The British elite

Who of the current crop of British contenders does anyone see as reaching the accolade of elite fighter. When I say elite I mean as a Floyd Mayweather, Wlad Klitschko or Sergio Martinez fighters who are regarded as top of the heap. Can a British fighter reach the heights of an Oscar De La Hoya?

Khan, Brook, Fury, Price, Saunders are the names I would put forward for debate. Froch I would guess is already an elite fighter but do the others really have what it takes to take the world on and win?

My opinion so far is Price. What say you?

Khan will never be considered elite. Not good enough.

Froch if he beats Kessler will be considered elite, and if he beats Ward he's got a strong shout to be the best to come from these shores for a very long time.

Fury won't be elite - do you see anything in him that suggests otherwise? I see at least 3 heavyweights outside the K bro's putting him to sleep.

Price possibly, depends how he fares when he's hit. Fury goes down. Price hasn't shown us yet. So far he's blasted his way through low ranked yet tough opposition. Sam Sexton isn't renowned for being knocked on his arse.

Saunders could be special.

We could throw in Groves here, as I think he could be the next charge after Froch, although the next 2 years will show us what he's capable of on the world stage.

Froch is not an elite level fighter if you judge elite as Martinez, Wlad and Mayweather who have all become the main man in their divisions. Froch has never been a true world champion.

If Froch is elite then so is Khan who has at least unified lest we forget. I'd say neither Froch nor Khan are elite at the moment.

Super D Boon wrote:Froch is not an elite level fighter if you judge elite as Martinez, Wlad and Mayweather who have all become the main man in their divisions. Froch has never been a true world champion.

If Froch is elite then so is Khan who has at least unified lest we forget. I'd say neither Froch nor Khan are elite at the moment.

Does that mean when Hearns and Leonard were both at WW that Hearns was not elite?

Lumbering_Jack wrote:

Super D Boon wrote:Froch is not an elite level fighter if you judge elite as Martinez, Wlad and Mayweather who have all become the main man in their divisions. Froch has never been a true world champion.

If Froch is elite then so is Khan who has at least unified lest we forget. I'd say neither Froch nor Khan are elite at the moment.

Does that mean when Hearns and Leonard were both at WW that Hearns was not elite?

Thomas Hearns at his time was the record holder for most world titles in most divisions (I think!) and beat genuine p4p fighters (or drew with them). Froch let's be fair has not achived either of these things. I'm just saying that being the perennial number 2/3 in one division is very good but not elite. It depends what you mean by elite at the end of the day.

Elite as in regarded among the very best. Froch has a resume that wees all over Calzaghe's. Doesn't mean you have to be THE main man.

JabMachineMK2 wrote:Elite as in regarded among the very best. Froch has a resume that wees all over Calzaghe's. Doesn't mean you have to be THE main man.

That's a stretch. Calzaghe clearly beat Kessler (who Froch lost to) and laid claim to being the main man in two weight divisions and one time p4p No.3. Froch is perennial No. 2/3 in one division and will remain so unless Ward moves on. If Froch however was to step up and dispose of Dawson (which he is capable of doing) I'd rank him as elite. At the moment no.

No he doesnt, he has faced good opposition in a shorter time but Calzaghes wins over Kess and Hoppo give his resume the nod.

JabMachineMK2 wrote:Elite as in regarded among the very best. Froch has a resume that wees all over Calzaghe's. Doesn't mean you have to be THE main man.

I dunno what made me laugh the most here the stupidity of that comment or the considerable lack of English language which I have highlighted

No a Brit can't hit those heights......

Because

1. DelaHoya wasn't protected..Promoters over here like to nurture their investment..

2. Delahoya was American and an olympic hero and Boxing is bigger in my wonderful Country...

3. DelaHoya appealed to Women and was a heart throb so he transcended the sport.

4. He was a great talent who fought the best around......

5. Boxing was a bigger sport ten years ago with less politics..

6. Because If it wasn't for our money..you'd all be talking German now!!

7. He wasn't rolled like a drunk..

TRUSSY

Super D Boon wrote:Froch is not an elite level fighter if you judge elite as Martinez, Wlad and Mayweather who have all become the main man in their divisions. Froch has never been a true world champion.

If Froch is elite then so is Khan who has at least unified lest we forget. I'd say neither Froch nor Khan are elite at the moment.

by that logic wlad cannot be considered elite, as him and vitali never fought and vitali for many years was the better of the two (had to revenge losses for his brother), and martinez and floyd have fought in the same division, so neither can claim to be king at the weight, and floyd never settled the manny argument at LW or WW, neither has he beat bradley who holds a title, a win over manny and is undefeated. even martinez needs to beat gennady and saul alveraz to really claim the top spot.

i dont think the criteria for elite means the top dog, as huck is a lesser fighter that froch (in terms of skill, wins/losses etc) but cannot claim to be ahead of froch in anybodys p4p rankings, even though you should realistically rank froch #3 and huck #1 in their respective divisions.

Steffan wrote:

JabMachineMK2 wrote:Elite as in regarded among the very best. Froch has a resume that wees all over Calzaghe's. Doesn't mean you have to be THE main man.

I dunno what made me laugh the most here the stupidity of that comment or the considerable lack of English language which I have highlighted

Your comment seems further from what could be considered 'good English' than JM's.

steff has a excuse, he's welsh

eddyfightfan wrote:steff has a excuse, he's welsh

Exactly what I was just about to say

Dunno what JMs excuse is...

Ah, now I think I know what you were incorrectly driving at: his apostrophe usage. Just so you know, his was correct, yours (as in the post above) isn't.

Fancying actually admitting your Welsh.........

Comes further down the list than admitting you wear your Mrs clothes...

Although I'm rather fetching in her pink blouse..I'll thank you very much..

Qoxiivi wrote:Ah, now I think I know what you were incorrectly driving at: his apostrophe usage. Just so you know, his was correct, yours (as in the post above) isn't.

I was more referring to his way of comparing two fighters records. Dont think using 'urination' as a comparision would get me many marks in one of my Uni assignments...

But anyway back to boxing...Truth be told there is not one fighter from The Isles who could be classed as elite right now. I really thought Khan was the man for the job but it doesnt look that way. Hope he proves me wrong though. That being said there is a market for Price and Fury once the Klit Bros retire

quigg looks set for a decent 2013, probably be my bet, think cleverly would have a chance (hopkins, dawson etc all look beatable) but im not even going to bother going down that road today.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Fancying actually admitting your Welsh.........

Comes further down the list than admitting you wear your Mrs clothes...

Interesting comment given your ODLH eulogy above.....

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Fancying actually admitting your Welsh.........

Comes further down the list than admitting you wear your Mrs clothes...

Although I'm rather fetching in her pink blouse..I'll thank you very much..

From the sight of your missus I'd say it's hard to tell which one should be wearing the trousers.

[quote="TopHat24/7"]

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Fancying actually admitting your Welsh.........

Comes further down the list than admitting you wear your Mrs clothes...

Or that you're American

I think different people have different opinions on what 'elite' means. Although obviously it means being numero uno in your division (s) i personally feel sometimes that isn't enough to be the 'biggest' as such. I think it's a combination of being in the top bracket of fighters in your weight division but also being enough of a PPV draw. I'm not not saying that if you clean out your division but can't draw (Timothy Bradley) that you are not the best. But the 'elite' would be the top people within that division.

Out of the current british lot i hope Fury goes on to be the one to box-smart and claim a world title whilst still keep his '0' in tact. I find his boxing 'style' entertaining and i enjoy listening to the guy speak. I hope a few can go on to dominate but as someone previously said Clev is probably in the weakest division in boxing so he should be able to dominate given the right fights and Dawson keeps losing focus and Ward stays where he is.

Do any of you guys know if we have any decent cruiserweight lads coming through? I know the division doesn't catch most peoples eyes but if there was any division to be able to top in boxing then surely that'd be the one to crack!

I guess it depends on each of our interpretations of 'elite'. I'd consider all of those fighters either world class or on their way to being world class, but for me 'elite' is another level above that. I'd say Froch has been the nearest to it, but i don't know if he's quite an elite fighter, because he's lost to two people, one very comfortably.

Until we match our fighters more competatively earlier, and until the promoters put more money on the table to attract bigger names to the UK, we're probably never going to have many real elite fighters, but i don't have a problem with that. We regularly produce world level, even world class fighters. We're not doing too badly, to be honest.

I suspect that most of our better fighters - Brook, Burns, Saunders, Price, etc, might get found out when the time comes for real tear-ups over the pond. The one i actually think might do the best of the lot is Frampton. I think he has the best all-round skill set and temperament, but it remains to be seen how he'll do against elite fighters on foreign soil.

Im not too sure that too many people would call Kessler an elite fighter and he beat Froch, so I couldnt really bracket Froch as an elite boxer. Ward is clearly a long way ahead of anyone in that division and is the only guy who you would call a truly elite fighter and even he needs to sprinkle a bit more stardust on his CV though he can only beat what is put in front of him and the super middle division consists of a lot of very decent but not great fighters.

monzon wrote:I suspect that most of our better fighters - Brook, Burns, Sanders, Price, etc, might get found out when the time comes for real tear-ups over the pond. The one i actually think might do the best of the lot is Frampton. I think he has the best all-round skill set and temperament, but it remains to be seen how he'll do against elite fighters on foreign soil.

Frampton's problem is he is operating in the most talent stacked division in the world today, there'll always be 1-2 guys ahead of him therefore I cannot see him ever being 'elite', though world class should definitely be achievable for him - big fan myself.

TopHat24/7 wrote:

monzon wrote:I suspect that most of our better fighters - Brook, Burns, Sanders, Price, etc, might get found out when the time comes for real tear-ups over the pond. The one i actually think might do the best of the lot is Frampton. I think he has the best all-round skill set and temperament, but it remains to be seen how he'll do against elite fighters on foreign soil.

Frampton's problem is he is operating in the most talent stacked division in the world today, there'll always be 1-2 guys ahead of him therefore I cannot see him ever being 'elite', though world class should definitely be achievable for him - big fan myself.

Have to agree TopHat, in terms of picking up belts and lookign dominant he's been played a bad hand with Rigondaeux, Mares and of course my Nonito Donaire who is looking more and more invincible as time goes on.

However, my feelings on Frampton is that if he keeps pushing on as he is now he could give two out of the three of them a serious run for there money and another one a pretty tough fight.

He might even get lucky and find one or two of them move up. Donaire for one certainly looks like he has the physical capacity for SFW - and maybe even LW if there's a super-fight swanswong for him there before retirement.