Who will be the Most Improved of 2011-2012?

With the end of season drawing near I have a poll. What team will achieve most in comparison to where they are at now? I've given a few suggestions on who could have much better seasons in 2012 but feel free to vote for another. And above else say why

From that list, tis Glasgow for me. They have been hit appallingly by injuries to their key players this season and it's had a huge effect on them. Going from play-off semi finals last year to almost bottom this year was a bit shocking. I can't see them having such a bad season again. I reckon they'll give a much better account for themselves next season with players coming back from injury, and with the top half of the magners being as close as it has been this year, adding a Scottish side to the mix is going to be brilliant.

It's Glasgow for me too. Despite the injuries they've had, they still played some good rugby this season. I like their rugby-playing philosophy, their offloading - their forwards will look to take contact and offload the ball rather than go to ground whenever possible. Duncan Weir and Ruaridh Jackson, if they kick on, could be handy outside halves.

I'm personally going to tout Stade Francais. Cheika has had a season to get used to how things work. They are 11th in the French League and had an ok Amlin Cup. I expect them to do much better next year. Paul Warwick and Felipe Contepomi are arriving and I think this year they suffered from losing a bundle of players like Marconnet, Bergamasco, Kayser and Gasnier.

Interesting this idea of’ improvement’. If we are purely talking about league positions then I wouid have to say Glasgow will be the most improved next season.
However, what is REAL improvement ? I’ll probably get shot down here but I’m hoping the Ospreys will ‘improve’ massively next season and play a more rounded game instead of the rudey poo they’ve played this season Getting rid of a lot of the ‘deadwood’ down there will hopefully give the youngsters who played so well during the 6 Nations a chance to cement places. With the forwards they’ve got they should be setting the platform for the backs to work off to produce some great rugby. We’ve seen glimpses of it now let’s see the whole picture

Penfro - I hope the O's have a better season this year too. I'm a bit concerned about the impact that the internationals and world cup will have though.

Anyway on the survey above I picked Connacht. Just cause I could

Penfro improvement is whatever you want it to be. If Ospreys come on that much fair play.

Must be Stade. They are near the bottom of the Top 14 and are not in the HC next year. Thier owner, who is not exactly the shy, retiring type, has committed to improvements. Not sure what he has up his sleeve, but I am sure a record of 10 wins and 15 losses is not going to be repeated next season. Hopefully some of the improvements will extend to the jerseys, although to simply be walking adverts like the other French teams is not great either.........

Glasgow. They can't get much worse, can they?

I don't see Glasgow improving THAT much next year. I think they will do better than this year but they are losing Max Evans and Richie Vernon. The likes of Tom Seymour and Troy Nathan will only bring so much.

Any of the Welsh regions to be honest, and it is not because there is any potential, just a fact that they have to or heads will roll, the same could be said for the Wales setup as well.

red_stag wrote:Penfro improvement is whatever you want it to be. If Ospreys come on that much fair play.

That's why I raised it. A lot of people will just be thinking of league position improvement, but I'm looking for an improvement in the quality of what is being offered up by the O's. If they acheive that, then I'll be 'happy'

Penfro - If I was to think like that then I would also hope for some big improvements from the Scarlets for next season too. Notably our defensive efforts and our concentration in the 2nd half of matches. We lost far too many matches this season because of a 2nd half blip. Get that ironed out and up our forwards' performances and I'll be fairly satisfied.

I'd love the Ospreys to start playing some decent rugby next season. They have done in patches this season - while their internationals were away, as has been mentioned - but largely they've been disappointing. It would almost be better if they hadn't shown glimpses of what they can do. It would be less frustrating when they don't produce!

PenfroPete wrote:

red_stag wrote:Penfro improvement is whatever you want it to be. If Ospreys come on that much fair play.

That's why I raised it. A lot of people will just be thinking of league position improvement, but I'm looking for an improvement in the quality of what is being offered up by the O's. If they acheive that, then I'll be 'happy'

If they do that, then the league position will take care of itself.

I've been impressed with Exeter this season - so much so that I think they will press on and improve further. Will they suffer second season blues? I hope not.

In Wales we all need to improve!! Hope the Dragons show more consistency.

I think the Dragons will definitely improve next season. Cardiff Blues will go the other way...

Just looking at the suggestions you've made Stag, here are some thoughts:
* Sale: can't go much lower in the league from 10th without risking getting involved in the relegation scrap; Steve Diamond has waved goodbye to a host of players, some he clearly didn't want to lose (Hodgson) and some that he's happy to open the door for; they are clearly in rebuilding mode, and altho success may not be immediate, they shouldn't be much affected by the RWC or 6Ns, so I would imagine they'll get back into the middle of the chasing pack;

* Stade Francais: defo can't go much lower in the league from this season, otherwise coaching heads will roll due to the owner's notorious lack of patience; that being said, altho there may be some high profile recruits over the summer, cash is no where near as plentiful as it has been in the past, and I imagine that one or two of their bigger names will be on their merry way; expect them to be significantly affected too by the RWC and 6Ns, so the performance of understudies will be critical;

* Connacht: this year represented a significant improvement for the west coast men, and (apologies to ummm, and Bouncer) I just can't see Lord Elwood managing to repeat that level of improvement again this year; that being said, I don't think that there will be any shame in maintaining the level that they have reached this season;

* Harlequins: not their best finish in the AP, but winning the Amlin was no mean feat; while I think they have a decent chance of improving their league position next year, I don't think that they have sufficient squad depth to fight on two fronts, so perhaps that will lead to a less successful European campaign next year - would that combination represent improvement? Not for me;

* RC Toulon: A very disappointed, wealthy backer will have been spitting at the level of consistency this year, so we can expect the arrival of even more big names than those already announced; the big question for me remains whether PS-A has the coaching skills to blend a group of disparate individuals into a team (have to confess that I nearly choked when I read that "team spirit" will be emphasised next year - I've always thought RCT were the antithesis of those two words); squad depth shouldn't be a huge issue, so success on two fronts is a possibility, partly depends on how the Heino pools play out;

* Glasgow Warriors: some improvement is almost a given on the basis that things couldn't get any worse; on the one hand, hopefully injuries to key players like Cusiter, Kellock, Beattie and Morrison will be avoided, and the loss of Thom Evans, Kelly Brown and Dan Parks not repeated; but on the other hand, they're still shipping out Max Evans and Richie Vernon next year, albeit that Robert Harley and the two Ryans (Grant and Wilson) should come on a treat in their second ML year in the pack, but the backs look fragile out wide, with the replacements brought in not really up to standard; likely to be hit hard during the RWC and 6Ns again, but I still say they have to be better than they were.

offload wrote:I've been impressed with Exeter this season - so much so that I think they will press on and improve further. Will they suffer second season blues? I hope not.

In Wales we all need to improve!! Hope the Dragons show more consistency.

So hope that you're right, offload

Dont expect the Ospreys to improve that much, the world cup will dictate matters there. Having a strong front five is fine IF they play, but in truth I see the O's retrenching for the season beyond.
Glasgow HAVE to improve or Lineen will be shown the door, so that's my pick.

Spare a thought for Connacht though, in the heineken can they do any worse than the dragons?

Hello all,

Just signed up and liked the look of this post.

I think Harlequins will push on from their Amlin success this year and will be a force in next year's Heineken Cup.

Welcome aboard Tayto. Quins have a good team, good young English players coming through and are looking the part. I think Care and Evans is potentially the best half back pairing in Europe.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Connacht going backwards next season. Not happy, but not surprised either.

They are losing Keatley, Cronin, Hagan and Carr (and others, but those are the headliners). They aren't getting the same quality in replacements - the only Ulster player going there I am slightly disappointed to lose is McCrea.

Bearing this in mind, I think if they get a couple of hidings in the Heineken Cup, the defining theme of next season may be stoicism and endurance, rather than consolidation. On the other hand, the quality at their junior player level is clearly improving rapidly, so maybe in a couple of years they will have come on, with better home-grown talent.

Of course, a couple of hard-fought wins in the HC and the season may have a very different feel, but I can't see them improving with that talent going. It's for another thread, really, but I personally feel they've been shafted by the IRFU.

Nick Evans is world class. It's just his misfortune that his career's coincided with Dan Carter's.

I've gone for 'Other'... Aironi

They were getting better and better towards the end of the season. Ok, maybe it's an easy pick to say they'll improve on last year when all they'd need to do that would be to win three games, but I don't think they'll be as big a walk over next time round.

After seeing what is expected of them this year they now know what it takes to play a full season. And the Italian union, if they've got the cash, will not want to rely their international hopes on only one domestic team and will probably do all they can to help Aironi become the equal of Treviso (who themselves should be well improved next year also)

Speaking from the English team’s point of view I would most definitely say that Harlequins will have more of a chance to improve than Sale.

It seems like Sale have decided to spend the close season throwing out/losing formerly core members of their squad. [Carl Fearns, Charlie Hodgson, Chris Jones, Sean Cox, Chris Bell, Eifion Lewis-Roberts, Christian Ormsby and another 17 odd others] And replacing them with such leading lights as Vadim Cobalas, Andy Powell, Andrei Ostirkov, and not forgetting the non-scrummaging duo of Buckley and Dickinson. I will be extremely surprised if they avoid the relegation mire again next season.

Harlequins have had their audition year, people will know what they can do now and it will be harder for them. Fortunatley some of their key partnerships; JTH & Lowe, Marler, Gray & Johnson have had time to mature together and gain an understanding.

I've gone for Treviso. They have done very well in their first season and coped reasonably well during the 6N. I think they will have learned a fair bit and will certainly be looking to close the gap to the Welsh/Irish teams.

Cheika in his second season will have Stade Francais humming. They were unlucky in the Amlin Cup in that George Clancy was blowing the whistle. The likes of Warwick, Stan Wright and Contepomi will help them.

Anyone here interested in a fantasy rugby game on 606?

EggbertEnglishman wrote:Cheika in his second season will have Stade Francais humming. They were unlucky in the Amlin Cup in that George Clancy was blowing the whistle. The likes of Warwick, Stan Wright and Contepomi will help them.

They were even more lucky in the Amlin semi when Clermont gifted them the game. Cheika has his work cut out for him.

I think Ulster will take a big step forward again. With Afoa and Payne arriving and so many young guys who are improving fast I think we'll be a real force next season if we can avoid too many injuries.

I think the Saints are very close to winning either the HEC or the AP and next year could be their year . Harlequins look to be really going places as do saracens.

I'll put one in for the Scarlets - I think they'll toughen up a lot next season and they won't lose so many close matches. I'll put a tenner on a top four ML finish and 4 victories in the HC pool.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Just looking at the suggestions you've made Stag, here are some thoughts:
* RC Toulon: A very disappointed, wealthy backer will have been spitting at the level of consistency this year, so we can expect the arrival of even more big names than those already announced; the big question for me remains whether PS-A has the coaching skills to blend a group of disparate individuals into a team (have to confess that I nearly choked when I read that "team spirit" will be emphasised next year - I've always thought RCT were the antithesis of those two words); squad depth shouldn't be a huge issue, so success on two fronts is a possibility, partly depends on how the Heino pools play out;

Toulon is not qualified for the H cup. They can improve provided they have a decent start of the season. They will aslo have a new forward coach. the real question is which players they will have during the RWC? heard they are even looking for Cipriani for a couple of months stint!

I voted for Connacht, however i do not think that they will actually improve too much, however i think that their reputation will increase considerably, and i think they may take a scalp of two in the HC causing the English Prem followers to change their views on them somewhat.

I went for Harlequins as they have really picked themselves up from that complete ddisaster a couple of seasons ago. IMO they should be challenging top four of the premiership and should challenge to make it out of their heineken pool. They have the players to do this in the likes of Nick Evans, Nick Easter, Joe Marler, Danny care and Mike Brown; so as long as most of their players are not p[icked for the world cup they should have a great team next season.

Stade for me too. Cheika was visibly furious after being robbed of the Amlin by Clancy. Added to the players they signed already mentioned, I think they will use that hurt and get in amongst the TOP14 playoffs.

I haven't seen a replay yet of the last scrum but the reason Stade lost the match was they thought they had won the match with 5 minutes remaining. Like Ireland v France in 2007.

The Ospreys in my opinion. Many of the senior players who are causing the disruption at the region are being shipped out, and the Ospreys have done brilliantly when those players havent been in the side.

Taibach?

Gibson wrote:Stade for me too. Cheika was visibly furious after being robbed of the Amlin by Clancy.

Couldn't happen to a nicer man.

Glas a du wrote:Taibach?

I see you posting Taibach everywhere, do you know something about it we dont?

Hopefully Wasps!
Last season we played with a weakly performing pack, hopefully with some solid signings & youngsters coming through we have the backs to cause some damage.

Here's hoping