Well done Novak and Andy

Of course as a fan it's great that Andy's won. But what is even more important is that we have two players with now a great rivalry (3-2 to Novak at Slams) and also two characters, who looked Rafa and Roger in the eyes and stated, with their Tennis, that one day they would be better

Now it may have taken age with Roger and dodgy knees with Rafa, for this to happen. However, it would be good if we all acknowledged that no-one else has bothered to burst through this door, so if it was that significant others would have won slams

No. Away from clay, we've got the two best players but lets hope others join them. For instance I'd love Tsonga to win a major and think Berdych, even though his game bores me, deserves one too. Hopefully the likes of Raonic, JJ, Tomic, Dolgo and even Nishikori can keep improving and join them

But we really should praise the way the current Top 2 are now dominating Tennis, away from the dirt

banbrotam wrote:Of course as a fan it's great that Andy's won. But what is even more important is that we have two players with now a great rivalry (3-2 to Novak at Slams) and also two characters, who looked Rafa and Roger in the eyes and stated, with their Tennis, that one day they would be better

Now it may have taken age with Roger and dodgy knees with Rafa, for this to happen. However, it would be good if we all acknowledged that no-one else has bothered to burst through this door, so if it was that significant others would have won slams

No. Away from clay, we've got the two best players but lets hope others join them. For instance I'd love Tsonga to win a major and think Berdych, even though his game bores me, deserves one too. Hopefully the likes of Raonic, JJ, Tomic, Dolgo and even Nishikori can keep improving and join them

But we really should praise the way the current Top 2 are now dominating Tennis, away from the dirt

+1

I'm glad Andy won but that was one of the worst men's slam finals I can remember. I hope they don't play each other in anymore finals as their games are so similar. Either of the other semi finalists would have given us a far more interesting match with more contrasting styles.

I thought it was very entertaining, and I hope they keep meeting in slam finals. I think they will too.

Far from Novak's best day but he will be back like all great champions are. Novak is still world number 1 and will go into the USO as favourite in my opinion. I'm a little amazed at what murray achieved today. More winners, less errors, more aces, higher serve percentage, better returning... Against someone like Novak.

And the sheer determination and guts it took to win that last game.... Wow. He just refused to give up. Monumental achievement for him that nobody can ever take away.

Would agree banbro

Great result for Andy - and the very last game was something else.

The future looks bright for the two of them, both pretty evenly balanced.

Massive congrats to andy, so glad he won it finally! bare kudos.

I dont feel quite as strongly as eric, but I didn't think it was a great final, far from it, but I thought the nadal ferrer match wasn't great either.
I want to see a murray nadal match 2bh, not seen that in a long time.

You have got to give credit to Murray for bringing Djokovic back to earth. A very good player, yes, but cant' see enough reasons to justify a wider gap in terms of slams. Hope JJ and Del Potro will do the same soon.

For me, only well done to Andy today. Discipline, courage and no lack of quality.

I'm really fed up with Novak.

Two matches in a row against his biggest rivals (Rafa and Andy) and he's choked massively in both. By "choke", I don't mean "lost". That can happen to anyone. I mean he's turned in a performance that stank.

What's really got my goat though is arguing with the umpire, without any grounds to do so. He, again, made himself look a right plum.

LS - I agree with that, a Murray v Nadal match is the one I really want to see. Hopefully Rafa can come back strong to make it happen.

Perhaps I'm a bit too involved to asses the quality of the match, but the conclusion of each set was so dramatic it felt like 3 matches!

It wasn't the best match any of them have played for sure but it was definitely dramatic considering what was at stake and the extreme weather. In any case what does it matter. I have sat through mundane finals including Roger or Rafa or players before that. At the end of the day it is another slam win for Andy chalked up.

To the OP I can only agree, they are dominating the game away from clay for sure.

I just can't get into the tennis. Sure, there were some great points and the drama came for free of course, but overall I'm just not excited by the baseline stuff.

But that can't detract at all from what you're saying, they are the top boys for sure. We just need some new blood because a duopoly without style contrast isn't my thing.

Murdoch - that argument with the umpire was a bit bizarre considering the ball was in.

It was surprising to see Murray hit more winners. Less errors I expect as that's usually how the stats go in their matches, but just when he got going in sets 2 and 3 he got pulled back. Through some great tennis by Murray, but he didn't make first serves when it mattered.

He moved fine, but his decisions were strange at times. Drop shots against Murray? Coming to the net almost kamikaze at times.

But look, Novak is a great great player and the number 1. He will bounce back.

Commiserations anyway mate.

I thought the dropshots were brilliant, until he overdid them and they got telegraphed. A few less and they may have won him it, they were killing Murray for sure.

Yes Murdoch commiserations. His game plan just wasn't there today for some reason. As others have said he was not playing his natural game and was getting flustered a little too much. I am sure Novak will be back winning slams in the future though.

Credit to Novak as well. He wins with grace and loses with grace.

Andy now has as many Wimbledons as Jonathan Marray, just amazing wow holy moly!!

And his brother! 

A high quality final that was too tense to be enjoyable for me... also from a neutral prespective probably too short set wise. Novak didnt play that well but hes turned up for other finals, you cant win them all. He still competed pretty well.
A brilliant, brave, going for it Muzz performance, to silence the critics. The hate were seeing is just the last dying convulsions of people who cant stand success from hard work

erictheblueuk wrote:I'm glad Andy won but that was one of the worst men's slam finals I can remember. I hope they don't play each other in anymore finals as their games are so similar. Either of the other semi finalists would have given us a far more interesting match with more contrasting styles.

I find it hard how anyone can say it was the "worst" after that horrible serve dominated Stich victory of 1991 or even the Krajicek (even though I was glad he won) of 1996. There were also some very poor quality finals involving Sampras. Not the great man's fault, I might add

I think it's very easy to make rash statements after the event - for instance I've just watched the 3rd set and it was the play of the other player that won the point for 75% of them

bogbrush wrote:I thought the dropshots were brilliant, until he overdid them and they got telegraphed. A few less and they may have won him it, they were killing Murray for sure.

 
They were a factor. like the JJ match, at first, but seriously, why would you do this all match against agruably a player who is arguably the best ever at running down balls near the net. Could it be now that some players think this is the only thing that works against Andy, now the forehand is no longer a big issue (still weak compared to most of his rivals though)
 
It was also the wrong tactic on the baking hard centre court

The odd drop shot is fine, but he was playing them so often... I think Murray won about 5 points those last few games by chasing down drop shots or drop volleys.

Don't get me wrong I was delighted to see them from a Murray perspective. Just as I was happy to see him charging to the net on not very deep approaches.

He was being outplayed from the baseline I guess, but I've never seen him panic tactically before.

Truth be told I think the drop shots were because he was tired. Novak won a lot of the long baseline rallies but i think his semi caught up with him. Drop shots were a case of him giving up, he was off his game today and through in some tired drop shots in desperation

But lets remember slasher that going into the final Murray had been on court half an hour longer than Djokovic.

For me it's a great sign if someone like Novak thinks that the best way of beating Andy is via drop shot!!

In fairness, it could be that his rivals away from the clay are struggling to find consistent weaknesses

Even his 2nd serve, isn't that much of a problem, because I don't think he has a problem with the ball coming back to him at speed - provided he gets his racquet on it

I remember the very good Peter Fleming stating back in 2009, that when Andy "got" a forehand, watchout!!

CC fair point indeed but something was not right with Novak. His serve was so slow, never seen him serve that bad for a couple of years. He was so lethargic in his service games. As a fan he really disappointed me with his performance today, so many unforced errors and throwing in consistently awful service games and drop shots. It was like a different player to the one in other matches.

Anyway, onwards and upwards. Murray deserves his success and hopefully Novak comes back strong in us open. Easy to lose perspective, he has won a slam this year!

I've seen a lot of tennis in my years, some boring, some mundane and others bland.

Every Wimbledon final I've ever seen has been interesting, exciting or amazing. (I haven't seen them all though)

Today was different, it was tortuous, alleviating, nail-biting and relieving. Scary, exciting, nervy and hopeful. Not once was it boring or mundane or bland.

It was good all round entertainment, I cant understand why the term "base lining" corresponds with boring and monotonous to some people, all the greats did it, but for some reason its not parse today. I found the whole thing a great spectacle of tennis bravado, skill and courage and maybe not on par with the skills on display between Fed and Nad a few years ago, but just as good a day of entertainment.

Not boring, no, thats not a fair resume of the match imo.

JubbaIsle wrote:I've seen a lot of tennis in my years, some boring, some mundane and others bland.

Every Wimbledon final I've ever seen has been interesting, exciting or amazing. (I haven't seen them all though)

Today was different, it was tortuous, alleviating, nail-biting and relieving. Scary, exciting, nervy and hopeful. Not once was it boring or mundane or bland.

It was good all round entertainment, I cant understand why the term "base lining" corresponds with boring and monotonous to some people, all the greats did it, but for some reason its not parse today. I found the whole thing a great spectacle of tennis bravado, skill and courage and maybe not on par with the skills on display between Fed and Nad a few years ago, but just as good a day of entertainment.

Not boring, no, thats not a fair resume of the match imo.

It is all about what floats people's own boats so to speak. It is not a given that baseline tennis is boring though many will tell you that. There are just as many that will tell you they hated the serve dominated tennis of the 90's so there you have it.

slashermcguirk wrote:CC fair point indeed but something was not right with Novak. His serve was so slow, never seen him serve that bad for a couple of years. He was so lethargic in his service games. As a fan he really disappointed me with his performance today, so many unforced errors and throwing in consistently awful service games and drop shots. It was like a different player to the one in other matches.

Anyway, onwards and upwards. Murray deserves his success and hopefully Novak comes back strong in us open. Easy to lose perspective, he has won a slam this year!

In the great words of a former BBC 606 sage, "If your not fit for purpose, you shouldn't be there or complain when you lose"

A bit harsh a description of Novak, but it illustrates a point that the previous 5 setter against Del Boy may have taken its toll. It may not have been a physical thing either, he was pushed and could have lost, but as BB calls it, he may have red lined the 5th set in his quest for the final showing, but the doubt that crept in after going 5 sets to a crocked Potro may have some bearing on todays result.

After losing the 2nd set to Murray, he was faced with the proposition of having to win the next 3, I don't think he could have pulled that off, asking a bit much really, but the result is in and he has to live with it and learn, he's not that old he can't learn new tricks.

Novak played a tougher final at the AO against Rafa following a tougher semi against Murray - in 2012. I don't think we can blame the Del Potro match here.

slashermcguirk wrote:CC fair point indeed but something was not right with Novak. His serve was so slow, never seen him serve that bad for a couple of years. He was so lethargic in his service games. As a fan he really disappointed me with his performance today, so many unforced errors and throwing in consistently awful service games and drop shots. It was like a different player to the one in other matches.

Anyway, onwards and upwards. Murray deserves his success and hopefully Novak comes back strong in us open. Easy to lose perspective, he has won a slam this year!

Slasher. I think's it's nothing more sinsiter than the following - re Andy and Novak

1) On clay I doubt Andy would ever beat Novak - certainly it would be no more than once in five matches
2) On slow hard courts (the majority we have) then I think in a 10 game sequence it 6-4 to Novak
3) Then fast hard courts and Wimbledon when it's like it has been in the last two events - then I'd expect Andy to win 7 times out of 10

In other words, Novak's problems were tactical - simply because Andy's more natural in these conditons

Expect him back for US Open as I think he'll win that and Andy the Aus in 2014 (not betting my life on these just yet!!)

I almost want Murray to win the next two so we can have the situation of him going to the French with a chance of holding all 4 titles, but at the same time seemingly no chance at all.

ryan86 wrote:I almost want Murray to win the next two so we can have the situation of him going to the French with a chance of holding all 4 titles, but at the same time seemingly no chance at all.

Imagine a scenario where Roger has gracefully retired. Rafa isn't fit and Novak gets dumped early at The French!!

Crazy as it may sound - I don't rule him out for a 'lucky win' and hence having done only what Rafa and Andre Agassi have acheived

Remember, Andy has never taken part in a clay court contest in recent years, unless at least one of his three rivals were there and in 2011 he had a couple of matches wherehe looked half decent

Don't think it will happen, but you never know - I can imagine him having one year when he does what Rafa does and simply plays on clay earlier, just to given himself a chance

The only thing I didn't like about the article is lack of mention of Del Potro's name, he can really turn the tide as top 3 for the present and future. 

banbrotam wrote:Of course as a fan it's great that Andy's won. But what is even more important is that we have two players with now a great rivalry (3-2 to Novak at Slams) and also two characters, who looked Rafa and Roger in the eyes and stated, with their Tennis, that one day they would be better

Now it may have taken age with Roger and dodgy knees with Rafa, for this to happen. However, it would be good if we all acknowledged that no-one else has bothered to burst through this door, so if it was that significant others would have won slams

No. Away from clay, we've got the two best players but lets hope others join them. For instance I'd love Tsonga to win a major and think Berdych, even though his game bores me, deserves one too. Hopefully the likes of Raonic, JJ, Tomic, Dolgo and even Nishikori can keep improving and join them

But we really should praise the way the current Top 2 are now dominating Tennis, away from the dirt

I agree banbro, I have been roundly criticized when I placed Murray as a great player waiting in the wings and ranked him as a co-equal member of the big 4 in many ways. Because I don't look at pedigree or career CV, I look at how the guy is playing and how well he can play. And in the last couple of years Murray has been the biggest and most consistent challenge to Novak, and most likely one day will get his chance at a turn at #1. I find the athletic nature of their rivalry to be quite entertaining, some don't like it, but I find it amazing what these two do both offensively and defensively.

On another note, a great trait Andy has in post-match interviews is how he tries to deflect his glory onto others close to him. In the first tournament of the year in Sydney in his victory speech he broke down dedicating the win to Ross Hutchins and he did the same at Queen's (or near enough). Yesterday he thanked Ivan and said the win was for him as he realised how much Ivan wanted to win Wimbledon but never quite managed it as a player. Top stuff Andy. Very unselfish.

banbrotam wrote:

erictheblueuk wrote:I'm glad Andy won but that was one of the worst men's slam finals I can remember. I hope they don't play each other in anymore finals as their games are so similar. Either of the other semi finalists would have given us a far more interesting match with more contrasting styles.

I find it hard how anyone can say it was the "worst" after that horrible serve dominated Stich victory of 1991 or even the Krajicek (even though I was glad he won) of 1996. There were also some very poor quality finals involving Sampras. Not the great man's fault, I might add

I think it's very easy to make rash statements after the event - for instance I've just watched the 3rd set and it was the play of the other player that won the point for 75% of them

I said one of the worst finals and if you have to go back to the 1990's to find a worst one then then it sounds like you agree with me.