the other.

No one he here knows what eveidence or what exactly went on when they charged Suarez so stop acting like bloody lawyers. Fact is Suarez is charged and going by the law he is a racist. Full stop. but if he appeals and wins then Evra is the racist liar.

compelling and rich wrote:. The same evidence that the fa have looked at and charged suarez with. Go on about liverpools lawyers all you want but you trying to tell me the fa havent had there lawyers look at it first before they charged him. Not the biggest fan of the fa but even i dont believe there that stupid.

This just smacks of despration by lfc. Putting football before morals because they know without suarez there season is pretty much finished

VivaPaulScholes wrote:I don't know unlike you I was not invited as a special guest to the hearing so I wouldn't know if it was Evras word or they had furthur evidnece. So I won't come up with Love sacks like I know when I don't. But what I do know is that Suarez has been fined and is branded a racist not by me but others. If the case was dropped because it was Evras word against Suarez would you Liverpool fans still be saying what you are now or would you change it to your suiting?

VivaPaulScholes wrote:But currently Suarez is the racist and will be known as Racist Thug Suarez because he has been charged, fined and ban.

liverbnz wrote:

Ent wrote:Suarez has admitted using the term - this is nailed on. They have shown in the past, which many have dragged up with delight and ignorance, that when it's a case of one persons word against another they do not jump to conclusions.

After 2 months of prep, an independent panel (including a prominent qc), took 6 days and found him guilty.

Liverpool have now dropped one part of their ridiculous statement (they no longer wish for evra to be punished). I expect them now to apologise to evra over their libellous statement. I'd also like their rationale for appealing, it's a lenient punishment and the fa have been thorough.

You do not know what Suarez has said. Nobody on this forum does.

Every tribunal in history has got the correct decision the first time around hasn't it?

Liverpool Football Club have not dropped any part of their original statement and how the hell is it libel when Evra is the one who admitted calling Suarez something himself in his bloody statement?!?

You are talking sh!te I'm afraid.