Saul Alvarez

How good is this kid? Ignore the fact that he has won an underserved world title. Is e destined to be the next big thing or the next big hype? Imo I dont rate him that highly. I dont think he will ever be an ATG despite his age. I'd like to see him against Cotto.

I think its a bit premature to say whether he will or will not be an atg, the guy's only 20. He's a decent puncher, throws good combinations and has a fairly exciting style, but he's not the hardest to hit and someone less of a pillow puncher than matt hatton (kirkland for example) could've put him in serious trouble the other night. He was almost ko'd by jose miguel cotto, who is no great shakes. He's got a lot to learn about defending himself. The problem is he's a hot prospect with marquee value who has been gifted a world title which he'll now have to defend, so the time for learing is fast running out. GBP will probably match him very carefully, they will know he's not ready for some like cotto yet. A fight with kirkland would be interesting, but i'd back a big puncher to beat alvarez has he's too easy to hit. Good prospect but with plenty still to learn.

azania wrote:How good is this kid? Ignore the fact that he has won an underserved world title. Is e destined to be the next big thing or the next big hype? Imo I dont rate him that highly. I dont think he will ever be an ATG despite his age. I'd like to see him against Cotto.

Has all the moves Azania, looks a formidable talent at 20. Worry is you seen how Matthew could hit him every time he put punches together, put him in with a Cotto or a Margarito at this stage and I think it would be suicide.

He has great moves, but the lack of head movement and stationary target makes me feel he'll come a cropper not before too long.

Cheers

Rodders

Not to hark back to an earlier converation, but I wouldn't say Alvarez's title is undeserved. He was worthy of the shot at least.

While a bit of bother in some of his previous fights, he has never looked uncomfortable. Certainly, has a cool head, picks up the rounds and stops the majority of them. Stylistically, Alvarez stays just on the outside and looks to pick his opponents of with heavy jabs, while softening them up with strong body shots. He basically used the same strategy as Froch vs Abraham in all of his fights. Wouldn't say he utilises a classy style as of yet.

He may struggle with quick, busy fighters. But, Alvarez is only 20 and still has some development years ahead. Not sure how far he will go, but should be a name in the division for a while at least. The flip side of Alvarez receiving the apparent benefits of being a De La Hoya protege, is that how often do they get it wrong?

I agree that the jury is still out on him, but your line of 'I don't think he will ever be an ATG despite his age' is a little harsh and not really appropriate. We shouldn't simply take for granted that any young fighter will become an all-time great, regardless of how much hype is behind them. Even if he doesn't achieve true 'greatness' it doesn't mean he can't still have an excellent career and repay the faith that Golden Boy have, thus far, placed in him.

I honestly think that his failure to stop Hatton, and the so-called significance of this, has been blown well out of proportion. He's not going to look utterly spectacular in every fight, and these sort of gritty bouts against game opposition will be a big part of his learning curve. He got a near shut out, tried his best to put on a show and, as long as his head is screwed on properly, will take a fair amount away from the fight.

Yes, he does have his weaknesses. He's a little too keen to close the show at times and starts to look a bit clumsy and wreckless, and so far hasn't really shown that he is willing to fight three minutes of every round. But he can punch with the best of them, seems to be pretty fearless and has shown me that he can take a punch when he needs to, although obviously this is something that he'll need to address.

It's tough to judge him at only twenty, but I personally think that he does have the potential to be something very special. We can all be guilty of it, but I think we do have a tendancy to run down young talent and dismiss them as a 'hype job' a little too readily. I think Alvarez has all the tools to be a top fighter for years to come. Maybe I'll be proved wrong, but as it stands he's doing everything right and has demonstrated great potential.

He needs to stop wearing sparring gloves to a fight.

The flip side of Alvarez receiving the apparent benefits of being a De La Hoya protege, is that how often do they get it wrong?

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Got it massively wrong with Charles Huerta, was another one tipped for big things and was wiped out inside a round (from memory) by some journeyman and lost again to another randomer recently...

Didn't have the hype Canelo does though, seriously think he's gonna get sparked sooner rather than later and don't rate him all that much to be honest

Rodney wrote:

azania wrote:How good is this kid? Ignore the fact that he has won an underserved world title. Is e destined to be the next big thing or the next big hype? Imo I dont rate him that highly. I dont think he will ever be an ATG despite his age. I'd like to see him against Cotto.

Has all the moves Azania, looks a formidable talent at 20. Worry is you seen how Matthew could hit him every time he put punches together, put him in with a Cotto or a Margarito at this stage and I think it would be suicide.

He has great moves, but the lack of head movement and stationary target makes me feel he'll come a cropper not before too long.

Cheers

Rodders

He's a world champion so the learning curve is over. He has to fight the best available. I'd like puerto to see rice vs mexico fight.

azania wrote:I'd like puerto to see rice vs mexico fight.

You'd like to see a Puerto Rico vs Mexico fight?

He's a world champion so the learning curve is over. He has to fight the best available. I'd like puerto to see rice vs mexico fight.[/quote]

Its a fair point I guess Azania, would be an intruiging battle but one a little too early, think Golden Boy trying to chase the dollars before the nurturing, Cotto too advanced for him at this stage IMO.

Cheers

Rodders

Rodney wrote:He's a world champion so the learning curve is over. He has to fight the best available. I'd like puerto to see rice vs mexico fight.

Its a fair point I guess Azania, would be an intruiging battle but one a little too early, think Golden Boy trying to chase the dollars before the nurturing, Cotto too advanced for him at this stage IMO.

Cheers

Rodders[/quote]

I hear what you're saying. But the nurturing should end as soon as he fights for a title.

I have only seen three of his fights so I am going off those and to be honest I couldnt read too much into them. I think its next to impossible to say after a couple of performances whether someone will be an all time great or not.

He obviously has potential and is very developed for a 20 year old. Whether hes quite good enough now to beat a Cotto or Margarito is an open question.

Ive seen his fights with Hatton, Ndou and JM Cotto and he has bossed the fights relatively comfortably and while hes guilty of being tagged a bit too often I think it comes from him realising early on that his opponents cant hurt him too much and he can afford to take one to give one.

Other than brief flurries, he looked to be in second gear against a Hatton who was looking to just hear out the final bell to benefit his career. It makes it hard to judge when you have an opponent like Hatton that is just so outgunned.

He looks well built even for the LMW division so my guess is he would be hard to stop for a guy like Cotto and he probably has the class to avoid a war with Margarito so I think he would be capable of giving them a good argument even if he may not yet be ready to beat them outright yet.

I think in 4-5 years time Alvarez will be finished as a major force. Not just because of his style, but he is being rushed. He is not ready fpr the best yet and when he does fight the best he will be exposed.

GBP are milking him now and will discard him after a couple of losses.

i highly rate him. he wasn't spectacular, but he is 20, i dont know many 20 year olds who look as complete as he does. The hatton fight wasn't a wipeout, but matt is solid and you could see how seriously he took the competition due to his conditioning.

Canelo hits hard with both hands, has a cool head, very physically strong and is mature. ATM, he probably wont be able to beat top fighters. In a year, i would pick him to beat both cotto and marg. Cotto is one of my favorite boxers, but i think alvarez can walk through his best shots and wear him down to the body. Margarito is too slow for alvarez, who has quick hands and good combos.

Wold like to see his development as his style makes for fun fights and has a frame to be a multi-weight champion. A middleweight clash between him and lemieux in the future could be the big fight of their era.

I think Alvarez is better than people are making out here, yes he wasn't deserving of a world title shot but that isn't the point here. He has talent that's for sure and he's still got a lot to learn so it's unfair to judge him as a 20 year old. Wait til he steps up and we can make a better judgement call on him.

imperialghosty wrote:I think Alvarez is better than people are making out here, yes he wasn't deserving of a world title shot but that isn't the point here. He has talent that's for sure and he's still got a lot to learn so it's unfair to judge him as a 20 year old. Wait til he steps up and we can make a better judgement call on him.

I'm judging him as a world champ. Imo his fundermentals are flawed. Too easy to hit, not enough power. Yes he has fast hands and can be exciting. But if as the commentators say he wants to fight likea typical mexican, I can see him having a short career unless he works on his fundermentals ie not being so easy to hit. But for a 20 yr old, he is something else. But you have to judge him now as a world champ. Probably too much too soon.