Who Had The Hottest Heavyweight Run In History?

When rating a fighter, it is necessary to evaluate their career as a whole; however, there have been a number of posts of late that would appear to place too great an emphasis on defeats at the end of a fighter’s career (when the fighter is no longer the force they once were).

What if we could only judge a fighter from when they hit their full stride until they ran into a road block (as most ultimately do)?

Looking at the great heavyweights, could Sonny Liston have had the best hot streak of any heavyweight in history?

1959-63

Mike DeJohn TKO6
Cleveland Williams TKO3
Nino Valdes KO3
Willi Besmanoff RTD6
Howard King TKO8
Cleveland Williams TKO2
Roy Harris TKO1
Zora Folley KO3
Eddie Machen UD12
Howard King TKO3
Albert Westphal KO1
Floyd Patterson KO1
Floyd Patterson KO1

I think Ali has a shout. From the first Liston fight to the first Frazier fight;

1970-12-07 Oscar Bonavena
1970-10-26 Jerry Quarry
1967-03-22 Zora Folley
1967-02-06 Ernie Terrell
1966-11-14 Cleveland Williams
1966-09-10 Karl Mildenberger
1966-08-06 Brian London
1966-05-21 Henry Cooper
1966-03-29 George Chuvalo
1965-11-22 Floyd Patterson
1965-05-25 Sonny Liston
1964-02-25 Sonny Liston

Then from the first Norton loss to the Spinks loss he has;

1977-09-29 Earnie Shavers
1977-05-16 Alfredo Evangelista
1976-09-28 Ken Norton
1976-05-24 Richard Dunn
1976-04-30 Jimmy Young
1976-02-20 Jean-Pierre Coopman
1975-10-01 Joe Frazier
1975-06-30 Joe Bugner
1975-05-16 Ron Lyle
1975-03-24 Chuck Wepner
1974-10-30 George Foreman
1974-01-28 Joe Frazier
1973-10-20 Rudi Lubbers
1973-09-10 Ken Norton

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:I think Ali has a shout.  From the first Liston fight to the first Frazier fight;

1970-12-07 Oscar Bonavena
1970-10-26 Jerry Quarry
1967-03-22 Zora Folley
1967-02-06 Ernie Terrell
1966-11-14 Cleveland Williams
1966-09-10 Karl Mildenberger
1966-08-06 Brian London
1966-05-21 Henry Cooper
1966-03-29 George Chuvalo
1965-11-22 Floyd Patterson
1965-05-25 Sonny Liston
1964-02-25 Sonny Liston

Then from the first Norton loss to the Spinks loss he has;

1977-09-29 Earnie Shavers
1977-05-16 Alfredo Evangelista
1976-09-28 Ken Norton
1976-05-24 Richard Dunn
1976-04-30 Jimmy Young
1976-02-20 Jean-Pierre Coopman
1975-10-01 Joe Frazier
1975-06-30 Joe Bugner
1975-05-16 Ron Lyle
1975-03-24 Chuck Wepner
1974-10-30 George Foreman
1974-01-28 Joe Frazier
1973-10-20 Rudi Lubbers
1973-09-10 Ken Norton

I'd say his best run was between Liston and Folley -- he was incredible during that time (and we arguably didn't see the best of him). Accomplished more in the second run but struggled at points.

Ali's first championship run would have to be a contender for sure, Tina. Utterly dominant and that performance against Liston which started it all off was sensational, wasn't it?

That second run features the better names on paper (with the odd patsy thrown in!), but the downside is that he looked anything but hot in a few of those fights. Only just scraped past Shavers, put on an awful show with Young and got away with murder against Norton (III). Probably knocks that one out of contention, for me.

The other major contender here would have to be Tyson's first championship run. Going from memory, I believe it ran Berbick, Smith, Thomas, Tucker, Biggs, Holmes, Tubbs, Spinks, Bruno and Williams all within the space of 32 months. Again, extremely dominant in just about all of those fights and his performances against Tucker and Spinks in particular were just outstanding. Really cut through the division with an ease and arrogance that only a peak Louis can match.

88Chris05 wrote:

The other major contender here would have to be Tyson's first championship run. Going from memory, I believe it ran Berbick, Smith, Thomas, Tucker, Bigg

Here you go mate, I was in the middle of doing it when I read your post.

From trying to put Ferguson's nose through his brain to the fight before Douglas, here is his victims. Most of them by crushing KO. It ain't a bad streak.

1989-07-21 Carl Williams
1989-02-25 Frank Bruno
1988-06-27 Michael Spinks
1988-03-21 Tony Tubbs
1988-01-22 Larry Holmes
1987-10-16 Tyrell Biggs
1987-08-01 Tony Tucker
1987-05-30 Pinklon Thomas
1987-03-07 James Smith
1986-11-22 Trevor Berbick
1986-09-06 Alfonzo Ratliff
1986-08-17 Jose Ribalta
1986-07-26 Marvis Frazier
1986-07-11 Lorenzo Boyd
1986-06-28 William Hosea
1986-06-13 Reggie Gross
1986-05-20 Mitch Green
1986-05-03 James Tillis
1986-03-10 Steve Zouski
1986-02-16 Jesse Ferguson

The Liston run takes some beating, he was fighting all the top men while Patterson was taking the easy fights and making the big money. Shame that Sonny was kept out of the title picture for so long and left the best of himself in the ring before he actually won the title which came bit too late in his career.

David Haye

Monty Barrett
Nikolai Valuev
John Ruiz
Audley Harrison

A glittering CV that is up there with the very best.

One for the old timers. Jim Jeffries. Lots of question marks over his reign, Jackson was pretty much dead, Fitz/Corbett were pounding him, he held physical advantages over pretty much everyone, and fights were perfectly suited to his style of strength and grappling. But, if you're looking for names on paper, then it is pretty good. Jackson, Everett, Sharkey, Fitzsimmons x2, Corbett x2, Ruhlin, all worthy adversaries.

1903-08-14 James J. Corbett
1902-07-25 Bob Fitzsimmons
1901-11-15 Gus Ruhlin
1901-09-24 Joe Kennedy
1901-09-17 Hank Griffin
1900-05-11 James J. Corbett
1900-04-06 Jack Finnegan
1899-11-03 Tom Sharkey
1899-06-09 Bob Fitzsimmons
1898-08-05 Bob Armstrong
1898-05-06 Tom Sharkey
1898-04-22 Mexican Pete Everett
1898-03-22 Peter Jackson

Gone on the Boilermaker.

T’is a good run Tina, also has to be remembered with Jim he was pretty green in terms of fights when he was pitched into this level so the results he got were all the more remarkable. Also perhaps understandable why the likes of Corbett and Fitz gave him headaches. Worth remembering though that he improved quick and most reports have him more than holding his own boxing wise with Corbett second time round.

Rowley wrote:T’is a good run Tina, also has to be remembered with Jim he was pretty green in terms of fights when he was pitched into this level so the results he got were all the more remarkable. Also perhaps understandable why the likes of Corbett and Fitz gave him headaches. Worth remembering though that he improved quick and most reports have him more than holding his own boxing wise with Corbett second time round.

Yep, he made massive improvements between Corbett I and II. His record has so little chaff on it, just a short sharp burst of excellent names. Shame he had to go out like he did on a loss. Would have liked to see a fully fit and active Jeffries in with Johnson. He would probably still have lost, but not in the fashion he did in 1910.

To be fair that run of Jeffries was brutal especially when you consider the physicality involved and the impressive way he dealt with such good fighters.

I discount Jeffrieswin over Jackson. Jackson was in the grip of Tuberculosis which would eventually kill him a short while later. Think Ali/Berbick and then some.

Holmes didn't have the best opponents but still some decent ones and going 48-0 was fantastic achievement.

DAVE667 wrote:I discount Jeffrieswin over Jackson. Jackson was in the grip of Tuberculosis which would eventually kill him a short while later. Think Ali/Berbick and then some.

I know.

Tino wrote:  Lots of question marks over his reign, Jackson was pretty much dead

I also quite like Frazier's five-year run between 66 and 71, ending with his unimprovable win over Ali. Leaving aside the fillers, the important wins came against Bonavena (x2), Machen, Doug Jones, Chuvalo, Mathis, Quarry, Ellis and Foster before the immortal triumph in The Fight. In all, Joe's record for the period was 16-0 (12), a series which stands fair comparison with a lot of heavyweight champions.

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:I discount Jeffrieswin over Jackson. Jackson was in the grip of Tuberculosis which would eventually kill him a short while later. Think Ali/Berbick and then some.

I know.

Tino wrote:  Lots of question marks over his reign, Jackson was pretty much dead

I know you know, I was just illustrating the point for the young un's who may not have been fully aware of the severity of Jackson's illness. Although it does beg the question why you bothered to list Jackson's name if you knew it would be discredited by both me and your good self.

DAVE667 wrote:

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:I discount Jeffrieswin over Jackson. Jackson was in the grip of Tuberculosis which would eventually kill him a short while later. Think Ali/Berbick and then some.

I know.

Tino wrote:  Lots of question marks over his reign, Jackson was pretty much dead

I know you know, I was just illustrating the point for the young un's who may not have been fully aware of the severity of Jackson's illness. Although it does beg the question why you bothered to list Jackson's name if you knew it would be discredited by both me and your good self.

I like Jackson.  Good fighter and I didn't want him left off Jim's winning streak.  Just wanted to add the caveat that it might just have been a slightly shopworn version.

Would you like it more if I referred to him as PETER JACKSON moving forward?  I know how much you like capitals.

captain carrantuohil wrote:I also quite like Frazier's five-year run between 66 and 71, ending with his unimprovable win over Ali. Leaving aside the fillers, the important wins came against Bonavena (x2), Machen, Doug Jones, Chuvalo, Mathis, Quarry, Ellis and Foster before the immortal triumph in The Fight. In all, Joe's record for the period was 16-0 (12), a series which stands fair comparison with a lot of heavyweight champions.

You'd have to suggest Joe takes the cake here. Smokin' indeed.

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:

DAVE667 wrote:I discount Jeffrieswin over Jackson. Jackson was in the grip of Tuberculosis which would eventually kill him a short while later. Think Ali/Berbick and then some.

I know.

Tino wrote:  Lots of question marks over his reign, Jackson was pretty much dead

I know you know, I was just illustrating the point for the young un's who may not have been fully aware of the severity of Jackson's illness. Although it does beg the question why you bothered to list Jackson's name if you knew it would be discredited by both me and your good self.

I like Jackson.  Good fighter and I didn't want him left off Jim's winning streak.  Just wanted to add the caveat that it might just have been a slightly shopworn version.

Would you like it more if I referred to him as PETER JACKSON moving forward?  I know how much you like capitals.

That's something of an understatement.

Capitals are only for metal bands like SLAYER or MALEVOLENT CREATION. Don't be flinging them about with wild (or even gay) abandon. Thank You

That run Ali went for in Africa with all them kids singing and running along with him.

Sweating buckets he was.

captain carrantuohil wrote:I also quite like Frazier's five-year run between 66 and 71, ending with his unimprovable win over Ali. Leaving aside the fillers, the important wins came against Bonavena (x2), Machen, Doug Jones, Chuvalo, Mathis, Quarry, Ellis and Foster before the immortal triumph in The Fight. In all, Joe's record for the period was 16-0 (12), a series which stands fair comparison with a lot of heavyweight champions.

Good shout that one captain.

What about Lennox from the McCall loss through to the Rahman loss?

Not the best of the lot I guess but good by todays standards:

David Tua
Francois Botha
Michael Grant
Evander Holyfield
Evander Holyfield
Željko Mavrović
Shannon Briggs
Andrew Golota
Henry Akinwande
Oliver McCall
Ray Mercer
Tommy Morrison
Justin Fortune
Lionel Butler

Pedro147 wrote:David Haye

Monty Barrett
Nikolai Valuev
John Ruiz
Audley Harrison

A glittering  CV that is up there with the very best.

And lets not forget he was sent by the greats of yesteryear to save heavyweight boxing (according to Haye)

Steffan wrote:What about Lennox from the McCall loss through to the Rahman loss?

Not the best of the lot I guess but good by todays standards:

David Tua
Francois Botha
Michael Grant
Evander Holyfield
Evander Holyfield
Željko Mavrović
Shannon Briggs
Andrew Golota
Henry Akinwande
Oliver McCall
Ray Mercer
Tommy Morrison
Justin Fortune
Lionel Butler

Lewis clicked into gear against Golota but floundered a bit against Mavrovic before kicking on again. Golota to Tua is pretty good.

Liston is a good call Haz........Didn't realise he'd planted so many quality heavies.....

I imagine he was Tyson-esque in winning before the opening bell plenty of times...

I may need to re-appraise my next heavyweight list...........

Jeffries has a touch of Lewis about it...some great names on the slide but a good resume......

Think all the best names have gone so I'll back out..

Good thread though Mate..

I've been watching a bit more of Sonny of late (a report came out recently from a former mobster's son, claiming Liston HAD been the victim of a mob killing).

He tends to be underrated due to those Ali fights. Hopefully one day the truth might surface over those two curious affairs.

The man was unbelievably strong.