Cipriani for the Lions?

Seriously who said that ...hang your head in shame young man!

Not even in the macthday squad for the worst team in NH professional rugby.

Wonder who Mitchell couldve been talking about the other day

I've been looking at this group of players ahead of the Christmas period and I certainly know a lot more about some individuals after that performance. Some of the characters have been revealed

You have to ask, did he not already know the kid is a fair weather show boat?

Still competing against players of the claibre of Corne Uys (????) for spots cant be easy



Sale need grafters and a miracle to get out of this mire. The mud may help even the playing field a bit, certainly wont favout Wasps flashy wings and all out attack style.

Cipriani is a good ten when given a front foot platform but behind a beaten pack he is a complete liability. Sale need to sort the pack out first and use McLeod to keep them in games until they can afford to bring on the luxuary of Cipriani.

Has he learnt how to tackle yet?

Doesn't seem so.

IronMike wrote:Has he learnt how to tackle yet?

Missed 6 last weekend



Tight game so far arguably with Sale looking the stronger side ball in hand

Do you mean Rugby Lions ?

They are one of only three teams in England allowed to wear All White strip along with Rugby School and England you know.

He doesn't even try tackle, in the away Toulon game he just watched players run past him, in order to miss a tackle you have to make an attempt...he has the worst defense of any player I have ever seen, he was the same at rebels and success came instantly when he left, he has soo much talent and he has really kept his head down off the pitch but I wouldn't play him even at 2nd division level because he will let in at least 1 try everygame down his channel.

On his day he's an excellent attacking 10 but his day comes around about once every 10 games and that just isn't at the level you'd expect for an AP level player. His lack of commitment in defence just exacerbates the problem. He seems to want all the rewards without any of the effort.

It is a huge disappointment that Cipriani hasn't addressed one of the fundamental aspects of the game - defence. These days no team can afford the luxury of a 'pat-a-cake' tackle 10.

He has all the attacking attributes, but Mitchell's decision to drop him will hopefully see a positive reaction from Cipriani. I wouldn't have wanted him facing Wasps today though. Sale's half backs don't create enough.

Talking of half backs, Cillian Willis was knocked spark out in a tackle. When he got up (play had moved on and was then halted for a knock on) he was staggering around like a drunk. You may not have seen this if watching on TV.

Stephen Jones drew the ref's attention to his plight. After medical attention Willis was allowed to continue, to the amazement of both Wasps and Sale fans.

His next action, from the scrum, was to chuck the ball along the deck. He had not recovered from the tackle, and should have been taken/ordered off the field. We keep hearing about player welfare being paramount, but I felt this was an occasion where the player was let down by all supposedly responsible parties.

I should add that I hope Willis is ok.

Ok guess whos going to be available for hire pretty soon ....

http://www.espnscrum.com/premiership-2012-13/rugby/story/174880.html

Danny didn't want to tackle last week," Kennedy told the Mail on Sunday. "It's the coaches decision, but if you can't defend then there's no place for you in Premiership rugby.

"Danny had a dreadful game in defence last week. And if you're not prepared to put your body on the line for this club, who pay your wages and give you the chance to play at the highest level each week, then you won't be in the squad, will you?

"You just have to watch Danny's game at Toulon to understand why he's not playing against Wasps.

"Toulon are a great side full of great players, but no Premiership team should lose by 62-0 to any side, at any time. Some of the players have paid the price for it, and that includes Danny Cipriani.

Ouch

So what do you think of the Scots contingent on show in the Sale / Wasps game? n Gray seemed to be putting himself about a bit more than of recent adn actually getting stuck into clearing out rucks and making some tackles. Vernon looked very lively I thought. I want to find a place for him in the scotland team Southwell looked as good as I have seen him as well. An y thoughts? Will it ruin Gray and Vernon playing for sale?

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Seriously who said that ...hang your head in shame young man!

That'd be me

I'm struggling to see the relevance of The Lions in the professional era personally, but I know a lot of people still love them and spend a lot of disposable income to follow them on tour to enjoy a relatively infrequent event.

I'd rather see a full strength home nations sides tour their respective countries in the summer is all, but that's just my opinion. So, no chance of getting our coaches back and donating a Cips to the cause no?

So what do you think of the Scots contingent

Grey continues to look like a waste of money, a lot of effort but little impact his ball carrying was especially average. Why McKenzie was on the bench is beyond me, as soon as he came on the Sale forwards had a lot more aggression at the breakdown.

Southwell had another solid game, he's offered good stability to the Wasps back three.

Vernon offered a lot of good running in the outer channels but lacked the physicality to win the battle against Vunipola.

Wow I find Kennedys attitude way out of order!

Yes Cips had a poor game but the weekend before he'd had one of his best and that was better then most other Sale players have performed all season.

Not just that but singling out a player and targeting them like that sets out completely the wrong example and smacks of scape-goating, with coaches like that in charge no wonder Sale are Frak.

It's a flaming team sport and although Cips did miss 6 tackles I guarantee the rest of the team made their own mistakes as well. Toulon didn't score 60+ points from 6 missed tackles.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

So what do you think of the Scots contingent

Grey continues to look like a waste of money, a lot of effort but little impact his ball carrying was especially average. Why McKenzie was on the bench is beyond me, as soon as he came on the Sale forwards had a lot more aggression at the breakdown.

Southwell had another solid game, he's offered good stability to the Wasps back three.

Vernon offered a lot of good running in the outer channels but lacked the physicality to win the battle against Vunipola.

Ta

formerly known as Sam wrote:Grey continues to look like a waste of money.......

Hey, I take that personally.
Grey

Mitchells latest

"I'm certainly not Santa Claus - I don't care where he played before," the Kiwi told the Daily Mail. "All I've asked him to do is defend.

"Our defence was good last week until he chose to be an individual. You have to serve your team-mates before yourself. He was not the only player to receive bad news so if he improves his defence he will come back into contention."

If you were Danny Cipriani, you'd just love coming onto this board.

Imagine if you were.

Pot we'd all love to see him fulfill his potential and become a top 10. It's Cips who seems unwilling to put the work in to get there. There has to be sacrifice in a professionals personal life in order to make it, Tom Youngs described his first cap as the reward for all the missed parties and sober nights out. Can Cips say he's done the same?

Pot Hale wrote:If you were Danny Cipriani, you'd just love coming onto this board.

Imagine if you were.

We are a lot nicer about him than his coach is being at the minute!



Apparently Sale have just sacked the lass who looks after their facebook after she went online to tell the fans it wasnt her fault the team sucks.
Festive joy and cheer all round by the sounds of it. Apparently they are finding the same as Bath did, you cant just spend your way to instant success. Unless youre Saracens.

Surely a 10 should: a) make attacking decisions, b) have nice hair and c) be able to change the game in an instant.......Mr Cipriani seems to fit into these 3 quite nicely.......Not a Cips fan at all but for a coach to be so un-subtedly withering in his criticism of one man when his pack isn't protecting his potentially star asset?
Flamin' wilkinson has spoiled it for the rest of them........get him behind a baby eating front five, a hard tackling trio of tackling machine, exocet style back rowers and he's be awsome!!! Shoulda been born a kiwi!

Cips should have signed for Tigers when he had the chance. Just because they told him he'd be seen as a 15, short term. With the opportunity to stake a claim in the 10 pecking order as and when. He didn't want to know, he wanted first team money and the ten shirt. He'd have earnt less and had to work harder at Tigers but he would have benefited from so much more quality ball and protection.

Honestly hope he hasn't been finished by his agent's choice. Henson was once a 24 yr old who made bad decisions......now a 30 yr old laughing stock.

If he ever did read this I hope he realises how many 30, 40 somethings who would've sold their souls, (or at least their kids'), for a glimpse at what it must be like to be that talented!

But then again...these prima donna's.....ALWAYS backs........wouldn't sell my old rusting ford sierra to be a back

No sorry....unless hes being fed to them, he shouldnt be anywhere near any Lions.

His coach seems to be in the process of feeding to the lions anyways.

And a forward as a prima donna just wouldn't work, what with those unsightly ears...

ultra wrote:
If he ever did read this I hope he realises how many 30, 40 somethings who would've sold their souls, (or at least their kids'), for a glimpse at what it must be like to be that talented!

To be fair though most of us wouldve sold our souls to touch Kelly Brooks bottom and not get arrested for it

I hope Cips does get picked to tour. His inclusion will undoubtedly contribute to yet another series loss and perhaps, just perhaps, get people questioning the need for this ritual humiliation in the professional era.

You can get all misty eyed trying desperately to remember when the Lions came away with anything other than a good kicking, but in the cold light of day, its anachronistic and is a drain on coaching staff and players in an ever tighter yearly schedule. Especially since the majority of the team will surely now be supplied from the English ranks.

Hands off our players!

It seems that the fans want the Lions, the players want it and the TV companies certainly want it.

I mourn the passing of the Tigers v Baa Baas Christmas fixture. I've been able to see players like Blanco, Campo. Eales and countless other legends.

The Lions bring the same experience to the Southern hemisphere, nurture lifelong friendships between fans and players and if this is an anachronism it's one I can live with.

tigerleghorn wrote:It seems that the fans want the Lions, the players want it and the TV companies certainly want it.

I mourn the passing of the Tigers v Baa Baas Christmas fixture. I've been able to see players like Blanco, Campo. Eales and countless other legends.

The Lions bring the same experience to the Southern hemisphere, nurture lifelong friendships between fans and players and if this is an anachronism it's one I can live with.

Well, not all of them it would seem.

I'm sure there's not 100% in favour of course. A poll on here would be interesting if I were bothered. I'm pretty sure you'd see over 80% approval.

In 1997, the Labour Government were voted in by the so called 'majority'. I think its now fairly obvious, even to the less gifted amongst us, that doing so was a huge mistake.

Ok Jimpy, I'll not be picking up any hand grenades you throw in.I'll stick to the Rugby.

It was a perfectly legitimate analogy to demonstrate that the majority aren't always right.

I'm fairly certain that you consider yourself right regardless of the majority on any topic Jimpy. That's fine, it's the sometimes caustic responses that are unnecessary.

I'm not entirely sure how my responses were caustic, there's plenty on here who fit that bill much better than I.

AlastairW wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Seriously who said that ...hang your head in shame young man!

That'd be me

I'm struggling to see the relevance of The Lions in the professional era personally, but I know a lot of people still love them and spend a lot of disposable income to follow them on tour to enjoy a relatively infrequent event.

I'd rather see a full strength home nations sides tour their respective countries in the summer is all, but that's just my opinion. So, no chance of getting our coaches back and donating a Cips to the cause no?

Be careful, anyone questioning the validity of the Lions runs the risk of being accused of being 'caustic' when attempting to justify their opinion...

Quote Jimpy: "I think its now fairly obvious, even to the less gifted amongst us,"

Caustic anybody?

Not unless you're less gifted?

I like real ale, but I don't expect people to drink it just because I do.

Anyway, back to the rugby. Mitchell's comments have probably killed off any chance Cipriani has of making the England squad, let alone the Lions. And as Sale will not be gracing the latter stages of the HC, there is no top level stage for Cipriani to show his worth.

I do, however, think it was a poor show by Mitchell to criticise a player in public. That is not how you build loyalty to the cause. It is management by fear and no one is loyal to that sort of regime.

Hound_of_Harrow wrote:I like real ale, but I don't expect people to drink it just because I do.

Anyway, back to the rugby. Mitchell's comments have probably killed off any chance Cipriani has of making the England squad, let alone the Lions. And as Sale will not be gracing the latter stages of the HC, there is no top level stage for Cipriani to show his worth.

I do, however, think it was a poor show by Mitchell to criticise a player in public. That is not how you build loyalty to the cause. It is management by fear and no one is loyal to that sort of regime.

Exactly, and that's precisely why he's been booted from coaching job to coaching job as the players and support staff get tired of him.

But it was cipriani who singly failed to even try and tackle properly first, lets not forget that. the name and shame campaign may be a bit poor in some peoples eyes but thats not the reason why Cipriani hasnt been looked at for England, its because of his play.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:But it was cipriani who singly failed to even try and tackle properly first, lets not forget that. the name and shame campaign may be a bit poor in some peoples eyes but thats not the reason why Cipriani hasnt been looked at for England, its because of his play.

And maybe because he was allegedly seen laughing at England's demise playing in an international watched by himself and fellow (young and impressionable)Saxon squad members.

True, humour should be quashed at all times.

Cips will not be the last player to miss 6 tackles in a game. Especially let's not forget a renowned weak tackler playing at 10 against one of the biggest and nastiest packs in Europe at their own home ground in front of mental fans when his whole pack has just decided to turn round and bend over. What was he meant to do when the flankers et al don't do their jobs? What was Sales captain doing to stop the rout? What was the other star signing Richie Gray doing to help protect his fly half?

Yapp,

The complaint wasnt that he missed the tackles...the complaint was that he didnt even try to make them.
Hodgson (formerly a famously flakey and easily rattled young fly half,)was heavily targeted by Bath last weekend, he stood up and put his body in the way.

Its the same not trying that irked Lewsey enough to chin him several years ago.

He did make 8 tackles as well, more then a fair few others in the team.

He's also starting against Wuss so was he ever actually dropped due to his missed tackles or was that press spin?

"He's also starting against Wuss so was he ever actually dropped due to his missed tackles or was that press spin?"

It seems even more likely that Mitchell was looking for a convenient scapegoat after a 62-0 tonking then. I haven't heard any criticism of Rob Miller, who missed 11 points in kicks against Wasps on Sunday - and the three penalties he missed were absolute gimmees. Only the conversion was tricky.

But the three missed penalties cost Sale the game.

Didn't Miller only take over because Macleod scuffed the first couple of kicks and bottled it?

Sam, you're partly right. I just checked the Wasps' match report and McLeod missed the first kick, then Miller took over. I missed the first Sale penalty as I 'needed to get rid of some beer' so I only saw Miller taking the kicks and assumed he was the starting kicker.

Still, those three missed were some of the worst I've seen in the Premiership.

If only Cips had been there eh?

Mitchell and co are coming out of this looking like utter twonks. I bet the Sale fans can't wait to see him swan off back to SA in Feb leaving the team in an even worse state and with morale utterly wrecked. Diamond you are a genius.