PGA Tour: "Arnold Palmer Invitational" etc: Notes from the Ballwasher

First topic message reminder :

1).Before we move up Interstate 4 from the course that the Pros consider the best they play in Florida to the course they rate the worst, let's have a look back at last week's Tampa Bay Classic, at Innisbrook's Copperhead Course. Kevin Streelman became the fifth first-time winner on Tour with a marvellous final nine holes which trumped Boo Weekley's best-of-the-week 63.
Streelman beat a good field to secure his maiden victory the right way, with birdies on two tough par-3's and brave, straight-down-the-middle drives on the "Snake Pit's" two par fours.

2).But who is Kevin Streelman? He's 34, middle-aged for a first-time winner, has collected $7M in official prize-winnings as he enjoys his sixth season on Tour, and won a cool $1M as the inaugural winner of the Kodak Challenge in 2009. Despite bursting on the scene in San Diego (twice, as he was joint first-round leader at the Torrey Pines US Open) in 2008, when he led after 36 holes and was grouped with E.T.Woods for Round 3 before fading, his only podium finishes before Tampa were third places in golfing hotbeds of Cancun, Puerto Rico and New Jersey.
Now he's a Tour Champion and the sky's the limit for someone who's always been much more than a journeyman and, by all accounts, one of the nicer guys on Tour. (Especially when he's not reading "the scriptures".)

3).He'll tee it up at Bay Hill this week and he's enjoyed a top ten finish here in the past. One bloke who won't be there is JB Holmes who has broken an ankle roller-blading and will be out of commission for three months. While this portends a pick-up in pace of play on Tour, it sadly suggests also that his brain surgery in 2011 wasn't as succesful as first thought. A terrible start to JB's season and now this.

4).This is one week where it's impossible not to speak of defending champion Tiger Woods. And of course he jump-started coverage of himself by posting mug-shots of Lyndsey and him all over social media and then requested privacy for the smiling couple. Good luck with that, especially following his week's canoodling with Lyndsey on his yacht "Privacy" (nothing if not ironic) during Doral. Las Vegas odds-makers are offering 4-1 against an engagement by January 2015 - I imagine Paddy Power and other reputable houses might offer rather different odds regarding rather different aspects of the joyful coming together of a sex addict and a depressive.

5).Speaking of Tiger, and why not, he was on the radio the other day likening the spotlight's glare on Rory and Wozza with that on himself and, you name her. He also revealed, in the aftermath of his (personal) record of 100 putts at Doral and putting tips from Stricker, that he had indeed offered tips to "Stricks" during last year's FedEx Play-Offs. 'Course, they then travelled together to Medinah and we know how that worked out, don't we. Needless to say he wasn't pressed on that but Thanks Tiger.

6).No tips on the putting green this week, Stricker is back in Wisconsin. But the fact is that Tiger has won here seven times and any consideration of likely winners has to include him. Which will mean that prices for the rest of the field should be generous, if only you can pick someone to beat the favourite. I certainly can't.

7).There's a terrific field on hand, no Luke or Rory, no Charl or Louis, but just about everyone else is in town. Strangely, and as noted last week, this has been a happy hunting ground for GB&I golfers with Martin Laird having won two years ago, Greg Owen incomprehensibly contriving to lose to Pampling in 2006, and decent best finishes by McDowell (2nd twice), Poulter (3rd last year), Rose (3rd in 2011), Davis (4th last year) and Westwood (5th in 2007). David Lynn makes his first visit and, at the other end of the scale, Ross Fisher was DQ'd after one round on his only appearance.
Maybe Justin Rose's turn? Wouldn't put any money on it but there seems to be something in Justin's DNA that has him winning this sort of event, especially after not doing so great coming in. Will playing with Tiger (and Ernie) in Rounds 1 and 2 help or hinder the English petal?

8).A strong web.com field is assembling in Louisiana for the first US-based tournament of the year, and Gary Christian and Russell Knox tee it up for Britain along with 18 Tour winners (and seven more are alternates).

9).While the old farts are in adjacent Mississippi, where Brian Henninger makes his first Champions Tour start. Not many Tour players can say their only two tournament wins were in Mississippi but Henninger certainly can. He was also the guy holding Ben Crenshaw's hand during the final round of Gentle Ben's post-Penick-funeral Masters win in 1995. Chapman, Mouland and Lyle will be there as well, Lyle presumably making his final (and futile) start before Augusta.

10).Easy to be cynical writing notes about the famous and wannabe famous, but much harder to express adequate admiration and appreciation for Stacy Lewis's relentless rise up the Rolex rankings to be Number One in the World.
Her difficulties with scoliosis, spinal fusion, years in a cast are well known, but she was also the first Curtis Cupper to win all five of her matches, at St.Andrews, in 2008, having already won a rain-shortened (and hence unofficial) LPGA event as an amateur. She qualified for the 2008 US Open which she led after three rounds before crumbling with a Sunday 78.
Lewis qualified for the LPGA Tour in the same Q-School as Michelle Wie, receiving far less publicity but winning the event by three shots, Wee Wie finishing six shots back.
Her career has maintained its upward trajectory including a 2011 Kraft Nabisco Championship and, without falderal or fanfare has become the first American since Beth Daniel (in 1994!!) to be LPGA Player of the Year in 2012. Great to see her go from strength to strength, even as she and her caddie go over the Rules Book regarding etiquette in a bunker.
A credit to the LPGA Tour and one of many good reasons why the Tour seems to have bottomed out and is on the rise again.

Yeah he was told to turn it down due to tyre wear as a precaution.

Obviously if a non team mate was attacking from behind or the team wasnt supposed to hold back(no team orders) webber more than likely wouldnt have turned the engine down, or at the very least been aware of being in a 'Race' situtation

So vettel can claim victory but not a moral one. Because webber had no power to challenge.

So either way it was a non race. Following team orders or one not doing so.

I dont completly blmae vettel btw. But at the same time it was a complete farce

Dyna - what was that F1 programme called?

Quite like watching that stuff even though it was often a death sentence. Whilst I deride health and safety these days - it was certainly a necessity in F1...

McLaren wrote:...Tiger has the mind of a Vettel and not a webber.

i.e. he's a disgusting piece of work?

navyblueshorts wrote:

McLaren wrote:...Tiger has the mind of a Vettel and not a webber.

i.e. he's a disgusting piece of work?

I would say muslim scholars and vatican officials who support or ignore abuse are disgusting pieces of work, poor sportsmanship just makes you a a bit of an arse wipe.

Mac,
I'm not more negative towards Tiger, I'm negative about everyone's sycophantic regard of him, as if his supposed standing in the game is too lofty to be tweaked by anyone.

Actually liked a little tweak by Arnie when asked about Woods equalling Sam Snead's reord of 8 wins of a specific tournament. 'Amazing', or something like that, 'but Sam won on several different (Greensboro) courses . . . . . '

I don't see any humanity or humility in Tiger whatsoever, or even any regard for his fellow pro.

Clearly the greatest golfer of his era (past twenty years), though not necessarily any better than Rory right now, but his relentless drive and failure to offer any legacy except the "W" diminishes his standing in my view, rather than enhances it.

But, hey, that's just my view, there are plenty of eminent people in all walks of life that fall into the same category for me.

Similar view from myself - huge respect for what he has done in the game, but doesn't seem like a decent human being based on what little we know about him as a person (although there's a separate debate as to how much fault lies with him rather than his peculiar upbringing). Don't have a problem with him choosing to play courses where he has had success previously mind you.

Like him or loathe him (and I know we have contributors in both categories and everything in-between), I find it utterly astounding that he has regained world #1 ranking given the abysmal shape he was in around 2010 and a third(?) overhaul of swing technique - whether necessary because of injury or otherwise, and the resultant bursting of his invincibility aura. Also bearing in mind that many people were saying towards the end of 2012 that McIlroy was firmly established as #1 and would stay there for many months or years.

Obviously, he still wants to go on and win more major championships, but we'll have to watch and wait to see whether he manages to bag another 1, 4 or 5 or however many.

Its about how good they are for me. And woods is the best ever!- forget 20 years.(if we bring the GOAT topic into this)- legacy- well that has no bearing IMO

But at the same time its not. If Tiger starts winning everything in sight- I wont be watching golf much untill his reign is over..

Some wonderful memories

http://www.golfchannel.com/media/tiger-woods-career-pga-tour-wins/?cid=twitter_P_gc_TIGER76PGATOURWINS_032313#1

Mac -

Nice find!

SR isnt upholding his bet. I think we need to give him a different punishment.

Lock him in a room with the above wins on video 24/7

I am, I've done one post today saying how pleased I am about his return to #1.

You can't change the goalposts just because you think I'm not sincere.

Thats no fun Super. Its all about winding you up at the same.

Kwin - Interesting about Tiger is that he's almost universally respected by his fellow professionals. How much of that is sheer awe or fear of "rattling his cage" who knows.

Mysti - Fully agree with your assessment, but I enjoy watching him dismantle tournaments. Much like I enjoyed watching Rory at Congressional. And MUCH more than watching Phil's ever plastic smile as he lips out 3 footer after 3 footer.

Speaking of which, I'm hoping for some epic battles this summer between the two.

Very few guys who have hit the heights Woods has come back to be close to their previous bests. If Woods can go on and bag a few more majors then for my money its one of the biggest comebacks on sport considering the mental and physical issues the guy has faced.
He's a hard bloke to like but an easy golfer to admire.

Diggers wrote:He's a hard bloke to like but an easy golfer to admire.

Lots of BS on here at times from both sides about Woods, but this I am in 100% agreement with.

Sr,
I followed a couple of Isleworth members around at Turning Stone a few years ago (CHIII and Appleby I think) and there were some middle-aged women from CNY who wintered in Isleworth and talked about how Woods was gracious and polite etc. Doubtless that's true, but who is really close to him (apart from boy-racer Atwal I suppose)? He seems to have dumped John Cook and Fatty O'Meara - even Stricker and Couples went ages without hearing from him.

Am quite prepared to believe Phil is a total prat but will always much prefer watching him, his failures as well as his triumphs. Interesting that Phil seems to be a mentor for young Americans in team matches but Tiger sticks mostly with old-time cronies, Furyk, Stricker etc.

Regardless, will reprise a very mind-blowing experience of watching Woods in this week's Notes . . . . I know, you can't wait!!

McLaren wrote:Some wonderful memories

Can't believe what a miserable sod he is. All those pictures of him holding trophies and scowling. What a w@nker...

McLaren wrote:

navyblueshorts wrote:

McLaren wrote:...Tiger has the mind of a Vettel and not a webber.

i.e. he's a disgusting piece of work?

I would say muslim scholars and vatican officials who support or ignore abuse are disgusting pieces of work, poor sportsmanship just makes you a a bit of an arse wipe.

True, although that's a little unfair of you to bring in such as they. Maybe 'disgusting' is a bit strong. Still, bit of an unfair comparison for TW; I wouldn't suggest he's as low as Vettel was last weekend. Webber should definitely have punched his lights out.

MontysMerkin wrote:

McLaren wrote:Some wonderful memories

Can't believe what a miserable sod he is. All those pictures of him holding trophies and scowling. What a w@nker...

Super, are you not supposed to be nice about tiger this week?

McLaren wrote:Some wonderful memories

http://www.golfchannel.com/media/tiger-woods-career-pga-tour-wins/?cid=twitter_P_gc_TIGER76PGATOURWINS_032313#1

I don't know about 'wonderful memories' but he's sure as Hell won a lot.

A couple of points:

DLIII must have been thoroughly fed up with TW around 2000ish
What was Arnie thinking with those stupid Viking-a-like swords for TW's earlier Bay Hill wins????

McLaren wrote:

MontysMerkin wrote:

McLaren wrote:Some wonderful memories

Can't believe what a miserable sod he is. All those pictures of him holding trophies and scowling. What a w@nker...

Super, are you not supposed to be nice about tiger this week?

Not me, I promise, I would never say something as derogatory as that, well not this week obviously.

super_realist wrote:

McLaren wrote:

MontysMerkin wrote:

McLaren wrote:Some wonderful memories

Can't believe what a miserable sod he is. All those pictures of him holding trophies and scowling. What a w@nker...

Super, are you not supposed to be nice about tiger this week?

Not me, I promise, I would never say something as derogatory as that, well not this week obviously.

Maybe I should have added a

MontysMerkin wrote:

McLaren wrote:Some wonderful memories

Can't believe what a miserable sod he is. All those pictures of him holding trophies and scowling. What a w@nker...

Your telling us your not Super!

Still getting your fix

Oh dear, have I been modded or did I dream that had I posted "Bloody germans!" ... in quotation marks no less?

I wonder how many personas super_realist has deployed over time?

Don't know if anyone else has noticed but he posts a lot but never seems to be online?

Shotrock wrote:
...awe or fear...
...I enjoy watching him dismantle tournaments...

etc... Not sure if Tiger is back, but the Tiger 'speak' is certainly back.

C'mon... he only won by a couple of shots at the end of the day...
And can't really say that Rose was in any state of 'awe or fear', he outscored him by 6 shots the first 2 days when they played side-by-side. His 3rd round faltering was his own problem (if there is one) and had nothing to do with Woods...

Not criticizing this by any means, as I also find myself sometimes getting carried away and using 'big words', which I wouldn't normally use that easy. It's all to do with watching too much Golf Channel, NBC, Sky , etc... I suggest giving up tv for lent as we did in this household, it's amazing how little we're missing it...
Ok, cheated there a little bit, I did have a peek every now and then for some online golf video feeds...

" I suggest giving up tv for lent as we did in this household, it's amazing how little we're missing it.."

I dont have a TV and don't miss it at all.

Thats interesting mclaren, what do you do with the time you used to spend watching tv?

incontinentia wrote:Thats interesting mclaren, what do you do with the time you used to spend watching tv?

Telling everybody about it apparently.

kwinigolfer wrote:Mac,
I'm not more negative towards Tiger, I'm negative about everyone's sycophantic regard of him, as if his supposed standing in the game is too lofty to be tweaked by anyone.

Actually liked a little tweak by Arnie when asked about Woods equalling Sam Snead's reord of 8 wins of a specific tournament. 'Amazing', or something like that, 'but Sam won on several different (Greensboro) courses . . . . . '

I don't see any humanity or humility in Tiger whatsoever, or even any regard for his fellow pro.

Clearly the greatest golfer of his era (past twenty years), though not necessarily any better than Rory right now, but his relentless drive and failure to offer any legacy except the "W" diminishes his standing in my view, rather than enhances it.

But, hey, that's just my view, there are plenty of eminent people in all walks of life that fall into the same category for me.

What the "Arnster" failed to mention (but I'm guessing he didn't even know this) was that Sam's Greensboro Open wins spanned 27 years, whereas Tiger just did the same in less than half the time (13 years), which is more impressive to me.

But, play a limited schedule (taking a page from Jack Nicklaus) and win as much as TW does, multiple times on the same course are inevitable.

8 at Bay Hill
8 at Torrey
7 at Firestone
5 at Muirfield Village
5 at Cog Hill
4 at Augusta
4 at Doral
2 at Pebble Beach
2 at TOC
2 at Medinah

Roller the racing prog was on BBc4 last night 'great days of british racing'or something similar.Some great black and white footage.
may have been said already but the F1 teams at the weekend were trying to save fuel and more importantly engine wear as they have to resuse effectively

princedracula wrote:

Shotrock wrote:
...awe or fear...
...I enjoy watching him dismantle tournaments...

etc... Not sure if Tiger is back, but the Tiger 'speak' is certainly back.

C'mon... he only won by a couple of shots at the end of the day...
And can't really say that Rose was in any state of 'awe or fear', he outscored him by 6 shots the first 2 days when they played side-by-side. His 3rd round faltering was his own problem (if there is one) and had nothing to do with Woods...

Not criticizing this by any means, as I also find myself sometimes getting carried away and using 'big words', which I wouldn't normally use that easy. It's all to do with watching too much Golf Channel, NBC, Sky , etc... I suggest giving up tv for lent as we did in this household, it's amazing how little we're missing it...
Ok, cheated there a little bit, I did have a peek every now and then for some online golf video feeds...

You could put it another way , if Rose is now the 3rd best player on the planet Woods is hardly going to be quaking in his boots right now, he must be thinking let's make hay while the sun shines.
Kwini, define what leaving a legacy is meant to mean ? Why us Woods going to be any less than say Watson ?
It's the same old Love sacks as far as I can see. Nicklaus has his own tournament and he's a wonderful caring human being , Woods does it and its all self interest, the foundation is all self interest etc etc.
As far as I can see Woods gets nothing like the same level of sycophancy as Nicklaus or Palmer or Watson which is on a vomit inducing level.
Nicklaus concedes a putt and he is a hero , Woods does it and he's a zero. Woods has no personality and is completely focussed yet apparently is actually popular on tour.
Etc etc.

Diggers -

Diggers wrote:

princedracula wrote:

Shotrock wrote:
...awe or fear...
...I enjoy watching him dismantle tournaments...

etc... Not sure if Tiger is back, but the Tiger 'speak' is certainly back.

C'mon... he only won by a couple of shots at the end of the day...
And can't really say that Rose was in any state of 'awe or fear', he outscored him by 6 shots the first 2 days when they played side-by-side. His 3rd round faltering was his own problem (if there is one) and had nothing to do with Woods...

Not criticizing this by any means, as I also find myself sometimes getting carried away and using 'big words', which I wouldn't normally use that easy. It's all to do with watching too much Golf Channel, NBC, Sky , etc... I suggest giving up tv for lent as we did in this household, it's amazing how little we're missing it...
Ok, cheated there a little bit, I did have a peek every now and then for some online golf video feeds...

You could put it another way , if Rose is now the 3rd best player on the planet Woods is hardly going to be quaking in his boots right now, he must be thinking let's make hay while the sun shines.
Kwini, define what leaving a legacy is meant to mean ? Why us Woods going to be any less than say Watson ?
It's the same old Love sacks as far as I can see. Nicklaus has his own tournament and he's a wonderful caring human being , Woods does it and its all self interest, the foundation is all self interest etc etc.
As far as I can see Woods gets nothing like the same level of sycophancy as Nicklaus or Palmer or Watson which is on a vomit inducing level.
Nicklaus concedes a putt and he is a hero , Woods does it and he's a zero. Woods has no personality and is completely focussed yet apparently is actually popular on tour.
Etc etc.

Diggers, drop Super a line...he could probably do with some of your input this week

Prince - It's not how many strokes you win a tournament by it's whether you win or not. It's the most binary of all calculations. From my observation, this past Sunday/Monday no one made a meaningful charge at Tiger: Not Rose, not Bradley, not Fowler. Much like GMac in Tiger's other victory this year.

Why? I'll suggest that players chasing down Tiger need to make something happen and not wait for him to falter; which given his record of closing events he's incredibly proficient at. So, they go out of their comfort zone. Folwer fires at pins near the water, etc.

Rose perhaps stayed true to his plan and, of course, lost (if you can call pocketing $600k+ "losing").

Digs,
Only any point in responding to comments I've made rather than others you've (justifiably) dug up.

By legacy I'm just suggesting that Tiger's legacy will be:
*Higher Tour purses.
*A quality of play at his best that hasn't been seen for a generation, some would say ever, but still feel Nicklaus wins that argument.
*Exponential interest by those who wouldn't normally follow golf, leading to unprecedented endorsements, sponsorships, equipment and apparrel sales, etc.

But despite all this:
*No black American players on Tour.
*Continued reduction in golf participation, in the US at least.
*Continued net closure of courses in the U.S.

Don't think any of the rest is relevant but certainly respect your views.

bites lip....................................................

Sups.

Respect for not having a pop(on that username anyway )

You might as well be banned for a week

Great post diggers. I remember on the bbc 606 I got a lot of stick for suggesting Arnold Palmer was probably a deeply unkind person who cared for only his own kind. Not that I needed any more proof but his comments about healthcare are quite revealing.

Tiger may be a git to the odd person he meets but is there any evidence that he wishes great suffering on those unable to afford adequate health insurance?

I said earlier that we should support golfers based on what they do on the course. So in some ways it is inconsistent of me to know bash Arnie for off course opinions. But when they are so dire it is fair to make an exception.

As for the legacy of Tiger, the key point is field strength. If you ignore that -which would be irrational - you can still argue Jack was better. If you accept tigers generation was a lot stronger then he is clearly the best player ever.

Good perspective Diggs.

Time does soften the views, I wasn't around but I bet that Nicklaus' career was in the main one of relentless self interest in the pursuit of titles/glory. Looking back now he is (rightly) remembered for simply being the greatest golfer. He probably also benefitted from not having blanket media coverge, I bet there are unsavoury Nicklaus incidents that simply never got out.

Kwini - in terms of the dearth of black American tour pros, the breakthrough of TW was less than 20 years ago. Tiger and Rory showed talent at 3 (ish?) so the likelihood of top talent making it to the pinnacle yet is, I would suggest, unlikely. A more telling factor would be whether there are more/significant numbers of promising black American golfers in the High School/College ranks as yet. That I have no idea about.

The main problem of the inspiration for a generation (particularly in golf) is that it takes a generation for it to flow through (and favourable socio economic circumstances). I would hazard a guess that it is more likely that those directly inspired by Woods would be too old to have made it and so their inspiration may manifest itself through their children.

McLaren wrote:

As for the legacy of Tiger, the key point is field strength. If you ignore that -which would be irrational - you can still argue Jack was better. If you accept tigers generation was a lot stronger then he is clearly the best player ever.

You really think Mac??
Palmer, Player, Trevino, Watson, Seve...just a selection of multiple major winners during Nicklaus' era.

During the Woods era the multiple major winners have been Els? Goosen? VJ? Harrington? Now Rory...

Do you honestly think the latter group were stiffer competition than the former?

If Woods finishes with more than 18 Majors then yes, by almost all definitions he can be considered the greatest until then the jury is out and will stay out.

JAS wrote:

McLaren wrote:

As for the legacy of Tiger, the key point is field strength. If you ignore that -which would be irrational - you can still argue Jack was better. If you accept tigers generation was a lot stronger then he is clearly the best player ever.

You really think Mac??
Palmer, Player, Trevino, Watson, Seve...just a selection of multiple major winners during Nicklaus' era.

During the Woods era the multiple major winners have been Els? Goosen? VJ? Harrington? Now Rory...

Do you honestly think the latter group were stiffer competition than the former?

If Woods finishes with more than 18 Majors then yes, by almost all definitions he can be considered the greatest until then the jury is out and will stay out.

You prove my point by failing to appreciate it is about the strength of the players ranked from 10 upwards, and not the very best of each generation. You have to understand that in tigers day the probability of anyone going low enough to beat the very best is much higher than in jacks. Think of the lower ranked players as one entity, where each week one of them springs out and goes as low as even the very best can.

I am with mac here.

And i have deabted my theory for hours on here. Golf has an upward curve in quality. What woods has done is so significant his collegues have been undervalued by some.

The reason we cant put els, singh, pmick in watsons or parlmers league is because so many majors got taken out by woods in there peak time.

Well now you could say the others won in a longer era than a 10 year spell so they still had the chance. Point is though the top 200 golfers are so good these days they can all win a major ! So winning one is hard in its self. Its not just about being the best..

I think it was Robo (thanks!) who published something about strength of field that Jack faced, particularly in the Open Championship where (their loss) too many Americans didn't want to travel. It's nowhere near as weak today in that event, and all other majors IMO. Mysti is 100% correct - the fields are far deeper.

At the end of the day, Jack could only beat the competition in front of him, and Tiger can only do the same.

Tiger wins more professional tournaments than Jack, that is irrefutable.

Jack has more professional majors, but Tiger may not be done yet.

Even if Tiger beats Jack's record, start the parade of those that will highlihght Jack's second place finishes in majors (or as I like to say, majors both Jack and I did not win!).

Best of all time - Tiger. But, it's all opinion and you know what they say about that ...

Now Tiger is fully back I hope we get a period of historic head-to-heads similar to Nicklaus / Watson or will the norm be for Tiger's contendors to "do a Rose" whenever Tiger climbs the leaderboard. We've had over a decade of the world's best players "doing a Rose" against Tiger. I for one will be dissapointed if this becomes the norm again.

I can't see any of the established players beating Tiger head-to-head as they failed in this task the first time round - why would they be better now they are older and richer? Are the younger players up to the challange?

I guess I'm heading towards a hope that Rory can take on and beat Tiger. I'm sure they will have several clashes in years to come. I propose Rory will win if he outplays Tiger and build up a lead going into the back 9, but if they start the back 9 tied then Tiger's mental strength should prevail.

Anyway, 2013 as a golf fan is more interesting now Tiger's back, provided he is not allowed to dominate again. All we need is Rory back and it will be an amazing season to follow.

I would have thought "legacy" was more about how an individual, in this case a golfer, left the world/place/community a better place, not about individual achievements.

Roller:
Appreciate what you're saying but the world where Charlie Sifford and Ted Rhodes, Lee Elder and Jim Dent, Charlie Owens, Tony Sills and Jim Thorpe which partly fostered the young Tiger has apparently disappeared, and I'm not sure why. The situation is more promising in South Africa than in the land of the freee, home of the brave.
But I DO know that almost no (OK, Joe Bramlett) black pros are coming through the ranks, and very few Hispanic golfers from the caddy shacks like Trevino, Rodriguez, Jimenez.

Tiger has some amazing stats, not sure how Jack compares with these-
-top 10 in 60.4% of career starts
-top 3 in 41.6% of career starts
-9 missed cuts on the pga tour in his entire career
-has won 52 out of 56 times when at least sharing the 54 hole lead

That's where I bow to greater knowledge Kwini.

I reckon the theory will stand up and there will be some en route but just down the ages at the moment. I guess the "elitist" world of golf (and it is still so or at least very much perceived as so I'm afraid) will remain a hard nut for many sectors of society to WANT to crack on mass let alone actually have a go at doing so.

I find it really bizarre that people should think for instance part of Woods legacy should be more black players on tour...why ? Or even in fact more black guys playing golf, maybe by and large black guys dont like playing golf and prefer other sports.
Bill Gates has a foundation, the aim of that foundation isnt to encourage people to become computer billionaires, why should Woods be to make more people golfers ?
From what I gather Woods helps make the world a better place for injured military personnel, thats more than most people do, a hell of a lot more than most people do.

Tiger's legacy:

1) raises awareness that sex addiction is possibly a psychologicial condition.

2) teaches new generation of golfers that spitting on the golf course (paticularly the greens) is acceptable behaviour.