Aaron Cruden. Best 10 in the World?

Today Aaron Cruden ripped apart the Irish defending for 20 minutes and put in the all blacks players for 20 points already before he go out injury with the achillies tendor strain.

Last week we watch Dan Carter fail to guide the team to penetrate fanatical Irish defense.

Some of what Cruden did was just unbelievable. The offload to SBW was a golden moment for history (yes, TO SBW, not FROM SBW). Yes that comes from familiar combinator in Chiefs but he do this weekly for the Chiefs in SXV who now top the SVX table.

So is Aaron Cruden now better than DC and so by fact of his position, the best 10 in the world today?

No he is not!

Today the All Blacks forwards went back to the basics supply Front foot ball for there backs.I neither get carried away with blow outs and think what would happen in games when forwards don`t get on top.The answer was last week
Savea could have been as effective as Gear today.Colin Slade fit given the service Crudon had today by the forwards and Aron Smith`s service instead of Jimmy Cowans guess where this ones going pass.COULD have been impressive too,Crudon is good make no mistake and playing with players he knows was impressive like today.Or in the RWC with the Welligton Backline he was used to
ALL the youngsters have had good starts but not s let get carried away yet this is not YET THE great All Blacks side we have come to Love.

Thank you emack for making a serious posting!

Do you think the all blacks dominate about the breakdown and supply the ball was the combinator of locks and backrow (with three fetchers and a new big strong lock?) or was about attitude of all blacks? or do you thinking like some posters that Ireland run out of energy and commitment after last week?

Cruden is a brilliant player. Hes proved that from his captaining and player of the u20s jwcup a couple of years ago, his short time in the world cup last year and is one of the key reasons the Chiefs are on top of the super xv.

During the week I read and article that had the Irish studying videos of Cruden specifically. In the 20 minutes it didnt seem they learned much.

Carter is still the undisputed king but he is injury prone- training seeminly his jinx. Cruden offers an attack that Carter doesnt. Hes able to take the ball to the line and at the last second choose one of several options. This year hes passed, stepped, chipped right and left or just taken it up. Hes also not relied on his own skills alone and knows the value in working with those around him.

For me thats a rare talent indeed and if he keeps up this form and confidence he just may overtake Carter. One of those players you just love to watch because of his unpredictabile yet confident nature.

Besides. Two very good 10's can't be bad and i believe hes not likely to do an evans given his commitment to nz rugby and carter being in his twilight.

Taylorman my mind is in riddle if it was possible at all to shut down Cruden's pass to SBW to make the try. Even if the all blacks posted the rehearsal vido to Ireland for the study. That was just some sublime moment.

Is Carter going to make it to the next RWC. NZ have some pretty useful young 10s in Slade, Cruden and Amscombe (thats the blues kid right?).

Not saying he should leave now to seek his riches but what else he got to achieve in a AB jersey other than dominate a RWC like a JW, Lomu, Campo etc??? Not sure if he will get another shot at that given the internal competition.

3 years off looks a long long way away.

He's certainly lost some pace since his youth... I can't remember who put he was blitzed a couple of times this series no... that never happened in the past. Then again, great players never need pace or after its gone, they always find a way to compete.

fa0019 wrote:Is Carter going to make it to the next RWC. NZ have some pretty useful young 10s in Slade, Cruden and Amscombe (thats the blues kid right?).

Not saying he should leave now to seek his riches but what else he got to achieve in a AB jersey other than dominate a RWC like a JW, Lomu, Campo etc??? Not sure if he will get another shot at that given the internal competition.

3 years off looks a long long way away.

He's certainly lost some pace since his youth... I can't remember who put he was blitzed a couple of times this series no... that never happened in the past. Then again, great players never need pace or after its gone, they always find a way to compete.

Maybe he just enjoy it a lot and wants to keep doing it?

Id be ok with dc retiring now. Sacrilege i know but lately i find him boring.
Pecking order is dc, cruden the barrett. Slade is injury prone and has serious confidence issues. Anscombe is with the blues. They wont touch him while theyre failing.

For me cruden and bartlet are the future. Both are young, keen, quick- can kick and have smarts about them.

I think Ascombe game management is not so good for all blacks. He is more of the style of "kicking 10" like Jonny Wilkinson. He stand deep and manage with positional kick. He fail to light up the blues backline and get messing around a lot by Pat Lam.

My mind is Anscombe will moving the Europe in a few season.

Ye I think NZ have real problems going forward too. No top class running threat at 10 and this 'golden generation' is about to fall off the cliff too, I agree with your opinions AWOP

Bluesman you have ruin enough thread today. If you have no sensible point why dont you go polish something?

So you don't think Anscombe is a deep kicker? and is opposed to the style the kiwis play?

You don't think that the baby blacks have had their worst ever JWC's?

You don't rate Mccaw and Carter as high as everyone else? We all know how poor the NZ team can perform without those 2 guys, and although there are some monsters in the team it doesn't have the feel of the NZ of 3 years ago?

DC had a superb game in the first test. He was sensational. The best All Black on the paddock. So I wouldn't write him off because he struggled in the next game where the whole team struggled.

With Cruden playing so well he'd be starting #10 with any other nation, and young Barrett and a lesser extent Slade (with other options there the pressure to fill DC's boots is shared so there's less pressure on him so he may play better in Black from now on), I'd like to see Carter continue playing until the others overtake him in performances. May be next year, may be the next RWC. He's the best first five the game has seen so we shouldn't be casting him onto the scraphead prematurely.

No Dallym I agree but its timely and inevitable to put the thnking out there such is the rate of DC's 'training' injuries. The subject will not go away if DC keeps coming up injured and other younger 10's add more spark to the role.

Thats the nature of AB rugby. Fox saw it in Merts, Merts saw it in DC and ??? will start asking the questions. We will play the best but only while they remain the best.

I watch again today's matches and Cruden stand out by a mile in that first 20. I didn't see a 10 performance with such authority and precision since DC himself in that 2nd Lions game. Extraordinarily stuffing.

Cruden looked and was uncontainable in that opening quarter of the match. This year he just seems to have that confidence in his game whereby he is always aware of his options, his running game is superb and he's showing great decison making.

Obviously DC is still the prototype 10, but as others have said, with these increasingly recurrent injuries I'd like to see Cruden get more opportunities to showcase his talents at 10 in the next few tests.

anotherworldofpain wrote:Extraordinarily stuffing.

I'm gonna have to store these somewhere and bring them out for a rainy day...

My post before the match. Not entirely unpredictable but hey...

Taylorman wrote:Since becoming an All Black Cruden was told to work on his kicking both at goal- which he hardly ever did, and from hand. He has added yards to his out of hand kicking and can goal from up to 50, his limit.

In fact last 3 years he would have improved his kicking more than anyone. Superxv I believe he is near the top in accuracy and ponts scored.

I think presently hes better than Carter in that area. His running is in a way superior and he takes the ball to the line quicker, can step etc.

I dont think we lose anything at all in fact we gain more on attack with he and SBW. I dont think Carter 'gets' SBW but cruden has worked a combo with him to stunning success with the Chiefs. What Carter has over Cruden and in fact every 10 is his composure and his uncanny ability to do the right things at the right time.

Ireland should not make the mistake of underestimating Cruden or he'll rip through them such is his confidence levels at the moment.

Yup, he proved you right TM, ripped through them in his short time he had on the field. He's offloading like SBW, they've obviously worked on that at the chiefs.

Is there a concern Cruden himself is injury prone? He's put on some weight but is still fairly slight. He seems to hold his own in s15, but in his last two internationals, he's limped off twice after 20 min cameos.

Yes its becoming a trend and Crudens the shortest of them all. Barrett looks more the all round Merts/ Carter type that may end up in the position.

Seemed an innocuous injury as well. Havnt seen yet where this is at yet...

I have just watched the Second andThird ireland matches again tonight,last week both sides.Were getting away with a lot of cynical things jersey pulling,blocking off[obstruction] and taking players out off the ball.I don`t take any notice of commentators ,I watch and make up my own ideas.For example
immediatly prior to the penalty from which Ireland scored there try. Aron Smith was taken out of f the ball cynical you bet? innocous true.You see it every match BUT technically should have been an AB penalty.Last week was a Proper test,people said Carter,McCaw,Dagg were poor.They were`nt just not as good as there usual standards,Crudon was very good for 20 plus minutes.Achilles problem according to the press not happy about that.On Paper the AB side today was the least experienced since France first test 2009.Ireland should have smelt blood BUT there was no passion at all 3 try`s in 20 minutes game over.No way back after that you can`t give them that sort of lead,EVERY THING they tried came off.BUT i`ll reserve judgement on the new boys until the 4Ns.Because they should`nt have been able to get away that easily Romano i`ve always rated.HE could be the answer at 4 with Whitelock at 5 ,Messam got thru a lot of work today.Ritchie was immense leading from the front again Cane at 7 was impressive too. The traditional 6,7, 8 no longer applies in modern rugby it dates from the days of the Scrum cover defence days.I know some here think I am stuck in past sorry to disappoint you I give opinions based on what I have Seen,Read or Heard about.I do not have the advantage a dedicated
NZ rugby Channel to judge the new boys .Super Rugby does`nt always translate to test rugby Mealamu is a case in point.Seldom looks impressive at Super level but ALWAYS fronts up in BLACK congratulations on breaking Fitzys Record.What IS very encouraging is that with so many key players missing there are a number of youngsters coming thru.Especially at 9,10,12,and 7 the scrum still needs work BUT Mike Cron will sort that.Ritchie at 6, Read at 8,Cane or Todd at 7.Vito cover 8,Messam cover 6,Thomson as super sub covering all 3 positions.Smith has been a revelation at 9.BUT Paranera or Kerr -Barlow could also be in the frame with Ellis.Carter is still the Governor but Crudon,Slade when fit Barrett and Anscombe bodes well for the future.SBW looks very good now BUT will he be here next year the grubber today was very neat .With Nonu, Conrad Smith,Kahui the midfield looks solid.Gear,Guilford,Savea ,Cory Jane,Dagg ,not mentioning Toeva and Ben Smith,Ellison the futureseems promising at least for a couple of years.

You might be able to reserve judgememt till the 4Ns but the point is the ABs cant afford to. They've given these guys valuable experience. Test preparation for a week in the All Black camp under the pressure of a near loss the previous week is huge and a bonus going into the 4N. They certainly wouldnt have been better prepared for the 4N without this experience and to not try them would be neglegent.

You cant just stick to your tried and true all the time. Thats not the AB way. They knew they had to get players up to speed and have.

Its also true about superxv not reflecting test rugby but in the same vain the reverse is true. The cruden sbw combo was straight out of the chiefs pattern and Sam Cane, Romano, Bartlett, Aaron Smith etc have ONLY sxv form behind them so its clear thats the primary reason for their test form.

4N is a different matter for sure but so far the right moves have been made.

Answer to the original post: No. let's just leave it with 1/2 a game where the team as a whole dominated the opposition isn't enough to draw any conclusions.

Barrett will be better than Cruden by the end of next year I reckon

He beat a pathetic Ireland side. So no. I was very impressed with him but the fact that Ireland had their worst game in the last 10 years needs to be taken into account.

nganboy wrote:Barrett will be better than Cruden by the end of next year I reckon

+1

When you look at the other 10s playing International Rugby then NZ would seem to have the best 2 certainly. If not now then it seems a safe bet he will be number 1 before long.

Marshall seems to think so...

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/our-experts/7162463/Cruden-presents-All-Blacks-challenge-to-Carter

I'd go as far to say that the 20 minutes of Cruden was the best 20 minute spell in test match rugby ever.

Dare anyone to find a better one in that timeframe.

Thomond wrote:He beat a pathetic Ireland side. So no. I was very impressed with him but the fact that Ireland had their worst game in the last 10 years needs to be taken into account.

Or may be Cruden helped Ireland have a bad game. By the way this is not the first time he has played a good game for the AB's. He did play a bit last year as well.

But no not the best 10 in the world.

No not yet, but the best performance by a 10 by a street.

He's not going to waltz up to the Boks and twinkle toe around them all day no, but he will cause some problems, potentially match winning ones.

Great player with potential, but Carter is the best player i've ever watched by a distance in the last 15 years

He is better than Preistland but that is not saying much, but better than Carter, no way.