Heino team of round 6

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:08 pm

Have your say on planetrugby.com's Heineken Cup team of the week:

"Team of Round 6

15 Jonny May (Gloucester) - Arguably a hard call on Leinster full-back Rob Kearney and Cardiff Blues equivalent Leigh Halfpenny, with the duo contributing greatly to their side's victories over the weekend. But for his two-try effort that stunned Toulouse, May is our man.

14 Takudzwa Ngwenya (Biarritz) - Charlie Sharples impressed again at a good time for him personally with the Six Nations fast approaching. Meanwhile, Sitiveni Sivivatu was back to his best as he glided past defenders. However, how can we ignore a hat-trick from the Eagle himself? Ngwenya was electric as Biarritz found their Heineken Cup form - at last.

13 Matt Scott (Edinburgh) - Aurélien Rougerie cut Ulster to pieces in combination with right wing Sivivatu early on at Stade Marcel Michelen while Keith Earls was also good in patches for Munster. But we go for Scott, who was shifted out one spot before kick-off and went on to have one of his better games, almost scoring from the impressive Greig Laidlaw's fine chip.

12 Fabrice Estebanez (Racing-Metro) - Man-of-the-match in their loss in Cardiff, Estebanez sent a message to France head coach Philippe Saint-André that he should not be forgotten. Maxime Mermoz, Aurélien Rougerie, Yann David and Wesley Fofana must stay on their toes.

11 Simon Zebo (Munster) - Aforementioned centre Scott starred alongside soon-to-be Scotland international Tim Visser at Murrayfield, who is going to be key for Edinburgh when they face Toulouse in April. But three scintillating tries meant it was always going to be Zebo.

10 Ronan O'Gara (Munster) - From one new Munster star to their oldest. At 34, O'Gara yet again rolled back the years as he kicked and directed Munster to the knockouts as top seeds. It was high fives all round when ROG was withdrawn late on as his love for the Heineken Cup continues to go both ways. A mention for Connacht fly-half Niall O'Connor.

9 Dimitri Yachvili (Biarritz) - They truly are a different team when he is on the field aren't they? Yachvili was at his mercurial best, directing traffic and kicking for fun as they made the Amlin Challenge Cup quarter-finals. Morgan Parra and Lloyd Williams deserve mentions.

8 Robert Barbieri (Treviso) - The toughest of our weekend calls came at eight as Netani Talei, Ben Skirving and Chris Masoe all put in man-of-the-match performances for their sides. Add to that James Coughlin's effort and we had a nice headache that was soon eased by Barbieri's showing against Sarries. A top shift against the English champions.

7 Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse) - Let us get the mentions out of the way first. Solid efforts from Peter O'Mahony, Gerhard Vosloo and as per usual, Sam Warburton, kept our selection cogs turning. But for being the best of a surprisingly bad bunch, Dusautoir sneaks in.

6 John Muldoon (Connacht) -Tom Croft was man-of-the-match for Leicester against Aironi and, despite the opposition, sent out a message to Stuart Lancaster that he should not be overlooked for their Six Nations opener. Yet there was a certain blindside flanker at the Sportsground who stood head and shoulders above the rest on Friday as Connacht brought to an end their dismal run of fourteen successive defeats. Take a bow John Muldoon.

5 Mouritz Botha (Saracens) - A try from the EPS member comes at just the right time as he begins his training battle with Tom Palmer, Courtney Lawes, Dave Attwood and the currently injured Louis Deacon. On form, Stuart Lancaster would be hard pressed to ignore this lock.

4 Paul O'Connell (Munster) - The stand-in Ireland captain can be delighted with his recent form as he carried superbly for the Munster cause. It just remains to be seen who will be partnering him in green as Donnacha Ryan and Donncha O'Callaghan continue to battle.

3 John Afoa (Ulster) - The majority wouldn't have expected to an Osprey in the mix this week following their 36-5 loss to Biarritz, yet Adam Jones came extremely close after a strong performance. However, Afoa continued his good form in an Ulster jersey around the park and was unlucky to be on a losing side. Brian Mujati also deserves a big tip of the cap.

2 Ti'i Paulo (Clermont) - We were scratching our heads wondering why he was not starting for les Jaunards against the powerful scrummaging outfit that is Ulster. But on 52 minutes he got onto the field and duly crossed for what turned out being the deciding seven-pointer.

1 Soane Tonga'uiha (Northampton) - It was a toss-up between the impact Vincent Debaty of Clermont made from the bench when he came on and the frightening impact Tonga'uiha made at scrum time. The Tongan conjured up two penalty tries for Northampton. Immense."

by **LondonTiger** Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:01 pm

I agree with Muldoon in there - he was magnificent and has been every time I see Connacht in HEC or Amlin. He is what 4th choice to play 6 for Ireland, yet mad Quins backrow look like little children.

by UlstermaninGlasgow Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:52 pm

LondonTiger wrote:I agree with Muldoon in there - he was magnificent and has been every time I see Connacht in HEC or Amlin. He is what 4th choice to play 6 for Ireland, yet mad Quins backrow look like little children.

Just shows the depth we have in the back row! Ferris, O'Brien, Muldoon, McLaughlin, Ruddock, Henry, O'Mahoney, Ryan, McCarthy, Heaslip, Coughlan, Jennings with the injured Wallace and Leamy... It's a hard life being an Irish back rower!

by funnyExiledScot Tue Jan 24, 2012 5:00 pm

I really wouldn't have included Scott ahead of Rougerie. Scott was very tidy, but certainly not the pick of the Edinburgh players. The reference to the chip from Laidlaw is odd as well - wasn't that the chip that was easily covered? Wasn't really a try scoring opportunity.

Talei should be in the side. No question. Laidlaw deserves a mention, as does Geoff Cross and Ross Ford, although I've no issues with the actual selections in those positions. ROG was awesome.

by 21st Century Schizoid Man Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:23 pm

Planet Rugby are a bunch of jubblies - they are watching a different game to the rest of us. Ross Ford at hooker surely ? mad

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:48 pm

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Planet Rugby are a bunch of jubblies - they are watching a different game to the rest of us. Ross Ford at hooker surely ?

You would think so C21st, but then again Fordy wasn't playing in a game that involved Ulster Wink

by Imperialbigdave Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:58 pm

They must be glasgow fans if theyre not even mentioning ford. Saw one of them on their forum claim that hes not even the best hooker at edinburgh, and that Pat Macarthur is better. laughing

by Guest Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:00 pm

I'd have been tempted to try and fit either if Shingler or Gilbert in there for the Scarlets, both had absolute stormers, but it seems like a lot of backrow players did for this round!

by Golden Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:45 pm

Ofisa made 20 tackles and missed none. Just saying.......

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:45 pm

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Planet Rugby are a bunch of jubblies - they are watching a different game to the rest of us. Ross Ford at hooker surely ?

More just not watching all the games. Think I'm going to do an article; team of the Heineken Cup so far. Should generate some debate.

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:46 pm

...or am I?

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:47 pm

Connacht?

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:48 pm

Notch wrote:...or am I?

Go for it, it will give us all a nice fix in Heino pool cold turkey phase

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:52 pm

Yeah, but now I have to come up with 15 names... and they can't all be Ulster players. Headscratch

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:56 pm

It works for planetrugby, Notch? Wink

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:57 pm

6 pools, one from each of the top two teams, plus three misc extras?

by Rava Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:58 pm

Notch wrote:Yeah, but now I have to come up with 15 names... and they can't all be Ulster players.

Just slip Niall O'Connor and Roger Wilson in Notch. No one will notice Very Happy

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:59 pm

Hehe. Ah come on! There's only one Ulster player there, and to get the better of the Clermont scrum in Clermont after a few early penalties and contribute in the loose in a big way too is pretty good. Actually Afoa would probably be the one Ulsterman definitely in the XV of the tournament for me.

I know we had four the week before though, that was nice.

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:00 pm

No room for Bowe, or is he a Leinster-man now? Wink

by Rava Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:01 pm

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote: No room for Bowe, or is he a Leinster-man now?

He was shoite Asbo.

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:03 pm

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:6 pools, one from each of the top two teams, plus three misc extras?

I'll try and use that as a guideline then. Already two from Munster though.

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:03 pm

that's why he'll be headed to D4 then? Wink

by red_stag Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:07 pm

I would say that Donnacha Ryan and Roman OGara are good shouts for being in team of tournament so far

by **rodders** Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:20 pm

Paddy Wallace at 12. Best player on the pitch in the Clermont game.

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:29 pm

Couldn't be bothered making a new thread. rodders, I agree Wallace had a great game and was better than his opposite number Fofana but I've backed the latter for his form over the entire tournament.

Unglamorous workhorse Chris Henry is, I feel, worth a mention though.

1. So'oane Tonga'uiha (Northampton)
2. Ross Ford (Edinburgh)
3. John Afoa (Ulster)
4. Donnacha Ryan (Munster)
5. Mouritz Botha (Saracens)
6. Thierry Dusatoir (Toulouse)
7. Chris Henry (Ulster)
8. Jamie Heaslip (Leinster)
9. Dmitri Yachvilli (Biarritz)
10. Ronan O'Gara (Munster)
11. Tim Visser (Edinburgh)
12. Wesley Fofana (ASM Clermont Auvergne)
13. Florian Fritz (Toulouse)
14. Julien Malzieu (ASM Clermont Auvergne)
15. Jonny May (Gloucester)

by red_stag Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:47 pm

I would have gone for Mike Brown over Jonny May. For me its tough to leave out Toulouses Timoci Matanavou who has racked up 7 tries in 5 matches. Thats not bad going at all. 2 against Quins, 2 against Gloucester, 2 against Connacht and then a try against Gloucester in the return match.

by **Notch** Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:55 pm

Yep. I put May, then I put Brown, then I swapped them again, then I finally settled on May.

by Standulstermen Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:53 pm

Ferris at 6 for me. That may make e back row ulstercentric though. I do think he has been the best 6 though

by TJ1 Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:40 am

Laidlaw? Great display in the last game :-)

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:26 am

Heino Power rankings: HC rankings - agree or disagree?

by funnyExiledScot Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:35 am

Not sure why Castres and Montpellier deserve to leapfrog Glasgow. Glasgow beat Montpellier in Glasgow, drew with them away and finished above them in the pool.

by beshocked Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:48 am

Personally I would switch Toulouse and Clermont. Toulouse are lucky to still be in the HC because Quins messed up badly in their last match.

by Chunky Norwich Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:47 am

Not even a mention for Aaron Shingler.

Pfffft

by whocares Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:02 pm

red_stag wrote:I would have gone for Mike Brown over Jonny May. For me its tough to leave out Toulouses Timoci Matanavou who has racked up 7 tries in 5 matches. Thats not bad going at all. 2 against Quins, 2 against Gloucester, 2 against Connacht and then a try against Gloucester in the return match.

Matavanou although being a great finisher has still a lot to learn particularly in defense and under high ball. He might have scored 2 tries (and set up one) last friday, he costed toulouse at least 2 tries. Am glad to see Estebanez mentionned, probably his best performance for over a year and starting to look like international material.

by Rava Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:10 pm

Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest

by asoreleftshoulder Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:47 pm

Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest

This is probably fairly close at the top but the further you go down the list the harder it is to judge.Still it's got a set of criteria and is updated regularly so I'll go with that.

It's nice to see 3 Irish sides in the top 10 although putting the Northern Ireland flag is beside Ulster is a bit strange as Norethern Ireland is in Ulster but also encompasses part of the R.O.I. it's a bit although not exactly like putting the Welsh flag beside a British entrant in the Olympics.(can't blame them entirely it's a tough one to figure out)

by Guest Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:55 pm

Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest

This I like. Can't remember the last time the Scarlets were in the top 10 Very Happy

by UlstermaninGlasgow Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:03 pm

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest

This is probably fairly close at the top but the further you go down the list the harder it is to judge.Still it's got a set of criteria and is updated regularly so I'll go with that.

It's nice to see 3 Irish sides in the top 10 although putting the Northern Ireland flag is beside Ulster is a bit strange as Norethern Ireland is in Ulster but also encompasses part of the R.O.I. it's a bit although not exactly like putting the Welsh flag beside a British entrant in the Olympics.(can't blame them entirely it's a tough one to figure out)

It's actually the provincial flag of Ulster which I'd say is pretty correct! Not a bad touch really!

by asoreleftshoulder Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:07 pm

UlstermaninGlasgow wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest

This is probably fairly close at the top but the further you go down the list the harder it is to judge.Still it's got a set of criteria and is updated regularly so I'll go with that.

It's nice to see 3 Irish sides in the top 10 although putting the Northern Ireland flag is beside Ulster is a bit strange as Norethern Ireland is in Ulster but also encompasses part of the R.O.I. it's a bit although not exactly like putting the Welsh flag beside a British entrant in the Olympics.(can't blame them entirely it's a tough one to figure out)
It's actually the provincial flag of Ulster which I'd say is pretty correct! Not a bad touch really!

Huh I stand corrected Doh

I didn't even consider that option just jumped on my high horse and said giddy up.

by **George Carlin** Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:05 am

Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest

Rava - what's this based on? Historic consolidated European performances or just this season?

Couldn't believe my one eye when I saw Blues above Edinburgh and Pelly above Glasgow when each side finished ahead of its comparator in the pool. Headscratch

by Mickado Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:07 am

George Carlin wrote:
Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest
Rava - what's this based on? Historic consolidated European performances or just this season?

Couldn't believe my one eye when I saw Blues above Edinburgh and Pelly above Glasgow when each side finished ahead of its comparator in the pool.

All of the calculation details are listed on the website but I believe it’s based on the last 30 games in all competitions.

by beshocked Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:31 am

George Carlin wrote:
Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest
Rava - what's this based on? Historic consolidated European performances or just this season?

Couldn't believe my one eye when I saw Blues above Edinburgh and Pelly above Glasgow when each side finished ahead of its comparator in the pool.

Cardiff are above Edinburgh in the Rabo having won more games. Also they won as many games in the HC so should have a higher ranking. Cannot explain why Montpellier are that high though.

by Rava Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:31 am

Correct Mickado.

George, If you go to Main Menu and click on Behind the Rankings it explains everything there.

by Mickado Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:40 am

beshocked wrote:
George Carlin wrote:
Rava wrote:Another ranking table that I keep tabs on. It is updated every week. I'm sure there will be some who agree with this and some who won't.

http://www.eurorugby.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=Rugger&file=latest
Rava - what's this based on? Historic consolidated European performances or just this season?

Couldn't believe my one eye when I saw Blues above Edinburgh and Pelly above Glasgow when each side finished ahead of its comparator in the pool.

Cardiff are above Edinburgh in the Rabo having won more games. Also they won as many games in the HC so should have a higher ranking. Cannot explain why Montpellier are that high though.

`

They reached the top 14 final last year. That would have been less than 30 games ago.

by funnyExiledScot Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:54 am

True, but surely finishing bottom of their pool in this years HC would have more impact?

by Mickado Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:56 am

Obviously not. It's just a collection of stats, based on something. It's not opinion, maybe HC games and more recent games should be weighted more, maybe they are. I'm just saying that beating Castres and Racing Metro in the T14 playoffs could account for their position.

by Rava Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:05 pm

Each week, the results of all domestic league and cup games (2) as well as European ties are fed into the computer. As with any league, points are awarded to teams for winning or drawing a match. The Eurotable, however, takes account of many other factors:

Points scored and points conceded (the points system encourages attacking rugby but it also rewards sides who lose a match by a narrow margin.).
Whether the game was played at home or away (bonus awarded to the away team).
Strength of the opponent (more points are awarded when playing against a top-ranked opponent as opposed to a weaker one).

Strength of the domestic league (Account is taken of the differences in playing standards of the various domestic leagues by applying coefficients for each country. These are based on the performance of each country's clubs in the Heineken Cup (and to a much lesser extent, the European Shield) over the previous three seasons. The approach is similar to that used by UEFA to calculate their football rankings for each country.
Importance of the game (more points are awarded for European Cup games and at the latter stages of all cup competitions).
Recent form feature (a unique weighting of the results ensures that a team's more recent performances are given more credit than those of earlier games. As a result, the rankings will usually reflect current form rather than a team's standing over its last thirty games.

by Smirnoffpriest Thu Jan 26, 2012 4:25 pm

If it's based on the last 30 games - it seems strange that the Scarlets are above the Blues as they got to the Semi's not so long ago - or is that outside the 30 games?

Still nice to see them in the top 10

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