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Hearn or Warren - Who will come out on top ??

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Rowley
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Post by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 19 Jul 2012, 2:30 pm

This is the biggest grudge match in Boxing...

Warren still has the boxers..though Hearn is catching him up!!

Boxnation is still in it's infancy and warren has a friend in the Luxembourg commission...who knows what old names may decide to come back with licences flying about??? Warren has the WBO...and cheap titles always appeal to Boxers!!!

However Hearn has the prestigious top spot at SKY!!! He's vanquished Hatton...Maloney is no real threat...

Hearn or Warren - Who will come out on top?????

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Post by Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn Thu 19 Jul 2012, 2:35 pm

Both have big cards on TV on 22nd Sept:

Hearn: Carl Frampton vs Kiko Martinez

Warren: Ricky Burns vs Kev Mitchell

Will be interesting to see who gets more viewers. Being bias of course I will be at the Frampton fight, but I think that would be a better fight regardless.
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Post by alanqlm Thu 19 Jul 2012, 2:36 pm

Frampton will get more views simply by being on Sky as opposed to subscription Boxnation... And while I would be watching Frampton due to the same biased... I think there in no denying Burns v Mitchell is the bigger fight.

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Post by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Jul 2012, 2:36 pm

Hearn, by virtue of it not costing £20 (in ref to Reborn).

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Post by SugarRayRussell (PBK) Thu 19 Jul 2012, 2:41 pm

Boxnation is back down to £10 a month it was only at £18 for the week before the Haye v Chsiora fight. Anyone who paid £18 is a fool.

Burns v Mitchell is no doubt the better fight and will have a bigger crowd in the arena as well. The Frampton fight might get slightly more viewers but not that many he isn't that big a draw.

Haye v Chsiora got more viewers than Froch v Bute. If it's all down to viewing figures Mick Hennessey is the top man tyson Fury and Kid Galahad are the 2 biggest draws in the sport.
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Post by Rowley Thu 19 Jul 2012, 2:51 pm

Would never do to write Frank off because you do not stay at the top of a business as cut throat as boxing without being a smart cookie and being resilient, however I would probably struggle to recall a time his cupboard has looked quite so bare talent wise. Cleverly can hardly buy a good write up at the minute and is at a crossroads, can’t get away with fighting muppets but is not good enough for the best at his weight probably. The Olympians who were next to be his next big stars are either beset by injuries or personal problems (Gavin and Saunders) or desperately trying to fly the coup (Degale) even some of his younger fighters like Callum Johnson have been moaning about money and inactivity.

Hearn does appear to be the flavor of the month, has Sky behind him and in Froch and Brook has probably the best fighter to watch in Britain and the guy most likely to secure a world title and for as long as Prizefighter and the other sports that draw the figures you would have to think he would have Sky’s backing but things can change fairly quickly, however you do wonder if there is a sea change occurring because if you were a young amateur turning over where would you choose to be showcased, on Sky Sports or Boxnation?

However for all that I would never write Frank off because anyone who can get shot and still remain the biggest promoter in Britain is hardly likely to be discouraged by a new promoter appearing on the scene.

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Post by Guest Thu 19 Jul 2012, 3:02 pm

Look for news that a "mysterious outbreak of food poisoning" has broken out after the Matchroom Xmas do.

Frank Warren will be on a high profile, high visibility tour thousands of miles away at the time!!!!!!!!!!!! Whistle

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Post by Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn Thu 19 Jul 2012, 3:35 pm

what were the Haye vs Chisora figures Kev?
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Post by SugarRayRussell (PBK) Thu 19 Jul 2012, 4:03 pm

Triss Dixon said it was around 700k just pipping Froch v Bute which was about 650k.

Boxnation like Sky don't release figures.
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Post by owen10ozzy Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:04 pm

Rowley makes a good point with regards to Warren ...write him off at your own peril.

However I do think their is a sea of change occuring on the British scene. Unless Hearn makes an absolute mess of it he should go from strength to strength from here on out....and the chances of making mistakes are slim when you have Mr Barry Hearn as your father.

When he first came into the sport I remember thinking..hmm could be a bit of a pet project for Eddie to work on...

However it has the full backing of his Dad and you only need to look at what Barry has done with Darts and very quickly doing with Snooker to see how good this family is when it comes to selling sport.

In Froch and Brook he has two immediate draws...not huge but certainly big enough to make some money and increase his stable. Froch has around 3 big fights left in him I think....and he is increasing his draw every time he is on now.

Brook is building a fan base quite quickly when you see where he was 18 months ago without Hearn. The added bonus is that the following will only get bigger...northerners are notoriously loyal fans and Sheffield has been crying out for a talented fighter since Naseem.

Then we have the exciting prospect in Frampton who again will have a large following as he builds plus the Darren Barker.

He also has a string of exciting young lads in the form John Ryder, Scotty Cardle,Tommy Ghent..

I believe he has a few signings in the pipeline for some of the amateur lads who just lost out on an Olympic spot. These will turn pro without the lofty expectations of those at the Olympics and will also cost a fair whack less.

I like this idea and think he has learned from Warren's mistakes who as has been mentioned invested a lot in the Beijing class and has had his fingers massively burned!....

And after all of that you have Prizefighter aswell...which whilst can be poor has thrown out some good tournaments aswell.

As for Warren...well where do we start. For me he is quickly going backwards regardless of the Haye V Chisora card..

Though it may have got 700,000 viewers im sure 50% perhaps a little more were already signed up and if rumours are to be believed it was not a cheap show to put on and if Warren made money from it the margins were relatively short.

He does have a fairly decent stable of fighters but they are not fighting regular enough and the level of competition being put in front of them is pretty appalling.

I would be surprised if he keeps hold of DeGale (not sure how big a loss he is mind) and Frankie Gavin is a liability.

That still of course leaves him Groves, Chisora, Bellew, Cleverley, Burns, Mitchell....plenty of names their to make a good go of it...

But again I think he is making mistakes in building card's around one of them...think he really needs to start stacking them..

For instance Burns v Mitchell we ideally need to see..at least one of Bellew, Cleverely plus 3 of the prospects in the stable.

The signs in the coming months are good as he does have Broner's fight aswell as Guerrero...Cloud v Pascal, Bailey v Alexander and Matthysse v Olusegan...

Whether he can keep up with that and continue to bring numerous cards from both sides of the atlantic remains to be seen.... however on past evidence im not hopeful.

I remember being sucked into subscribing when the channel first appeared, got my first 2 (maybe 3 cant remember) months free and then he had some excellent shows for about 6 weeks after that...then BOOM! It all went south and it was just crap the majority of time with numerous fights from the past that werent even great...

Cant help but feel the same is being done here..get people suckered in on the Haye fight..get some big cards on in the following weeks and then 2 months down the line it will return to being naff.

For me..at this moment in time I only see one real winner. If Hearn can keep up the good work I see him getting plenty more dates on next years SKY calendar and if he does his stable will no doubt get even stronger.

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Post by Rowley Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:09 pm

owen10ozzy wrote:

I believe he has a few signings in the pipeline for some of the amateur lads who just lost out on an Olympic spot. These will turn pro without the lofty expectations of those at the Olympics and will also cost a fair whack less.

He has already signed Iain Weaver I believe, I saw Weaver win his ABA title a few years ago, he is a tidy fighter and a decent prospect.

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Post by owen10ozzy Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:13 pm

Yeh I caught something on Ringside couple of weeks back..

I have it on good authority he is chasing two of the lads from the Olympic squad aswell (can't reveal names) and they are pretty much sewn up deals...

Alot of them have been approached but keeping options open until afterwards, put it this way I can't see a plethora moving to Warren given what has happened with DeGale and co...

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Post by ShahenshahG Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:16 pm

Frank has price possibly and Probably Haye on his cards which will keep him ticking over now. The heavyweights always bring in the money and if price is as good as we think he is - it could mean good things for frank. Sauerland might also be willing to deal with frank rather than Haye directly so the options are open.

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Post by Guest Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:19 pm

The trick with the Olympians will be how they're marketed. If we start having novice pros headling events like Audley and DeGale then we're up the proverbial creek without a paddle.

Stick 'em on the undercard of a well known fighter but make it perfectly clear they are not top of the bill. Hopefully Hearn will realise this and avoid subjecting his charges to the sort of ridicule that DeGale suffered (mind you, that was all justified)

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Post by Rowley Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:21 pm

Will be interesting to see what happens with the Olympic lads next time round as even their staunchest defenders would have to admit the last lot have not excactly worked out as planned. Am sure they will find pro contracts as they have obvious talent but suspect they may not find huge contracts being waved in front of their noses, particularly with how few promoters have TV deals nowadays. Would not surprise me to see Hennessy pick a couple up as his terrestrial deal must be an attraction.

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Post by Guest Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:26 pm

Course it'll all be for naught if none of them pick up a medal.

The boxer who signs with Hennessey must be daft, deluded or desperate.

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Post by Super D Boon Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:26 pm

rowley wrote:Will be interesting to see what happens with the Olympic lads next time round as even their staunchest defenders would have to admit the last lot have not excactly worked out as planned. Am sure they will find pro contracts as they have obvious talent but suspect they may not find huge contracts being waved in front of their noses, particularly with how few promoters have TV deals nowadays. Would not surprise me to see Hennessy pick a couple up as his terrestrial deal must be an attraction.

I saw James DeGale in Cardiff yesterday. What was he doing over here??

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Post by owen10ozzy Thu 19 Jul 2012, 5:31 pm

Shah - Yeh good point regards Price...Hearn hasn't even put anything forward for him which I find hugely puzzling, had he got Price I really think we could be discussing a huge change in the waters..as it is it would seem (95% anyway) that Frank has got his lifeline with Price.

I don't put much stock on Haye as he is only looking for one fight now and that seems a long way off now if were honest.

Dave667 - That's where I think Hearns 'man of the people' approach sets him apart from Warren. Everything the Hearn family does they do as fans of the sport rather than businessmen.

Of course their is a business sense to it but they look at it as fans...i.e. if you were a fan would you rather go to a fight with one good fighter and crap undercard or go to a stacked event.

The Ireland card announced today is a bit of cracker...and the Quigg v Munroe card was a pretty decent one aswell.

Also dont think picking up a medal is the be all anymore either. Didn't work with Harrison...people know now more than ever that a good amateur doesn't always make a good pro.

Rowley - No doubt they will all find themselves with pro-contracts but you are right in that the figures will not be daft. I also believe that alot of clauses are going to be drawn into the contracts this time around in a way of having a safety net if things dont go as planned. As I said 2 names are already signed up to deals...that leaves 5 for the promoters to scramble over.

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Post by Sugar Boy Sweetie Thu 19 Jul 2012, 10:11 pm

Has to be said Hearn is in the driving seat as he has the (comparatively) free to air platform and higher profile fighters in Frich & Brook. Frank may have had a good night on Saturday but that's because he had David Haye and all his hype in tow - it's nit every month or even every year he's gonna be able to put such a high profile fight on BoxNation with the stable he currently has, unless he starts over matching Cleverly and risking him taking some losses. BoxNation has to be putting on quality shows every month to justify a monthly subscription to its punters and frank just doesn't have the stable to do that. The channel is still in its infancy, but I think it will dwindle over the long term. Meanwhile up & coming fighters will be more attracted to Hearn due to the more accessible platform he can provide.
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