ATP Monte-Carlo Masters: the Final

by Green Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:18 pm

First topic message reminder :

Monte-Carlo Rolex Masters
ATP World Tour Masters 1000

Monte-Carlo, Monaco
date: 10-17 April 2011
surface: Red Clay
prize money: € 2,750,000

Day 8 - The Final:
Sunday, April 17th, 2011

2:15 p.m. GMT / 1:15 p.m. CET
Court Central:

Rafael NADAL (1) - David FERRER (4) > 6:4 7:5

H2H: 12-4
[9-1 clay; 3-3 hard]

Last two meetings:
Australian Open 2011, D. Ferrer 6:4 6:2 6:3
Rome Masters 2010, R. Nadal 7:5 6:2

Road to the Final:

> Rafael Nadal:	> >	> David Ferrer:
- SF - A. Murray > 6:4 2:6 6:1 - QF - I. Ljubičić > 6:4 6:2 - R3 - R. Gasquet > 6:2 6:4 - R2 - J. Nieminen > 6:2 6:2		- SF - J. Melzer > 6:3 6:2 - QF - V. Troicki > 6:3 6:3 - R3 - M. Raonić > 6:1 6:3 - R2 - F. Lopez > 6:2 6:0

Monte-Carlo 2011 Champion:
Rafael Nadal

Links:
Men Singles Draw
Order of Play
Live Scores
Official tournament website

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:45 pm

Melzer deserved his win but has gotten a bit cocky at his presser... puts me off frankly.. I hope now Daveed gives him his usual runaround... Federer didn´t turn up for that match.. interesting to see tomorrow how he handles Ferrer. I know he has beaten him on the last two occasions but Daveed has upped his game this past few months.

Socal... not sure I like your predictions Ok!

so I wont put money on Andy if you dont mind. Gil would have made me look good today laughing

by socal1976 Fri Apr 15, 2011 6:53 pm

Haddie, first off let me say I am not picking Andy, I am saying if he plays well he could conceivably pull the upset. Would not pick against Rafa on clay. But I will make this prediction I think it will be the most difficult match Rafa has faced in the tournament so far. No doubt Gil was a weak opponent. But Andy is really cranking the forehand well and looking like he is enjoying himself. Rafa wins but I think it will be a hard fought match.

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 7:02 pm

Socal.. I know what you are saying... and I may eat my words. But Rafa is not playing anywhere near what he is capable of.. his game against Looby was a bit tame for Rafa.. he allowed Looby NEARLY to get back into that second set purely becuse he had lost concentration.. he was half way to the locker room. Rafa as you know plays best when he is pushed.. and he hasn´t been pushed.
Andy seems to play differently against Rafa he needs to play his ´Á´ Game which he hasn´t done for months. The combination of Rafa and Clay ?? he is going to have to play well or hope that Rafa doesnt.In a sense I hope Andy does.push him. I want to see Rafa play as well as I know he can

by sonic_boom10 Fri Apr 15, 2011 7:04 pm

Murray is a mug on clay and he has no chance vs Nadal.

Murray luckily got into a tie break at Monte Carlo back in 2009, when Nadal was nowhere near his best and lost his focus.

Nadal cakewalk in 2 sets

by socal1976 Fri Apr 15, 2011 7:14 pm

Sonic boom you could be right, Rafa is a monster on clay. And I have always wondered why with his speed and varied game Andy didn't play well on clay, but well he hasn't. But again I think he can play on the surface, and I think that he seems to have snapped out of slump. Will Rafa win, probably but I think Andy is playing well enough to push him.

And Haddie, I agree Rafa looks to be sleep walking on way to the title. I think if Andy pushes Rafa, then Rafa will find that 5th and 6th gear. I am hoping Andy can take a set off of him.

by sportslover Fri Apr 15, 2011 7:46 pm

sonic_boom10 wrote:Murray is a mug on clay and he has no chance vs Nadal.

Murray luckily got into a tie break at Monte Carlo back in 2009, when Nadal was nowhere near his best and lost his focus.

Nadal cakewalk in 2 sets

And Nadal went on to win the final (again)

Do you actually know anything about tennis!

See this is your first post Doh

by sonic_boom10 Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:01 pm

sportslover wrote:
sonic_boom10 wrote:Murray is a mug on clay and he has no chance vs Nadal.

Murray luckily got into a tie break at Monte Carlo back in 2009, when Nadal was nowhere near his best and lost his focus.

Nadal cakewalk in 2 sets

And Nadal went on to win the final (again)

Do you actually know anything about tennis!

See this is your first post

Plenty pal.

Nadal is the greatest player ever on the dirt.

Murray is a choker.

by Solerina Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:05 pm

Jubbahey wrote:Murray wins it, yee haa..... 6-2 6-1.

Roll on Rafa, I wish I could see these matches somewhere, anyone ?

Jubba...I watch tennis on bet365......you have to deposit £5 , or it might be £10, I can't remember, but it's well worth taking the trouble to subscribe.....it's a great service.

I've only just seen the results......it's fantastic!

Well done Andy : )

Solerina

by Mad for Chelsea Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:10 pm

Hi Sol, how are things?

Andy looked pretty good in the bits I saw. Admittedly I only watched until 2-1 in the second but given he won the next four games on the trot he can't have got much worse Smile

Looks like he's worked hard on the forehand, trying to dominate rallies off that side, which he wasn't able to before. He's added some pretty heavy topspin there too. Add to tha his improved movement (seems to be getting the hang of this sliding thing), and IMO he could start to seriously challenge on the dirt.

by Solerina Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:27 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:Hi Sol, how are things?

Andy looked pretty good in the bits I saw. Admittedly I only watched until 2-1 in the second but given he won the next four games on the trot he can't have got much worse

Looks like he's worked hard on the forehand, trying to dominate rallies off that side, which he wasn't able to before. He's added some pretty heavy topspin there too. Add to tha his improved movement (seems to be getting the hang of this sliding thing), and IMO he could start to seriously challenge on the dirt.

Hi Chelsea.....thanks for that.......I've been really busy .....hardly had chance to watch any of Andy's matches....just catching bits here and there.

Yes...he seems much happier on clay......this return to form is very exciting isn't it?

Win or lose tomorrow I hope he puts in a good performance......I might have to miss the end of the match as I will be going to work at 3.30.

I'm so looking forward to RG, now that Andy's got the hang of the sliding thing, as you put it lol.

Just imagine... Andy's first slam title could be on Clay......who'd have thought it lol

Anway, enjoy the match : )

Solerina

by Mad for Chelsea Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:36 pm

Unless it's a really long match (or the first semi isà I'm going to miss tomorrow's semi as I'll be at cricket practise Sad

Still for once I'm feeling confident about the upcoming clay season. Go Andy Yahoo

by sonic_boom10 Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:53 pm

Solerina

Murray isn't even a top 20 on clay. Winning RG isn't ever on the cards unless the superior claycourters all quit tennis at the same time.

Come RG guys like Soderling, Ferrer, Delpo and Verdasco will power through Murray, let alone guys like Rafa, Novak or Roger

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 8:59 pm

Solerina wrote:
Jubbahey wrote:Murray wins it, yee haa..... 6-2 6-1.

Roll on Rafa, I wish I could see these matches somewhere, anyone ?

Jubba...I watch tennis on bet365......you have to deposit £5 , or it might be £10, I can't remember, but it's well worth taking the trouble to subscribe.....it's a great service.

I've only just seen the results......it's fantastic!

Well done Andy : )

Solerina

Solerina I have watched on Bet365 and never had to deposit a penny

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:04 pm

Solerina wrote:
Mad for Chelsea wrote:Hi Sol, how are things?

Andy looked pretty good in the bits I saw. Admittedly I only watched until 2-1 in the second but given he won the next four games on the trot he can't have got much worse

Looks like he's worked hard on the forehand, trying to dominate rallies off that side, which he wasn't able to before. He's added some pretty heavy topspin there too. Add to tha his improved movement (seems to be getting the hang of this sliding thing), and IMO he could start to seriously challenge on the dirt.

Hi Chelsea.....thanks for that.......I've been really busy .....hardly had chance to watch any of Andy's matches....just catching bits here and there.

Yes...he seems much happier on clay......this return to form is very exciting isn't it?

Win or lose tomorrow I hope he puts in a good performance......I might have to miss the end of the match as I will be going to work at 3.30.

I'm so looking forward to RG, now that Andy's got the hang of the sliding thing, as you put it lol.

Just imagine... Andy's first slam title could be on Clay......who'd have thought it lol

Anway, enjoy the match : )

Solerina

Solerina

Andy´s best chance of a GS is h.c. Clay is his worst surface no matter how well he plays tomorrow I wouldn´t look any further than that.

by Solerina Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:28 pm

Hi Haddie and Sonic boom,

I know realistically Andy won't be winning RG.......I'm just getting a little over-excited here.

It's been so long since, as a Murray fan, I've had anything to get excited about lol

If this return to form is here to stay I'll be very keen on his chances at the USO Very Happy

Haddie......bet365 stopped my live streaming and said if wanted to be able to continue to watch it I needed to deposit some money.

Maybe you don't have to because you're in Spain

Solerina

by Stealth Maestro Agro Love Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:30 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:Hi Sol, how are things?

Andy looked pretty good in the bits I saw. Admittedly I only watched until 2-1 in the second but given he won the next four games on the trot he can't have got much worse

Looks like he's worked hard on the forehand, trying to dominate rallies off that side, which he wasn't able to before. He's added some pretty heavy topspin there too. Add to tha his improved movement (seems to be getting the hang of this sliding thing), and IMO he could start to seriously challenge on the dirt.

Whilst I disagree with sonic_booms idea that Murray is a 'mug' on clay; the lad has reached the last 16 at the clay slam before, he raises a fair point as well. Murray is not great on the stuff, and to be honest he's always been reasonably decent at the whole sliding thing; you have to remember Murrays biggest assest is probably his movement.

To say that he's suddenly going to really challenge on the stuff though is a rather large over-reaction; Murray's opponents thus far, bar possibly Simon who is also a hard court specialist, are not exactly the sort that should actually be pushing Murray, even on clay. The likes of Ferrer, Nadal, Soderling are all a massive step up from what he's dealt with thus far and that's what he's got to overcome to really challenge. I think tomorrow is in all liklihood going to reveal a rather large gap between 'good' and 'great'.

You never know, to be fair, and Monte Carlo has been nothing but a huge plus for Murray this time around, but there's a reason Murray has no clay tournament wins and unless he's suddenly made a huge improvement in his game, which he doesn't really appear to have thus far; he is just playing like Murray again, which is bloody good on any surface, then he's going to remain winless on the stuff for this year I think.

Solerina wrote:Hi Haddie and Sonic boom,

I know realistically Andy won't be winning RG.......I'm just getting a little over-excited here.

It's been so long since, as a Murray fan, I've had anything to get excited about lol

You've gotta be kidding me. laughing

He was in a slam final 3 months ago. We had this doom and gloom tripe last year, and he did fine after the clay season again.

Try being a Blake fan, eh? Wink

I'd be over the moon for a slam quarter final, let alone a final appearance!!!

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:40 pm

Solerina wrote:Hi Haddie and Sonic boom,

I know realistically Andy won't be winning RG.......I'm just getting a little over-excited here.

It's been so long since, as a Murray fan, I've had anything to get excited about lol

If this return to form is here to stay I'll be very keen on his chances at the USO

Haddie......bet365 stopped my live streaming and said if wanted to be able to continue to watch it I needed to deposit some money.

Maybe you don't have to because you're in Spain

Solerina

Solerina check out that link I gave jubba its really a good streaming channel honest and it costs nothing.

by Mad for Chelsea Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:47 pm

Stealth Maestro Agro Love wrote:

Whilst I disagree with sonic_booms idea that Murray is a 'mug' on clay; the lad has reached the last 16 at the clay slam before, he raises a fair point as well. Murray is not great on the stuff, and to be honest he's always been reasonably decent at the whole sliding thing; you have to remember Murrays biggest assest is probably his movement.

To say that he's suddenly going to really challenge on the stuff though is a rather large over-reaction; Murray's opponents thus far, bar possibly Simon who is also a hard court specialist, are not exactly the sort that should actually be pushing Murray, even on clay. The likes of Ferrer, Nadal, Soderling are all a massive step up from what he's dealt with thus far and that's what he's got to overcome to really challenge. I think tomorrow is in all liklihood going to reveal a rather large gap between 'good' and 'great'.

You never know, to be fair, and Monte Carlo has been nothing but a huge plus for Murray this time around, but there's a reason Murray has no clay tournament wins and unless he's suddenly made a huge improvement in his game, which he doesn't really appear to have thus far; he is just playing like Murray again, which is bloody good on any surface, then he's going to remain winless on the stuff for this year I think.

Firstly, just to be pedantic, you do know he actually reached the last 8 at RG in 2009, right? Wink

Next, I disagree with you about the movement thing. Yes it has always ben one of his strengths but on HARD COURT. I think two of the reasons he's struggled on clay before now are
1) His inability to transfer his hard court movement onto clay, he's always looked kind of akward on the stuff.
2) His lack of a dominating forehand capable of dictating rallies from the back of the court, which all the other top clay courters have (Nadal, Djokovic, Federer, Soderling, Ferrer, etc.)

These two points I feel he's much improved on this year. I don't know how much of him you've watched on clay in previous years, but his movement seems a lot better this year, and his forehand much improved (he's added some heavy topspin). So yes, I do think he's made marked improvements to his clay court play.

Do I believe this will make him Nadal's equal all of a sudden? Nope not at all, of course not. When I said "seriously challenging" I was overreacting much as Sol was (and regardless of who you support, three months without a win is tough). What I really meant was that we could see him regularly in the last 8 or last 4 of clay tournaments from now on.

by Solerina Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:58 pm

Stealth Maestro Agro Love wrote:
You've gotta be kidding me.

He was in a slam final 3 months ago. We had this doom and gloom tripe last year, and he did fine after the clay season again!

Yes, of course Andy did brilliantly getting to the AO final.......seems an age ago to me now tho'

I am a Blake fan, Stealth, he seems such a nice guy : )

Anyway that was a very interesting post you just made....thanks,

Solerina

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:01 pm

It amazes me that Andy has found clay so difficult.. he trained here in Spain for 2 years with Rafa when he was in his early teens.. you would have thought it would have been a natural surface for him but he has always struggled with it and it begs the question as to why

by Solerina Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:01 pm

Another interesting post, from Chelsea.

This is all geting a bit much for me......I'm off to Horse Racing for a while........I know what I'm talking about on there Very Happy

Solerina

by Stealth Maestro Agro Love Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:07 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:
Stealth Maestro Agro Love wrote:

Whilst I disagree with sonic_booms idea that Murray is a 'mug' on clay; the lad has reached the last 16 at the clay slam before, he raises a fair point as well. Murray is not great on the stuff, and to be honest he's always been reasonably decent at the whole sliding thing; you have to remember Murrays biggest assest is probably his movement.

To say that he's suddenly going to really challenge on the stuff though is a rather large over-reaction; Murray's opponents thus far, bar possibly Simon who is also a hard court specialist, are not exactly the sort that should actually be pushing Murray, even on clay. The likes of Ferrer, Nadal, Soderling are all a massive step up from what he's dealt with thus far and that's what he's got to overcome to really challenge. I think tomorrow is in all liklihood going to reveal a rather large gap between 'good' and 'great'.

You never know, to be fair, and Monte Carlo has been nothing but a huge plus for Murray this time around, but there's a reason Murray has no clay tournament wins and unless he's suddenly made a huge improvement in his game, which he doesn't really appear to have thus far; he is just playing like Murray again, which is bloody good on any surface, then he's going to remain winless on the stuff for this year I think.

Firstly, just to be pedantic, you do know he actually reached the last 8 at RG in 2009, right?

Next, I disagree with you about the movement thing. Yes it has always ben one of his strengths but on HARD COURT. I think two of the reasons he's struggled on clay before now are
1) His inability to transfer his hard court movement onto clay, he's always looked kind of akward on the stuff.
2) His lack of a dominating forehand capable of dictating rallies from the back of the court, which all the other top clay courters have (Nadal, Djokovic, Federer, Soderling, Ferrer, etc.)

These two points I feel he's much improved on this year. I don't know how much of him you've watched on clay in previous years, but his movement seems a lot better this year, and his forehand much improved (he's added some heavy topspin). So yes, I do think he's made marked improvements to his clay court play.

Do I believe this will make him Nadal's equal all of a sudden? Nope not at all, of course not. When I said "seriously challenging" I was overreacting much as Sol was (and regardless of who you support, three months without a win is tough). What I really meant was that we could see him regularly in the last 8 or last 4 of clay tournaments from now on.

For all he's no natural on the stuff I still wouldn't say his problem is his movement. The players that have dumped him out of clay tournaments in the past have generally tended to be attacking players who can hit through the clay. The forehand is for me his big problem, and I've seen no real development in this. Murray does tend to hit it a bit flat for a player who is fairly defensive; if you look at Ferrer's fairly loopy shots compared to Murray's flatter efforts, which work fine on hard courts, you'll see what I mean.

The problem is that for all he's had the power to make those sort of shots really count on hard courts, it hasn't worked the same on clay, so ultimately he gives the big guns the ammo they need. So far the players he's been up against, Simon, Gil and serve and volleyer Stepanek aren't the sort of guys who have the power to punish Murray on clay; Gil and Simon in particular could only hope to outlast him, which is bordering on the impossible, and serve and volley on clay is close to suicide, so it's hard to really assess if there's been any major improvement.

Equally, Nadal will probably be an unfair assessment tomorrow as well, for the opposite reason. I just think Murray's found some form again, hence improvement. I'd like to see him play someone like Soderling or Verdasco if he gets out his rut or del Potro, as those lads are the ones that will ask the questions that ultimately will decide his fate on clay.

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:11 pm

Verdasco would not be a test for Andy at the moment he is tumbling down the rankings he has his own issues. Del Potro yes.. and even David Ferrer would be a good test.. David has raised his game considerably.. dont be surprised to see him in the final again this year.

by Stealth Maestro Agro Love Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:16 pm

Haddie-nuff wrote:Verdasco would not be a test for Andy at the moment he is tumbling down the rankings he has his own issues. Del Potro yes.. and even David Ferrer would be a good test.. David has raised his game considerably.. dont be surprised to see him in the final again this year.

Ferrer would I guess, but he's not the guy to test Murray's forehand I don't think; that would be more a stamina battle.

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:19 pm

O come on... you cant fault Ferrer for stamina... the man never knows when to give up... a typical cussed Spaniard !!!!! Very Happy

Plus his retrieval skills and court coverage are incredible.

by Mad for Chelsea Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:21 pm

Re the movement. While it hasn't been a big problem, he has IMO struggled to transfer his excellent hard court movement onto clay in the past.A good example would be the change of direction. In the past couple of years players have been successful against Murray using the drop shot on clay as he has struggled to change direction to chase it down. This year he's done really well chasing down the droppers.

Re the forehand. Well I personally think it's better this year, it's got a bit more of that loop you describe, though it's certainly not as good as Ferrer's (and not in the same league as Nadal).

So I'd say there are signs of improvements in Murray's clay court game. Maybe we'll have to agree to disagree Smile

Caveat. Your point about the quality of opposition is spot on.

Not sure I agree about your analysis of players who have beaten Murray on clay. Over the last couple of years he has lost to Nadal, Monaco, Del Potro, Gonzalez, Kohlschreiber (a match which still gives me nightmares), Ferrer (twice) and Berdych. Of those, I would class only the Gonzalez and Berdych losses as players hitting through him.

by sonic_boom10 Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:22 pm

Sorry but whether Verdasco is dropping down the rankings or not - he's a mighty fine clay court player.He definitely has the power to blast Murray off the court.

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:28 pm

You dont have to tell me that .. I know.. and under normal circumstances I would agree.. but at this moment in time the only person Nando beats is himself.
He has been nursing a foot injury for a long time now.. and at the end of last year was debating whether to have an operation.. given the age he is foot operations are notoriously difficult to recover from.. he has postponed it. And I think it shows. Nando is one of my fav players so I am not being critical of him without reason

by sonic_boom10 Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:30 pm

Haddie-nuff wrote:You dont have to tell me that .. I know.. and under normal circumstances I would agree.. but at this moment in time the only person Nando beats is himself.
He has been nursing a foot injury for a long time now.. and at the end of last year was debating whether to have an operation.. given the age he is foot operations are notoriously difficult to recover from.. he has postponed it. And I think it shows. Nando is one of my fav players so I am not being critical of him without reason

I read he had a broken foot Shocked

Some fighting sprite that he's still playing with it

by Haddie-nuff Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:33 pm

I know he has had problems for some considerable time... he cannot slide on clay too well as a result. Nando is a hard court player rather than clay.. he and Feli Lopez were "brought up" on the h.c. in Madrid.. he is much happier on that surface. But whatever the reason for his foot injury I think its beginning to take its toll. Shame Nando has a wonderful game .. his forehand is incredible and that semi-final at the AO against Rafa was brilliant.

by sonic_boom10 Fri Apr 15, 2011 10:38 pm

Haddie-nuff wrote:I know he has had problems for some considerable time... he cannot slide on clay too well as a result. Nando is a hard court player rather than clay.. he and Feli Lopez were "brought up" on the h.c. in Madrid.. he is much happier on that surface. But whatever the reason for his foot injury I think its beginning to take its toll. Shame Nando has a wonderful game .. his forehand is incredible and that semi-final at the AO against Rafa was brilliant.

I was enjoying his emerging rivalry with Rafa, hopefully he can get back to his best(providing he fixes his foot)

by socal1976 Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:54 am

I think the difference so far with Andy, is that I think in the last couple of weeks he has worked on the forehand. He is hitting it with more body rotation which allows for both more pace and spin. When he starts missing the forehand its all arm with the shot he doesn't get into a closed stance and really turn into the shot. And he also doesn't get very good knee bend or leg drive either. When he is miss firing on the forehand it seems like he is just arming the ball over. But he has been turning on the forehand real well, albeit against some pretty inferior opposition.

Good for Andy, I hope he will come back into the mix at the very top.

by Haddie-nuff Sat Apr 16, 2011 1:31 pm

What a star you are David... I said you would make the final.
A demonstration of clay court tennis at its best.
If Rafa makes the final tomorrow... we should be in for a treat.
Yahoo

Vamos..

Quite a different ball game for Melzer Whistle

by socal1976 Sat Apr 16, 2011 1:47 pm

Can't wait for the semi between Nadal and Murray, two great scramblers playing on a slow court, both capable of great tennis. Rafa is too strong though, however I think Murray is not going to get whipped, it should be a relatively close match.

by Haddie-nuff Sat Apr 16, 2011 1:54 pm

Im hedging my bets but Andy seldom looks comfortable on clay where Rafa looks so at ease..... scramble may well be the operative word. However Im no good at predictions probably because I hate having egg on my face Ok!

by Solerina Sat Apr 16, 2011 3:08 pm

Looks like the first set will go to Rafa.......watching the tennis and horse racing at the same time Erm

Solewrina

by yummymummy Sat Apr 16, 2011 3:52 pm

Great play from both Rafa and Andy thumbsup

by Mad for Chelsea Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:26 pm

Hi all, just got here, in time to see Andy get one break back, though he's still down 4-1.

Go Andy!!!!

Yahoo

by Mad for Chelsea Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:34 pm

Andy promptly fails to win another point, but still a great effort and he can take plenty of positives from today. Wel done to both players!

by sonic_boom10 Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:25 pm

Nadal was very average today and still had far to much for Murray.

Imagine was might occur in Barca, Madrid and Rome is he reaches his normal level.

by Haddie-nuff Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:25 pm

I agree with you sonic.. Rafa took time off in that second set .. he was very mediocre iI thought . I found it tedious to watch frankly but . he got the wake up call in the third. If Andy stopped beating himself up he would do a lot better its counter productive and I think he makes it harder for himself

by yummymummy Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:53 pm

sonic_boom10 wrote:Nadal was very average today and still had far to much for Murray.

Imagine was might occur in Barca, Madrid and Rome is he reaches his normal level.

Congratulations sonic boom - You've made your dislike of Murray absolutely clear.

Do you think you could curb your *wummery* Just a little for the sake of those of
is who joined 6062V to get away from this sort of thing ?

by sonic_boom10 Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:56 pm

yummymummy wrote:
sonic_boom10 wrote:Nadal was very average today and still had far to much for Murray.

Imagine was might occur in Barca, Madrid and Rome is he reaches his normal level.

Congratulations sonic boom - You've made your dislike of Murray absolutely clear.

Do you think you could curb your *wummery* Just a little for the sake of those of
is who joined 6062V to get away from this sort of thing ?

Wummery?

I was making a statement about Nadal, who cares about Murray?

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:12 pm

Yummy: A leopard cannot change its spots; there is only one course of action. Others have forewarned of this eventuality as the football season draws to a close.

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:16 pm

People can have a dislike of certain players, in football there are players i dont like and i express my views about them.
It all a matter of opinion.

But going forward, and as a general rule of this board i say to ALL, everyone is entitled to their view point, but please no not abuse other posters because they happen to like a certain player that you dislike.

If we all liked the same thing, the forum would be boring. We are all here to debate. If there are reasons for disliking a player, back it up with constructive criticism but please do not have a go at eachother in the process.

Cheers
Y I Man

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:26 pm

sonic_boom10 wrote:Murray is a choker, he must be part South African

What is the implied relationship between "choker" and being "part South African"?

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:28 pm

Its a reference to S African cricketers being chokers/bottlers

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:36 pm

Y I Man wrote:Its a reference to S African cricketers being chokers/bottlers

Now that is a confusing as there is no evidence of the S African cricketers being "chokers/bottlers" and it is entirely irrelevant to tennis:
http://www.espncricinfo.com/rankings/content/page/211271.html

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:39 pm

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2011-03-25/news/29187767_1_chokers-tag-south-africa-kiwis

Although its nothing to do with tennis the saying is something that a cricket fan would say.

by Guest Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:54 pm

Y I Man wrote:http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2011-03-25/news/29187767_1_chokers-tag-south-africa-kiwis

Although its nothing to do with tennis the saying is something that a cricket fan would say.

Hi thanks for this new perspective, it seemed like the 606v2 member was attempting to make an unfathomable racist comment. I think I will avoid the cricketing forum.

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