What is Edwards up too at the Dragons?

First topic message reminder :

Looking at the team sheet for tomorrow I’m wondering how we will do against the Blues. It’s probably safe to assume the season is over for the Dragons and we won’t be participating in the Heineken Cup next season.
But knowing that the season is over I’m totally at a loss for words as to what Edwards is up too.
Ok the backline has been solid all season and he’s gone with familiar faces in 15 Thomas, 14 Harries, 13 Tuilagi, 12 Smith, 11 Brew, 10 Robling, 9 Evans.
The main disappointment here is no spot for Jack Dixon who they probably have released for U20 duty (which is generally is considered less important by the WRU so we could have held on to him).
Now for me the kid looked like a real find. Great hands, eye for a cap & quite bulky for a kid of 17. I don’t understand why they wouldn’t opt to give him game time now given our season is over. As Tovey is leaving I understand why he’s bringing Jones & Robling through.

It’s the pack that bothers me the most though. He’s gone with 1 Williams 2 Jones 3 Buck 4 Groves 5 Sidoli 6 Evans 7 Waters 8 Brown.
I think Buck is worth the investment and he is a mainstay in the team so far this season. He’s only 22 and given that good Tightheads are costly it stands to reason we have to develop our own.
But here is where the problem lies.
Steve Jones – Not a bad hooker a few years ago but he is not the same player he was at 34. Given his contract is up end of this season but he wasn’t released I am guessing they are offering him a new one or he’s packing it in. But why select him? Parry would gain more from the exposure of these matches.

Groves – I’m really disappointed with the general need to move players around into positions which do not suit them. Groves is a backrow player. Keep him there. He’s not tall enough for lock or nearly heavy enough. He has got great hands, good mobility and is a ball carrier. All season long Edwards has used him wrong. To be honest Groves for me looks a good player and should be playing alongside Lydiate & Falatau in the backrow (when they are available). You could move him to Blindside which is his natural position when they are away. I appreciate the Dragons are thin on the ground on Locks but are we saying that in the whole of the Premiership there is not a single descent lock or young lock who would benefit from playing there? Dan Hodge (Crosskeys) looked quite good when we gave him a match this year.

In the backrow Evans has never really impressed me much and neither has Darren Waters (even though people seem to rate them both). Tom Brown has looked useful though. But in my view playing either Evans or Waters is a monumental waste of time with both players being not good enough at this level. Maybe I am being harsh but given that our 2 younger backrowers are already representing Wales its clear they haven’t developed how they should have.

What really worries me though is that we are being linked with players like D. Jones and D. Manu. I really hope this does not turn out to be true because we seem to take other regions cast offs at a whim.
When will we realize in order to change the status we need to develop and find our own talent. People like Dixon need to be played and developed now. I appreciate that our real promising players will always be targets similar to what happens at Newcastle but I would rather see us produce the stars of tomorrow than continue to sign players that nobody wants.
Speaking to a lot of local fans I get the sense they think the experience is needed to bring talent through. My argument tends to be this though. The game is changing and it’s becoming a young man’s sport. Players at the age of 25 are experienced these days so players at 30+ are on the way down in terms of their performances. I think there is an epidemic in the Welsh game at regional level where there are far too many substandard 25y-36y players who are still offered professional rugby contracts. Perfect example would be Parker at the Ospreys. He wasn’t on a small contract over the last 2-3 seasons but he’s done nothing of note in that time. There are dozens of cases similar to his.
I just hope we start adopting the Scarlets approach and focus on development from within. I certainly hope Edwards does not go out and start buying more Foreigners or Ex Welsh Internationals.

BTW I’m not having a go at players who are getting on but only the very best should be retained. Stephen Jones for example should be moved into coaching, mentoring or becoming a development officer for the WRU (spotting talent). He is clearly was a high level player in his pomp and played international rugby for a long time.

Another turnover

how can the Dragons not clear their lines? so many chances


HA!! ref takes a tumble!

ah bless him, he's got cramp.

And now the ref is injured - nice one Paterson.

glamorganalun wrote:I think man of the match has already been decided as D Waters! He is a good 7 great import from the local regional club Ponty.

Wow! Good spot.

glamorganalun wrote:I think man of the match has already been decided as D Waters! He is a good 7 great import from the local regional club Ponty.

Yep

Dragons, still a poor game

from a Scarlet, thank you Dragons!

Dire, dire game though.

Think Blues are level with us on points now.

Awful, awful game

As are most of the Blues games these season.

Dreadful

Happy with that, thought we had blown it when they took the lead.

Not a great spot, it reminded me of Jiffy in the Wales game he was singing praise for Lydiate from the first minute against Scotland, the pundits (Holley) was doing the same tonight but he is a very good player.

Thank god dragons did us a fav and won but poor match and poor ref

Cracking atmosphere at the Dave tonight , how they could turn a region with such a vibrant and atmospheric ground into a development region and keep the other regions going with their dead souless grounds is a mystery to me

munkian wrote:Cracking atmosphere at the Dave tonight , how they could turn a region with such a vibrant and atmospheric ground into a development region and keep the other regions going with their dead souless grounds is a mystery to me

£££'s and the WRU have 50% ownership of the Drags as they did with the Celtic Warriors so beware.
I was there tonight. Not a great atmos where we were in the North terrace, but no doubt it was better in the Hazell.
Drags v Blues though. Used to be 10 times better when it was simply Newport v Cardiff.

glamorganalun wrote:I think man of the match has already been decided as D Waters! He is a good 7 great import from the local regional club Ponty.

Take it up with the Blues, not us for recognising Welsh talent, otherwise you look like an idiot again! Your dragonsitis really shows you up sometimes. Any excuse for a dig!!

gcBlues wrote:Also, no matter how bad a ref is, i don't agree with chanting 'cheat' at him.

Get off your high horse and tell me why Buck kept getting pinged in the scrum yet it was your loosehead dropping his arm every scrum. You had every single decision tonight. If you attended and the ref was a homer I'm sure you'd feel similar. We took a lot of dog poo decisions before our support shouted that. Obviously it's easy to say these things from in front of your tv. What kind of ref makes a scrum half throw into a lineout when the hooker is on the field still injured. Like I say, get off your high horse.

Well done dragons! Thanks

Cardiff Dave wrote:

munkian wrote:Cracking atmosphere at the Dave tonight , how they could turn a region with such a vibrant and atmospheric ground into a development region and keep the other regions going with their dead souless grounds is a mystery to me

£££'s and the WRU have 50% ownership of the Drags as they did with the Celtic Warriors so beware.
I was there tonight. Not a great atmos where we were in the North terrace, but no doubt it was better in the Hazell.
Drags v Blues though. Used to be 10 times better when it was simply Newport v Cardiff.

That's what you get for sitting in the che ap seats

Hazell was buzzing, I've been to the Carfiff City Stadium three times now and it was plastic in comparison I'm afraid to say

Munkian - totally agree, the other grounds are terrible, I keep making the journey to the blues Lego labs but it's not much of a day out.. I used to love the arms park (not that u saw us win there often) but it's just not the same.

Good win for the dragons with a lot of youngsters playing, I was nervous when we went behind but tondi's peace of class won it.
Ref was a joke, of cause we will shout cheat... It could of been worse.

So why's Tovey going to Lego land...
STAND UP FOR THE MEN OF GWENT!!

munkian wrote:
I've been to the Carfiff City Stadium three times

That's more than me!

Well done Dragons
A win's a win.





It also helps the Scarlets playoff hopes too

I do love opposition fans moaning about the Dragons support. Newport is a working class city. There are parts of the crowd who aren't afraid to show their feelings. It's nothing like an international crowd and I for one am glad. I went to the Wales v Italy game and was over the dragons tonight. I know where I'd rather be and that's stood up in a passionate Hazell Terrace rather than sa next to a sap who only watches rugby through binoculars and then goes back to his hotel for a bottle of Pinot noire and a Crostini!!!
For me that's what's wrong with the game. Tonights atmosphere wasn't as good as it could have been. The Blues fans offer nothing in their Barbour jackets and colourful scarfs. Only heard them when they went 14-13 up. They're a different type of fan, but Rodney Parade is no more hostile than Sardis road or the Gnoll.
On the game. The blues should have won. Their pack were on top, but their backline was a shambles. To think Rhys Thomas, Rees, Sweeney, James and Czekaj have all played for Wales!!!
A rodney parade crowd is very different from a CCS and I know what I prefer. I too have been their 3 times and it's the pits!!!

youngguns6 wrote:Munkian - totally agree, the other grounds are terrible, I keep making the journey to the blues Lego labs but it's not much of a day out.. I used to love the arms park (not that u saw us win there often) but it's just not the same.

Thanks youngguns. It means a lot and more than you know when away fans say good things about the Arms Park. I will never knock Rodders as it is a fantastic ground.
What I will knock however is what is on offer. Newport/Cardiff fixtures were once massive, any time of the year. Blues v Drags are limped wristed affairs now i'm sorry to say.

manofgwent wrote:I do love opposition fans moaning about the Dragons support. Newport is a working class city. There are parts of the crowd who aren't afraid to show their feelings. It's nothing like an international crowd and I for one am glad. I went to the Wales v Italy game and was over the dragons tonight. I know where I'd rather be and that's stood up in a passionate Hazell Terrace rather than sa next to a sap who only watches rugby through binoculars and then goes back to his hotel for a bottle of Pinot noire and a Crostini!!!
For me that's what's wrong with the game. Tonights atmosphere wasn't as good as it could have been. The Blues fans offer nothing in their Barbour jackets and colourful scarfs. Only heard them when they went 14-13 up. They're a different type of fan, but Rodney Parade is no more hostile than Sardis road or the Gnoll.
On the game. The blues should have won. Their pack were on top, but their backline was a shambles. To think Rhys Thomas, Rees, Sweeney, James and Czekaj have all played for Wales!!!
A rodney parade crowd is very different from a CCS and I know what I prefer. I too have been their 3 times and it's the pits!!!

Not moaning at all MOG, if that's what you think and i'll go in the Hazell next time. Glad you've mentioned the CCS is the pits. I agree.

Wasn'taimed at you Dave. More GC Blues.
Let's hope you get back to the arms park full stopz.

thebluesmancometh wrote:For me the OP has no idea of the sport, what it takes to be a player, or what constitutes a proffesional player!!

I can tell you Dixon is a monster... FOR HIS AGE GRADE! He is far from ready for senior rugby at this level, and if he is rushed through risk of injury would be high, and any injury would be a big one.

RE Waters and Lewis Evans, what are you talking about. I know both and they are excellent talents, the test very highly and are very proffesional!!

All players develop at different rates, especially tight 5 and half backs, you look at the best in the world and they are around the 30 mark. Some players get more rugby and gain experience earlier, Warburton for example has been thrown into int rugby and come up swimming, but for evey Warbs there are 5 that sink!

Firstly there is a old adage the New Zealanders use, if your good enough your old enough. Your point regarding injuries to young players is also a mute one unless you can find a direct correlation between injuries and ages of players. No factual evidence available suggests what you are saying is right.

Secondly im a avid Dragons fan and played the game so not exactly sure why your having a dig at me. Are you even a Dragons fan? Waters had a good game but still our pack got dominated by the Blues last night and their pack isnt the best around.

Your point regarding the tight 5, if thats really true explain to me then how the Franks brothers & Sam Whitelock have amassed so many caps for the All Blacks?
I aggree that Loose forwards get better as they get on in age but that is not to say young probs are not up to high level rugby.

Your final point regarding for every player who makes it at international there are 5 who sink, I aggree with but we clearly have a different outlook why Regional Rugby is in place. For me the whole point is that you have international standard players playing for regions. If that level is maintained the step up for International Rugby is a small one. Sadly though there are too many players who are retained who are not good enough to be playing International Rugby. Basically thats the problem, our regions are still being managed as clubs, when in reality they should be operating like mini international sides. Its the only way our Regions will truely become competitive and give the national strength true strength in depth.

Welshmushroom wrote:our regions are still being managed as clubs, when in reality they should be operating like mini international sides. Its the only way our Regions will truely become competitive and give the national strength true strength in depth.

Well said.

Risca Rev wrote:Get off your high horse and tell me why Buck kept getting pinged in the scrum yet it was your loosehead dropping his arm every scrum. You had every single decision tonight. If you attended and the ref was a homer I'm sure you'd feel similar. We took a lot of dog poo decisions before our support shouted that. Obviously it's easy to say these things from in front of your tv. What kind of ref makes a scrum half throw into a lineout when the hooker is on the field still injured. Like I say, get off your high horse.

The referee was dreadful, but calling him a cheat is too much. I don't mind the banter, saying he has one arm and all that...but calling him a cheat goes beyond saying he's a crap ref, because it suggests he's gone out there and cheated the knuckle draggers on purpose.

And i have a right to be on my high horse, thank you very much. Now back to the factory young man while i admire my silverware and assorted Doily's.

Were they not refering to the Cardiff props not binding ?

manofgwent wrote:Wasn'taimed at you Dave. More GC Blues.
Let's hope you get back to the arms park full stopz.

Ah right. I do apologise. Too many Gunness's on my part possibly.
Yeah, I hope we can get back to the Arms Park. Welsh rugby as a whole would benefit also.
As it stands Dave and CAP are the best rugby grounds in Wales without question.

luckless_pedestrian wrote:

Welshmushroom wrote:our regions are still being managed as clubs, when in reality they should be operating like mini international sides. Its the only way our Regions will truely become competitive and give the national strength true strength in depth.

Well said.

Really?
The current Welsh side has never had more strength in depth as it does at present. The whole squad is strong and there are others knocking on the door.
The regional sides (managed by clubs who are independent businesses) will not be competitive if they operate like "mini international sides" because there aren't enough Welsh only players who are good enough to fill 4 squads. Wales needs NWQ players such as Xav, Blair, Tiatia, King, Snow. They not only fill holes, but they also bring class and interest to the game.

Dave - I read that 'mini-internationals' more along the lines of Wales call up players from the regions, and the regions players should be coming from teams within their regions. Whether it was meant like that or not I ain't sure.

Maybe the NWQs could be tied into teams around the region. E.g. Rush is representing Glamorgan Wanderers, Blair Pontypridd, Lualala Cardiff etc. And then if they are not in the match day 22 they can play for their club sides. And the same with any other players in the squad. That way the best players in teh country are getting more game time, as at the moment there are a fair few players who are on the fringes of the regional sides who don't get that much game time as tey don't drop down to the prem (folk like Maule, Mustoe etc).

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Dave - I read that 'mini-internationals' more along the lines of Wales call up players from the regions, and the regions players should be coming from teams within their regions. Whether it was meant like that or not I ain't sure.

Maybe the NWQs could be tied into teams around the region. E.g. Rush is representing Glamorgan Wanderers, Blair Pontypridd, Lualala Cardiff etc.

Are you having a laugh or what?
Rush turn out for Glammy? Ben Blair for Ponty? I'd pay to see that that mind you.
Xav, Blair and Laulala are contracted to Cardiff RFC.
Galmorgan Wanderers RFC and Pontypridd RFC are totally seperate rugby clubs.
The veil of regionalism I have to admit is confusing, but that is all regionalism is.