What will be the 23 Man Squad for Saturday?

OK guys name the 23 man squad you believe will be selected for Saturday. You do not have to differentiate between starters and bench, just name the players. Whoever gets the most right will be known for one week at least as:


Mr (or Ms) Know-it-all.


My entry:

Forwards:
Croft, Corbisiero, Cole, Heaslip, Hibbard, Jones (Adam), Jones (Alun-Wyn), Lydiate, O'Connell, Parling, Vunipola, Warburton, YoungsT,


Backs:
Davies, Farrell, Halfpenny, Maitland, North, O'Driscoll, Phillips, Sexton, Tuilagi, YoungsB

Forwards:
Cole, A.Jones, Vunipola, Hibbard, T.Youngs, AWJ, POC, Gray, Warbs, Tipuric, Heaslip, Faletau, Croft

Backs:
Halfpenny, North, Zebo, Davies, O'Driscoll, Hogg, Phillips, Youngs, Sexton, Farrell

I would be very surprised if any players from tonight are selected for the weekend.

Glad to see lots of votes for North. Does this mean he will be fit for the game?

Aelandor wrote:Glad to see lots of votes for North. Does this mean he will be fit for the game?

hoping

Vunipola, Corbisiero, Hibbard, Youngs, Jones, Cole, POC, AWJ, Parling, Warburton, Croft, Heaslip, O'Brien

Phillips, Youngs, Sexton, Farrell, Davies, BOD, North, Zebo, Halfpenny, Tuilagi (or Hogg can't decide)

It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

LordDowlais wrote:It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

I agree on your starting line up mines the same...! Though I would be picking a different bench.

I would definitely carry a loosehead.

Corbisero, Youngs, Cole, Gray, SOB, Youngs, Tuilagi Hogg.

LordDowlais wrote:It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

Dowlais do you really think he will pick one front row on the bench no lock cover and 3 back rowers?

Some interesting bench configurations here.  IronMike dropping a prop for an extra back row and LordDowlais dropping a prop and a lock for two extra back rowers (unless Croft is a second row replacement).  I like the ingenuity but I'll be a little surprised if Gatland goes down this route.  I believe rules stipulate having 2 props on the bench is non optional.

My 23: Corbs, Vunipola, Youngs, Hibbard, Cole, Jones, POC, AWJ, Gray, Croft, Warbs, Heaslip, SOB, Phillips, Youngs, Sexton, Farrell, North, JD2, BOD, Maitland, Halfpenny, Tuilagi

Vunipola
Youngs
Jones
A W Jones
POC
Croft
Warburton
Heaslip
Phillips
Sexton
Davies
BOD
North
Cuthbert
Halfpenny

Cole
Hibbard
Corbs
Gray
Lydiate
Youngs
Farrell
Tuilagi

Jeffwinger has beaten me to it, I think he will use croft as second row cover, Gatland loves versitle players and Croft will be ideal for this.

Also I cannot for the life of me see Gatland not starting Adam Jones And Richard Hibbard in the front row, although I will concede that my bench could have had more thought put into it, in the light of day I would change either SOB or Croft for Corbisero most likely SOB.

Mine would be:

Vunipola
Youngs
Jones
Jones
O'Connell
Lydiate
Warburton
Heaslip
Phillips
Sexton
North (if fit, otherwise Zebo)
Davies
O'Driscoll
Cuthbert
Halfpenny

Cole
Hibbard
Corbisiero
Croft
SOB
Youngs
Farrell
Zebo

I like Tipuric but he didn't have a good game today and I would be surprised if he makes it having played 80 minutes today

offload wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

Dowlais do you really think he will pick one front row on the bench no lock cover and 3 back rowers?

He can't he has to pick a full front row on the bench

I don't think Croft is good cover for lock and 6, in fact he only really covers 6.  That's why I think Croft will start with O'Brien on the bench as he covers the whole back row.  I think Parling has played his way onto the bench as cover for POC and AWJ.

ChequeredJersey wrote:

offload wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

Dowlais do you really think he will pick one front row on the bench no lock cover and 3 back rowers?

He can't he has to pick a full front row on the bench

Beat me to it. 8 players on the bench. 3 MUST be qualified to play in the front row. So unless you have someone like Richardt Strauss who can play hooker or openside, you would have 2 props and a hooker.

Also would be easier to read if people put them in order 1 to 23 or numbered them.

I would go with Offload's team

Corbisiero, Vunipola, Youngs, Hibbard, Jones, Cole, AWJ, POC, Parling, Croft, Warburton, Heaslip, SOB

Phillips, Youngs, Sexton, Farrell, Davies, BOD, Tuilagi, North, Maitland, Halfpenny

Pretty certain about the pack and pack replacements, it's just a question of fitness in the backs and the selection on the right wing

Is North going to make it?

thomh wrote:Corbisiero, Vunipola, Youngs, Hibbard, Jones, Cole, AWJ, POC, Parling, Croft, Warburton, Heaslip, SOB

Phillips, Youngs, Sexton, Farrell, Davies, BOD, Tuilagi, North, Maitland, Halfpenny

Pretty certain about the pack and pack replacements, it's just a question of fitness in the backs and the selection on the right wing

Hmmm. Maitland or Zebo or Cuthbert? Presuming North makes it that is the choice. If he doesn't then 2 of them will probably make the 23.

Also. Tuilagi at 23? Doesn't really cover the back 3.

Kearney at 23? Doesn't really cover the centre, nor do any of the back 3 (no Bowe) So with North out could you see all three above and no Tuilagi? Or Rob K?

Lastly. I know people think that you cannot have Murray and Phillips in the 23 as they are too similar, but did Youngs play himself out of the 23 today?

TBH I think the too similar thing is more about their build and looks rather than their playing style.

When will they annouce the team?

Team announcement is on Thursday

Why are people dropping a prop off the bench, with the new 23 man squads you have to have a full front row on the bench.

Because some of the posters know little about rugby and pick their favourite players from their country/club/region/province; way it is on the board.

LordDowlais wrote:It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

Are you Frank Hadden?

Dorothy_Mantooth wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:It will be an all Welsh front row;) Vunipola,Hibbard and A Jones. Alyn Wyn Jines and O'Connell in the boiler house, Warburton, Heaslip and Tuperic in the backrow.

In the backs we will see, Mike Phillips, Sexton, John Davies, O'Driscoll and North(hopefully) and Cuthbert on the wings with Halfpenny at full back.

Subs. Cole, Murray, SOB, Maitland, Tuilagi, Croft, Farrel, Faletau.

Are you Frank Hadden?

That's out of order. I'm surprised the swear filter didn't pick that up

Forwards: Vunipola, Corbisiero, Hibbard, T Youngs, A Jones, Cole, AW Jones, POC, Parling, Croft, SOB, Warburton, Heaslip

Backs: Phillips, Murray, Sexton, Farrell, Davies, BOD, North, Cuthbert, Halfpenny, Tuilagi

Alex Corbs
Tom Youngs
Adam Jones
Alyn Wyn Jones
Paul O'Connell
Sean O'Brien
Jamie Heaslip
Sam Warbs

Mike
North
Sexton
John Davies
O' Driscoll
Zebo
Halhpenny

Vunipolo, Hibbard, Cole, Parling, Croft, Ben, Farrell, Hogg

My 23:

Vunipola, Corbisero
Hibbard, Youngs
A Jones, Cole
AW Jones, POC, Parling
Croft, Heaslip, Warburton, SOB
Phillips, Murray
Sexton, Farrell
Davies, BOD
North, Cuthbert, Halfpenny, Maitland

Starting:

Vunipola Youngs A Jones
AWJ POC
Croft Faletau Warburton

Phillips Sexton

North JD BOD Zebo
Halfpenny

Bench:

Cobrisiero Hibbard Coles Parling SOB Youngs Farrell Hogg

1. Vunipola (Id start with Corbs and bring the big man on at 60)
2. Hibbard (Fair shout I think, Youngs at 60)
3. Jones (Almost decided pre tour and fair shout IMO. Cole at 60)
4. AWJ (played his way in on tour)
5. POC (Almost decided pre tour, fitness permitting, and fair shout)
6. Lydiate (Almost decided pre tour IMO, fitness permitting. Tough on Croft)
7. Warbs (Decided pre tour! Tough on Tips)
8. Heaslip (50/50 shout I reckon but Toby played 80mins on Tues)
9. Phillips (Decided pre tour and fair shout)
10. Sexton (Decided pre tour, fitness permitting, and fair shout)
11. North (Decided pre tour and fair shout)
12. JD2 (played his way in with no Doc available)
13. BOD (Almost decided pre tour, fitness and form permitting, fair shout)
14. Cuthbert (Obvious choice with no Tommy available. would love it if Tommy's fit)
15. 1/2P (Decided pre tour and fair shout)

16. Corbs (Grant is average, Healy and Melon out)
17. Youngs.T. (Maybe unlucky not to start, Best has been awful IMO)
18. Cole (Obvious choice)
19. Parling (just ahead of Grey I reckon)
20. SOB (Big impact and covers 6,7 and 8. Again, tough on Croft and Tips)
21. Youngs.B. (Obvious choice)
22. Farrell (Hogg covering 10 experiment hasn't worked IMO)
23. Kearney (Toughest call of all for me. Played v.well Tues, 1/2p covers wing, North and Farrell cover centre at a push)

Right, so if what we know about the Aussies starting side is true, this is it:

15- Barnes- good player, not much recent rugby (could get at him?), indicates they will be happy to kick into space at our back 3, so we need our wingers to be happy doing a lot of tracking back and defending those. To me that means Zebo is our best bet opposite North (who is fit, thank God, and a shoe in) assuming 1/2p is at 15, but I suspect Cuthbert will start. He isn't a natural FB to me, though he can certainly play there, so we should test him with high balls which must be chased. Kearney would be ideal for that but Sexton and Halfpenny will do a fine job, North and hopefully Croft would really pressure him on the chase.

He will probably come in at 1st receiver sometimes as with 3 FHs in the backline I think they will mix it up a bit to take pressure off JOC and make their attack unpredictable. We have to be ready for that, someone must watch him and shout at the defensive line to alert them so they aren't surprised by the shift in focus of attack. This will also let JOC play some plays as an outside back, in which case he must be marked.

14- Folau- class act but has played less at wing than FB. Do NOT test him in the air as he is awesome there. Kick to Barnes or Ioane instead, unless the chase can force him to kick, not run, as this is not his strength. Whoever marks him must have good feet and watch out for the offload he will ineviatbly make. He is reasonably big but watch the ball, take the tackle to him to negate his footwork and take him high- I'd have North covering him and he's strong enough to not get shrugged off. Having North here (well, at 11) would allow him to run hard at Folau and use his own deceptive footwork and speed to expose his lack of experience in this position.

13- AAC. Does the basics well. Started off out of form at S15 level this season but has grown with every game and always steps up for the Wallabies. BOD at 13 should have enough to counter him in attack and defence. AAC can ignore passing opportunities to the outside, so I think BOD should do what he does best and hold off the tackle and invite AAC to run it then snaffle him off the back foot if there is a lot of space on the outside, to either prevent the pass or give the Lions winger more time to close down the Aussie winger. If the defence is already well set and there is little space outside, then cut him down earlier. In attack, AAC is a strong and proactive tackler so make him commit to BOD who has the passing range and soft hands to exploit either outside space for North to test Folau or space for an inside runner, as CL is best at defending on the front foot and could struggle with a cut inside pass to a forward, JD2, 1/2p at pace or one of the wings.

12- CL. Lealiifano is surprisingly good in defence, the most likely (and best) kicker and an excellent attacking passer and at taking the ball to the line to commit the defence. He defends on the blitz at his club, so have an inside runner off JD2 at 12 to pop off to when he commits. Also be ready to chip over him if the line is blitzing. If it is not, then CL might be hesitant so run JD2 at his outside shoulder hard and directly. He (unlike ex-League International Folau) is untested at this level, so JD2 should be really aggressive in the tackle to see how he likes the pressure. I expect he will also play some plays at first receiver, in which case, as above, someone must cover O'Connor

11- Ioane. Proven class for the Wallabies but he's been out injured with a serious blow and might not be ready physically, so don't be afraid to test him under the highball and rough him up a bit. Will look for the ball, so watch out for him popping up in the line. I'd want Zebo against him as I think he would track him better and has better footwork to test him in defence, though if he is not fully physically recovered, Cuthbert running straight at his shoulder could break through the tackle as he might bail out. Test him early and see. Suspect he will come off as he hasn't played recently, with JOC moving to wing and Beale at 10/15.

10- JOC. I rate him very highly and he has a devastating short and long passing game and the best footwork I have ever seen. However he does not have experience at 10 at this level. Warbs to really get at him from set pieces, and everyone to give him no space and see if he cracks. Invite them to play a territory game and put him under pressure when kicking for it and Sexton should better him in this area at least. NOT as weak a tackler as many cluelessly think, but the key thing is don't give him space to use his feet or time to think as his FH reflexes and decision making will be thought out and not natural.

9- Genia. Best 9 in the world. Phillips needs to be really on his game and not let it become a one on one contest with him or he will lose 10 times out of 10. The backrow to give him no time on the ball and Phillips to keep running at him to a minimum- they will expect him to run the ball himslef or do his "step and draw the defence" move. So if he doesn't, they will take time to react and our pack/backs (whoever is better situated to receive the ball) will get a little space. Then, when it looks genuinely on, get Phillips to take Genia by surprise and power through, supported off the shoulder to keep the ball alive and avoid isolation (which is my biggest fear here). Must not let it be an ego contest.

8- Palu- Powerful but getting on a bit. Heaslip etc should be able to run him off his feet early by making him defend a bit and then he won't be making his rucks, which will work in our favour. Big carrier, cut him down early

7- Hooper - my danger man. Warbs will need some help as he is rapid, and I'd pick either Tipuric to counter him and Mowen at the ruck or Croft to cover his pace and get to some breakdowns before him. Assume he is as good as Poccock but a fair bit faster. Do the same as we would to Poccock- get everyone chipping in at rucks on Aussie ball to slow it, make him make tackles by running straight at him (he can't win ball if he's at the bottom of the ruck) and keep the ball alive if we can. With Douglas and Paul there, they'll have to use him a bit at the lineout so pressurise him there

6- Mowen- first cap so get at him. He is also good at the breakdown but if we can cut out him and Cooper, the Aussies seem to think the rest of their pack isn't great there. A major lineout option so watch out for him as he'll be receiving more ball than Douglas.

5- Douglas- with Horwill will add power to their scrum and we won't dominate them there, don't know much about him, but think he is a lump and maybe AWJ or Gray can run him off his feet?

4- Horwill - excellent alround lock, but POC will be looking to minimalise his impact (vital) in the lineout. The Aussies pack is actually pretty strong at carrying, IMO, but I reckon if we get our big guys like POC to wrap them up and initiate a maul we can actually move them back and get some turnovers.

3- Alexander - was not in the front row that France killed, or Ireland, but in the one that killed England. Don't start Mako against him, start Corbs and bring Mako on later when he has tired or Slipper (better in the loose) is there and do damage in in the loose

2- Moore. Tough as nails, I'd want Hibbard to outscrummage him. If the Aussie scrum beats ours it will be embarrassing and a huge boost to their morale on pitch.

1- Robinson- similarly to Alexander, but when he comes off his replacement Kepu is actually a TH. Jones might be able to put him under pressure. If this is the case, try and pincer Moore with Jones and Hibbard and win some penalties taht we know 1/2p will kick

Good work mate. Looking forward to reading that.

1-  Corbisero
2-  Hibbard
3-  Adam
4-  AWJ
5-  POC
6-  Croft
7-  Warburton
8-  Faletau
9-  Phillips
10- Sexton
11- North
12- Davies
13- BOD
14- Cuthbert
15- Halfpenny

Vunipola, T.Youngs, Cole, Parling, O'Brien, B.Youngs, Farrell, Hogg.

1. Corbs
2. Hibbard
3. Jones
4. AWJ
5. POC
6. Lydiate
7. Warbs
8. Heaslip
9. Phillips
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Davies
13. BOD
14. Cuthbert
15. Halfpenny

Bench: Cole, Youngs, Vainipola, Gray, Croft, Youngs, Farrell, Maitland.

The team that I think WG will pick / changes I would personally prefer.

1. Vunipola / Corbisiero
2. Youngs. T
3. Jones
4. Wyn-Jones
5. O'Connell
6. Croft
7. Warburton
8. Heaslip
9. Phillips
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Davies
13. O'Driscoll
14. Cuthbert / Maitland (would have gone for Bowe if fit)
15. Halpenny

16. Hibbard
17. Corbisiero / Vunipola
18. Cole
19. Parling
20. O'Brien (felt WG would have Tipuric on the bench if Deans had picked a different backrow combo)
21. Youngs. B
22. Farrell (covering 10/12 off the bench)
23. Maitland (covering 11/14/15 with North covering 13 in case of injury).

Nice write up on the Aussie team CJ 

Really good write up there CJ. Here's my prediction for the Lions:

1.Vunipola
2.Hibbard
3.Jones
4.Wyn Jones
5.O'Connell
6.Croft
7.Tipuric
8.Heaslip

9.Phillips
10.Sexton

11.North
12.Davies
13.BOD
14.Zebo
15.Halfpenny

Corbs, Youngs, Cole, Parling, O'Brien, Youngs, Farrell, Hogg

Dammit, I got one wrong. I was so sure that Manu would be fit and on the bench (with Maitland starting ahead of Cuthbert).

I don't know how Lydiate makes the bench in front of the other backrowers. What's he gonna offer if the lions are behind and he comes on?  Fantastic tackling? They are better served having SOB or tipuric to come on and make an impact.

Gretgael1 wrote:I don't know how Lydiate makes the bench in front of the other backrowers. What's he gonna offer if the lions are behind and he comes on?  Fantastic tackling? They are better served having SOB or tipuric to come on and make an impact.

Flip side, when we are ahead he will be instrumental in closing the game out?

There are plenty of players on that team that can see out a victory if that arises so I still think the lions are better served with Tupiric or SOB.

Lydiate on the bench seems to be the one that no-one predicted, just because he only covers one position in the back row, which we already have cover for in warburton anyway. Leaves us without any cover at 7 or 8, so maybe Tipuric or O'Brien can feel slightly aggrieved. It's certainly a show of confidence in warburton though.

Slightly worried about Cuthbert who looks like he's carrying a slight injury. Other than that, all pretty much what everyone expected..

thomh,

Agree about Lydiate on the bench but he has played 7 for Wales at this level though for me SOB would have got bench slot.

Has he worn 7 for Wales or did he just switch there after a substitution? Can't imagine someone of his size being the most effective breakdown operator

Basically, has he ever played 7 to a high enough level that, of Warburton was having a shocker at the breakdown, they would realistically consider bringing him on there. Suspect not, but the bench always leaves you light in some areas.

He played 7 for us against Australia (I think) in one of the AI games few seasons back when Warburton was out injured.

As I said though I think SOB would have been the better bench option over him and Tipuric

bedfordwelsh wrote:He played 7 for us against Australia (I think) in one of the AI games few seasons back when Warburton was out injured.

As I said though I think SOB would have been the better bench option over him and Tipuric

Wasn't that Toby?

Rev,

Trying to find line ups now but sure it was Dan