Spanish GP Thread Sponsored by Fernando's Alonso's Facepaint Supplier - Contains spoilers of Practice/Qualifying and Race

[Fernando]

First topic message reminder :

Round five of the 2013 FIA Formula One World Championship sees the teams journey to the Circuit de Catalunya for the Spanish Grand Prix. After beginning the year with four long haul races, the European season starts here – with a return to the circuit that hosted two-thirds of this year’s pre-season testing.

The track itself is famed for offering a broad examination of Formula One machinery with its mix of medium and high-speed corners, a low-speed complex and a long straight. As a venue it hasn’t, however, proved to be particularly conducive to overtaking: the corner combinations tending to make following and attacking very difficult – even with DRS.

Barcelona in May is a very different proposition to Barcelona in February. Temperatures are on average some 15°C higher, and this changes the challenge completely. What doesn’t change is the abrasive nature of the asphalt.

Given the evidence of the first four races in 2013, Pirelli have decided to move away from the Hard/Soft allocation favoured in Spain for the past two years, and instead will bring the Hard and Medium compounds. The Hard, however, is not the tyre that saw use in Malaysia and Bahrain. Pirelli have tweaked their offering, making it closer to that used in 2012.

Coming to Spain, Sebastian Vettel and Red Bull Racing lead their respective championships – but this does little to disguise the fact that it has been another weird and wonderful beginning to the year, with more questions asked than answered in March and April. The Circuit de Catalunya is regarded as the first ‘normal’ track of the season, and has frequently provided a solid indication of overall car performance – on 16 occasions from 22 runnings the team winning in Barcelona has collected the Constructors’ Championship trophy at the end of the year.


Facts
The Circuit de Catalunya became the home of the Formula One Spanish Grand Prix in 1991, taking over from Jerez de la Frontera (1986-90). The race has also been held at the Jarama circuit in Madrid (1967-8, 1970, 1972, 1974, 1976-80), Montjuïc (1969, 1971, 1973, 1975) and Pedralbes (1951, 1954). Only five circuits on the current F1 calendar have a longer continuous run (Interlagos, Silverstone, the Hungaroring, Monza and Monaco).
The Circuit de Catalunya is one of three Spanish Grand Prix venues located in the vicinity of Barcelona. The others – Pedralbes and Montjuïc – were within the boundaries of the modern city. This track, despite frequently being referred to simply as ‘Barcelona’, is not.
Pastor Maldonado’s Spanish Grand Prix victory last year saw a number of ‘firsts’ recorded. It was his first start from pole position, his first victory, and the first win for a Venezuelan in Formula One.
Maldonado is the only driver to win a grand prix at the Circuit de Catalunya and for that to be his solitary victory of the season.
Maldonado’s win, however, should not be regarded as surprising. Taking pole position (after Lewis Hamilton was excluded from the qualifying result) made him a favourite. Starting from pole at this circuit has historically been the key to victory: 18 times from the 22 races, the driver starting P1 has won the race. Of the four drivers to buck the trend, Mika Häkkinen, Nigel Mansell, and Sebastian Vettel were all front-row starters.
leaving Michael Schumacher the distinction of being the only driver to win the Spanish Grand Prix at the Circuit de Catalunya having started without a clear track in front of him. In 1996 he qualified third. With the race affected by torrential rain, he made light work of the terrible conditions to record his first victory for Ferrari. Another 71 would follow.
Ferrari is the constructor with the best record at the circuit. The Scuderia has won here seven times, Williams has six victories, McLaren four, Red Bull two, Benetton/Renault two and Brawn one.
Regarding drivers, Schumacher (1995, 1996, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004) is out in front with six victories at this circuit. Häkkinen (1998, 1999, 2000) has three wins, Kimi Räikkönen (2005, 2008) and Nigel Mansell (1991, 1992) two each. The race has also been won by Alain Prost (1993), Damon Hill (1994), Jacques Villeneuve (1997), Fernando Alonso (2006), Felipe Massa (2007), Jenson Button (2009), Mark Webber (2010) and Vettel (2011). Mansell and Prost also won at Jerez.
The Circuit de Catalunya is a preferred testing venue for F1 teams. The driver with the most testing mileage at this circuit is McLaren’s Jenson Button. The 2009 World Champion has completed a staggering 34,706 testing kilometres at this circuit.

Source: Racedepartment.com

[Critical_mass]

Well done Fernando. Fantastic performance... almost untouchable today. Well done to Massa too.

RBR didnt look THAT great today.

[GSC]

You guys are so touchy.

Rosberg with a nice drive to keep 6th today

[McLaren]

Anyone else think renault need to stop messing about trying one pit stop less.

A 4 stopping Kimi pushing harder between stops wins today. Assuming he covered alonso's early stops.

[GSC]

I don't think the Lotus could compete with Ferraris pace on fresh tyres tbh, so they stuck to the strength of their car, which is tyre preservation. They did a 3 stop, using the medium 3/4 times.

[GSC]

A nice recovery from McLaren, getting both cars to score

[Guest]

Very poor race, never like Barcelona. Drivers & cars just going around saving tyres, conserving everything and generally doing nothing resulted in a bore fest. If only Alonso was Turkish, then we could actually race at a decent track. Clear three horse race now, Mercedes are out of the running without a doubt, although I can actually see them grabbing pole in Monaco and having a chance which is quite funny due to the nature of the track. Nice team orders at the end by McLaren helping out Jenson Button.

Other than that.........not much happened and you know it's a poor race when the commentators just start talking about other topics. I'm a bit downbeat knowing Hamilton is out the picture now and once again we have to watch three foreigners battling for the title.

[Gregers]

Good race today, tyres are still a joke but the teams that have cars/drivers that can deal with that are doing well

Hamilton on the other hand...

[GSC]

I didn't mind this race. Wasn't as good as the last one but was a decent watch.

Bloody foreigners. Bloody Obama

[monty junior]

Predictable ,boring race out of the way, roll on Monaco.

Why was Perez not allowed to pass Button?

[GSC]

Predictable ,boring race out of the way, roll on Monaco.

[Guest]

Good race today

Basically McLaren split the strategies and then told Perez that he should hold stations and that was it. Basically, Whitmarsh wasn't going to let Button be done over two races in a row from Perez, therefore the protection came from over the radio.

[Critical_mass]

You guys are so touchy.

Rosberg with a nice drive to keep 6th today

Banter went over your head i guess

[dyrewolfe]

Well, it was an interesting race up to the final round of pit stops. Last 15-20 minutes were a bit boring.

Of course, some people seem to think any race is boring unless a British driver does well.

As predicted, flying starts by Vettel and Alonso got them into early contention for the lead. Surprised Rosberg managed to hold them off as long as he did (12 laps?).

Brilliant drive by Fernando - my driver of the day. Never looked back after taking the lead. Great race for Massa too, making up the places he lost through the penalty on the first lap and worked his way up to a comfortable 3rd. Getting back to where he was in 2008 IMO. That said the Ferrari looked an absolute beast today - both drivers able to overtake more or less at will.

Mixed fortunes for Lotus. Grosjean getting the bad luck early on with broken suspension. Superb drive by Raikkonen though, a good start coupled with some brilliantly aggressive driving getting him 2nd place. Move of the day when overtaking Vettel for the lead at one stage.

Not one of Red Bull's better races - looked as though the weather and track conditions conspired to neuter their performance advantage. Harder on their tyres than usual and Vettel told to look after his tyres after just a few laps. Probably just a blip though.

Mercedes...again showed that while they have a blindingly fast car in qualifying conditions, it just destroys its tyres over any kind of distance. Rosberg seemed to cope better and finished about where I expected. Hamilton though...a complete disaster of a race for him.

McLaren on the other hand showed that while they lack outright pace, the fact the car seems to be relatively easy on the tyres allows their drivers to be more competitive in races. Bit disappointed with Perez this time - thought he'd make the top 6 but he seemed to fall away while Button got stronger. Pretty good recovery drive by Jenson, given where he started.

Another decent points finish for Di Resta in 7th - the highest placed British driver.

[GSC]

Yeah Perez at one stage had Mark Webber dead to rights but then dropped off completely

[Guest]

So what are the chances of a Mercedes win in Monaco, pretty high in my opinion. They showed they had good traction and good speed on the curbs through the slow last section at Barcelona, therefore Monaco could suit them. Qualify pole and you can manage the race to the end because of the nature of the circuit and less degradation, certainly you are not going to be falling five or six places back at Monaco because of the limited overtaking. If, somehow Hamilton (because he's higher in the WDC) could manage a win, it could buy the team time but ultimately I still think there fighting a losing battle. Will be interesting.

Alonso looks the great all-round package for this year's WDC though.

[monty junior]

Mercedes were good on the tyres at Monaco and could have easily won. Think Rosberg was only a second behind the winner, so i think they have every chance to win, certainly over a single lap i don't know if they can be matched.

[harryspiv]

Claire williams, you can tell she's a chip off the old block of her dad can't you

[SteveG]

It used to be "Lets go racing". Now its "Lets go tyre managing".

Absolute shocker for Hami. Never expected a win but equally never expected to see one of his worse drives ever. Very worrying as Merc spent all weekend working on race pace and simply don't have an answer. Roll on Monaco - never a favourite due to lack of overtaking but as all ovetakes are now completely artificial then so what. Less tyres and more driver - I'll take that.

[Critical_mass]

Couldnt have said it better ^^^

[GSC]

You'll all be complaining if it goes back to the invincible bridgestones, mark my word

[lorus59]

I'll say it again (still can't believe I am saying it) but what an inspired move by Lewis Hamilton. At the time the move was announced I was sure Lewis had made a huge mistake as Mercedes was a shambles of a team lacking pace or seemingly direction whilst McLaren were at least competitive and perennial challengers. Now though it is clear Lewis made the right move. Mercedes are the team moving forward whilst McLaren are sadly struggling badly and slipped back pace-wise into the midfield runners.

I have to agree. Hamilton was really inspired to move to Mercedes. He was really moving forwards in this race.

[GSC]

Might as well get paid and rack up some pole stats for a year before a soft reset in F1

[Gerry SA]

Enjoyed the race today, maybe mainly because my favourite drivers Fernando and the Kimster came 1st and 2nd.

I think the pace of Fernando's Ferrari shows he could easily have won in Malaysia and Bahrain if not not hitting Vettel and broken DRS.

Those lost 46 points could be vital come São Paulo.

[Trebs]

Was a good race today, wouldn't be calling it exceptional or anything. The Mercedes wasn't great, Hamilton in particular and the Ferrari looked like the fastest car there, Alonso was always the winner and Massa could have got second had it not been for the penalty I think. Grosjean could have been joining Raikonnen in a high position had it not been for the suspension damage.

I agree with the decision to stop Checo Perez overtaking Button, he could not have made up any further places anyway so it would have been pointless and having two fighting McLarens would have just caused a lot of tyre wear.

Monaco two weeks away, looking forward to it.

[GSC]

If you're busy sunday, and would like to know how the Monaco GP finished, watch qualifying on saturday instead.

Worst race of the year tbh. great event but its terribly dull

[Critical_mass]

Worst race of the year by far... i wouldnt miss it if it was removed from the calendar, but that will never happen.

[GSC]

I'll predict it now.

A long procession behind the Mercedes for 10 laps, Vettel gets the undercut on the pit stops and drives off into the distance for an easy win.

[liverbnz]

You'll all be complaining if it goes back to the invincible bridgestones, mark my word

Why does it have to be one or other? Can't there be an in between? Just because the Bridgestones were poor for the sport, albeit at the opposite end of the spectrum, doesn't excuse the Pirellis wearing down like they have been.

At the end of the day, Pirelli are instructed to construct a certain tyre within certain durability parameters in order to contrive a racing spectacle. Tyres are only the symptom of a greater problem with F1.

[GSC]

Might be controversial, but F1 is the most entertaining its been in years at the moment. And isn't that the most important thing as a spectator?

[Fernando]

This is a comment from a F1 driver who shall remain nameless

“Mate, everyone is complaining about the tyres. But the guy who wins… does he complain? No. You should ask them why they don’t complain when they do well, when the day before they were saying it was the end of the world. The only one who understands it is Kimi. He says it’s the same for everyone. If you don’t like it, Frak off, do something else. He’s right. If you make the tyres more durable and you only have three stops in a race everyone will still try to make only two stops. It’s the same now as it was with Bridgestone. You always try to do one less stop. By complaining you only damage the sport. It’s the same for everyone. Get on with it and race

[Guest]

Key Points in F1

1. The tyres need tweaking because this isn't working for either the drivers or, more importantly, the fans. Motor racing is about pushing yourself to the limit, showcasing your car's ability and the driver's ability. Having four stops in a race and over eighty pit stops in total is ridiculous and therefore results in more action in the pit lane than on track. The beginning of the race is exciting and then the end is relatively exciting depending on the car's strategies, however in between there is a huge gap of nothing and conservation in anticipation of the end. F1 should be having two, maybe three stops a race. Yesterday was like a bus journey......stop after stop.

2. World class drivers being paid millions each year stating, 'I can't drive any slower', or 'I was driving at the tyre's limit, not the car's limit', is just an example of the situation F1 finds itself. The drivers aren't pushing to the limit, maybe 75/80% of their true potential, no wonder we have no Red Bull's blowing up anymore or drivers crashing out, simply because of the over-importance of saving tyres and tip-toeing around for over an hour and a half. Driver's don't even look tired after races and, as expected, no safety cars at all this season. Ross Brawn stated, 'We are going to have to do something about the tyres in F1. All we are doing all weekend in solely focusing on tyre management and it's frustrating'. Says it all.

3. The tyres are having such a damaging effect that there actually impeding the teams and us seeing the full potential of car performance. Months & months of design, tens of millions of pounds of R&D has gone into developing these cars, yet the tyres take the centre stage and are the over-riding factor between success and failure. The Mercedes for example is a geniunely fast car with a great core design, yet the tyres are hurting the team so badly and they have absolutely no idea of how to resolve the issue. Tyres that are unpredictable and unable to be understood just isn't good for the sport.

4. Everything just feels artificial in F1. The overtaking element in F1 is beyond a joke now. Due to the nature of the tyre and the effect of DRS, there is absolutely no skill whatsover involved in the majority of overtaking manoeuvres. The are completely uncontested and what once was an exciting moment of F1, has been turned into a recurrent dull moment of predictability. 'Should I let him pass to save my tyres', Rosberg utters through his radio........embarrasing for motorsport at the highest level.

Glad that there has been quite a big media response post race to the tyre situation in F1 and listening to the three journalists on Sky, and there reaction, was evidence of the growing frustration to which F1 is heading.

[GSC]

Tyre preservation is a skill, and designing a fast car that ruins its tyres within 10 laps is not a good job quite frankly

[dyrewolfe]

From the tone/language I'm guessing it was Mark Webber.

Have to agree with him too.

Alonso, Massa and Raikkonen evidently didn't have any major issues with their tyres (although Massa said he had to back off after trying to catch Kimi).

Ferrari, Lotus and to a lesser extent Red Bull have shown they can be competitive with the tyres as they are. Its up to the other teams and drivers to figure out a way to be quick while not destroying them.

That said, I would say Pirelli need to look at why there have been so many de-laminations recently. Also, making them a tad more durable (if Red Bull struggle, you know something's a bit off) and giving them wider optimum operating temperatures would help, given the wide range of climates they need to work in.

[dyrewolfe]

Tyre preservation is a skill, and designing a fast car that ruins its tyres within 10 laps is not a good job quite frankly

True, there should be an element of tyre management, but I think at the present time there is too much emphasis on it, to the detriment of the racing spectacle.

While I agree that the teams need to design cars that don't eat their tyres and drivers need to think about tyre conservation I think there is an imbalance right now.

You expect cars to wear out their tyres quickly during the first stint or races, when they are heavy with fuel, but even the Red Bulls were experiencing rapid tyre degradation after the second round of stops on the hard compound.

[Guest]

Dietrich Mateschitz has had his say today about the current situation regarding tyres.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/22509847

Basically, to keep the Bernie 'show' going and to stop viewing figures dropping they needed something to spice up the show in order to prevent Red Bull and Vettel dominating again. Unfortunately, Pirelli have taken it too far and created a huge imbalance within the sport between actual racing and artificial, conservative racing.

[Fernando]

The only thing i paid attention to in that bunch of crap was the Gary Anderson analysis bit

The tyres are part of the car and some teams are using them better than others.

Barcelona is always very tough on the tyres - and back in the tyre-war days sometimes you would get two or maybe three laps out of the softer tyres and then be five or six seconds a lap slower for the next four or five laps before they cleaned up and you could push again.

Tyre management has always been part of F1, no matter what anyone will tell you, and there has never been a time when a driver could push flat-out for the entire race distance

Sooner you guys accept that the better cos it's not going to change for the next 3-8 years

[SteveG]

This is a comment from a F1 driver who shall remain nameless

“Mate, everyone is complaining about the tyres. But the guy who wins… does he complain? No. You should ask them why they don’t complain when they do well, when the day before they were saying it was the end of the world. The only one who understands it is Kimi. He says it’s the same for everyone. If you don’t like it, Frak off, do something else. He’s right. If you make the tyres more durable and you only have three stops in a race everyone will still try to make only two stops. It’s the same now as it was with Bridgestone. You always try to do one less stop. By complaining you only damage the sport. It’s the same for everyone. Get on with it and race

Sounds pretty much like MW and if so then reading between the lines translates to:
"anything that helps stop my teammate from streaking away and making me look 2nd rate for yet another season is alright by me".

[Fernando]

This is a comment from a F1 driver who shall remain nameless

“Mate, everyone is complaining about the tyres. But the guy who wins… does he complain? No. You should ask them why they don’t complain when they do well, when the day before they were saying it was the end of the world. The only one who understands it is Kimi. He says it’s the same for everyone. If you don’t like it, Frak off, do something else. He’s right. If you make the tyres more durable and you only have three stops in a race everyone will still try to make only two stops. It’s the same now as it was with Bridgestone. You always try to do one less stop. By complaining you only damage the sport. It’s the same for everyone. Get on with it and race

Sounds pretty much like MW and if so then reading between the lines translates to:
"anything that helps stop my teammate from streaking away and making me look 2nd rate for yet another season is alright by me".

It's actually not Mark Webber it's someone further down the field

[GSC]

If hes using mate, then its probably Chilton

[SteveG]

Not sure about Chilton - the tone's a bit too strong. Seems to be coming from someone more seasoned and not bothered about upsetting reputations rather than a new kid on the block whos's probably still too much in dreamland to care.

[Critical_mass]

If hes using mate, then its probably Chilton

Yeah i thought that, the word "mate" is an indication. Def one of the english speaking drivers...

[GSC]

Mate isnt a particularly Scottish word so I doubt Di Resta.

[Critical_mass]

Ricciardo? Cant imagine button nor Lewis saying it, Its not webber.. so going to say Ricciardo.

[Guest]

Anyway......

Something interesting news I've heard from a number of sources is that there has been a meeting within the Mercedes hierachy and many of it's finacial backers who are becoming increasingly worried about matching last year's total of race wins and showing a significant improvement in race performance to show that the money being pumped into the team is actually making the team progress.

I think it's a tad premature, if true, however, there has also been a rumour that if the Mercedes do indeed achieve a front row lockout at Monaco then whoever is leading into the first corner will have the second driver, under team orders, to intentionally hold up the rest of the field in order for the lead driver to escape and win the race. If true, it's shows just how worried the team and the Mercedes organisation are about achieving a race win because under normal circumstance and 'normal' racing tracks, winning is looking extremely unlikely.

All very interesting and at least something else to talk about. Also Pirelli's Paul Hembrey has stated that if the drivers and fans want to go back to 'Processional racing' then Pirelli can do it. Not sure that's quite the reaction we wanted from him and shows that even he's getting angry now with this criticism of the tyre supplier. Should all kick off I fear, especially if Red Bull continue to raise their voice......

[Critical_mass]

I heard that about monaco, though was was a posters comment as opposed to an official statement. Though either way, its a possibility.

It is premature, considering Merc KNEW and STATED it was always about 2014 and not this year. The early good performances have been nothing but a bonus. Besides other than Spain and the first half of Bahrain for Lewis, their performances have been good. Its just one bad race, lets see where they are in Monaco and better still Canada - where Lewis excels.

The decision makers at Merc need to hang on in there and see where the team performance is at the end of next year.

[CaledonianCraig]

Pirelli have succumbed to Red B...err Bernie Ecclestone pressure and say they will have a more durable tyre available for Canada.

[Critical_mass]

more durable tyre for Canada that has little degradation... hmmmm...

[Gerry SA]

So Red Bull are eating their rear tyres due to loading their car with too much downforce.

Pirelli should've told them to reduce their aeropackage and their tyres would last longer...

[Guest]

So Red Bull are eating their rear tyres due to loading their car with too much downforce.

Pirelli should've told them to reduce their aeropackage and their tyres would last longer...

Yes, but that should not be the case, why penalise a team for creating a very good car with alot of downforce? Why punish a designer of Adrian Newey's ability and hard work over a period of months, possibly forcing him to rethink his position within F1. The same thing with Mercedes, who have built a very good 'core' of a car, yet are being punished in the races because of the race tyre. These teams spend millions of pounds on design & R&D in order to compete in F1 and try to win races & Championships, yet they are impeded by the tyre which prevents the team and the driver from racing the car at it's full potential. Why do we want drivers racing at the tyre's limit and not the car's limit? Of course, tyre management has always been an integral part of F1 and racing but Pirelli have just gone beyond the point where tyre management should be, in terms of the the factors which effect a Grand Prix race. I'm just glad they have decided to change the tyre, signalling their acceptance that they have made a mistake.

[CaledonianCraig]

To be honest though I'd more lay the blame at Bernie Ecclestone's door. After all he was the one who instructed Pirelli to supply these type of tyres. The bloke is a buffoon who it cannot be denied is a glory-hunter ie bosom buddy of Michael Schumacher and now of Seb Vettel and Red Bull. Okay I may be exaggerating but it cannot be denied how much he fawns over them. A man in his position should be seen as completely impartial but he never is.

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