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PGA Tour: Amateur Hour at Pebble Beach: Notes from the Ballwasher

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 05 Feb 2014, 4:45 pm

1).Peter Jacobsen waxes lyrical about what this week's AT&T National Pro-Am means to the PGA Tour.
As quoted by Doug Ferguson this week, but oft-repeated by Jacobsen:
"This combines all the elements we're looking for when it comes to the PGA Tour - corporate involvement, amateur involvement, celebrity and fan interaction, it's a combination of good fun and good golf."
 
2).The annual Bing Crosby "clambake" has morphed in to a TV extravaganza, publicity gushing on to a handful of household names among the "celebrities" and more than a hundred titans of corporate America (plus some Irish gamblers).
Not so good for golf fans watching the coverage on CBS TV though. Brandel Chamblee tweeted last Sunday that the worst thing about the Super Bowl coverage was the Super Bowl. Those watching CBS's broadcasts last weekend of the Phoenix Open must have felt pretty much the same, the only thing wrong with the golf coverage was the golf coverage; plenty about "Our Military", Waste Management (understandable), the circus surrounding the 16th hole, and Weiskopf's plans to blow up his golf course creation and design a new version for next year, all in Jim Nantz's nauseatingly smarmy tones.
But very little focus on a fascinating golf tournament with half a dozen possible winners until it was almost too late.
They'll be at it again, "Friends", at the "Most felicitous meeting of land and sea in creation." (Robert Louis Stevenson must have been homesick when he said that.)
 
3).As we said following Jimmy Walker's recent win in Hawaii, another journeyman-turned-mid-thirties-breakout-star has revealed himself, with long-time Tour player Kevin Stadler, known apparently as the Smalrus, winning "Phoenix" by one shot over Bubba Watson. Three interesting things about that:
~Stads won his first web.com event, in 2004, beating Bubba Watson in a play-off.
~The Walrus and the Smalrus will become the first father/son duo to play in the same Masters - added benny of that is that Father Craig promises it will be his last one.
~Don't believe everything you read on pgatour.com - which lists Kevin Stadler at 250 lbs - about 18 stone. That must be a serious understatement, plus his caddie is even bigger! Golfers as athletes? Hmmmm.
 
4).Poor efforts by Harrington (3-putted his 36th hole to miss the cut) and Westwood (his ineptitude on the greens included a 4-putt from inside 9 feet).
Westwood only missed 6 greens (two fewer than Stadler, for instance) out of the 36 he aimed at, and was rated to have lost 3.6 "strokes putting" per round. I love what Westwood has achieved over the past twenty years, but this is utterly pathetic, his PGA Tour career at risk if this continues.
 
5).Nicolas Colsaerts disintegrated as the weekend wore on and he's even worse off than Westwood as Nicky misses out on the WGC's, The Masters, Open Championship, Players, and possibly even the PGA unless he pulls his socks up.
 
6).They say to "beware the injured golfer" and Golf Digest included an allegation from an anonymous "Undercover Tour Pro" that some Tour pros exaggerate injuries when going through a poor run of form to the extent that they manipulate the "medical extension" consideration to give themselves a better chance of cherry-picking events they play in so giving themselves a better chance of resurrecting their career.
 
Clearly wounded Tour warriors pick and choose which events they contest whilst in the Major Medical Extension category, but I've never heard of anyone being accused of feigning injury to secure a medical extension.
Perhaps sour grapes (if this undercover pro is who I think it is, one wouldn't be surprised!), or he just doesn't understand how the Medical Extensions work.
 
7).Regardless, golfers who have recently played their way back to the top of the injured category to the extent that they can be reconsidered as exempt players again include Kevin Na and Briny Baird. Others who should get there soon include Goosen, Spencer Levin, and hopefully John Mallinger (good record at Pebble Beach), JB Holmes and Jonathan Byrd (tho' Byrd is really struggling).
Those reasonably active Pros who are probably goners include Kris (why can't I bring my gun thru airport security?) Blanks whilst among others just returning are Blake Adams, Harrison Frazar, Jhonny Vegas and Lumpy Herron.
Dudley Hart got injured whilst in the form of his life seemingly a lifetime ago and is struggling back, and Fatty Marino seems to have disappeared again after cameos last autumn.
And then there's the Anthony Kim category.
 
8).I wonder how the three courses on the magnificent Monterey Peninsula will be playing this week?
Torrey Pines was playing harder and firmer than usual as California struggles with its drought so perhaps there'll be more of a mid-summer feel to the set-ups for the "AT&T".
Most of the single Tour Europeans are playing and there's even a sponsor's invite for Alex Cjeka. Harrington and McDowell are there, plus Dubuisson, Cabrera Bello and McGinley.
I fancy course specialists this week, a fit Phil for instance, or a distraction-free (unlikely as he's playing with father-in-law to be, the Great Gretzky) Dustin Johnson.
As last week Hunter Mahan will be motivated to continue his belated but promising start to the season and form guys like Jommy Walker and Jason Day have good records here. And one day Aussie Matt Jones will break through.
 
9).A nice story doing the rounds following Pete Seeger's death a few days ago:
He toured a lot with Arlo (son of Woody) Guthrie, but one year Seeger said, "Look, my voice is not so good as it used to be, I don't think I should be doing this any more."
Arlo told him, "Pete, Look at our audiences, they don't hear as well as they used to, yet they enjoy our show."
And they carried on touring and continued to prosper.
 
Kind of reminded me of the Champions Tour and we've said before that a number of well known pros turn 50 this year. Woody (no word if he has a son called Arlo) Austin, Ames, Goydos, Verplank and Lee Janzen among them. Perhaps we'll see The Mechanic too?
This week's tournament sees the coming of age of Billy Andrade; Chapman and Montgomerie also competing.
 
10).Among the best rounds played this year has to be Bernhard Langer's final round to win the Champions Tour event in Hawaii - absolutely brilliant, in a surgical, OK Germanic, sort of way.
And that's his 19th win on the Champo Tour, tied with Larry Nelson, Gary Player and the Gilroy Cowboy (OK, George Archer) at 10th on the all-time list.
But remember, there are far fewer events these days, than in the 90's for instance.
Those ahead of Bernhard are:
45: Hale Irwin
29: Trevino
25: Gil Morgan
24: Miller Barber
23: Bob Charles
22: Don January and Chi Chi
20: Colbert and Crampton.
But none of them enjoyed a year like Peter Thomson's 1985:
Played: 22
Top 25: 22
Top 10: 20
Won: 9


Last edited by kwinigolfer on Wed 05 Feb 2014, 6:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by twoeightnine Wed 05 Feb 2014, 5:47 pm

Good write up as always.

Although the Ferguson quote sounds like flannel it probably is pretty true for the PGA as while the reality of combining all those things is maybe pushing it, there will be a lot of business done out there. While I personally cannot think of anything worse than watching Am's hacking around as I can do that with my friends, I would imagine that a lot of armchair viewers love to say that they can see Billy Murray, etc. playing so think that this would appeal to a wider audience.

I would imagine that Finchem uses this massively to lure sponsors, as I am sure that the ET does at the Dunhill. And while playing classic links courses is a good lure, Personally the Monterey Pennisula in Feb beats the East Scottish coast in Oct!

Plus the players must think that while this is a bit of a ball ache, they must also know that the big sponsorship cheque is largely signed by playing with the CEO of xyz plc in event like these.

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 05 Feb 2014, 6:23 pm

Thanks 289,
Peter Jacobsen wears lots of hats, including running a company that manages charitable events and Pro tournaments. Plus he's long been an Arnold Palmer disciple in terms of the importance of fan-friendliness and corporate relationships.
Unfortunately he also commentates for NBC without getting to know the players, or at least those below the American superstar strata.
Nauseatingly jingoistic while he's at it.

Might be a bit parky on the links this week, temps probably struggling to get out of the fifties, so that may mean slightly higher scores than usual.
Which is better than it is here; sap leaking on my sugar maple on Saturday seemed to be a harbinger of spring-to-come.
But I'm just about to shovel eight inches of winter. Hate it when that happens.

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Post by Davie Wed 05 Feb 2014, 7:59 pm

I just heard a "pundit" from one of the top bookies on the radio (I think he was from SkyBet) - and I'm sure he said Jason Day was favourite? Some mistake there surely?

EDIT: just checked the odds on the site I use and sure enough G'Day is favourite with them too. The world has gone mad

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Post by GPB Wed 05 Feb 2014, 8:25 pm

Kwini, that UnderCover Pro article said that the Pros on Major Medical get 10K a month as stipend.

I am looking at Jose Coceres and Hank Kuehne and see that have 2 and 1 tournaments left in their major medical.

Why would they ever play their last tournament?

Coceres played in Dubai last week and he also played on the Latino Americas tour late last year.

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 05 Feb 2014, 8:27 pm

Davie,
I just think everyone wants to be on board when/if Jason Day finally breaks through. There's got to be something between the ears that holds him back - not sure his closeness to his caddie/coach does him any favours at all.

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 05 Feb 2014, 8:38 pm

GPB,
I missed that about the $10K; can't see that's any reason for guys to hand in sick notes, especially as determination of receiving Medical Extensions are somewhat subjective (sure Greg Kraft would agree).
Coceres is now eligible for the Champo Tour so wonder if he receives any hand-out.

I reckon the p1ssed off Undercover Pro is Alex Prugh, who do you think??!!

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Post by GPB Wed 05 Feb 2014, 9:03 pm

I don't think Alex Prugh has been around long enough to fit some of the profile of Undercover Pro from previous installments.

I was thinking about someone like Chalmers or Maggert

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Post by kwinigolfer Wed 05 Feb 2014, 9:12 pm

Ah!
I think it could actusally be a different pro each time; one of the earlier columns said he was based in Florida, which made me think Brian Davis fitted that particular profile. Don't Chalmers & Maggert both live in TX?

Anyway, this one seemed to imply that he was a web.com grad with a poor reshuffle position and was getting shafted out of West Coast fields. Though not this week's!


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Post by puligny Wed 05 Feb 2014, 10:37 pm

Kwini, good one. In (slight) defence of Nantz, he popped up on BBC while over as a tourist watching The Open. Seemed far more knowledgeable, interesting and even mildly amusing than anything I have heard from him during US coverage, where he does appear smarmy and sycophantic!
Comment on Sky was Stads had chosen his caddy to make himself look small!
Anthony Kim - didn't he use to be a golfer? Good one as I recall. Has he been kidnapped?
Looking forward to views of Pebble etc, but dreading Ted Schmuk CEO of Bing Bong Corp, and various tv and sports stars hacking it round like.......well like me actually!

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Post by JAS Wed 05 Feb 2014, 11:03 pm

"Looking forward to views of Pebble" yeah me too Puligny, Xmas just gone was the first year i didn't make it for my long weekend in Monterey since 2008 Sad Stayed in Blighty and had salt rubbed in the wound with the Poopie weather....which is still going!! Reckon the seafront holes at Porthcawl would have been a sight at high tide today :-/

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 12:08 am

Agreed, love watching the Pros play courses I've hacked it around on. Not to mention it's drop-dead beautiful.
Agree also about Nantz, but he gets more of a smarmy/corporate persona every year. Just terrible.
Have also heard him on ESPN's coverage of The Open when he presumably doesn't have to answer to Corporate America's sponsorship of CBS. Much better!!

Is Porthcawl as beautiful as the flyovers suggest?

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Post by McLaren Thu 06 Feb 2014, 12:29 am

Kwini wrote:some Tour pros exaggerate injuries when going through a poor run of form

Please tell me McIlroy didn't fake is tooth ache?


Is McGinely in because he is the Ryder cup captain?
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Post by JAS Thu 06 Feb 2014, 7:37 am

Re Porthcawl...it depends which way you look Kwini...West and you have Swansea Bay and The Mumbles in the distance...beautiful. North and you get the remnants of Port Talbot steelworks...um...not so beautiful! Distant views aside I think it'll look cracking in the camera lens when the Senior Open gets there in July.

With Pebble it doesn't matter where you look, the whole area is just stunning. View wise, Pebble & Kapalua must be by some distance the most scenic stops on Tour.

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Post by puligny Thu 06 Feb 2014, 8:59 am

Kwini re Porthcawl - playing it for first time at end of Feb with JAS and a well known (former) poster on these boards. I will let you know. Then again if it's blowing like the last few days!!!

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Post by McLaren Thu 06 Feb 2014, 9:05 am

puligny wrote:Kwini re Porthcawl - playing it for first time at end of Feb with JAS and a well known (former) poster on these boards. I will let you know. Then again if it's blowing like the last few days!!!

You are playing with Mav?
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Post by puligny Thu 06 Feb 2014, 9:40 am

Mac - good spot there!

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Post by JAS Thu 06 Feb 2014, 12:19 pm

No...not Mav....Fader!! :-O

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Post by JAS Thu 06 Feb 2014, 1:17 pm

Anyway...back to PB...don't be misled by it's beauty, it's a steel fist in a velvet glove, if you're gonna miss you've GOT to know where to miss. Miss in the wrong place and you have the shot from hell!! All depends on where the pins are but typical examples would be...long on 8, left on 10, long on 11, long on 13...as for 14...the most evil green in championship golf, the only miss is either in the front bunker or straight long, if you go left or right without a killer short game you could be there for some time!!!

Really enjoy the AT & T watching how both celebs and Pros deal with shots I would categorise as "rather tricky"

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 1:34 pm

Still think #8 at PB is my favourite hole in golf.

As for #14, evil is right; both times I played it I had the good sense to underclub and plonked in to the relative sanctuary of the front bunker. Horror stories if you pull your approach.

Enjoy Porthcawl guys!

The boys on Monterey get underway at 4.00 p.m. GMT; looks as if temps will be in the high forties when they get their balls in the air, be surprised if it reaches 60.

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Post by pedro Thu 06 Feb 2014, 3:43 pm

The AT&T is at 44 OWGR points this year, the highest since 2010, yet "only" 2 top 10 players (Phil, Day). Still far away from the early-mid 2000's when it was always worth 50+ points.

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 5:07 pm

Well, this figures.
California has been complaining of a historic drought but the PGA Tour comes to town and, Guess What??!!
Rain delay.
Though not sure whether it's to humour amateurs who might only have US Ryder Cup-issue rain gear.

But: Wouldn't you just know it, Almost the only rain on the radar for the entire country.

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Post by twoeightnine Thu 06 Feb 2014, 6:07 pm

I remember that 14th from when the US Open was there and thought it was pretty much unplayable. I totally understand risk and reward but the margin on this seemed wrong. I'm sure that with USGA greens it made it look worse.

Beautiful course though. Probably not a patch on Porthcawl though! I used to live in the Mumbles that were mentioned and used to have a lovely view back across the bay to the steelworks in Port Talbot. The things that people caught if they were stupid enough to fall in the bay. All changed now that they treat the sewage before they let it out of a pipe 50 ft into the water! Didn't really play golf then but would love to play the links just round the corner at Pennard looking over Oxwich Bay. Now that is stunning. Touch blowy and wet today though!

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Post by GPB Thu 06 Feb 2014, 6:14 pm

I love Pebble Beach but I am not fan of the 14th green. Its a small green and they only use half the green to put the hole.


The other half of the green should be leveled out so it can be used for a hole placement.  

The top half the green should get overly stressed from all the foot traffic, day after day after day.

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 6:34 pm

Nice one 289!

GPB: Am I losing my remaining marbles or did they used to use the right hand (lower) side of the green in the not too distant past?

PS: I'm sure we'll see 1992 flashbacks of Faldo climbing the tree, short and right. I was standing on the other side of the green with some of your fellow countrymen hoping there'd be a calamity!


No updates from the Tour so that's not good news; the GC seems to indicate the rain is easing up a bit. Not sure how many of the 54 greens have "standing water" on them though.
If there's any more significant rain during the wekend, we'll be looking at 54 holes and/or a Monday finish.

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 6:55 pm

Resumption of action scheduled 11.30 p.m. local (7.30 p.m. GMT).

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Post by robopz Thu 06 Feb 2014, 8:11 pm

Kwini... great write up as usual...  thumbsup 

A few things on AT&T.... This event used to have it's own entry criteria that made it more like and invitational, but no longer. Now it fills its field "mostly" the same as any other event except ATT Pebble winners prior to 2000 can get in along with the last 5 years of past champions. Same with major winners prior to 2000. And now, where this event used to get something like 20 SE's... now they are allocated the same as any other event. Mac brought up McGinley... he would have needed one of those 10 SE's. (2 for PGAT members, 6 unrestricted and 2 foreign). Many weeks there are only 4 unrestricted when all the Web*com guys don't get in... but those 2 go unrestricted when all the Webbies make the field (like this week).

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Post by robopz Thu 06 Feb 2014, 8:28 pm

Oh... and Undercover Pro is ONE guy. Seems pretty common knowledge among the working media who he is... but since I was always somewhat of a "3rd-tier 4th estate type"... the name was never shared with me, but I have it narrowed down to small mitt full. I texted someone in the last hour asking... got back a "If I tell ya I would have to kill ya" response... :-) But did get an indication that the real guy is among my options. If that is in fact the case... it wouldn't be any of the names that have been mentioned in this thread yet... I'll say if I ever think I have it pinned down more closely.... but think it better to hold out until I do.

But here's what we do know... mid-30's, 10 years out there, no wins (unless that's a smokescreen) . That narrows it down a LOT more than many might realize.

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 8:42 pm

I think he says he lived in FLA also.
 
But I think the u.p. is a number of different guys.
This from January for instance:
"I'm entering only my second full season on the PGA Tour."
Well, we know that contradicts the introductory article last year!
 
He also raises eyebrows with this:
"There's a player who missed the start of his 2014 season after failing a pot test."
 
Must be Jim Furyk. Or Tiger Woods perhaps. Luke Donald?
!!!


PS: I wonder if robo's suspicion rests on another (shall we say) foreigner?

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Post by NedB-H Thu 06 Feb 2014, 9:26 pm

What's got into Chopra? No doubt his regular sextuple-bogey will come along shortly to restore normality.

Scrolling down the leaderboard and struggling to find even half a dozen players who fit robo's criteria exactly. Although obviously mystery man may be taking the week off. There is a guy playing nicely so far today who may fit the bill though.


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Post by robopz Thu 06 Feb 2014, 9:57 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:
PS: I wonder if robo's suspicion rests on another (shall we say) foreigner?
 Whistle 

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 10:03 pm

Ned,
There are too many conflicting statements from the U.P., contradictions galore. One month a 10-year veteran, but in January in only his second year.
 
Chopra 100% in the gir stat - almost more suprising than the fact he's leading.
 
And Harrington has his obligatory double-bogey in early.


robo,
If you're thinking the same as me, wouldn't you think there's an unusual amount of "attitude" in what he says?
Still think there's more than one involved, see my comment about January. (And his comment about an early season suspension wouldn't be looked on favourably by his fellow pros, would you think?)

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Post by McLaren Thu 06 Feb 2014, 10:32 pm

Never heard of the secret golfer before.  Where can we find his writing?
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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 10:50 pm

Mac,
It's an occasional column in Golf Digest.
I'd link one to you but can't seem to be able to do that. But they're archived on-line.
Only about four of them, but interesting.


Worth mentioning a couple of unfashionable pros who have unfathomably good records at this event:
Mallinger, as mentioned above, has two 3rd place efforts.
And Greg Owen has a 3rd, a 4th and a 9th, plus has never missed a cut.
Just saying. Both going well early . . . . .

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Post by robopz Thu 06 Feb 2014, 10:53 pm

McLaren wrote:Never heard of the secret golfer before.  Where can we find his writing?
Undercover Pro here... http://www.golfdigest.com/golf/undercover-pro

Kwini... the [short] conversation I had was the 1st or 2nd week of January... and at that time it was being discussed as "he"... and even in the texts from earlier today... it was still "he". But yeah, I see the discrepancies now... soooooo... that's got me wondering if the contradictions are purposeful smokescreens to conceal identity..... or if it really is different pros... hmmm.

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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 11:15 pm

Oh well, I'm sure it's not Padraig Harrington, his comments would take up an entire issue.

Chopra seems to have settled down, Dustin Johnson doing well under the eagle eye of the Great One.

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Post by McLaren Thu 06 Feb 2014, 11:30 pm

Thanks, will have a read of that.
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Post by McLaren Thu 06 Feb 2014, 11:49 pm

"There's a player who missed the start of his 2014 season after failing a pot test."


Just read the article. Really, who could it be?

Kwini, I assume you were not serious with your suggestions above.
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Post by kwinigolfer Thu 06 Feb 2014, 11:55 pm

Of course I was . . . . . . . !

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Post by NedB-H Fri 07 Feb 2014, 12:53 am

Chopra gives back 5 of his 6 early birdies in the end, to universal lack of surprise. More surprising that McGinley has gone back in time ten years though. And who is Andrew Loupe?

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Post by kwinigolfer Fri 07 Feb 2014, 1:05 am

Ned,
Did you see that Chopra had a triple?

Loupe is a college buddy of John Peterson who made it thru' the web.com finals.

And: The Legend of Will Mackenzie continues.
After nothing better than a 15th place in the past three seasons, Will the Thrill has FIVE already in the 13/14 season. Playing well again today.

Woods confirms he won't play the Match Play.

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Post by McLaren Fri 07 Feb 2014, 2:00 am

So tiger will play honda, doral, bay hill then masters?

Does he play Quail hollow anymore?
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Post by kwinigolfer Fri 07 Feb 2014, 2:08 am

Mac,
Since TW won Quail Hollow in 2007, he's:
DNP
4th
Cut
DNP
Cut
DNP.
I'd be surprised if he turns up this year.

Darkness brings 'em in at Pebble(etc); not a bad day for GB&I with no-one over par, just McDo and Padraig outside the cut-line.

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Post by McLaren Fri 07 Feb 2014, 2:41 am

Quick look at the scores on the different courses (although not all players have finished)

PB averages -0.37 (best -6)

SH -0.87 (-5)

MP -1.96 (-8)

I guess we need to compare the players to the course they are playing.
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Post by robopz Fri 07 Feb 2014, 3:35 am

McLaren wrote:Quick look at the scores on the different courses (although not all players have finished)

PB averages -0.37 (best -6)

SH -0.87 (-5)

MP -1.96 (-8)

I guess we need to compare the players to the course they are playing.

A little surprised at those numbers... more than 1.5 strokes difference (relative to par) from MP to PB. it had seemed to me they'd done a pretty good job of mostly equalizing the scoring on these three courses the last three years. Here's the three round averages.

2013
PB = 71.814 (-0.186)
SH = 72.641 (+0.641)
MP = 70.244 (+0.244)
0.430 of a stroke difference from highest to lowest.

2012
PB = 71.923 (-0.077)
SH = 72.581 (+0.581)
MP = 69.883 (-0.177)
0.758 of a stroke difference from highest to lowest.

2011
PB = 72.118 (+0.118)
SH = 72.058 (+0.058)
MP = 69.519 (-0.481)
0.599 of a stroke difference from highest to lowest.

I consider anything less that a stroke difference from best to worst as "relatively" insignificant... but 1.59 strokes is considerable. If I had to guess... it'll even out over 3 rounds... but you never know... I didn't notice a gap this wide in any of the individual rounds over the last three years.

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Post by McLaren Fri 07 Feb 2014, 4:23 am

robo

I could be wrong, it was a rather hasty calculation.
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Post by kwinigolfer Fri 07 Feb 2014, 12:15 pm

Action scheduled to begin a tad earlier today, Round 1 to be completed starting at 7.45 a.m., (3.45 p.m. GMT), Round 2 to get underway at 9.00 a.m.
So, for forty(ish) golfers, and their amateur partners, it's complete Round 1 at one course, hail a cab to take you to the first tee somewhere else for Round 2.

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Post by robopz Fri 07 Feb 2014, 12:23 pm

McLaren wrote:robo

I could be wrong, it was a rather hasty calculation.

Mac... not questioning your numbers... I haven't done it myself... but just looking at the all the MP's at the top of the leaderboard... I'll bet you're pretty darn close, even though it's hard to be accurate before a round is complete, and not studying or applying the distribution of hard/easy holes remaining on which courses.

My comment is aimed at the fact in the last 3 years they had done a pretty decent job of equalizing the scoring relative to par across the 3 courses. It surprises me if they "missed it" this year... that is if they did. But still... it could be just the weather, or the distribution of players... let's see if margin stays this way... or tightens... or even expands over the next few days.

But not that it "usually" matters all that much as all players play all three.

But at the Hope sometimes it did make a real difference.... for a while there they were playing one course (Indian Wells) that was a LOT more exposed to the wind. I forget the year... but there was one VERY windy day and the players on IW were brutalized, while the players on the other courses not so much in more protected courses against the mountains... Since the real bad wind was just one day... it turned out to be something like a 3 or 4 shot disadvantage to have that IW draw.... that did NOT balance out the other days. It may have happened other times, but not to that extent as far as I'm aware.

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Post by I'm never wrong Fri 07 Feb 2014, 5:43 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:Ned,
There are too many conflicting statements from the U.P., contradictions galore. One month a 10-year veteran, but in January in only his second year.
Just had a brief look, and 1 explanation could be "Last season on the Web.com Tour I busted my hump." 10 year veteran golfer but only 2 year on PGA Tour?

I've no inside knowledge.

I'm never wrong

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Post by robopz Fri 07 Feb 2014, 5:50 pm

Possible Explanation of Scoring difference on ATT courses.....

I just saw on another board... MP is playing at a par-71 this year compared to par-70 last year (just checked and yessir it is) That could explain the larger difference (relative to par) for MP vs the other courses this year vs the last 3....

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