Lions weaknesses

With the selection made and the current squad packing their bags, where do you think we have the most potential weaknesses? (this is not a country bashing thread btw).

For my opinion I think we have the squad to make a good strong team, but with any touring squad there are a few areas that are relatively weaker than others

Front Row - I think an area of strength, certainly with the first choice. There are some concerns over the bench on hooker, I do not actually think it is really that weak. Our third sting options (In my opinion Stevens and Vinoploa) are weaker / untested - but as third string should not have an impact

Second row - lots of options and some good strength - main concern if the fitness of Gray and POC, both coming back from injury - if they come up to their potential - I think we have a very strong group to choose from

Back row - big debate over Lydiate and Croft and their fitness / form - while still a concern, there are good options in the back row. With the addition of croft, we have some varying styles we can go with. Only other concern is has Gatland put a rod up his back with a captain who may not be the best in his position?

Scrum half - Actually think this is a slightly weaker area. - Philips at his best is very good, but apart from the England game, he was fairly poor in the 6 nations. Additonally his style may not always suit playing Australia. Youngs can be sublime, but not sure he is firing on all cylinders, but he does offer a different challenge to Australia. Murray is a less experiences Phillips. Not sure if there was anyone else really putting their hand up to fly (Maybe Care), which has left us a little weaker here

10 - Weak area - mainly because we have only 2. One is going through a little bit of a dip (and is slightly limited) and one coming back from injury. Will the tour re-invigorate Farrel and will he cope with the pressure. He is not nearly as bad as some people say, or as good as others say. The fact that Hogg may be shoe horned in (after not playing there since school (which to be fair is only 2 weeks agao :-0 )) shows we are short of options

12 / 13 - Weak / Medium- we have limited options to mix around 12 coupled with a grand dad who was (and could still be) world class, but will he survive. We have a strong runner, but off form and some questions about his passing and awareness and a strong performer, but needs to click. Could be a strength if it comes together, but an area to watch

Wings - Strong area - good mix of styles and strike runners. Might have been nice to have a bolter here, as the only area I think we are lacking is the magic dust of pixie feet

Full back - Strong area - 3 very good full backs - all offering something slightly different - if they all hit form, we are spoilt for choice


Gatland - Medium - brought Wales forward and has developed them into the leading NH team, but can he adapt enough to get that win over Australia - if Plan A is not working, does he have the guile to create and execute Plan B - at the moment I am not sure


Over all, I think we have a medium to strong squad - which may get stronger as some of the players gain fitness


Final note - Fans - Very strong (if sometimes a little mental )

Riskysports wrote:With the selection made and the current squad packing their bags, where do you think we have the most potential weaknesses? (this is not a country bashing thread btw).

For my opinion I think we have the squad to make a good strong team, but with any touring squad there are a few areas that are relatively weaker than others

Front Row - I think an area of strength, certainly with the first choice. There are some concerns over the bench on hooker, I do not actually think it is really that weak. Our third sting options (In my opinion Stevens and Vinoploa) are weaker / untested - but as third string should not have an impact

Second row - lots of options and some good strength - main concern if the fitness of Gray and POC, both coming back from injury - if they come up to their potential - I think we have a very strong group to choose from

Back row - big debate over Lydiate and Croft and their fitness / form - while still a concern, there are good options in the back row. With the addition of croft, we have some varying styles we can go with. Only other concern is has Gatland put a rod up his back with a captain who may not be the best in his position?

Scrum half - Actually think this is a slightly weaker area. - Philips at his best is very good, but apart from the England game, he was fairly poor in the 6 nations. Additonally his style may not always suit playing Australia. Youngs can be sublime, but not sure he is firing on all cylinders, but he does offer a different challenge to Australia. Murray is a less experiences Phillips. Not sure if there was anyone else really putting their hand up to fly (Maybe Care), which has left us a little weaker here

10 - Weak area - mainly because we have only 2. One is going through a little bit of a dip (and is slightly limited) and one coming back from injury. Will the tour re-invigorate Farrel and will he cope with the pressure. He is not nearly as bad as some people say, or as good as others say. The fact that Hogg may be shoe horned in (after not playing there since school (which to be fair is only 2 weeks agao :-0 )) shows we are short of options

12 / 13 - Weak / Medium- we have limited options to mix around 12 coupled with a grand dad who was (and could still be) world class, but will he survive. We have a strong runner, but off form and some questions about his passing and awareness and a strong performer, but needs to click. Could be a strength if it comes together, but an area to watch

Wings - Strong area - good mix of styles and strike runners. Might have been nice to have a bolter here, as the only area I think we are lacking is the magic dust of pixie feet

Full back - Strong area - 3 very good full backs - all offering something slightly different - if they all hit form, we are spoilt for choice


Gatland - Medium - brought Wales forward and has developed them into the leading NH team, but can he adapt enough to get that win over Australia - if Plan A is not working, does he have the guile to create and execute Plan B - at the moment I am not sure


Over all, I think we have a medium to strong squad - which may get stronger as some of the players gain fitness


Final note - Fans - Very strong (if sometimes a little mental )

This would be the biggest area of concern for me - a Plan B that is simply repeat Plan A just doesn't cut the mustard

They can only see in black and white and can be right lazy bar stewards at certain hot times of the day. Not great when you're in Oz against gold shirts.

I probably agree with you here risky...

Our front row options are superb IMHO, with the scrummaging prowess of Jones and Hibbard, and the dynamism of the likes of Jenkins, Healy, Vunipola and the breakdown work of croft and Jonkins I think we have it all, and Stevens to cheer them on!!

Lock I agree we need POC fit and firing, other wise Evans and Grey will play and they lack a bit of grunt and breakdown nous.

Back row is interwesting, but your right Warbs hasn't been the best 7 in Wales for over a year, let alone in the isles!!

I disagree a bit regarding Phillips, he has his weaknesses but 99% of what people hate about him is direction and execution of a gameplan, combined with breakdown issues Wales have been having for a while!

Sexton is my biggest worry, and our only 10 option of any note, I like Farrell but I don't want to see him in a test, infact I'd prefer Madigan or Biggar, but Farrell is a good option to have on tour.

Re centres I think we have a bit of a dillemma, Roberts is the defencive leader, and needs to be at 12, but he offers so little distribution, and with Sexton being targeted we'll need BOD or Davies to play there to help out!

Back 3 is wow OMG time, mixture of absolutely everything, and the only area I think Gats has a real headache for test selection!!!

Croft and Jonkins??? Cole and Jenkins

Largely agree on the playing front:

Strong front row options and plenty of dynamism

2nd row - If the guys picked (POC and Gray) get into top form then this is a strong area, with a good combination of athletic and more powerful players.

Flankers - Again, good strength and depth. Including Tipuric and Croft gives us more open field options, while the rest are very solid players. As I put elsewhere, Lydiate is a punt from Gatland in the hope of having a really fresh and in form quality player available.

No 8 - A bit of a weakness. Both Faletau and Heaslip are good rather than fantastic. Would have been nice to have the option of Ben Morgan, with his extra power, but injury and inactivity made that a selection risk too far.

No 9 - Youngs is a very good conventional SH, Phillips a very good unconventional one, so not a bad pair for starter and replacement. Agree that so far Murray looks like a less good version of Phillips, but I assume is there for the midweek games.

no 10 - Was always likely to be a weak position, with Scotland still not having a genuine test level fly half and Wales having their second choice playing for most of this year. The Lions came a bit too early for some of the more exciting talent (Burns, Madigan etc). Sexton's good and Farrell is better than some posters have suggested, but the selection of only 2 10s is baffling (especially in the absence of Hook or 12trees).

No 12 - For me probably the biggest area of concern. I'd have loved to see a more creative option included, but it looks like Roberts will be first choice. Good at what he does, but is that enough?

No 13 - a choice of BOD, Tuillagi or JD2 is probably one of our strongest areas. Just a pity it isn't the O'Driscoll of 4 or 5 years ago before he lost his break-away pace but had already become a smart player.

Wingers - Not sure we have an X-factor winger in the squad (unless 1/2p or Hogg play there), but have plenty of big, fast and powerful guys. Whether they will see enough ball and whether they have the brilliance to unlock the Aus defence is to be proven.

Fullback - Very strong area, with 1/2p as perhaps the best all-rounder, Kearney as probably the best guy I've ever seen under a high ball and Hogg, who is the best strike runner in the squad.

I think my biggest concern is a lack of flair in the back division. - we've a lot of boshers there but other than Hogg, 1/2p and perhaps O'Driscoll, not many that can go round a defender or produce a defence-splitting pass.

Overall, although the forwards selection has a few oddities (Stevens, Hartley, Lydiate), I like the strength and dynamism of the potential Test pack.

Just in terms of second row combinations.

On the last tour we saw that the scrum struggled with POC and Jones in the second row (both loosehead locks), I know Vickery was replaced by Jones which improved things but it can't be denied that Shaw had a massive impact on the scrum too. To truly ram home any scrum advantage we should look to pick a balanced second row pair, like POC and Evans, or Gray and Parling maybe?

In Africa Lions hunt in packs.

It is mainly the Lionesses that hunt, they have a "chaser" and then the others set an ambush.

So what you can learn from nature is the following.

Your wingers are your chasers, but most importantly without the ambushers, these are the support players, the chasers are useless.

The pack is misleading as in rugby the pack is usually seen as the forwards whereas in a pack (pride) of Lions it is all of them

The Lions King, is your flyhalf, there to take all the points, but not really involved in the hunting process.

Anyhow, some food for thought.

Oh just onelast thing, a Lion needs to feed regularly, as not to weaken, same with the British and Irish Lions, feed on points regularly.

I agree with dummy half here with regards to strengths..... the midfield will be awesome. I think Jon Davies will come out of this tour a major star. I would love Davies at 12 and Tualagi or BOD with some space hitting the outside line

It will come down to who Gatland actually starts and who he has on his bench.

The way I see it there are a few "weaknesses" that the Wallabies can look to hitting.

1. The Wallabies are not known for having an effective scrum. However, Scrums are units, the lions traditionally struggle here as it is due to the team being a colelction of individuals.
This issue is compounded in that if (who I class as being the starting front row) get injured, our backups are really not effective scrummagers.

2. The backrow. Again it will come down to who is picked. We have an abundance of talent here but if the balance is not right it can starve a whole team of attacking ball.

3. halfbacks. Only having two stand offs is risky. If Sexton gets injured, oh dear! Combined with the fact that our 9's are some of the slowest passers from the base of a ruck!!!

4. Wings. Cuthbert is a defensive liability. North has been rather quiet this year. Bowe is coming back form injury. Maitland is new to the NH style of play (maitland is my man to watch though if things click for the lions)

In general our backs are going to be big lumbering beasts with no zip. If 1/2p starts at 15 then we wont even have Hogg to provide that burst. If we are going to bosh it up the middle all day, the ozzies can soak that up and hit on the counter.

This is going to come down to Gatlands starting 15 and the game plan he employs. I'm still looking at a Wallabies series win to be honest!

The biggest danger for the Lions are predictability.

Noy sure I like that analogy there Bilts.... you saying wallabies going to be food for the lions?????

If they do the hunt well mate, not every hunt is successful.

phew!!

Well I'm off to the English beaches for the long weekend, hope you guys all have a great weekend and catch ya next week!!!

Matt Dawson questioned the goalkicking options the other day.

It may seem an odd concern, given that Sexton, Halfpenny and Farrell are all very competent, but he was thinking more about the kicking options in any given match day squad.

Am I the only one thinking Halfpenny could do a job at 10? He has stepped into that role for Wales and the Blues for brief moments, give him another kicking option at 12 and I'm sure he'd be alright there.

dummy_half wrote:Largely agree on the playing front:

Strong front row options and plenty of dynamism

2nd row - If the guys picked (POC and Gray) get into top form then this is a strong area, with a good combination of athletic and more powerful players.

Flankers - Again, good strength and depth. Including Tipuric and Croft gives us more open field options, while the rest are very solid players. As I put elsewhere, Lydiate is a punt from Gatland in the hope of having a really fresh and in form quality player available.

No 8 - A bit of a weakness. Both Faletau and Heaslip are good rather than fantastic. Would have been nice to have the option of Ben Morgan, with his extra power, but injury and inactivity made that a selection risk too far.

No 9 - Youngs is a very good conventional SH, Phillips a very good unconventional one, so not a bad pair for starter and replacement. Agree that so far Murray looks like a less good version of Phillips, but I assume is there for the midweek games.

no 10 - Was always likely to be a weak position, with Scotland still not having a genuine test level fly half and Wales having their second choice playing for most of this year. The Lions came a bit too early for some of the more exciting talent (Burns, Madigan etc). Sexton's good and Farrell is better than some posters have suggested, but the selection of only 2 10s is baffling (especially in the absence of Hook or 12trees).

No 12 - For me probably the biggest area of concern. I'd have loved to see a more creative option included, but it looks like Roberts will be first choice. Good at what he does, but is that enough?

No 13 - a choice of BOD, Tuillagi or JD2 is probably one of our strongest areas. Just a pity it isn't the O'Driscoll of 4 or 5 years ago before he lost his break-away pace but had already become a smart player.

Wingers - Not sure we have an X-factor winger in the squad (unless 1/2p or Hogg play there), but have plenty of big, fast and powerful guys. Whether they will see enough ball and whether they have the brilliance to unlock the Aus defence is to be proven.

Fullback - Very strong area, with 1/2p as perhaps the best all-rounder, Kearney as probably the best guy I've ever seen under a high ball and Hogg, who is the best strike runner in the squad.

I think my biggest concern is a lack of flair in the back division. - we've a lot of boshers there but other than Hogg, 1/2p and perhaps O'Driscoll, not many that can go round a defender or produce a defence-splitting pass.

Overall, although the forwards selection has a few oddities (Stevens, Hartley, Lydiate), I like the strength and dynamism of the potential Test pack.

I'd say flair is something the Lions backs aren't lacking, with guys like Maitland, Sexton, Bowe, Davies, Hogg, Kearney and the master himself BOD there's plenty of flair there... It's just whether it sticks or they end up going for Plan A of bosh bosh bosh and forget about Plan B of trying to create some rugby!

If their are any weeknesses in the Lions team. I think it could well be at 10.

Both Sexton and Farrell will have to play all the games. If one of them 2 get injured, then the Lions could well suffer....Unless they have a plan to play Halfpenny or Hogg, in some of the Games at 10.

Glaring weaknesses with the back up hookers and at 10 for me.

Weaknesses - half backs.

It would appear Phillips is going to be no 1 SH and he is glacially slow to get the ball out to the backs and gets caught in possession far to much and we only have one decent 10 in sexton alothough Hogg could just shine given his display for Glasgow today.

without a ball playing centre as well as the weak half backs we simply will be unable to score enough tries to win.

majesticimperialman wrote:If their are any weeknesses in the Lions team. I think it could well be at 10.

Both Sexton and Farrell will have to play all the games. If one of them 2 get injured, then the Lions could well suffer....Unless they have a plan to play Halfpenny or Hogg, in some of the Games at 10.

Hogg is the back up 10 - and showed why playing for Glasgow today.

Yeah, if there are any doubts about Sexton (see how he goes in the lead up matches) then it may be worth considering Hogg at 10. That would then free it up for Halfpenny at fb and be the choice of goalkicker.

Hogg's a sturdy bloke but he needs to get quick ball obviously so he can launch probing kicks and link up with Roberts/JD2... or a cut out pass for BOD. Does he have a deft touch, soft hands, good distribution skills?

I love the old Phillips cliche's...

Can you remind me what they are, blues?
Seriously, I know he gets a lot of stick but he's not that bad... is he?

He isn't particularly talented, mostly because his distribution is rather rash at times, but any notion that he is slow is mightily misguided.

He his undoubtedly a big game player and loves to rock up when the pressures really on, see his tries v Ireland, England, France and lions performances in key games, I think he may be man of the series.

Yeah, that's the impression I got. He takes it up to the gain line. Quite a fearless player, imo.

He's a weapon, and a handy one to have in the arsenal, by no means a complete 9, or a talented 9, he isn't as classy as Youngs, quick as Care or versatile as Laidlaw but he offers so much more than all 3.

Then he's your man then!
He's the most 'Australian' styled player if you know what I mean?

When you look at how the SH are playing the game at both club and Test level, they are miles ahead in handling skills - any kind of open game and the Lions will get pasted.

Where are leaders in the backline who will be needed to organise the defense? Will the Lions have any more coherent strategy other than don't give Australia the ball?

In his interviews Gatland already has shown how weak his selection and man management skills are, so the biggest weakness is undoubtedly the coaching team. If Gatland is rocked back on his heels there is likely to be considerable pain for him and the Lions.

My only criticism of Phillips is he sometimes looks laboured, almost bored, happy to just shovel the ball out endlessly. But hes had so many big game moments and thats what theyll need. I wouldnt worry too much about his pass as the Lions gameplan wont be reliant on super quick front foot ball. His ability to change the pace of the game quickly will help.

I have a concern re the no 10 slot. Sexton is class but is coming back from injury. Faz appears to be (to me anyway) a bit tired - much the same as last year when his form trailed off. I thought the SA tour last year showed this up and it could be an issue this time with potentially both playing in all games .

Phillips does not just look slow - e is seriously slow to get the ball out. He has other attributes - especially his defensive tackling but he is poor at the primary duty of a SH in getting the ball away from the breakdown quickly

its not what he does that is the issue - its what he doesn't do.

Linebreaker wrote:

Hogg's a sturdy bloke but he needs to get quick ball obviously so he can launch probing kicks and link up with Roberts/JD2... or a cut out pass for BOD. Does he have a deft touch, soft hands, good distribution skills?

Yes - he had a cameo at 10 for Glasgow yesterday made a try with a great pass and played well indeed. he played 10 in age group rugby. However he would not have been my choice as back up 10. I guess the plan is he will play in the midweek side at FB and there will be no substitute 10 - so if farreell is injured Hogg steps in. Fareell will be on the bench for the saturday games.

TJ wrote:Phillips does not just look slow - e is seriously slow to get the ball out. He has other attributes - especially his defensive tackling but he is poor at the primary duty of a SH in getting the ball away from the breakdown quickly

its not what he does that is the issue - its what he doesn't do.

Perhaps...but you can't have it all. There dont look to be many big game 9's around.
10 will be Flavell. Don't see why thats not obvious. Sexton is off injury and isnt the best performer vs SH sides. Neither is Flavell but hes a percentage player and Gats knows 10 man rugby is the best chance the Lions have. If youve been watching the Oz sxv sides last two or three weeks you'd forget about taken them on in open play. That part of the series is oceans apart.

Taylorman wrote:

TJ wrote:Phillips does not just look slow - e is seriously slow to get the ball out. He has other attributes - especially his defensive tackling but he is poor at the primary duty of a SH in getting the ball away from the breakdown quickly

its not what he does that is the issue - its what he doesn't do.

Perhaps...but you can't have it all. There dont look to be many big game 9's around.
10 will be Flavell. Don't see why thats not obvious. Sexton is off injury and isnt the best performer vs SH sides. Neither is Flavell but hes a percentage player and Gats knows 10 man rugby is the best chance the Lions have. If youve been watching the Oz sxv sides last two or three weeks you'd forget about taken them on in open play. That part of the series is oceans apart.

There is no aspect of the game where Farrell is better. Sexton will start whatever the gameplan, and that is a change in tune from when you were calling for the likes of Hogg. Sexton's injury wasn't all that serious, he is fresh unlike Farrell where I agree that he looks tired. Sexton has also hit the ground running with Leinster and will have another couple of big games under his belt by the time the plane departs.

Taylorman wrote:Flavell but hes a percentage player and Gats knows 10 man rugby is the best chance the Lions have. If youve been watching the Oz sxv sides last two or three weeks you'd forget about taken them on in open play. That part of the series is oceans apart.

The best chance would be to utilise the great backs we have available to outplay Aus. Yes the up front battle needs to be won first but Aus will score tries - we will need to score more. We have some great inventive creative backs available - some are not on the plane and those that are can look forward to not seeing much of the ball.

Also - its an entertainment business. Lets entertain.

thebluesmancometh wrote:I love the old Phillips cliche's...

If all your knowledge of Rugby as a sport came from the mouth of a sky sports pundit, you'd be riddled with Clichés too mate...!

Scrummaging-wise, the front row looks good but none of the B&I hookers are that great are throwing in.
Beyond that, back up to Sexton is a major issue. Unfair to ask Stuart Hogg to do it and Owen Farrell will only dazzle the Ozzies with his vast repertoire of kicking as he carries so little threat ball in hand
The greatest risk is that 32 good (plus a few not good <ahem> Matt Stevens) players may just not gel or the non Welsh won't have enough time to get into WG's mindset

Hogg will only be back up 10 in midweek games and only in case of injury. Another 10will be flown out if sexton or Farrell is injured out of the tour

TJ wrote:Hogg will only be back up 10 in midweek games and only in case of injury. Another 10will be flown out if sexton or Farrell is injured out of the tour

I agree Farrell is a weak link. I was more amazed by his inclusion than any other member.

He was hyped to a ridiculous extent by pundits and England/satires coaches alike for the last 12 months and has failed to do anything of note.

He hasn't the skills or experience of any of the other international tens in contention. As well as this I am yet to read anyone on here offer any good words about him other than that he has potential. Matthew Morgan has potential, he also has a crap load more skill than Farrell ever will and like Farrell is second fiddle to Dan Biggar.

1) Our only truly world class player is ageing and prone to injuries.

2) Lack of real quality strike runners & limited ability to change the one obvious game plan.

Big trev - who is our one world class player? I think there are a fair few and some are young and the best is yet to come

Plenty of quality strike runners - some left at home mind you. Cuthbert, Hogg, North, Maitland, Visser, Bowe, Scott, just off the top of my head. This is my issue with the selection is that it appears they will not be used to their potential

TJ wrote:Big trev - who is our one world class player? I think there are a fair few and some are young and the best is yet to come

Plenty of quality strike runners - some left at home mind you. Cuthbert, Hogg, North, Maitland, Visser, Bowe, Scott, just off the top of my head. This is my issue with the selection is that it appears they will not be used to their potential

TJ

The only one for me is BOD.

As for the strike runners I would only really put Hogg in that class for me. There are really no unpredictable players that could make something from nothing other than using their bulk and strength. I know I am biased but Wade should have gone he can do this (like Shane Williams, Jason Robinson) & would provide something different this is what is lacking in the squad.
I also think either 12Ts or Hook should have gone to provide a game playing 12 which would enable a different style to be adopted if required.

I don't know Wade but his reputation is good - hence why I said some of the strike runners we have are being left at home.

I do agree that Gatland has on the surface made mistakes leaving some of the creative players at home. Not Hook tho - but maybe twelvetrees. Matt Scott is another.

The players are there - its just Gatland is not going to use them it would appear

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:1) Our only truly world class player is ageing and prone to injuries.

2) Lack of real quality strike runners & limited ability to change the one obvious game plan.

1). World Class players, Adam Jones, POC, Warburton, Faletau, Phillips, Sexton, Roberts, North, Halfpenny, have all been touted as the best in their position, as well as BOD...!

2). What game plan? I haven't seen the Lions play or train yet, so I am very sure you haven't either?

Strike runners, I agree with you regarding also ran players like Tuilagi, Bulk and little else, can't pass can't kick and doesn't know how to get players outside him into the game. But him aside there are some fantastic backs in the squad.

I agree with tattie! It's gonna come down to who gatland picks to start.

Going by the weekends performances, I'd have 11. Bowe and 14. Maitland. North had a shocker and from what I saw of ulster vs blues cuthbert was pretty absent too.

As a wallabies fan, I thought iaone and cummins looked very impressive. Cummins was smashing players to the ground running straight over them whilst iaone was dancing around defenders with great skill. Very impressive return from injury by cummins.

bsando wrote:I agree with tattie! It's gonna come down to who gatland picks to start.

Going by the weekends performances, I'd have 11. Bowe and 14. Maitland. North had a shocker and from what I saw of ulster vs blues cuthbert was pretty absent too.

As a wallabies fan, I thought iaone and cummins looked very impressive. Cummins was smashing players to the ground running straight over them whilst iaone was dancing around defenders with great skill. Very impressive return from injury by cummins.

+1

10 a weakness, odviously, unfortunately for dan biggar he has been seen as priestlands replacement rather than as the welsh 10, when in fact ,through the dire time rp was f....up games ,biggar should have been playing.

this mindset that rp is still no 1, has cost biggar a lions place.

i believe he is a better all round 10 than farrell. a lot of welsh fans dont support him because he de-robed hook at 10 in the ospreys and hook went off scene and into utility mode, end of.

read interesting article that biggar has more supporters in england than wales. mmmm

It don't matter who is on the wings if the don't get any decent ball - the forwards have to get the ball - and the lions pack should be able to but I fear for the halfbacks and centres being able to create the scoring opportunities.

Hopefully I am wrong and gatland will take the shackles off and we can see what these backs can do when told to attack.

gavstar wrote:10 a weakness, odviously, unfortunately for dan biggar he has been seen as priestlands replacement rather than as the welsh 10, when in fact ,through the dire time rp was f....up games ,biggar should have been playing.

this mindset that rp is still no 1, has cost biggar a lions place.

i believe he is a better all round 10 than farrell. a lot of welsh fans dont support him because he de-robed hook at 10 in the ospreys and hook went off scene and into utility mode, end of.

read interesting article that biggar has more supporters in england than wales. mmmm

I didn't used to like Biggar for his petulance an lack of rugby intelligence. He used to seem to spend 90% of the game waving his arms in the air complaining.

But since Tandy took over at the Ospreys Biggar has changed completely and knoll Klee down to be a really good player. He is hard working in defence and attack, a great game manager and a has made some inspirational turnovers this season for Ospreys and Wales. Something rarely expected of a flyhalf.

He is definitely directly competing with Rhys Priestland these days rather than being understudy.

Maybe, as you said Biggar is viewed as understudy by Gatland and Howley. His omission may well hurt our chances as he has achieved and experienced far more than Farrell.