Wales vs Ireland - Six Nations

First topic message reminder :

Date - Saturday 2nd February 2013, KO 13:30
Venue - Millennium Stadium, Cardiff Wales

Coverage - Watch live on BBC One NI, BBC One HD
Internet - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/
Radio - BBC Radio Ulster
Replay the Game - BBC iPlayer

Wales Team

15 L Halfpenny
14 A Cuthbert
13 J Davies
12 J Roberts
11 G North
10 D Biggar
09 M Phillips
01 G Jenkins
02 M Rees
03 A Jones
04 A Coombs
05 I Evans
06 A Shingler
08 T Faletau
07 S Warburton (capt)

Replacements

16 K Owens
17 C Mitchell
18 P James
19 O Kohn
20 J Tipuric
21 L Williams
22 S Williams
23 J Hook


Ireland Team

01 Cian Healy
02 Rory Best
03 Mike Ross
03 Donnacha Ryan
05 Mike McCarthy
06 Peter O'Mahony
07 Sean O'Brien
08 Jamie Heaslip (c)
09 Conor Murray
10 Jonathan Sexton
11 Simon Zebo
12 Gordon Darcy
13 Brian O'Driscoll
14 Craig Gilroy
15 Rob Kearney

Replacements

16 Sean Cronin
17 Dave Kilcoyne
18 Declan Fitzpatrick
19 Donnacha O'Callaghan
20 Chris Henry
21 Eoin Reddan
22 Ronan O'Gara
23 Keith Earls



TOURNAMENT RECORD

MATCH FACTS

HEAD-TO-HEAD
These two nations have clashed on 118 occasions since 1882. Wales have 65 wins; Ireland 47.

Wales have won their last three Tests against Ireland; two in the Six Nations, one at the 2011 Rugby World Cup.

Since 1985 Ireland have won 10 and drawn one in Cardiff, with Wales picking up just two wins.

Legendary Irish fly-half Ronan O'Gara has scored 100 points in 14 appearances against Wales. O'Gara and centre Brian
O'Driscoll are the record caps holders for Ireland against Wales.

WALES

Have lost their last seven games, their worst run since 2003 (when they lost 10 on the spin).
Should Ireland win this fixture, Wales would have lost five consecutive home games for the first time in their history (they lost four at home during that 10-defeat run back in 2003).
Have scored just seven tries in their last seven matches.
The Wales pack retained possession at 96% of their own put-ins during last season's Six Nations. However, they did win just 22 scrums across the whole tournament - fewer than any other side.
Alex Cuthbert made seven clean breaks in last season's Six Nations, more than any other player.

IRELAND

Prior to the win over Argentina in their final match of 2012 Ireland had lost five straight Tests, scoring just two tries in the process (this excludes XV versus Fiji). It was their worst run since 1998.
Ireland were top points scorers in last year's Six Nations, racking up 121 in total (an average of over 24 per match). This included 13 tries, the most they had scored in the competition since 2007.


Games played between Ireland and Wales: 118 18.13%
Games won by Wales: 65 55.08%
Games lost by Wales: 47 39.83%
Games drawn: 6 5.08%

Most wins in a row for Wales over Ireland: 5

Most wins in a row for Ireland over Wales: 5

Average Pts Per Game 13

Heaviest Defeat 3rd of Feb 2002 Ireland 54 - 10 Wales

Recent Record between Ireland and Wales

2012 - Ireland 21-23 Wales
2011 - Ireland 10-22 Wales (RWC)
2011 - Wales 19-13 Ireland
2010 - Ireland 27-12 Wales
2009 - Wales 15-17 Ireland
2008 - Ireland 12-16 Wales

nobbled

Getting the ball to the backs isn't the problem though, it's stopping the carriers of the Irish pack, then slowing the ball, maybe nicking the ball, then forcing the Irish pack to tie themselves in in order to get the ball wide without them being flattened by a 13 man wall of green.

I've just been offered a ticket. I politely declined.

BlueNote wrote:What happens to our lineout when Evans goes off? Kohn is apparently a front jumper and Coombs doesn't have the height to be a middle jumper. So what do we do??

Hope like hell Evans lasts the 80!

wales606 wrote:Right, let go through how awful this forward pack is.

1. Gethin Jenkins - 3rd choice (James, Gill)
2. Matthew Reed - 3rd choice (Hibbard, Owens)
3. Adam Jones - 1st choice
4. Andrew Coombs - 9th choice (AWJ, Charteris, Evans, BD, Kohn, R.Jones, King, Reed)
5. Ian Evans - 3rd choice (AWJ, Charteris)
6. Aaron Shingler - 3rd/4th choice - (Lydiate, R.Jones, Warburton)
7. Sam Warburton - 2nd choice (Tipuric)
8. Toby Faletau - 2nd choice (R.Jones)

Lol, come off it.

wales606 wrote:Right, let go through how awful this forward pack is.

1. Gethin Jenkins - 3rd choice (James, Gill)
2. Matthew Reed - 3rd choice (Hibbard, Owens)
3. Adam Jones - 1st choice
4. Andrew Coombs - 9th choice (AWJ, Charteris, Evans, BD, Kohn, R.Jones, King, Reed)
5. Ian Evans - 3rd choice (AWJ, Charteris)
6. Aaron Shingler - 3rd/4th choice - (Lydiate, R.Jones, Warburton)
7. Sam Warburton - 2nd choice (Tipuric)
8. Toby Faletau - 2nd choice (R.Jones)

Lol, come off it.

The Irish must be more confident now? It seems quite clear to me that Howler (or whoever else makes these decisions) that they have not learnt a single lesson from the Autumn. Naff decisions cost Wales four games. It isn't too bad a side but why is Jenkins starting? Are Hibbard and R.Jones injured? I think Wales have the better bench and backline, but in a 6 Nations game against Ireland that surely won't be enough.

Is there that much diffeence between a guy who is 6'4 and a guy who is 6'6 other than the obvious?

Thats 2 inches height and 1 inch in arm length.... are most successful catches mere cm's away from being stolen??? Of course not.

Lineouts are more about strategy then anything else.

Victor Matfield was 6'7 but his height was never a factor in him being a class operator. He was very analytical and with Juan Smith or Pierre Spies at the tail he knew if he was well marked he would call an alternative move.

Crazy though Howley picking Jenkins. The guy has only played rugby for Wales and on the playstation this season.... he's got no game time for Toulon and during the AI's he looked well off the pace, unfit and to be honest, a little on the tubby side.

Ross, Best and Healy will be looking to dominate.

Well guys that's the team that's playing.

Saying what should be done will do bugger all to helping get a result.


Look for a few positives in the side. Even the opposition can do that.

maestegmafia

Positives.... Priestland is not playing???

fa0019 wrote:maestegmafia

Positives.... Priestland is not playing???

As an irish man when i heard he was out i questioned if we would still win. When I thought he would be playing i was confident we'd win. He has been a 5pt bonus to the other team and with a tight game that would give us the edge

Brendan wrote:

fa0019 wrote:maestegmafia

Positives.... Priestland is not playing???

As an irish man when i heard he was out i questioned if we would still win. When I thought he would be playing i was confident we'd win. He has been a 5pt bonus to the other team and with a tight game that would give us the edge

He was playing against us last year when they beat us by 2 points...

perhaps they would have won by 7 if Brendan's theory is right????

In essence he's not test class. Wales should be thankful he's not playing.

So it seems the criteria for selection these days has changed, youy no longer have to be first choice and playing regularly.

I can't wait to see what wonderful and insightful comments that clown Howley comes out with for this selection.

Jenkins and Rees FFS.

I feared we would be in battle for the spoon with Howler in charge but I doubt if we will have the ability to actually battle for it, give it us now and may I be the first to congratulate Ireland on their win by at least 10 points.

SubsBench wrote:I've just been offered a ticket. I politely declined.

Maybe you can someone how pass on your ability to make correct decisions to Howley, because he clearly doesn't know how to make any when it comes to selection.

IDIOTTTTTTTTTTTTT and they won't get rid of him so we are stuck with him.

I think Howley has been listening to some old SCW tapes from the 05 Lions.

Unfit - check.
Hasbeen - check.
Ignoring of younger in-form players citing lack of experience - check.

Words cannot describe how I am feeling.

If Faletau is injured early on, does this mean that Warbs will play 8 and Tipuric takes his place at 7?

Ospreydragon wrote:If Faletau is injured early on, does this mean that Warbs will play 8 and Tipuric takes his place at 7?

I think Team Wales have played Shingler at 8 before, so i would assume that would be the call. But where it is Tipuric on, or Coombs moving back and Kohn on?

fa0019 wrote:perhaps they would have won by 7 if Brendan's theory is right????

In essence he's not test class. Wales should be thankful he's not playing.

Lets just wait and see what Team Wales' tactics are. After all I would assume picking the 'controling' fly half in Biggar as opposed to the 'flair' fly half in Hook would indicate that the tactic may well be to see how many times Karney can catch the ball cleanly without knocking it on.

They've gone for Shingler to give another lineout option.

Warbs played 8 at age grade. But they're both too small to play 8.

So it's clear, then - Wales blitz defence, with Biggar's garryowens and Halfpenny's goalkicking will be what wins them this match. It's happened before but both set pieces could be crushed by Ireland and the backline will most likely be living off scraps.

It's difficult, but not impossible - Wales just have to keep the ball live and turn the midfield into a mess. Not somehow getting Tipuric on the pitch is a disaster when O'Brien and O'Mahoney are on the other side.

I know that they need Shingler for the lineout but as he's not really big enough to be the chopper that the job needs for a full 80, it's mystifying that Howley doesn't just stick Justin at blind and be done with it. Perhaps I just don't know enought about the characters involved.

Hmmm

Wined and dined in the corporate boxes by the stockbrokers and watch the match FOR FREE



Or pay to hire a saw bench so I can cut up a pile of logs, so I actually PAY TO DO WORK

I've seen the team.

No, its a no brainer...



...the logs won't cut themselves will they.

Glas a du wrote:Hmmm

Wined and dined in the corporate boxes by the stockbrokers and watch the match FOR FREE



Or pay to hire a saw bench so I can cut up a pile of logs, so I actually PAY TO DO WORK

I've seen the team.

No, its a no brainer...



...the logs won't cut themselves will they.

The lady doth protest too much!

Wales by 12!

As an Ireland fan I am delighted with that Wales team. It almost cancels out the naff calls our coach made. Your backs will still crush ours..

6-3 win to Ireland anyone?

the-goon wrote:As an Ireland fan I am delighted with that Wales team. It almost cancels out the naff calls our coach made.

That's the most damning thing of all. Howley knew the Ireland XV two days ago. Two days of knowing what we were up against and to plan accordingly. Advantage Wales, surely?

But no.

Nah Zeeeboo will score a hatrick but we'll loose because Sexton will miss all his placekicks as he'll be too distracted dreaming about how many pairs of chinos he'll be able to afford when he signs for Racing.

Radge will come on at 65mins and cost us two scores by first getting trampled by Roberts and then booting the ball an up and under and then taking out halfpenny in the air .....

rodders wrote:Radge will come on at 65mins and cost us two scores by first getting trampled by Roberts and then booting the ball an up and under and then taking out halfpenny in the air .....

Now be fair, Rodders, the second Lions Test was four years ago. Although seeing as Gethin Jenkins and Matthew Rees are starting on Saturday, Rob Howley must think that 2009 form is still relevant now.

Rob Howley think, well that would be a feckin novelty in itself.

This selection is a reasonable one to make based on the strengths of the 23 man squad rather than the starting 15.

The front row nearly always changes entirely during the match so what order is it best to start them in? Without Lydiate we need an additional tackler during the first part of the game and Gethin meets that need. The Irish will come out hard and fast and cool heads will be needed, MR is more experienced and calmer than KO. Adam has to start.

I don't have much view on the second row as we have no choice other than to play someone new to international rugby and the coaches are best placed to see who has trained well and learnt the game plan best.

In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on, for this it makes perfect sense to start with a solid tackler and then bring on Tuperic when the game breaks up.

Lloyd W has at least had one good game since Christmas which is more than any of the other SHs that could be chosen and he Hook will bring new challenges if they come on as they are not at all like Phillips and Biggar

Ok so yes its a 23 man game but if the first 15 have already bveen played off the park and stuffed then no matter how good your bench is they will be on the back foot and playing catch up.

Also Holwer hasn't got the minerals to make the big calls and changes thats why Jenkins and Rees are starting in the first place.

"the tactic may well be to see how many times Karney can catch the ball cleanly without knocking it on"

Of all the FBs in the world, Kearney is the last one I'd choose for that. Surely Howlers couldn't be that daft.

BlueNote wrote:" Surely Howlers couldn't be that daft.

I'll take that bet

Newsilure wrote:In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on

Hang on a minute, who's the home side here? Why should we sit back and let the visitors come at us? I mean, it's a very charitable way of doing things, but unless the rules have changed and I've missed something, we're allowed to take the game to the opposition from the first whistle.

We are yeah but we wont be capable of doing it.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Newsilure wrote:In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on

Hang on a minute, who's the home side here? Why should we sit back and let the visitors come at us? I mean, it's a very charitable way of doing things, but unless the rules have changed and I've missed something, we're allowed to take the game to the opposition from the first whistle.

Because we're visiting? Feel free to meet us in Dublin instead......

Could be a good game if the intention of selecting this light, mobile pack is to keep the pace high from the off. That was how Ireland played against Argentina too.

If both teams are looking to play at pace and attack from deep, could be a great match!

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Newsilure wrote:In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on

Hang on a minute, who's the home side here? Why should we sit back and let the visitors come at us? I mean, it's a very charitable way of doing things, but unless the rules have changed and I've missed something, we're allowed to take the game to the opposition from the first whistle.

It reminds me of the damage limitation sides we used to field in the 90s when we knew we had no chance of winning and were just trying to keep the score down.

However, having reflected on it and with MaestegMafia's 'be positive' call in mind - we can't blame Howley for all the injuries and if you swapped James, Owens, Kohn, Tipuric & Hook into the starting line up you'd have a strong and in form side that could take it to Ireland from the kick off.

This game could be over by halftime though.

Why would the game be over at halftime? Have you watched Kidneys Ireland?

Notch wrote:Why would the game be over at halftime? Have you watched Kidneys Ireland?

I think Heaslip and O'Brien will too much for our back row. Unless they have a bad day and Warburton has a blinder, tackling wise.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Newsilure wrote:In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on

Hang on a minute, who's the home side here? Why should we sit back and let the visitors come at us? I mean, it's a very charitable way of doing things, but unless the rules have changed and I've missed something, we're allowed to take the game to the opposition from the first whistle.

I am not suggesting we wont be attacking ourselves, just that when the Irish are at their freshest we need to have our best tacklers on the pitch and when they tire and hopefully start to slip off tackles our play makers will have most chance, I see players like Tuperic, Hook and LW as more in the play maker than defender role so why not bring them on fresh when there are a few more gaps for them to exploit

Warburton and Toby have had the better of these guys recently don't underestimate our boys. Irelands back row are always overhyped

Newsilure wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Newsilure wrote:In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on

Hang on a minute, who's the home side here? Why should we sit back and let the visitors come at us? I mean, it's a very charitable way of doing things, but unless the rules have changed and I've missed something, we're allowed to take the game to the opposition from the first whistle.

I am not suggesting we wont be attacking ourselves, just that when the Irish are at their freshest we need to have our best tacklers on the pitch and when they tire and hopefully start to slip off tackles our play makers will have most chance, I see players like Tuperic, Hook and LW as more in the play maker than defender role so why not bring them on fresh when there are a few more gaps for them to exploit

I have to agree with Newsilure on this one, I think out bench is strong and I would love to see Tipuric, Owens, Kohn and Hook coming on after about 9 minutes

RubyGuby wrote:Warburton and Toby have had the better of these guys recently don't underestimate our boys. Irelands back row are always overhyped

+1 Toby and Warbs can outplay anyone on their day....

RubyGuby wrote:

Newsilure wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

Newsilure wrote:In the back row we need to defend first, weather the storm and then push on

Hang on a minute, who's the home side here? Why should we sit back and let the visitors come at us? I mean, it's a very charitable way of doing things, but unless the rules have changed and I've missed something, we're allowed to take the game to the opposition from the first whistle.

I am not suggesting we wont be attacking ourselves, just that when the Irish are at their freshest we need to have our best tacklers on the pitch and when they tire and hopefully start to slip off tackles our play makers will have most chance, I see players like Tuperic, Hook and LW as more in the play maker than defender role so why not bring them on fresh when there are a few more gaps for them to exploit

I have to agree with Newsilure on this one, I think out bench is strong and I would love to see Tipuric, Owens, Kohn and Hook coming on after about 9 minutes

BBC Howley on Biggar interview


Interim Wales coach Robert Howley has pleaded for the nation's media and pundits to "please keep the pressure off" fly-half Dan Biggar.

The Osprey won Howley's backing to start at 10 in their Six Nations opener against Ireland on Saturday, preferred to Perpignan's James Hook.

Howley told the media: "It's important that he gets an opportunity and please can you keep the pressure off him." However, Howley also said there are "questions that Dan has to answer".

“We've given him [Dan Biggar] honest feedback in terms of his game management and his running threat and his kicking game”

Biggar, 23, takes over from Achilles tendon injury victim Rhys Priestland to win his 12th cap in a Wales career that began in 2008 against Canada. Since then the 6ft 2in, 14st 8lb Biggar has not been involved in any Six Nations games while Stephen Jones' 104-cap career continued, then saw Priestland overtake him in the Wales pecking order.

Before the injury that ended his tournament hopes, Priestland had been criticised to such an extent that he sought professional help. Howley says the decision between Biggar and Hook, 27, who has won 26 of his 67 caps in the Six Nations was "close".

The Wales coach says Biggar is the in-form stand-off, having impressed in recent Heineken Cup games for Ospreys against Toulouse - twice - and Leicester. "I think it's important that he gets an opportunity and please can you keep the pressure off him," said Howley. "All our 10s that have played the game, we've seen what's happened over recent times when the number 10 in Wales [has come under pressure] - and it's important that he's given the chance to develop.

"It's a big game for Dan. Obviously he understands that, but [because of] our Welsh culture and the way we talk about our 10s, it's important that Dan is given an opportunity and a chance and he'll certainly be given a chance from the Welsh management.

"He understands there's competition with James, but it's a big starting game for Dan and he's been exceptional this week.

"He's a key player and we'll support [him] in everything which we ask him to do.
"Dan has matured over the last 12 months and he's been continually knocking on the door and we've given him honest feedback in terms of his game management and his running threat and his kicking game.

"And I think from Dan's perspective, I think turning up on Saturday being confident, going out and playing the game as he sees it [are important].

"I think that he's got a pretty potent backline to try and get into the game and the game management, and when to bring them into the game and when to kick for field position and when to run.

"They're the questions that Dan has to answer on Saturday. But it's important that he gets the time. When you speak to the likes of [Wales skills coach] Neil Jenkins and when Hooky was there, Steve Jones, Rhys Priestland - they were given time."

"And I think Dan's got a great opportunity on the weekend and I think that it's important that he just focuses on facilitating the team and that's what you want your half-backs to do, to bring out the best in the players around you."

"And I'm certain Dan will do that."

Full-back Leigh Halfpenny will take Wales' kicks at goal and Howley believes that will allow Biggar to concentrate on his tactical role.

"I think that it will be a positive, not a negative [for Biggar]," said Howley.

Ryan Jones Back five, hooker Richard Hibbard, fullback Liam Williams, winger Eli Walker and lock Lou Reed were all unavailable for selection due to injuries.

argh, just lost my post

the gist was that jamie roberts is a numpty lumpo with less skill than ryan jones' broken thumb. should phillips deliver ball to the backs roberts will butcher it with a hopless lumbering run into contact or a useless lumbering run into contact.

time wales tried a playmaker at 12 instead of a ballkiller. roberts is utterly useless

dogtooth wrote:argh, just lost my post

the gist was that jamie roberts is a numpty lumpo with less skill than ryan jones' broken thumb. should phillips deliver ball to the backs roberts will butcher it with a hopless lumbering run into contact or a useless lumbering run into contact.

time wales tried a playmaker at 12 instead of a ballkiller. roberts is utterly useless

Yes I agree. Not disregarding Roberts very obvious attributes but I am kind of keen to see how Steve Shingler will go at the Scarlets... He really could be a massive asset in that regard. Gareth Owen was close but hasn't stepped up to the plate and I think he will be played at fullback or utility bench player rather than 10 or 12 for the future.

The problem I see for the Welsh back row is if Warbs has to step up and make the big hits, who wins the ball on the deck? Or if Warbs is on the deck who stops the Irish ball carriers? It's a catch 22... Warburton is a good groundhog and can stop our big men too but without his partner in crime Lydiate he needs someone to take up the slack. If Tipuric had started then you'd expect him to do the dirty stuff while Warburton chopped down POM and SOB. But instead Howley has gone to secure the lineout and Shingler for all his ability is not a chopper... It could be a long day at the office!