Loss in yardage???

Morning everyone,

I was just curious to see if anyone else has really struggled with thier yardage over the winter months as I have?

I bought brand new Ping i15s a couple of seasons ago now and throughout the summer i was hitting my irons as follow -

PW - 125yrds
9 iron - 135yrds
8 iron - 150yrds
7 iron - 165yrds
6 iron - 175yrds
5 iron - 185yrds
4 iron - 195yrds

Now, this winter i have been hitting my 7 iron around 145yrds (obviously a massive difference) and I know the ball has been hitting the greens and stopping dead. This goes for all my clubs with loss of distance between 10 and 20 yards on the longer irons.

Anyone else still struggling like me????

Clubs don't go so far in the winter.

I hear the popes catholic ..

Probably a combination of several factors.
1. Temperature (ball doesn't fly so far in cold heavy air)
2. No bounce/roll on wet turf
3. More clothing (I assume) in colder weather will restrict swing (no matter how much you think it won't)
4. Body mechanics, your body will naturally be stiffer/more restricted in colder weather.

I tend to go for a big golfing holiday to somewhere warm in the middle of winter and the difference is quite clear (circa 15/20 yards on a 7 iron)

I would take a shotgun and fire it somewhere near the roof of your mouth. There is no comeback from that yardage loss.

You have gone from hitting it further than rory to just less than Tiger.

McLaren wrote:I would take a shotgun and fire it somewhere near the roof of your mouth. There is no comeback from that yardage loss.

You have gone from hitting it further than rory to just less than Tiger.

Sorry McLaren but thats the yardages I hit my irons in good sunny conditions - playing off 5 I would hazzard to say it could possibly be expected. The post wasn't meant as a bragging rights in any shape or form and one of my playing partners (who plays off 8) hits the ball even further than me.

I've been hitting at least two clubs more during this winter.

What method do you use to calculate your yardages?

What is the obsession with how long you hit it.

I'm more concerned with accuracy and KNOWING how far I hit each club, rather than trying to hit them further.

I don't see anything wrong with your yardages really.

super_realist wrote:What is the obsession with how long you hit it.

I'm more concerned with accuracy and KNOWING how far I hit each club, rather than trying to hit them further.

I don't see anything wrong with your yardages really.

thank you super. i honestly dont care either how far i hit each club but its fundimentally important chosing the right club when firing into greens and knowing to within a few yards how far each club travels is it not? this is the point i am trying to make and how much yardage i have lost over the cold winter period really.

and mclaren, as far as how i work out my yardages, i have a bushnell range finder, go to my local driving range when its quiet (which use practise pro v1s and is what i use when im on the course BTW), measure up a specific flag (or flags) hit my respective club to the flag then have a quick walk up to see my landing parameters. simple really.

"KNOWING"...absolutely that's the key thing right there. It really doesn't matter how far you hit each club as long as you KNOW what club you need to hit a given distance with the shot you want in the conditions as they are at the time.

Played Saunton West in a good 2 club easterly yesterday. The par 3 8th. Is normally an 8 or 9 iron. Yesterday however it was a punched 5. I could possibly have got the same result with a full bore 6 iron but then again that wasnt the shot i vistualised. The number of the club means nothing.

This sort of came up a few weeks back in another thread somewhere and George1507 (I think) mentioned that it's about 1 yard carry loss per 2 degrees Fahrenheit temperature decrease. Independent of club.
Just thinking about my own yardages Summer vs. Winter, this is pretty close to what I see.

At any time though, despite being a decent golfer I probably couldn't say to within 5 yards + or - how far I hit each club. I don't believe anyone at club level could say any different. THerefore when thinking of yardages I'm probably considering a range than a specific number.
I've got a measured distance in my head, but that's based on hitting 30 balls with each club, removing ridiculous outliers from bad swings, catching it heavy etc and taking an average of what remains.

30 balls for each club must take an eternity super! I've never properly done this exercise but plan to at some point soon, once we have a week in the mid teens temp wise.
probably just hit about 10 with each club though!!

Personally i noticed a big difference between the last two summers, let alone summer/winter. Last summer i was carrying a six iron around 160, whereas the previous summer it was more like 170+ more roll. Our course played incredibly tough comparatively, with the average css for the first half of the year a good 1.5 strokes higher than the previous year.

It is indeed 1 yard further for every 2 degrees Fahrenheit increase, between 20F and 100F (at least it is with Titleist balls). I'd imagine it's pretty much the same for all balls.

NOt just that barra, I do it in both directions to account for wind. Worth doing if you are practicing anyway. 2 clubs an evening.

super_realist wrote:At any time though, despite being a decent golfer I probably couldn't say to within 5 yards + or - how far I hit each club. I don't believe anyone at club level could say any different. THerefore when thinking of yardages I'm probably considering a range than a specific number.
I've got a measured distance in my head, but that's based on hitting 30 balls with each club, removing ridiculous outliers from bad swings, catching it heavy etc and taking an average of what remains.

You play off 2 and you get ridiculous outliers, hit it fat and make swings bad enough to vary by more than 5 yards? There's hope for us mere mortals yet!

I've played extensively over the winter, and as the tees have been moved up to account for the conditions, I'm mostly playing my second shots from the same locations as I would in the summer. It's at least a club more to make the same carry on the colder days, and sometimes two. This Saturday was a lot milder, and I could already see some length coming back to the carry (it was more like half a club).

SmithersJones wrote:

super_realist wrote:At any time though, despite being a decent golfer I probably couldn't say to within 5 yards + or - how far I hit each club. I don't believe anyone at club level could say any different. THerefore when thinking of yardages I'm probably considering a range than a specific number.
I've got a measured distance in my head, but that's based on hitting 30 balls with each club, removing ridiculous outliers from bad swings, catching it heavy etc and taking an average of what remains.

You play off 2 and you get ridiculous outliers, hit it fat and make swings bad enough to vary by more than 5 yards? There's hope for us mere mortals yet!

What I'm saying is that if I hit 30 balls there are the 5th and 95th percentiles as outliers take them out right away, I'm not going to hit them all pure, but then again I'm not going to hit all 9 irons 127 yards as I'd like. Bounce, ground conditions etc are all going to affect it. What would be best is to do it on a beach where you can see where it lands, but I don't care enough to be that pedantic about it.

I've never played with anyone who hits a six iron 175 yards. That's impressive hitting. I assume you mean those are the carry distances. I'm one of the longer hitters in my club, but I don't get anywhere near those distances.

It's strange that the gap is 15 yards for the shorter clubs, and 10 yards for longer clubs.

George1507 wrote:I've never played with anyone who hits a six iron 175 yards. That's impressive hitting. I assume you mean those are the carry distances. I'm one of the longer hitters in my club, but I don't get anywhere near those distances.

It's strange that the gap is 15 yards for the shorter clubs, and 10 yards for longer clubs.

It's not that impressive - I'd be pretty close to that and I'm considered average in my regular four ball. One of the guys (I've caddied for him in inter-club comps) would carry a 7 iron 165 and a 6 iron 180 off the fairway. We've a 213 yard par 3 (plays about 5 yards downhill) and he'd regularly hit it with a 6 iron off the tee (whereas it's a smooth 4 iron for me). But as S_R says, it doesn't really matter much.... although playing a shorter iron approach is a bit of an advantage when it comes to stopping it on par 4s..

My dad who is 63 hits a 6 iron more than 170 so it's not that impressive or unusual, I'm around 160 myself and would rather do that than hit it like him

I can't believe people are doubting what look to me like perfectly average sorts of yardage. I'd say mine are very similar in summer, even down to the narrowing in difference with the longer irons. My pro did explain this to me but I can't remember the reason - to do with too much spin I think. I know the 8 iron yardage because I pretty regularly hit the board at 150 on the driving range.

Am I confusing you with someone else, George, or did you not say that you played in the English Amateur at Woburn last year? I'm sure most of the field there would consider 175 with a 6-iron to be lower end of average.

There is a big difference between links and parkland too. I find i carry the ball a lot farther at my away club compared to my home club. Fresh seaside air versus inner city smog. Obviously a lot more bounce and roll too. One reason i always like to get a practice few holes in when i visit prior to playing any comps. Otherwise i spend the first dozen holes trying to work out rough distances.

Hope this isn’t too off-topic but I’d be interested to hear others techniques for distance control below say 100 yds? The pro I’ve had lessons with wants me to know how to hit a 30 yd, 40 yd, 50 yd etc. shot based on the length of my backswing. Is this a popular approach or do you go for a bit more of a feel method?

Not me Smothers Jones. I played in the British Amateur a lot of years ago, but never the English Amateur.

My 4 iron goes 190 in the summer, maybe 180 in the winter. That's carry, not roll. I could hit my four iron further down a fairway with some roll, but into a green 190 is the limit with a 4 iron. I have about a12 yard distance gap between clubs, so my 6 iron goes 165, 8 iron 140 and wedge 115. Some guys have clubs with the loft bashed down so they go further, but that isn't much help when the greens are baked hard in the summer. Hmm, come to think of it, we haven't seen that in a while. Pass me that hammer.

Just checking the size of my cxxk and its minute.
I assume my swing speed is falling off considerably but My PW is 90 yards 100 if i close it down a bit.Hit 3 wood into a couple of 155 par 3s last week no run and slight wind against.Thanks guys really cheered me up.
However I am master of the 30-50 yard pitch usually when I have come up short with two goods shots just feel for the distance pick a landing spot same swing hands in front and scramble time.

Me too Dyna. I barely hit the ball anywhere compared to most people on here. Pretty average with the people I play with though the difference is mine tend to go where they are meant to more than theirs. They often tell me how short I am considering how low my handicap and I always reply that when the idea of golf becomes hitting it a long way then I'll learn how. Until then I'll settle for getting it in the hole in as few shots as possible.

I'm intrigued as to why the OP would know exactly how far he hits each club in "good, sunny conditions" but not in the conditions he's most likely to play in. Especially given he's from Newcastle.

shclaff wrote:Hope this isn’t too off-topic but I’d be interested to hear others techniques for distance control below say 100 yds? The pro I’ve had lessons with wants me to know how to hit a 30 yd, 40 yd, 50 yd etc. shot based on the length of my backswing. Is this a popular approach or do you go for a bit more of a feel method?

Tried this myself but didn't like it. A bit too methodical for me, I like a bit more of the feel approach.

dynamark wrote:Just checking the size of my cxxk and its minute...

Hibbz wrote:Me too Dyna. I barely hit the ball anywhere compared to most people on here. Pretty average with the people I play with though the difference is mine tend to go where they are meant to more than theirs. They often tell me how short I am considering how low my handicap and I always reply that when the idea of golf becomes hitting it a long way then I'll learn how. Until then I'll settle for getting it in the hole in as few shots as possible.

I'm intrigued as to why the OP would know exactly how far he hits each club in "good, sunny conditions" but not in the conditions he's most likely to play in. Especially given he's from Newcastle.

Believe it or not Hibbz we do actually get a summer up in the wilds of north east england sometimes. ive even seen 26*C on my car thermometer at times. who'd have thought the sun shines anywhere other than south of the watford gap huh?

cast clubs are generally a bit longer than forged too. my old titleist cast 990s went a good 5-10 yards further than my forged 712s. i got a lot more inconsistencies...eg. fliers with the cast clubs where i'd get up to the green and find i was through the back by some distance after hitting a shot that felt like it was going to be good. ping i15s are cast, they also have pretty strong lofts. just comparing the i20 short irons versus my 712mb standard specs:

club / i20 loft / 712mb loft
6 / 30 / 31
7 / 33 / 35
8 / 37 / 39
9 / 41 / 43
P / 46 / 47

on the combined basis of forged v cast and strong lofts, LBOD would probably just about need a 6 from my bag to match the distance of a 7 in his.

barragan wrote:cast clubs are generally a bit longer than forged too. my old titleist cast 990s went a good 5-10 yards further than my forged 712s. i got a lot more inconsistencies...eg. fliers with the cast clubs where i'd get up to the green and find i was through the back by some distance after hitting a shot that felt like it was going to be good. ping i15s are cast, they also have pretty strong lofts. just comparing the i20 short irons versus my 712mb standard specs:

club / i20 loft / 712mb loft
6 / 30 / 31
7 / 33 / 35
8 / 37 / 39
9 / 41 / 43
P / 46 / 47

on the combined basis of forged v cast and strong lofts, LBOD would probably just about need a 6 from my bag to match the distance of a 7 in his.

v

Very interesting barragan. i have been thinking about upgrading my irons to the titleist AP2's this season as i have just moved to a titleist 913 driver and i am SO impressed. solid equipment and much stronger ball flight than my old R11. very tempeted to go try them at the range!!

currently using a g15 driver - but looking at upgrading to 913 this year. had a wee shot recently and thought it was fantastic.

no complaints with the irons as yet. only got them in december, so yet to really test them in normal conditions other than a couple of links outings. came tied 2nd in my first and only competitive outing with them to date, back at the end of december so hit the ground running and generally happier than rory seems having made the switch away from titleist

I'm looking forward to summer temperatures as I can honestly say I haven't noticed any drop in my yardages this winter!

barragan wrote:currently using a g15 driver - but looking at upgrading to 913 this year. had a wee shot recently and thought it was fantastic.

no complaints with the irons as yet. only got them in december, so yet to really test them in normal conditions other than a couple of links outings. came tied 2nd in my first and only competitive outing with them to date, back at the end of december so hit the ground running and generally happier than rory seems having made the switch away from titleist

i really love the new 913 driver. im actually going to buy the 913 3 wood this weekend too as ive been that impressed.

its funny you should mention the nike equipment as another one of my playing partners bought the new nike driver and 3 wood and has been hitting them really well. hes probably gained about 10 or 15 yards on his drives but more importantly he is hitting a lot more fairways in reg. very forgiving from off centre hits so its definately horses for courses so to speak.

i think rory will come good and the fact he lined my pocket when he missed the cut at his first tournament was an added bonus for me. a tenner at 16/1 almost paid for my new driver!!

I know we've done this before, but in the winter I use a softer ball, Srixon Soft feel (green) and while there is some reduction in distance it is better than the ball I use in summer ( typically Srixon z star or pro v1).

been using srixon ad333's over the winter. back onto the pro v1x's last week, and got a dozen zstar xv's to give a whirl at some point this season - probably next weekends scramble methinks

Always thought those "soft" balls should be subject to trade description, they feel like cannonballs to me.

We've had this conversation before Super. If the Srixon soft feel is like a cannonball to you, what do you normally use?

Bridgestone 330 RXS or Taylor Made New Penta

i've only been using the ad333 at our home club. any away links days and i dig out a few old pro v's. otherwise putting in particular isn't much fun. our home greens have been so sticky and slow that it has actually helped having a more solid ball. there is a BIG difference between links and parkland s_r - remember many of us don't get such good playing conditions 11-12 months a year like you! we're very lucky if we get middle of march to early november in near-normal conditions.

interested to see what the 2013 prov1x will be like. the 2012 version was a massive improvement on the 2011 in my opinion. not tried all the options, but yet to find a top end srixon, bridgeston or taylor made which feels as good. z star is probably the closest i've come, but for some reason i lose more than i do with the pro'vs - no idea why that is!

Barra, remember that I've got another heathland course too, so know the restrictions you might face, mind you St.Andrews are so precious they close all courses if someone drops an ice lolly on the hallowed turf they are so worried about frost damage.

I've missed a lot of golf this year through not very bad conditions at all but which course managers fill their pants with fright. I think one entire month of weekends was written off in January and there have been a few since too.

Lovely to see first signs of spring arriving and hopefully no return to colder weather is imminent.