Murray Wants "Physical" Match With Nadal

Mmmm. Last night during Nadal's match the British knives were out in force. As well as being unable to hide their bias about wanting/hoping that Stephanic could do some damage. Talking about Nadal taking too long in the warm up (Stephanic was as well), time taken between points, (yawn.. ) and when Nadal started to play well about how he was mentally damaged by Djokovic (really?). Anything other than the spectacular play that presumably most had stayed up to watch. Why?

Maybe this has something to do with it? Apparantly Murray is angered by the time Nadal takes between points. Murray feels it prevents his matches with Nadal being as "physical" as he would like. The implication being Murray feels if a match up with Nadal was more physical and less skill based he would benifit. Nadal is being painted as the bad guy and Murray the good.

IMO Murray is more "physical" than Nadal but the most important thing is that Nadal is by far the superior tennis player.

What I dislike is that once again he is using his tremendous power with the media to talk himself up and put his own view across so that it is fed to us as the truth and pave the way to using disruption tactics when and if he next gets to play Nadal.

hawkeye wrote:What I dislike is that once again he is using his tremendous power with the media to talk himself up and put his own view across so that it is fed to us as the truth and pave the way to using disruption tactics when and if he next gets to play Nadal.

I don't think anyone can accuse Murray of disruption tactics - his on court etiquette towards his opponent is very good. (his etiquette towards his box has been less than desirable but that seems to be getting better). Murray is a very fair player.

These comments from AM are really encouraging imo because I think they show that Murray is having is backbone stiffened by Lendl - there is no reason for any of the players to put up with time delaying tactics from anyone. Perhaps this is Murray serving notice.

I agree with you HE that Nadal may well still be the better tennis player - but how much better for the game if the same result is achieved without this controversy over timely MTOs and time between points.

I think Andy wanting to make it a physical battle is a mistake because I only see one winner in that department and it's not Andy!

Nadal is naturally a powerful athlete, it's in his genes. Andy, by contrast, strikes me more as a skinny guy who has bulked up and trained hard. I don't think power is a game he can win against Rafa.

I actually think Andy has the game to challenge Rafa. Nole has got the beating of Rafa and Andy is a kind of 'Djoko-lite'. He should have the ability to cause Rafa problems.

I do like the way though that Andy is saying what he thinks and doesn't seem too bothered about upsetting Rafa. Historically I think he's been somewhat in awe of Rafa. There's a been a reverence when he talks about him that doesn't seem to be there when he talks of Fed and Djoko. If Lendl has got Murray to believe that Rafa is not some kind of demi-god but someone he is actually capable of taking down, then that can only be a good thing.

HM Murdoch wrote:I think Andy wanting to make it a physical battle is a mistake because I only see one winner in that department and it's not Andy!

Not sure about that. Look in Tokyo, it was Nadal running out of steam first. Murray spends less energy per shot and that is the key in his favour.

Nadal is naturally a powerful athlete, it's in his genes. Andy, by contrast, strikes me more as a skinny guy who has bulked up and trained hard. I don't think power is a game he can win against Rafa.

Not sure about that either. Nadal is way too cyclical to consider him a natural powerful athlete.

Tenez wrote:

HM Murdoch wrote:I think Andy wanting to make it a physical battle is a mistake because I only see one winner in that department and it's not Andy!

Not sure about that. Look in Tokyo, it was Nadal running out of steam first. Murray spends less energy per shot and that is the key in his favour.

True but that's a rather isolated result. Plus that was an end-of-season Nadal running on empty (which I accept is in line with your second point). I don't think collapsing 6-2 6-0 after one set is due to running out of steam, unless we mean in the context of the season. But then Rafa played a lot more matches in 2011 - 84 compared to Murray's 69.

Tenez wrote:

HM Murdoch wrote:Nadal is naturally a powerful athlete, it's in his genes. Andy, by contrast, strikes me more as a skinny guy who has bulked up and trained hard. I don't think power is a game he can win against Rafa.

Not sure about that either. Nadal is way too cyclical to consider him a natural powerful athlete.

I do agree that Nadal is very cyclical but that's not particularly what I mean by being naturally powerful. I was thinking more in terms of what their natural physique and strength is. Nadal was muscular even as a teenager but claims he doesn't do much in the way of weights (how true this is can be debated!). Andy had to go through a rigorous development programme to even get close to this (hence those rather annoying times in 2008 when he would show biceps when he won!).

Yes, I don't tend to believe everything Nadal says.

I just think that Murray can beat Nadal physically cause as I said, he spends less energy per shot. He has just to make sure, he doesn't do too much running in the meantime.

Tenez wrote:Yes, I don't tend to believe everything Nadal says.

I just think that Murray can beat Nadal physically cause as I said, he spends less energy per shot. He has just to make sure, he doesn't do too much running in the meantime.

By that definition I agree with you. Basically he needs to execute the Djoko plan: get fit enough so that being worn down stops being a reason for defeat and then win by having the superior game.

Murray has every right to feel frustrated,Nadal isn't above the law
The rule applies to everyone,no exceptions,so he is right to voice his feelings
Nadal purposefully does this to upset his opponents rhythm and to mentally control the match,so that the match is played on his terms when he's ready and he is in charge of the pace its played at
I also understand where Murray is coming from,to beat Nadal you have to be fitter,run faster and endure longer and I agree with him,definitely more physical then skill
I have heard almost every player say Nadal is hardest to beat,because you have to match his athleticism,you're not going to beat him on skill alone.On a slow court its virtually impossible to get a ball past him,its like playing against a brick wall
Murray has beaten Nadal at grand slam level so he knows what it takes especially from him personally.
I think people may be misunderstanding him here,I don't think he is saying he is going to change his game to be more physical,all he is saying is that the disruption Nadal causes prevents him from being able to be consistent throughout a match or prevents him from really reaching or finding the level he feels he needs to play at to stand a chance.Nadals tactics stops him from building momentum


I also don't agree with your comment about Murray being the more physical player and Nadal the more superior player.Nadal is without a doubt more physical and the gap between them I believe is more mental then technical superiority,and in terms of tennis I think Murray is far more talented were as Nadals talent lies in being a pure athlete,he has a shot at almost any sport
You gotta feel for Murray,here he is abiding by the rules and is still slam less while someone else is breaking the rules while winning majors and getting way with it
Murray knows Nadal will struggle to hold serve more if he was forced to serve within the time limit,and Murray obviously can tell the difference between playing someone else who abides by the rule and Nadal and how it personally affects him

Murray talks a lot of nonsense to the press rather frequently. I wonder if he gets paid for this sort of thing, for creating a 'story'.

Nadal is the better player in most departments and overall way ahead, clearly. The only chance Murray has is to serve as well as he did against Djokovic in their last encounter, because in long exchanges his groundstrokes are going to break down under the unrelenting pressure, particularly on the forehand side.
However, Murray's 1st serve percentage is hardly ever that high, that was an exception.

I haven't seen what Murray has said, can someone provide a link or paste in his comments? I can't find them anywhere.

I'm glad he has said it, not because it is something which particularly annoys me, but it is about time Murray started looking at the top 2 as enemies rather than his buddies.

I can definitely imagine Lendl playing a part in any mind games that Murray is trying to pull, if that is what he is trying to do.

In terms of the better player physically, that has to be Nadal. He plays with such physical intensity and I find it hard to believe that anyone can think Murray is ahead of him in that department. In terms of technique and imagination, I think it is pretty close and maybe Murray slightly edges it... But the better physical athlete? Nadal all day for me.

Well, Murray's tried the verbals with Federer and got precisely nowhere, but in his current put-upon state perhaps it'll work on Nadal.

Good work by Murray; he's correct that if they have to stick to the time rules he'll beat Nadal.

So will 4 or 5 others.

reckoner wrote:Well, Murray's tried the verbals with Federer and got precisely nowhere, but in his current put-upon state perhaps it'll work on Nadal.

He has? When?

I've always thought he has been too polite about the players above him, and particularly with Federer. I mean, yes it is an honour being on the same court as the best player ever... But he shouldn't mention it every time he plays him. I'd rather he tried to wind up the 3 players above him personally.

Danny_1982 wrote:

reckoner wrote:Well, Murray's tried the verbals with Federer and got precisely nowhere, but in his current put-upon state perhaps it'll work on Nadal.

He has? When?

I've always thought he has been too polite about the players above him, and particularly with Federer. I mean, yes it is an honour being on the same court as the best player ever... But he shouldn't mention it every time he plays him. I'd rather he tried to wind up the 3 players above him personally.

I don't have exact quotes handy and am in the middle of something so perhaps others can point out specifics. I do remember him saying something like there were several players on the tour with a better backhand than Fed and thinking it was probably not the wisest thing to say, true or not!

Also all this deference towards Federer is after the AO final I think.

Murray is not "polite" he is always making snarky remarks to the press about Nadal and Federer insinuating that they are not as good as him or as good as they are perceived to be and also telling the press how good he is himself. IMO he believes what the British press write about him. They big him up for their own reasons.

Sometimes I'm not quite sure if Murray is foolish or has just been put in the position where he knows no better...

Does he?
I think you are misinformed about Murray, he seems to be quite a nice and humble chap, very complimentary about Nadal in particular.

Disagree HE. I think he is way too complimentary about the 3 guys above him. I'm not saying they don't deserve it, I just think the guy trying to beat them shouldn't be saying "you're amazing" to these guys all the time.

I wish I agreed with you about Murray's remarks. I'd love nothing more than Murray to step up to the plate and say "I think I'm better than you" and then back it up on the court, but he has never come out with anything of the sort in my opinion.

His comments regarding his 3 main rivals has always been generous and gracious I think... Too much so.

Why do people think Lendl is going to help Murray with mind games? Lendl was a victim of mind games all his life. Versus McEnroe, Connors, Becker, Lendl was always at the wrong side of the stick.

reckoner wrote:

Danny_1982 wrote:

reckoner wrote:Well, Murray's tried the verbals with Federer and got precisely nowhere, but in his current put-upon state perhaps it'll work on Nadal.

He has? When?

I've always thought he has been too polite about the players above him, and particularly with Federer. I mean, yes it is an honour being on the same court as the best player ever... But he shouldn't mention it every time he plays him. I'd rather he tried to wind up the 3 players above him personally.

I don't have exact quotes handy and am in the middle of something so perhaps others can point out specifics. I do remember him saying something like there were several players on the tour with a better backhand than Fed and thinking it was probably not the wisest thing to say, true or not!

I don't think he knows the game,and even if he did and tried to play it,he is hardly going to have the impact he hoped for,for the simple fact that none of the 3 players above him are intimidated by him
Who is really going to take notice of him if he says several player on tour have a better backhand then Federer,even if its the truth its hardly like Roger will lose sleep over it,but that just proves the he doesn't know what he is doing cause Federer could rip him apart by responding to his comment and there wouldn't be much left for Murrays comeback,not to mention how unpopular he could become as the media ( even some British media) will always side with Federer
But if it was reversed and any one of the top 3 players decided to wind Murray up by giving him some kind of complex about his game Murray would probably go back onto another 6 months slum

Veejay, this was years ago, probably 2009 when Murray was on a real charge for number one. And in fairness Federer has sent a couple of zingers his way too.

At the time there was a lot being made of Murray's positive head to head and I suppose things got a bit heated between the two camps.

Tenez wrote:Why do people think Lendl is going to help Murray with mind games? Lendl was a victim of mind games all his life. Versus McEnroe, Connors, Becker, Lendl was always at the wrong side of the stick.

True, but we all learn with hindsight, and as a mature man he may see the value.

I don't think it's mind games by Murray, sounds to me like he's had enough and he isn't alone.

hawkeye wrote:Murray Wants "Physical" Match With Nadal.

I hear Murray sent Nadal the following: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWz9VN40nCA

Nore Staat wrote:

hawkeye wrote:Murray Wants "Physical" Match With Nadal.

I hear Murray sent Nadal the following: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWz9VN40nCA

My eyes!!!

Nore Staat wrote:

hawkeye wrote:Murray Wants "Physical" Match With Nadal.

I hear Murray sent Nadal the following: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWz9VN40nCA

Ha ha! That is one scary video. Nadal will have no chance with Murray playing mind games like that...