Glasgow and Edinburgh: Ongoing Banter Thread IV

by **George Carlin** Fri 27 Jun 2014, 6:11 pm

Historical Banter:

https://www.606v2.com/t48240-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread
https://www.606v2.com/t51313-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-ii
https://www.606v2.com/t53119-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-iii

A new thread for the 2014/5 season.

A. Edinburgh Rugby

1. Coaching Team

Alan Solomons - head coach
Stevie Scott - assistant coach
Omar Mouneimne - assistant coach

2. Players In

Neil Cochrane from London Wasps
John Andress from Worcester Warriors
Rory Sutherland from Gala RFC
Tom Heathcote from Bath Rugby
Michael Tait from Newcastle Falcons
Fraser McKenzie from Newcastle Falcons
Phil Burleigh from the Highlanders
Anton Bresler from the Sharks
Brett Thompson from USA 7s

3. Players Out

Steven Lawrie retired
Alun Walker released
Alex Allan to Glasgow Warriors
Geoff Cross to London Irish
Lewis Niven released
Sean Cox to London Irish
Robert McAlpine released
Perry Parker to Rotherham Titans
Izak van der Westhuizen released
Ross Rennie to Bristol Rugby
Dimitri Basilaia released
Alex Black released
Greig Laidlaw to Gloucester Rugby
Chris Leck released
Piers Francis released
Gregor Hunter released
Harry Leonard to Leeds Carnegie
Ben Atiga retired
Ben Cairns retired
Nick De Luca to Biarritz Olympique
Lee Jones released
Aleki Lutui to Gloucester Rugby

4. Pre-season Fixtures

Leicester Tigers v Edinburgh
Saturday 23 August, 14:00
Welford Road

Edinburgh v Newcastle Falcons
Friday 29 August, 19:45
Mansfield Park, Hawick

B. Glasgow Warriors

1. Coaching Team

Gregor Townsend – Head Coach
Shade Munro – Forwards Coach
Matt Taylor – Defence Coach

2. Players In

Alex Allan from Edinburgh
Murray McConnell from Ayr RFC
Euan Murray from Worcester Warriors
James Downey from Munster
Rossouw de Klerk from the Cheetahs

3. Players Out

Moray Low to Exeter Chiefs
Chris Cusiter to Sale Sharks
Ruaridh Jackson to London Wasps
Ed Kalman retired
Byron McGuigan released
Finlay Gillies released
Scott Wight to Melrose RFC
Gabriel Ascárate released
Folau Niua released
Carlin Isles to USA 7s

4. Pre-season Fixtures

Glasgow Warriors v Harlequins
Saturday 23 August, 14:30
Scotstoun Stadium

London Scottish v Glasgow Warriors
Saturday 30 August, 15:00
Richmond Athletic Ground

by **RDW** Fri 27 Jun 2014, 6:25 pm

Can't believe we got through 3 threads in one season.

Oh well!

Bring on next season!

by jimbopip Fri 27 Jun 2014, 6:42 pm

So how long do we reckon before the inane, irrelevant drivel begins?

by jimbopip Fri 27 Jun 2014, 6:44 pm

Schiz will probably know.

by funnyExiledScot Fri 27 Jun 2014, 6:58 pm

If Scottish Rugby threads were to follow the Rocky series then this is the one with the great Ivan Drago, one of the great and emotionally deep whilst misunderstood characters of 20th century action films.

I suspect the game tomorrow will indeed be reminiscent of the Drago vs Creed fight, with Scotland reprising the role of Creed but without the confidence. Or will we be Rocky? Either way I question the training methods of the South Africans......

How's that for complete nonsense Jimbo? Who says we need Schizoid?

by **RDW** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 9:23 am

Interview with Phil Burleigh in the Scotsman. A few points:

- It does very much sound like he was signed as a 10
- He himself admits he's more of a 12 and hasn't really played at 10 for years

PHIL Burleigh insists he is not heading to Scotland for an armchair ride after signing a two-year deal with Edinburgh Rugby.

The Murrayfield-based outfit caused a stir on Thursday with head coach Alan Solomons drafting the 27-year-old “primarily as a stand-off” despite the New Zealander plying his trade at inside centre with the Highlanders.

Solomons has also handed out a new deal to South African stand-off Carl Bezuidenhout and acquired young Scottish playmaker Tom Heathcote from Bath, but Burleigh is up for the challenge of breaking into the starting XV at stand-off.

“If that’s the way it is and I have to forge my way through, I like that,” he said. “Competition brings the best out of everybody and I’d hate to be starting right from the outset and for it to be an armchair ride.

“I don’t know a hell of a lot about European rugby – I haven’t watched a lot, but Alan has informed me of what the competition is like.

“It’s a different country; not many people know much about me. I’ve got to prove myself, but I’m looking forward to the challenge.

“Murrayfield has a lot of history — it’s awesome to get the chance to play there.”

While his short-term focus is on helping the Highlanders through tough Super Rugby matches against the Waratahs and Crusaders in the coming weeks to keep their play-off hopes on track, Burleigh is keen to put to rest any uncertainty in Scotland over his skillsets and ability to transition from inside centre to stand-off when he joins his new Edinburgh team-mates in August.

“A lot of those things come really naturally,” he said. “I work on those skills all the time so I’ve got no issues adapting to being a starting 10.

“I played a lot of rugby as 10 when I was younger. When I went through the grades in Canterbury I was a stand-off and also a fair bit at Bay of Plenty, my provincial side.

“Mostly I’ve played a lot of 12 and I’ve enjoyed that, but it’s a new opportunity for me and something fresh.”

Burleigh has been a prominent fixture in a Highlanders backline which boasts All Blacks stars Ben Smith and Aaron Smith, as well as rising star Malakai Fekitoa, but concedes that he has reached the point in his career where he needs a new challenge.

“Around 27 or 28, a lot of New Zealand midfielders start to head overseas — it’s a bit of a trend,” he said.

“I’ve got to that stage where I’ve hit my end point in New Zealand and probably won’t go any further. I want a fresh and new start somewhere else and I’ve definitely got that with Edinburgh.

“Alan has explained to me what he wants to do with the Edinburgh team and I like the challenge of trying to get back to near the top of the league.”

Unlike Glasgow Warriors winger Sean Maitland, who swapped New Zealand for Scotland in 2012 and made his international debut against England at Twickenham in March last year, Burleigh is not eligible to represent Scotland immediately, but admits he would be privileged to don the dark blue jersey if he became eligible.

“I don’t qualify, unfortunately,” he said. “My great grandparents were from Scotland, so I’ve definitely got Scottish blood in me.

“They’re a proud country and a couple of New Zealanders have played for them before and done it through residency. To play for any country is a great privilege. I haven’t thought too far ahead at this stage but, if that kind of opportunity came up, I’d grab it.”

The Christchurch-born son of former Canterbury centre Wayne Burleigh is due to arrive in Edinburgh with his partner after an enforced four-week break at the end of the Super Rugby season while he waits for his passport to be sorted out. Familiar faces Sam Beard and Mike Coman will be waiting for him.

“I’ve spoken to those boys and I’ve really enjoyed what they’ve done at Edinburgh so far and I look forward to getting over there,” he added.

“I played with Sam Beard at Bay of Plenty. I was out injured last year, but I got to know him quite a bit. I played a lot of age-grade rugby with Mike Coman at Canterbury and I’m good friends with him.

“I’ve never been over to that part of the world and my partner wants to do a bit of travelling, so it’d be nice to do that when it’s on your back doorstep. It made it easy as an option to move to Edinburgh.”

by **George Carlin** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 9:52 am

Fair play to him. What was also interesting was an interview I read with Grandpappy where he said that he expects much more from Bezzy this year. The implication was that Solomons cut him some slack last year because the Bezmeister was fairly exhausted, having come from a full Vodacom season into a Rabo one.

Interesting to see how much he'll improve. I think this surely means it's much less likely we'll see Tonks specifically feature as a fly half, regardless of how much it might interest us as Scotland fans to see it.

by jimbopip Sat 28 Jun 2014, 1:59 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:If Scottish Rugby threads were to follow the Rocky series then this is the one with the great Ivan Drago, one of the great and emotionally deep whilst misunderstood characters of 20th century action films.

I suspect the game tomorrow will indeed be reminiscent of the Drago vs Creed fight, with Scotland reprising the role of Creed but without the confidence. Or will we be Rocky? Either way I question the training methods of the South Africans......

How's that for complete nonsense Jimbo? Who says we need Schizoid?

FES, I think the more accurate movie reference would be Zulu, with a small band of plucky celts hopelessly outnumbered and outgunned dragging the sick and wounded out of the hospital while awaiting the African onslaught. If we get the same result I would expect at least 15 VC's this time.

by Majestic83 Sat 28 Jun 2014, 10:35 pm

If either Edinburgh or Glasgow are still looking for a centre/wing there is a scottish qualified one from the Melbourne rebels going spare.
Lachlan Mitchell is out of contract at end of the super rugby season. Been unlucky with injury this season but is a cracking player either at 12 or 13 and wing.
His parents are both scottish and was talk of the sru trying to get him a couple years ago but signed a new contract with the rebels instead. Would definitely add something to either Glasgow or Edinburgh.

by **George Carlin** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 10:45 pm

Maj, I've said this before but you really need a live Twitter feed directly to Sean Lineen. I've seen Mitchell pop up on Sean Maloney highlight reels quite a lot over the past couple of years.

by Majestic83 Sat 28 Jun 2014, 10:51 pm

George Carlin wrote:Maj, I've said this before but you really need a live Twitter feed directly to Sean Lineen. I've seen Mitchell pop up on Sean Maloney highlight reels quite a lot over the past couple of years.

He is one of the toughest players I have seen in super rugby and when he played at wasps. Would make a great centre partnership outside matt scott.

Anyone got lineens email?

by **RDW** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 10:51 pm

Well Glasgow have got hunners of wingers, and why would Edinburgh need another winger when we've got nikki walker?

In all seriousness, I'd be very happy if he came to Edinburgh!

by **RDW** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 10:56 pm

Had a look at some YouTube clips - he looks pretty strong defensively, definitely wouldn't fit in at Edinburgh!

by **RDW** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 10:59 pm

Looks like a no go - he says he's retiring and has had some offers but nothing interested him!

http://m.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/retiring-melbourne-rebel-lachlan-mitchell-has-no-bitterness-at-being-cut-from-2015-list-20140628-zspkm.html

by Majestic83 Sat 28 Jun 2014, 11:03 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Looks like a no go - he says he's retiring and has had some offers but nothing interested him!

http://m.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/retiring-melbourne-rebel-lachlan-mitchell-has-no-bitterness-at-being-cut-from-2015-list-20140628-zspkm.html

Yeah he has had a few offers from Australian teams but isn't interested in them but he has said if he got an offer from overseas that interested him he would continue playing.

by **RDW** Sat 28 Jun 2014, 11:17 pm

Good stuff.

Well given the number of players Edinburgh released they should have budget left, especially given that the players we've brought in aren't exactly stellar names!

by Nematode Sat 28 Jun 2014, 11:54 pm

His highlights look good.

Ihaia West plaved v well this weekend apparently. Guess he's out of SRU league

by Majestic83 Sat 28 Jun 2014, 11:59 pm

Nematode wrote:His highlights look good.

Ihaia West plaved v well this weekend apparently. Guess he's out of SRU league

Was Ihaia west a serious option for the sru? Apart from being ginger is he actually scottish qualified?

by **George Carlin** Sun 29 Jun 2014, 7:26 am

Majestic83 wrote:
Nematode wrote:His highlights look good.

Ihaia West plaved v well this weekend apparently. Guess he's out of SRU league

Was Ihaia west a serious option for the sru? Apart from being ginger is he actually scottish qualified?

Yes, West scored a try and kicked 5 conversations to beat the Western Force this weekend. He seems to be absolutely rapid and exactly what any team would want.

Can't find anything about his parentage, although he probably gets sunburned watching fireworks which clearly increases the likelihood of a Scottish granny at least.

To be honest, he's probably angling for a full ABs cap at his age rather than looking to come to Edinburgh to cement a powerhouse hinge with Sam Beard.

by EWT Spoons Sun 29 Jun 2014, 9:40 pm

Majestic83 wrote:
George Carlin wrote:Maj, I've said this before but you really need a live Twitter feed directly to Sean Lineen. I've seen Mitchell pop up on Sean Maloney highlight reels quite a lot over the past couple of years.

He is one of the toughest players I have seen in super rugby and when he played at wasps. Would make a great centre partnership outside matt scott.

Anyone got lineens email?

Nope, but reckon this lot might

"For general enquiries about playing, volunteering or coaching rugby in Scotland, email rugby@sru.org.uk"

by EWT Spoons Sun 29 Jun 2014, 9:41 pm

Should probably add that was taken from the SRU site

by nickj Mon 30 Jun 2014, 12:29 pm

Surely Lachie is the 13 Edinburgh have been crying out for?

by **George Carlin** Mon 30 Jun 2014, 12:44 pm

nickj wrote:Surely Lachie is the 13 Edinburgh have been crying out for?

What can you be talking about? Edinburgh have the animal that is Sam Beard. ( Glasgow and Edinburgh: Ongoing Banter Thread IV Bangin10

)

by funnyExiledScot Mon 30 Jun 2014, 1:21 pm

George Carlin wrote:Fair play to him. What was also interesting was an interview I read with Grandpappy where he said that he expects much more from Bezzy this year. The implication was that Solomons cut him some slack last year because the Bezmeister was fairly exhausted, having come from a full Vodacom season into a Rabo one.

Interesting to see how much he'll improve. I think this surely means it's much less likely we'll see Tonks specifically feature as a fly half, regardless of how much it might interest us as Scotland fans to see it.

Agreed. Heaven forbid that one of the two professional sides take a decision that would benefit the national side.

by funnyExiledScot Mon 30 Jun 2014, 1:37 pm

jimbopip wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:If Scottish Rugby threads were to follow the Rocky series then this is the one with the great Ivan Drago, one of the great and emotionally deep whilst misunderstood characters of 20th century action films.

I suspect the game tomorrow will indeed be reminiscent of the Drago vs Creed fight, with Scotland reprising the role of Creed but without the confidence. Or will we be Rocky? Either way I question the training methods of the South Africans......

How's that for complete nonsense Jimbo? Who says we need Schizoid?

FES, I think the more accurate movie reference would be Zulu, with a small band of plucky celts hopelessly outnumbered and outgunned dragging the sick and wounded out of the hospital while awaiting the African onslaught. If we get the same result I would expect at least 15 VC's this time.

Sadly nothing like Zulu in the end. More like Jaws, with the South Africans taking the lead role of the famous shark, and Scotland reprising the role of the unnamed extra paddling on the surf board at the beginning.

by **George Carlin** Mon 30 Jun 2014, 2:13 pm

The opening 20 minutes of Saving Private Ryan also sprang to mind when I watched the second half lowlights.

by Nematode Mon 30 Jun 2014, 2:48 pm

Given B...............t plays 15 too, we could see him there to kick to allow Tonks to play at 10?

by Nematode Mon 30 Jun 2014, 2:50 pm

Btw, Glasgow play Quins in a pre-season friendly. Announced on Twitter.

by funnyExiledScot Mon 30 Jun 2014, 4:12 pm

Nematode wrote:Given B...............t plays 15 too, we could see him there to kick to allow Tonks to play at 10?

That's certainly possible. Although I remain unconvinved, RDW actually prefers Bezzy at 15 than at 10. Also worth noting that Cuthbert kicked fairly well towards the end of last season, meaning that if the 15 is going to do the kicking either way, then there's room for Tonks at 10.

It's going to be interesting to see how and where Solomons deploys all these players. Most of the Edinburgh backs appear to be able to cover a number of positions - jacks of all trades, masters of none springs to mind.....

by justified sinner Mon 30 Jun 2014, 4:42 pm

That's where a good coach comes into his own. Jury's out just now, but I'm on the positive side. ST bought.

by **George Carlin** Mon 30 Jun 2014, 4:46 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
Nematode wrote:Given B...............t plays 15 too, we could see him there to kick to allow Tonks to play at 10?

That's certainly possible. Although I remain unconvinved, RDW actually prefers Bezzy at 15 than at 10. Also worth noting that Cuthbert kicked fairly well towards the end of last season, meaning that if the 15 is going to do the kicking either way, then there's room for Tonks at 10.

Surely with Heathcote and Burleigh, Tonks is a much better option at 15 than Cuthbert?
Then again, Cuthbert was good enough there last season and I can't remember the last time I saw Tonks actually play.

by **RDW** Mon 30 Jun 2014, 4:56 pm

Burleigh has said himself he's not played 10 much, more of a 12.

Tonks last appearance was at 10!

by **BigGee** Mon 30 Jun 2014, 4:58 pm

Burleigh probably won't be there for the start of the season. The Highlanders could well be in the playoffs and he has visa issues to sort out. In truth a bit of a break won't do him any harm, we saw what back to back season did to some of the players last season and we don't want him on his hands and knees at the business end of the season.

That will mean that others will get the first crack of the whip to show what they can do, which is always the best option. By the time he arrives then Heathcote may have established himself as first choice so Solly may then think about playing him somewhere else.

It will be a long season, international call ups, injuries will happen, you would imagine that they will all get there chance at some stage.

by justified sinner Mon 30 Jun 2014, 7:22 pm

I always thought Bill Lothian had lost the plot several years ago, but his piece in the EEN confirms it. Apparently Edinburgh are playing Leicester the same day Melrose are playing Heriots on the 23 September.

Edit, Edinburgh Tigers is confirmed for 23 August for those that didn't know.

by funnyExiledScot Tue 01 Jul 2014, 11:53 am

Tonks vs Cuthbert at 15 is quite tricky. Tonks for me is the more rounded player, but Cuthbert's direct approach actually worked well for Edinburgh last season, and when he runs the ball back at full tilt he always seems to make good ground. He's also better under the high ball in my view.

Once the silly wing experiment was dropped, Cuthbert was actually pretty useful at 15. I don't see him as a option at international level - he's too slow - but in poor conditions in the Rabo he's a really good option to have.

by **RDW** Tue 01 Jul 2014, 11:58 am

I'd say both are excellent under the high ball - it's one of Tonks' main strengths!

I'd say Cuthbert was more consistent though - Tonks is an excellent fullback did does make the odd mistake, which usually gets punished when you're the last line of defence.

Tonks at 10!

by funnyExiledScot Tue 01 Jul 2014, 12:39 pm

I'm with you on that RDW. I'd give Tonks and Heathcote the first couple of months of the season competing for the 10 jersey, with Burleigh introduced at 12 (in place of Strauss) whenever he's fit to play.

We know Scott will be out for a while, so that gives Burleigh a chance to get some gametime and settle. If he goes well he keeps the jersey and Scott will have to come in at 13 in place of Sam Beard (or Fife), if he turns out to be another Atiga/Strauss, then Scott comes straight back in at 12.

I'm getting that familiar feeling of optimism creeping back in at this time of year. I suspect it'll last until we face Leicester.

by Weegie Wizard Tue 01 Jul 2014, 5:43 pm

From when he has played this year and from the highlanders website he plays a lot of 13 so, although not where pappy has signed him for, that could end up where he is played. Good news is that would mean Scott would be put back where he should be once he's fit.

On another note, have we given up on bresler being signed for you?

by **RDW** Tue 01 Jul 2014, 5:54 pm

Everyone seems to be reporting he's coming, so it would be disappointing if it was all lies!

by Majestic83 Wed 02 Jul 2014, 8:30 am

Edinburgh announcing another signing this morning. Must be a second row.
Bresler played his first game after injury at the weekend for his club team.

by **RDW** Wed 02 Jul 2014, 8:31 am

Penultimate signing too!

by **George Carlin** Wed 02 Jul 2014, 8:39 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Penultimate signing too!

Who's the last one? Robbie Robinson left until last?

by nickj Wed 02 Jul 2014, 9:00 am

Personally I hope its Mitchell and Bresler (or one of those two, plus Hardie); but didn't the reports around this year's EDP draft intimate that Edinburgh were getting two more EDP young bucks at some point? That could mean no more big names coming in and perhaps more importantly no SQ cavalry riding to the 'rescue' in the time for the world cup.

by nickj Wed 02 Jul 2014, 9:02 am

BTW McInally has put on affair few pounds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XqGsWjGh_Fg#t=23

by Majestic83 Wed 02 Jul 2014, 9:27 am

nickj wrote:Personally I hope its Mitchell and Bresler (or one of those two, plus Hardie); but didn't the reports around this year's EDP draft intimate that Edinburgh were getting two more EDP young bucks at some point? That could mean no more big names coming in and perhaps more importantly no SQ cavalry riding to the 'rescue' in the time for the world cup.

Would like it to be Bresler and Mitchell but think we may have missed out on Mitchell and he is probably going to retire from what i have heard from oz.
The rumour I have heard this morning is Strokosh coming to Edinburgh!

by **RDW** Wed 02 Jul 2014, 9:29 am

You hear a lot of rumours!

I'd be happy with strokosh

by nickj Wed 02 Jul 2014, 9:33 am

Maj - are you an agent?

by nickj Wed 02 Jul 2014, 9:40 am

I wouldn't be disappointed with Stroks, but I'd prefer Hardie TBH. That would add another SQ blindside option to the mix and I'm sure another Top14 team would grab Stroks

by funnyExiledScot Wed 02 Jul 2014, 10:17 am

Strokosch would be a great signing, and coupled with Bresler would bring some real steel to the pack.

I'm getting too excited about this coming season. Best watch some "highlight" reels of last season to bring me back to reality.

by VinceWLB Wed 02 Jul 2014, 10:24 am

I don't think Strokosch would improve the back rows options much, sure he will tackle all day but can he carries? No. At least with Du Preez and Leonardi Edinburgh have some ball carrying threat who should come into their primes. Anyway i think he is staying at Perpignan.

Another 2nd row is a priority, a 2nd row combo of McKenzie and Bresler would be quite beastly!

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