A few AB changes for the Bok test

Well it seems Hansen is not a fan of rotation. But it also seems he wasn't a fan of what he saw in Wellington.

Aaron Smith has felt the wrath of the selectors and has been dropped in favour of Weepu, who stood out in better conditions. I wonder how much this has to do with Smith being a small man and the Bok backrow a big physical presence. In a way I see it as a smart call by Hansen and co and it keeps the young Smith eager and keen to earn that starting spot back. Putting on Smith in the last quarter or half hour with tiring legs and his quick service could also be a smart move. I wouldn't be surprised to see the same move for the away match in Argentina.

Cruden can count himself lucky that Carter is still not right as I imagine he'd have replaced Cruden as well. But Cruden gets another crack and in a way I'm happy for that as well so he can make amends. Messam comes in for Vito and he bumps Thomson again from the bench. I don't like him at all though as a backrow option but it's clear the selectors like something about him. Whitelock was told he wasn't playing well enough but now Retallick is being told the same thing. Ali Williams was training with the ABs as well and it seems he's likely to tour this autumn, which I'm not at all happy about. Far better to think of the future than to hold onto an experienced player past his prime.

There is much to be thankful from an AB perspective, especially with respect to injuries. But it seems the transition period is still very much a work in progress in some positions. I don't think it's a bad thing that players are given the message that if they don't perform then they're going to be dropped. You have to strive for consistency and some of these calls have come about because of below par performances.

Ian Foster should be admonishing the players for their inaccuracy as the backline has yet to click in this 4N. The forwards have done enough but overall there is much room for improvement across the board. The perfect game is what the players are chasing and even though it's really unobtainable they should be aiming that high in order to get the best possible performance. I think the correct changes have been made and it's up to the whole squad to prove their place.

I disagree about Smith Kia. We're now coming up against a relatively green Bok pack who won't be as physical as the Argies and in an indoor stadium where the pace of the game will be higher. It'd be ideal for him to fire out passes in a dry deck behind a pack that should have more ascendancy.

Same. And he cant just play smith in the easy matches. Good and bad matches are all part of the learning for a new player fnding their way. The smith sbw absence gives this backline a drop in gear feel to it.

He can still do that in the second half. I just think he's protecting him in the first half where the Boks will be at their most aggressive and angriest.

Look at it logically Weepu has had a lot time with Cruden,the complete former Hurricanes back line less Dagg.Whitelock is the best lock in NZ week in,week out
indeed one of the best in the World currently.Romano is his partner Hansen is going for combinations.Surprised Ben Franks discarded his experience will be missed if either starting Prop is injured.Messam has started most matches at 6,Vito does`nt convince but Thomson has`nt played you don`t change winning teams.Thomson is supposed to still be in the loop according to Hansen,but it`s obvious he isn`t going to play the 4Ns now.Unless he gets AIs starts he will be lost to Nz Rugby and that is criminal to a squad member since 2007RWC.

True...that was also the thinking with weepu on the bench. Id still have used him first to get early points. Sacking this side early is key to not losing fingernails in the last ten minutes where nothing happens. Hate that feeling.

I wouldnt read too much into Weepu starting, Since he will struggle to make it to the 60 minute mark I can see them getting about half a game each, just depends on whats happening on the scoreboard. I do like the idea of him (Smith) having an impact player role though.

Yeah I see that but Smith means urgency from the get go and NZ are fitter than SA in the forwards at present. So some that 60 minute mark NZ could have broken them down enough to release the outside backs in space and really hammer home an advantage. Weepu had a great cameo but I feel we're missing a trick here-the pack will handle SA's fire and brimstone first up so Smith would have been fine.

Apparently Smith broke team 'recovery' protocols, whatever they were...

Another point is I do like Smith and Cruden and that Manawatu combination has played a lot of rugby together.

What's that EBOP? Recovering with a Steinlager or ten or missing a training/recovery date?

Disney,Since it Piris job to get the late stragglers out of the pub he must have missed a training session..

The Argentina play a suffocating game style and spoiling too. Too much is made of NZ having a "bad game" because they didn't put on 40 points. You will notice in history most teams have a "bad game" against Argentina and it is just a function of their limited, focussed, defense-oriented strategy.

In time, with experience playing against it, the ABs will unlock the secret to break up this defense. But for now to hang it out on the players who played in bad conditions against difficult opposition in new patterns is naiive by the coaches and a knee-jerk.

Weepu is a classy player and at his best, the worlds most composed and multi-skilled 9/10. It was right for the selectors and coaches to stick with him and he deserves his opportunities to show he is not just a pie eating contestent of note.

Ali Williams hasn't played well in the All Black shirt for 3 years and needs to go out to pasture. I think it is the work-load on the Whitelock, Retallick that is showing in their resting as well as some bold disrespect to the SA pack!

I have no problem with Romano, Whitelock, or Retallick but if a fourth member is to be Added it should be Craig Clarke not Ali Williams.

Plus Clarke has the proven leadership qualities.

Correct AWOP it was never going to be a blow out versus Argentina in any conditions let alone last Saturdays.Respect the Boks in an indoor stadium Franz
Steyn can kick goals from his own half.Thats dangerous,also beware the wounded Bok. Like most here I want a complete performance from an AllBlack side,but a win by 8 or more points.Without concedeing 4 tries[unlikely] would mean a losing bonus point versus Argentina would almost certainly seal the 4Ns.The worse case being losing both the final 2 away matches which is always possible.

Be fair Ali Williams in 2008 was in a class of his own,he did his achilles twice missing 2009,and 2010.He has`nt reached the same level since that injury is usually career finishing .IF the operation was a success and he shows sufficent form he should be considered along with the rest.Not thrown aside like an old muck bucket he does`nt deserve that BUT he must prove his worth.

Emack
Lets see him "prove his worth" for Auckland, before we consider him for selection.

auckland Laurie PRECISELY my point BUT he has earned the right by his past worth to be given the chance.

Can't agree. he's been consistently bad for Auckland and the AB's in at least his last dozen outings. He's had chances with the AB's Alan- many...and flopped in them all.

Should a player get selected on that basis even though he 'used to be good'. No way. Clarke deserves a shot far more than Ali at this point in time.

Reaks of mates rates as I've said earlier...Ali is a chummy type that will have strong inside links with the team on a personal level.

It appears Smith has been a naughty boy, benched for 'breach of protocol' not form http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10833743

Fair enough. Good to set an example while hes so young. Possibly the stardom is starting to play with his head with the multitude of accolades he must have read (on forums like these), heard etc. Good to keep him grounded, and hungry...

In that case I agree. Gotta keep the discipline and nip stuff like that in the bud. Weepu did play bloody well when he came on too.

I have no problem with Ali Williams being close to the squad as his experience and knowledge should be shared with the team but his play does not merit getting onto the field. It's as simple as that for me.

Yeah Weepu was very good alright! If he has a cracker this weekend, I'm going to sweep his post WC blues under the table and not make any more KFC jokes.

And Messam, do you recall him receiving the ball and juggling it about 5 times and then finally catching it. That was the kind of ball spilt by others. He made headway up the field to.

Yeah I knew that all along. Didn't make that clear in the OP.

Definitely the right move. Got to stamp out such behaviour in a young man. Hope he comes on and doesn't try to force things. He just needs to do what he's been doing with that pass of his.

The benching is something and nothing,if it`s bad drop him for the match must be something relatively minor.Ali has`nt really regained 2008 form and if he`s been carrying an injury as has been implied can`t really judge him properly.The real Ritchie McCaw was missing for two seasons with the foot injury.This season post his latest OP he has been back to his oldself THE BEST.Perhaps Ali will have similar luck.

The benching is something and nothing,if it`s bad drop him for the match must be something relatively minor.Ali has`nt really regained 2008 form and if he`s been carrying an injury as has been implied can`t really judge him properly.The real Ritchie McCaw was missing for two seasons with the foot injury.This season post his latest OP he has been back to his oldself THE BEST.Perhaps Ali will have similar luck.

Maybe but a he ain't in the same league as McCaw in terms of being a talismanic figure and b I'm quite happy with Romano and Whitelock starting. Won't give those guys a lot of confidence to know a bloke past his best before date (not use by, just best before) can jump ahead of them at any moment without having to prove he's good enough again.

The boat is sailing away and Ali ain't on it. He's well past it and all he does these days is niggle and give away pens. He's just a lump, no athletism left in him. Still, he may be able to share some tips with the new guys.

Interesting to see what nonu decides, whether he'll stay or go. Stuff says he needs to decide in two weeks.

In fairness nonu has had a hard time of it spending most of his career being doubted about his abilities for the top job.
Wouldn't be there if SBW stayed let's face it.

He remains for me the single worst ommission from the 2007 wcup where he may have made a diff in a match like the french one.

Good luck to him.. I'm ready to see him move on for now as he's starting to represent a past era in our game.

Yeah Tman, 2007 was a shame for Nonu. Big fan of his and hope he stays in NZ. The Dagg try he set up against SA in the dying seconds in his socks is one of my favorite tries ever.

I heard a theory on the radio today that Woodcock left AKL due to the Henry factor. Not so much that he doesn't respect or rate him (obviously), but because he knew what it had in stall for him and he was perhaps not ready for another dose. Henry would be an awesome coach for young motivated upcoming players, but older players may become weary. Especially with the pressures of s15 and then ABs. It'd be a full on year and mentally exhausting. I'm sure Jamie is a similar hard man to GH, but at least it's in a fresh environment.

Nonu could be in the same boat and he's known for his rebellious streak. Hope he shifts to Highlandets and not overseas, but how would he fit in with Jamie's disciplined regime? Perhaps it would be good for him personally if he did go to France for a couple of years. I'd certainly wish him well if he did.

Taylorman wrote:In fairness nonu has had a hard time of it spending most of his career being doubted about his abilities for the top job.
Wouldn't be there if SBW stayed let's face it.

He remains for me the single worst ommission from the 2007 wcup where he may have made a diff in a match like the french one.

Good luck to him.. I'm ready to see him move on for now as he's starting to represent a past era in our game.

I'm not sure. Both flyhalves went off injured during the game, so not going to fill that space. If he was on at 12, then presumably McAllister wouldn't have been on the field? Was he playing 13 at time. We were playing two distributors at 10 and 12 so it would have been a different style. Given the uniquely low penalty count he would have had to create a try scoring opportunity. One are he might have made a difference was getting over the advantage line. Although in this game he would likely have been hit as he received the ball.

Nonu is arguably the best 12 in World Rugby and his link with Conrad Smith is the World`s best midfield.SBW is a great player but not as yet at the same level as Nonu.Crusaders are looking at options for a quality 12 and Nonu is the best option apparently.From his own point of view he has 60 odd caps so if he wants to follow the money good luck to him.BUT he himself has stated his loyalty to the Black shirt and Coaches should think twice before dumping him for the flavour of the month.SBW MAY be back 2014 but that is by no means a certainty and Nonu would certainly be in the frame starting at 12 in2015RWC.

blackcanelion wrote:

Taylorman wrote:In fairness nonu has had a hard time of it spending most of his career being doubted about his abilities for the top job.
Wouldn't be there if SBW stayed let's face it.

He remains for me the single worst ommission from the 2007 wcup where he may have made a diff in a match like the french one.

Good luck to him.. I'm ready to see him move on for now as he's starting to represent a past era in our game.

I'm not sure. Both flyhalves went off injured during the game, so not going to fill that space. If he was on at 12, then presumably McAllister wouldn't have been on the field? Was he playing 13 at time. We were playing two distributors at 10 and 12 so it would have been a different style. Given the uniquely low penalty count he would have had to create a try scoring opportunity. One are he might have made a difference was getting over the advantage line. Although in this game he would likely have been hit as he received the ball.

Given that the French defensive line was standing at first receiver for ther All Blacks most of the second half, it's unlikely Nonu could have made much impact. The All Blacks made the right call that day by keeping it close and driving towards the line, executed well and spent most of the game camped in the French 22. If only the French had not been allowed to commit foul after foul after foul every time the ruck got close to the line, then victory would have been assured.

We learnt much from that game AWoP so in future years we may look back on it as a blessing. It'll be taught in the 101 AB manual, take a DG when you can in important games!!