Martin Murray - Overrated?

I have heard a lot of talk lately about how good Martin is, and how he is easily the best of the British trio also consisting of Macklin and Barker, however is this justified?

He seems to have gained this reputation by beating no one of note, and being fairly inactive.

He made a decent effort in his world title failures, however you cannot tell me he was justified in getting a draw against Felix Sturm, also Martinez was there for the taking when they fought but Murray did not seem to have another gear to go in to, he seemed very cautious and far too passive in the "fight of his life".

He also seems to have become quite arrogant on twitter, and is very abrupt with people who want genuine debate with him over his boxing, I am not referring to WUMS here, but people who are polite and asking genuine questions.

He is not a big puncher, does not have a high workrate, seemed to fade badly against Sturm ( 30 seconds longer he would have been stopped) and Martinez and his boxing ability is average at best. The only thing I can see is that he is big for the weight, which gives him an advantage over most.

I do not have any dislike for the guy and I support all British fighters I am just genuinely confused at how his stock has risen so much, when ultimately he has failed in his two biggest fights that were both very winnable.....

Well he lost to a old, one-legged Martinez. Probably clipped Sturm. But yeah maybe he hasn't done anything worth getting genuinely excited about, but I wouldn't say he is overrated.

I think his stock has rightly risen after the Martinez fight. I thought he won that fight against a fighter that at the time was considered one of the best in the sport. Not only that, but away in Argentina in a very hostile environment. I wouldnt have him leagues above Macklin and Barker but as it is now I think he is worthy to be placed above them. I think hes a good fighter, and in my exprience I havent really seen him being touted as anything greater than that so I wouldnt say he overrated. The Martinez performance may have flattered him overall as a fighter but think you are selling him a bit short in that one. Had he got the decision I felt he deserved it would have been one of the great British wins and I dont think fighting Mainez in Argentina would have been seen as particularly winnable. So it proved with the judges who gave every close round to the home fighter.

IMO he is the weakest of the British trio still and has always been

Macklin was a lot more impressive against Sturm than Murray

Macklin & Barker gave Martinez real trouble and pushed him as hard as anyone. Murray took that one step further, he got the closest to beating Sergio but as someone mentioned he had him for the taking but let it slip himself and faded late. That version of Martinez was older than the one both macklin and Barker fought and was recovering from career shortening (considering his age as well) injuries and he looked like a guy who's body was deserting him. Even with all that he still couldn't win

I find it hard to rate Macklin. He has long been my pick out of the Brits and has fought the best opposition and the best versions of Martinez and Sturm, but he has had a long career and the Golvokin fight was damaging. On the flip side I'd expect GGG to do exactly the same thing to barker and Murray who both lack power and can be easy to hit

Manos I cannot agree he deserved the decision. It was close but he did not do enough to win. It almost seemed to me like he was happy to get close and was suprised himself by how much Martinez had faded. It was a hostile environment however my winnable comment was based on how Martinez fought, and not the fight on paper beforehand.

The fact consensus has him beating both Martinez and Sturm one would suggest it's too soon to say he's overrated........

Certainly above Macklin now he's been trashed in two of his last three fights..........Barker and him are pretty close however........

I thought the general consensus was he was very lucky to get a draw vs Sturm? He has also said himself he did not win the Martinez fight as he "did not do enough". That to me is borderline unforgivable when you are a few rounds away from beating a top 5 p4per on there own soil.

Depends If you like him or not as to whether you think he deserved Martinez and Sturm decisions..

Suggest with you writing this negative article it's the latter.....

Not interested in what he thought about his own performance.......Most 606ers had him winning and a majority of journalists also....

Ali once said Louis would beat him.........He was being humble....too.........

I thought general consensus was that he definitely beat Sturm, but just about lost to Martinez?

It wad asclose fight. Open to interpratation. My point is i felt he could have done so mich more to take any doubt away. He boxed within himself.... And he is not Muhammed Ali. He is a fringe world class fighter who had a case of beating one of the best fighters in the world. If he thought he won he would not have been saying otherwise.... Humble or not.

Apologies for awful spelling using my phone which is difficult.

leedizzle1986 wrote:Manos I cannot agree he deserved the decision. It was close but he did not do enough to win. It almost seemed to me like he was happy to get close and was suprised himself by how much Martinez had faded. It was a hostile environment however my winnable comment was based on how Martinez fought, and not the fight on paper beforehand.

I have to say I would be almost the opposite in my own position. I could certainly see a case for Martinez nicking the fight. But almost all the middle rounds were decisively won by Murray. He floored Martinez twice, one incoorectly given as a slip. But he won the middle rounds clearly. There were maybe 6 or so rounds that were close and capable of being scored level or either way. The judges gave every single one to Martinez. Theres an argument he nicked alot of them, but certainy in the middle of the fight Murray was winning rounds clearly and if you were to take the fight as a contest overall I think he deserved the nod. My card was (not factoring the 2nd undeclared knock down):

My card was:

Martinez Murray
1. 10 9
2. 10 9
3. 10 10
4. 9 10
5. 9 10
6. 9 10
7. 10 9
8. 8 10
9. 9 10
10.9 10
11.10 9
12.10 9

T= 113 115

Even in the event Martinez nicked the fight, I think Murray deserves alot of credit for going to Argentina and performing the way he did.

Overall, I dont believe Murray is a special fighter. I think he is good in lesser way that Froch is good. He is effective and tough to beat despite not looking outstanding. I cant really say Ive seen him massively hyped up though. I think he surprised alot of people with his efforts against Martinez and has rightly received praise for it.

Don't recall any consensus that Murray beat sturm. Thought the consensus was that the German judges made up for the sturm macklin fight with an away town decision. Whichever Regardless of the consensus, I thought sturm was jobbed against Murray. I did think Murray was pretty unlucky against Martinez.

Your card sort of proves my point in a way Manos. He was up but basically gave the last two rounds away and gave the judges the chance to give it to Sergio. Which you cannot do when fighting away. Its been a while but i may rewatch it tommorow and see if my opinion has changed but i remember seeing it as Martinez by a couple at the time.

I remember that most people on here (myself included) thought Murray was lucky to get a draw vs Sturm and as someone said he may have benefitted from the Macklin debacle

Murray martinez split people, as Murray looked the boss and did the most damage, but boxing is scored on a round by round basis and Martinez seemed to bank a lot of rounds on work rare alone. So murray won his rounds more clearly but gave away some easy rounds where he just didnt work

Murray is vastly overrated.

He lost to Sturm, but the judges levelled out the robbery given to Macklin.

Martinez was injured coming in to the Murray fight, sustained the near career ending knee injury against Chavez. Murray still couldn't get the job done.

Gutsy Prizefighter winner done good.

I had Sturm beating him in a close fight but still haven't seen the Martinez defeat. Credit for going out there and performing well but from what I've seen I'd have him behind Macklin and Barker although its a close call. That really is why most would like to see them square off against eachother; very close fights.

leedizzle1986 wrote:Your card sort of proves my point in a way Manos. He was up but basically gave the last two rounds away and gave the judges the chance to give it to Sergio. Which you cannot do when fighting away. Its been a while but i may rewatch it tommorow and see if my opinion has changed but i remember seeing it as Martinez by a couple at the time.

He may have lost the last two rounds, obviously the judges must have given them to Martinez but I dont think he gave them up or surrendered them. They were not especially clearly won by Martinez. The 11th was a close round. Were Murray the defending champion at home he probably would have won that round. If anything, I think it was the first couple of rounds where Murray lost the fight. The first two rounds he didnt land much and Martinez won those rounds pretty clearly.

The fight might have been winnable in hindsight, because Murray showed he could have won it. But that doesnt mean it was easy to win. He was battling home advantage of a highly rated champion while he was a relatively unheralded challenger. He was really up against it and I think it showed in the scorecards and with the referee. If the shoe was on the other foot and Murray was the established champion fighting in front of a large partisan support then the cards could have been as wide as 116-112 or 117-111 in his own favour if the close rounds went his way and his second knockdown scored.

I can see a case for Martinez edging it, a draw or Murray edging it. I thought 115-112 was a little wide and indicated the only rounds Murray won were the ones he won decisively with any close rounds going to Martinez. Overall I thought Murray was landing the more telling punches and edged the fight. I dont think he neccessarily gave the fight away.

But regardless of the result, I think he deserves credit for the performance and made a much better fight of things than people expected. I havent seen Murray touted as being a super boxer but he certainly exceeded my expectation in both his title fights even if he came up short. I cant really say I think he has been overrated on the whole based on the comments I have seen about him. Other than Golovkin at middleweight who looks to be a genuine top quality fighter, I think hes capable of beating anyone else in the division and I think his to world title performances are a reasonable indication of that.