Glaws v Bath - West Country Derby Build Up

So this Saturday is the big West Country derby (please don't get into semantics on this one!) when Bath visit Gloucester. I am not one to harp on about the same thing over and over again, but in case you missed it Glaws have now beaten Bath in 9 of the last 10 games. One key stat I haven't mentioned is that the overall head to head from the Jeff is sitting at 17 wins for Glaws and 18 wins for Bath.

Both sides have new coaching set ups and a raft of new players. Glaws are currently sitting in 5th with 15 points (3 wins, 1 draw, 1 lose) and Bath are 6th with 14 points (3 wins, 2 loses). Both sides have also been criticised in the past for having weak packs, but both also seem to have improved in this area this season. Taking my natural bias aside, I would suggest Glaws have probably seen the biggest improvement in the pack and the scrum is now a key weapon, although this is at the expense of the lineout.

It is going to rain for most of the week, but at present Saturday is due to be a balmy October day with clear sunshine and 15c warmth. So likely to be slippery, but still conditions to throw it about a bit.

Notably this game is to be refereed by Dave Pearson and I believe I am correct in saying this will be his last game before taking up a different role.

The latest odds are:
Glaws 9/10
Bath 10/1

So prediction time: the sweeping tide of Glaws victories will continue in a fiercely fought yet open game which Glaws will run out 32-18 winners

I'd expect Glaws to put out the following side:
Wood, Edmonds (d'Apice if not fit), Harden; Savage, Hamilton; Kalamafoni, Hazell (Qera if not fit), Morgan; Robson, Burns; Simpson-Daniel, Twelvetrees, Tindall, May (Monahan if not fit), Cook

d'Apice/Britton, Murphy, Knight, James, Qera/Cox, Lewis (probably too soon for Cowan), Trinder, Thomas

HKC - Who is your better lock out of James and Brown and who runs the lineout for you?

how is Robson going this season? Having heard such rave reviews last year I was left disappointed with his performances in the JWC.

Bathite wrote:HKC - Who is your better lock out of James and Brown and who runs the lineout for you?

Brown is the better lineout option by far, but he has been off form for a while and whilst his defence is still excellent, his ball carrying is limited. Unfortunately when we play him our scrum is not as good. James is a big lump, who in fairness to him is having somewhat of an Indian Summer in his career. He seems to be notably fitter and really adds to our game.

In terms of the lineout Hamilton runs it and is really our only proper option. Savage is fast improving, but he's no Brown in the lineout. It will be a definite area for Bath to attack us at.

LondonTiger wrote:how is Robson going this season? Having heard such rave reviews last year I was left disappointed with his performances in the JWC.

He's been going pretty well. He's had the odd duff pass and kick, but in general his management is very good. He also offers a real threat running with ball in hand. Having had Rory Lawson for so many years who would never ever run it's good to have a SH who can keep the defence guessing. I fully expect Cowan to be first choice once he's ready, but Robson will be the firm 2nd choice.

8-12 is where Gloucester will win it - superior in every position. Fearns will be a 1 man wrecking ball again, but in vain. Suspect Eastmond/Biggs and Abendanon will need thermals, as we don't have any 12s left who can pass!

I think probably 6-12 to be honest, back row without Louw is pretty average

Didn't know where Fearns would be playing!

Expect this will be the start of Baths losing streak up til after christmas. We have a poor back row consisting of no Louw, and poor AP level players Taylor and Skirving as our starting options. We have given away our current best player who has been scoring all our points, leaving us with a fly half who has had virtually no game time this season and proved sweet FA last season when he wasn't injured. We also have no quality/depth at inside centre and no depth at hooker. Hopefully after christmas banahan, agulla, heathcote, donald and webber will all be fit on form and firing and Gold may have lured over a big name saffa to prop our midfield (Hershs big name signing ?!) but until then its going to be painful for the faithful.

I think we'll lose the back row and breakdown battle regardless. Still crossing fingers for a win, but can't see a solution at 10 or 12?!! (Please don't make it 10. Donald 12. Vesty)

Very little other options!! Vesty is dependable if not spectacular.

Are you guys trying to give us a false sense of security here? I've never known you be this pessimistic with all your other false dawns!

What's the situation with Heathcote at the moment?

Well Ive made it to all Baths Home games this season and I can't make it to Gloucester unfortunately. But both teams have had a good weekend last, and should make for a hell of a battle...

Enjoy all, I will be watching avidly

Talking of Cowan and Robson, I actually think Dave Lewis has looked alright this season also. Really slated him last year, but seems to at least be competing for the 9 shirt instead of being the only option.

I agree Lewis has improved this season, but he is in the last year of his contract and I think could struggle to get a new one. I'd also question whether that was the best move for him. I think he has the potential to be a good SH, but he could do with regular game time, so maybe it is time for him to move on?

Bath are going to get tonked. Should be a good practice run for those Glos backs before they face some real compatition the week after.

Not sure that Saints are that much better than Bath.

maestegmafia wrote:Not sure that Saints are that much better than Bath.

Whatever you're drinking I'll have a pint of please!

Saints are a far btter side than Bath.

I always take in interest in the close border clubs around Wales and I honestly cannot wait for this game, there will be passion galore, now all we need is Bristol back in the top flight, them along with Worcester Gloucester and Bath and the West country is fast becoming a hotbed for English rugby.

Best News your gonna hear before the Scoreline...


HAPPY HOUR PRE MATCH

http://www.gloucesterrugby.co.uk/news/7758.php

The pre-match entertainment is quite good at Kingsholm. Proper real ales (which sell out fast!) and a Q&A with players not in the match squad. Followed by a ruddy good win over Bath

There is no danger of Bristol joining the West Country big boys for a while.

To be honest if I won a silly amount of money on the lottery (say 100+ million) I'd be tempted to help Bristol out.

HongKongCherry wrote:

Bathite wrote:HKC - Who is your better lock out of James and Brown and who runs the lineout for you?

Brown is the better lineout option by far, but he has been off form for a while and whilst his defence is still excellent, his ball carrying is limited. Unfortunately when we play him our scrum is not as good. James is a big lump, who in fairness to him is having somewhat of an Indian Summer in his career. He seems to be notably fitter and really adds to our game.

In terms of the lineout Hamilton runs it and is really our only proper option. Savage is fast improving, but he's no Brown in the lineout. It will be a definite area for Bath to attack us at.

HKC
Sorry, late to your thread but totally agree. It seems Big Jim is obliged to do the lineout jumping single handedly lately. He took an ankle bash on Sunday,and we did struggle in the l/o as attested by the match stats.

From what I've heard the knock won't stop him playing on Saturday. But we have sacrificed the lineout for the scrum, but to be honest I would rather have a strong scrum than lineout - obviously I'd prefer both, but if we can only have one it would be the scrum.

I do think Edmunds late withdrawal didn't help the lineout, but d'Apice did an admirable job. I still think Britton's throwing just isn't up to scratch, but he is more than young enough to improve here.

I feel ok about the scrum. We have pushed a lot of sides around, both last season and this. I do not see that Bath have any edge there.

The scrum is more than OK. My view is that we'll concede a scrum for not throwing straight at the lineout, but we'll then win a penalty at the subsequent scrum!

Im particularly looking forward to seeing

Attwood v Savage - could be a thumper.
Wilson v Wood
Fearns knocking lumps out of everyone.
Ironically the three Bath lads look rejuvenated under Gary Gold...as i expected.

Baths Forwards could edge this...but Glos backs could be seriously good.

Glaws' team is up:
Rob Cook; Shane Monahan, Henry Trinder, Billy Twelvetrees, James Simpson-Daniel; Freddie Burns, Dan Robson; Nick Wood, Huia Edmonds, Rupert Harden; Tom Savage, Jim Hamilton (capt); Sione Kalamafoni, Akapusi Qera, Ben Morgan

Replacements:

Koree Britton, Dan Murphy, Shaun Knight, Will James, Gareth Evans, Jimmy Cowan, Mike Tindall, Martyn Thomas

Welcome to Kingsholm Jimmy Cowan

I like the look of our side and bar injuries is pretty much the best we can put out. With Louw missing our loss of Hazell is felt less, so the backrow of K, Q and Morgan could wreak havoc!

So are May and Sharples injured HKC?

Gotta say i've been a little dissapointed by Sharples so far this season but i'd heard that May was going very well.

That's a very tough looking Glos side and your pack has really got some fight in it now. Bath are going to be in trouble

I'm not entirely sure what's happened to May. He had to withdraw late from the Welsh game, so clearly couldn't make it in time. But Sinbad and Monahan have both been playing well, so ample cover.

Sharples has only played the first game and a half and has been injured since. He also didn't have a full pre-season due to his shoulder op, so I'm not too concerned about him at the moment. Hopefully he'll be fit for the Amlin and LV to pick up a bit of form. But at present I'd have May and Sinbad as first choice wingers.

I do like the look of our pack. We're probably not going to be great at the lineout, but I can see our scrum really getting the upper hand again. I'm rather confident we'll make it 10 wins out of 11 against our barber-clad, prawn sandwich munching neighbours!

Bath team up

Only real surprise is Vesty coming in at 12. With Banahan and Williams injured, I thought that they might try Cuthbert at 12, following some A league experiments.

15. Nick Abendanon
14. Kyle Eastmond
13. Dan Hipkiss
12. Sam Vesty
11. Tom Biggs
10. Stephen Donald
9. Michael Claassens

1. Paul James
2. Lee Mears ( c )
3. Davey Wilson
4. Dominic Day
5. Dave Attwood
6. Carl Fearns
7. Ben Skirving
8. Simon Taylor

Replacements

16. Ross Batty
17. Nathan Catt
18. Anthony Perenise
19. Will Spencer
20. Will Skuse
21. Mark McMillan
22. Ollie Devoto
23. Jack Cuthbert

I am loving that team. Bit of a shame May is injured but the talent in there is quite extraordinary.

Fingers crossed for big games from 36 and Burns, i'd love to see those two force Lancaster to pick them this autumn.

yappysnap wrote:Fingers crossed for big games from 36 and Burns, i'd love to see those two force Lancaster to pick them this autumn.

No they're both rubbish, Lancaster should leave them well alone!

36 is definitely starting to find his feet. His defence traditionally always seemed to be one of his weaknesses, but he is doing very well there at present. I would probably prefer he stayed away from England during the AIs. I just feel he needs a really good run of games at 12, but i have no doubt he will make an appearance at 12 for England soon.

Burns is by far the form English fly half at the moment, but I just can't see SL starting him.

What does Burns dad do? Could he get in to the Eng set up somehow, as i've heard that's quite a good way to get your name on the tea sheet...

#obviously I meant team sheet, the tea sheet is completely different.

I saw an article somewhere the other day and Andy Farrell doesn't think Eastmond should be fast tracked into the England set up.

It made me laugh because 1) He was 2) His son was.

So burns and 36 have no chance this year unless England suffer a lot of injuries.

yappysnap wrote:What does Burns dad do? Could he get in to the Eng set up somehow, as i've heard that's quite a good way to get your name on the tea sheet...

I believe he's a plumber, so he could become the official England plumber...

Yeah Twelvetrees has impressed me with his powerful defence when ive seen him in a few games this season...which is a shfit from previous...so somethings working.

Burns for me is the form English FH in the Prem and has to involved in the AI's if he continues in that vein. He can kick and run...

Actually there is a large number of players on the pitch for this game (or injured in the stands) that could have a big say in Englands future...

"Actually there is a large number of players on the pitch for this game (or injured in the stands) that could have a big say in Englands future..."

Wouldn't expect anything else from a West Country Derby.

Yes, leave Burns alone for now. He is doing a great job for Glos and still growing in skill & stature. Don't screw him up with a jump too soon into the England setup. That has ruined a few youngsters in the past. But with his class he does seem to have an international future.... but later.

If the future of England is in the west country I am going to be enjoying the next few 6N and WC's...

Burns for the Lions.

How did Cardiff do against Glaws in August ?

HERSH wrote:Burns for the Lions.

Don't forget Big Phil Vickery too!

Well, these derbys are a lot of fun.
On paper – for whatever that is worth – Gloucester and Batch are evenly matched:

Gloucester is currently in 5th place
Bath is in 6th place
Gloucester’s record is 3 Wins, 1 Draw, 1 Loss for a total of 15 points
Bath’s record is 3 Wins, 2 Losses for a total of 14 points
Gloucester’s point differential between points scored and points yielded is +17
Bath’s point differential between points scored and points yielded is +18

So – on paper – this is going down to the wire.

But for some reason I think it won’t be quite that close. Glad its on tv.

Barf Rugby team to face Gloucester
15. Nick Abendanon
14. Kyle Eastmond
13. Dan Hipkiss
12. Sam Vesty
11. Tom Biggs
10. Stephen Donald
9. Michael Claassens
1. Paul James
2. Lee Mears ( c )
3. Davey Wilson
4. Dominic Day
5. Dave Attwood
6. Carl Fearns
7. Ben Skirving
8. Simon Taylor
Replacements
16. Ross Batty
17. Nathan Catt
18. Anthony Perenise
19. Will Spencer
20. Will Skuse
21. Mark McMillan
22. Ollie Devoto
23. Jack Cuthbert

Is Nat Catt a relation/ son of the great Mike ?

gregortree wrote:Is Nat Catt a relation/ son of the great Mike ?

No