Sundays big Ospreys v Northampton European showdown...! Euro cup ..!

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Ospreys v Northampton Saints

Fit to play: Christian Day
Fit to play: Christian Day

The Ospreys have done Northampton no favours in their team selection in what should be a pulsating Champions Cup game at the Liberty Stadium.

The Welsh region's hopes of qualification are slim but they will not go down wondering what might have been as head coach Steve Tandy names Rhys Webb, Dan Biggar and plenty more talent in his XV.

Dan Lydiate is ruled out so in comes James King on the blindside while last week's scorer Tyler Ardron continues at number eight this weekend.

The Ospreys currently sit on eight points after four matches, six behind Racing Metro and seven off Northampton Saints with two rounds remaining.

Meanwhile, Northampton make six changes from last weekend - a quintet of those in the forwards - as the final block of European Champions Cup pool fixtures begin.

It is an entirely new front-row, returning skipper Dylan Hartley flanked by Alex Waller and Gareth Denman on the loose and tighthead respectively, while Christian Day is fit again and back in the second row for the Round 5 clash.

The final change up front comes at number eight, Samu Manoa making his return to the starting XV, while Ken Pisi's introduction is on the right wing is the solitary alteration among the backs.

Form: Ospreys lost 18-14 away to Racing Metro in their last European clash but currently sit at the top of the Pro12 standings following last week's 22-11 win over the Dragons. Saints beat Treviso 67-0 in Round Four but were beaten 20-7 by Sale in the Premiership last week. Northampton Saints have won on their last four trips to Wales, with their most recent win on Welsh soil coming in last season's competition against the Ospreys. Ospreys are winless in eight home matches against English sides; losing seven. Ospreys' loss to Northampton last season represents their largest home defeat to an English team.

The teams:

Ospreys: 15 Daniel Evans, 14 Aisea Natoga, 13 Ashley Beck, 12 Josh Matavesi, 11 Eli Walker, 10 Dan Biggar, 9 Rhys Webb, 8 Tyler Ardron, 7 Justin Tipuric, 6 James King, 5 Alun-Wyn Jones (c), 4 Rynier Bernardo, 3 Aaron Jarvis, 2 Scott Baldwin, 1 Marc Thomas.
Replacements: 16 Sam Parry, 17 Gareth Thomas, 18 Dmitri Arhip, 19 Morgan Allen, 20 Sam Lewis, 21 Martin Roberts, 22 Sam Davies, 23 Hanno Dirksen.

Northampton Saints: 15 Ben Foden, 14 Ken Pisi, 13 George Pisi, 12 Luther Burrell, 11 George North, 10 Stephen Myler, 9 Lee Dickson, 8 Samu Manoa, 7 Calum Clark, 6 Tom Wood, 5 Christian Day, 4 Sam Dickinson, 3 Gareth Denman, 2 Dylan Hartley (c), 1 Alex Waller.
Replacements: 16 Mikey Haywood, 17 Ethan Waller, 18 Alex Corbisiero, 19 Phil Dowson, 20 Teimana Harrison, 21 Joel Hodgson, 22 James Wilson, 23 Jamie Elliott.

Date: Sunday, 18 January
Venue: Liberty Stadium, Swansea
Kick-off: 17:30 (GMT)
Referee: Jerome Garces (France)
Assistant referees: Patrick Pechambert (France); Jonathan Gasnier (France)
Fourth Official Jean-Marie Piraveau (France)
TMO Jean-Marie Piraveau (France)

*****

Ospreys are in for a very hard afternoon, a long injury list, the team not playing well in their las few games and their entire European Cup season rests on them not just winning this but winning well.

Saints have fought and bought their way into being a European powerhouse. The Ospreys should struggle to compete.

With so many front line injuries in the pack, scrum time will be a nightmare. Saints might be missing Courtney Lawes from their line out but they can replace him with Manoa...!

Not a result I hold much hope for I am affraid...

Griff wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:

gavstar wrote:doctor grey,  in answer to your question  'what else are people watching ' tv rugby and soccer and live soccer.  swans doing well at the gate ,despite bad loss this week. to be fair , the swans are  9,10,11, in premiership.   much as i love my rugby, ospreys especially, entertainment lies on the soccer side at the moment.........even when swans lose !

Is Rugby really losing (or already lost) the battle with soccer for the hearts and minds in Wales?  What do you think is the reason?

When have we ever had massive crowds in Wales for club rugby though?  Before regional rugby Newport RFC, for example, would still get around 6,000 like they do now for club games with a low level of travelling opposition supporters, and then more for a derby.  It's no different now.  

I probably have to think back to times like Newport RFC vs All Blacks in the 70's when they let everyone in and fans were allowed to sit on the side of the pitch! But seriously, I'm not arguing that 7000 is poor just that it hasn't been much different in Wales, ever, in the professional era and before.  This dwindling of fans as a result of soccer is a red herring, IMO.

The Rebel season or just after perhaps? 1999, 2000? Biggest crowd i've ever witnessed at CAP was against Newport at around this time. Would've been when Tony Brown was doing his thing.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/rugby-union-rebel-clubs-secede-from-wru-1173329.html
http://www.blackandambers.co.uk/Page/Content/519

Its not any one thing its a combination. IMHO the game other than at International level is almost out on its feet.

PenfroPete wrote:Errm ?? Here’s the full list of home ‘European’ attendances since the formation of the Ospreys.  Some names from the distance past in here

2003/4 – average 3,172
Edinburgh 1,822
Toulouse 4,378
Leeds 3,316

2004/5 - average 6,778
Munster 10,280
Quins 5,628
Castres 4,427

2005/6 – average 9,367
Stade 9,408
Tigers 11,488
ASM 7,204

2006/7 – average 11,093
Sale 13,529
Calvisano 6,201
Stade 13,550

2007/8 – average 11,934
Bourgoin 9,704
Ulster 8,082
Gloucester 18,017

2008/9 – average 12,050
Perpignan 10,761
Treviso 7,105
Tigers 18,285

2009/10 – average 10,946 (last time qualified for knock-out stages)
ASM 9,238
Viadana 7,974
Tigers 15,626

2010/11 – average 11,606
Irish 12,437
Munster 12,189
Toulon 10,192

2011/12 – average 6,747
Biarritz 7,732
Sarries 7,098
Treviso 5,411

2012/13 – average 10,660
Treviso 8,746
Toulouse 10,110
Tigers 13,126

2013/14 – average 9,036
Leinster 12,378
Castres 6,385
Saints 8,347

2014/15 – average 7,366
Treviso 7,625
Racing 7,164
Saints 7,308

So the Ospreys attendances have dropped in the last couple of years. Probably more to do with not having a chance to progress from the group, rather than the death of Welsh rugby at the hands of soccer. Those 'big' years a few seasons back were probably when the O's were getting to 1/4 finals??? Just a hunch...

But saying that, I imagine Doctor Grey would consider 10k or 11k pretty small too in a 20k stadium, so I'm not sure the figures posted above really point to any glory years as such???

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Griff wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:

gavstar wrote:doctor grey,  in answer to your question  'what else are people watching ' tv rugby and soccer and live soccer.  swans doing well at the gate ,despite bad loss this week. to be fair , the swans are  9,10,11, in premiership.   much as i love my rugby, ospreys especially, entertainment lies on the soccer side at the moment.........even when swans lose !

Is Rugby really losing (or already lost) the battle with soccer for the hearts and minds in Wales?  What do you think is the reason?

When have we ever had massive crowds in Wales for club rugby though?  Before regional rugby Newport RFC, for example, would still get around 6,000 like they do now for club games with a low level of travelling opposition supporters, and then more for a derby.  It's no different now.  

I probably have to think back to times like Newport RFC vs All Blacks in the 70's when they let everyone in and fans were allowed to sit on the side of the pitch! But seriously, I'm not arguing that 7000 is poor just that it hasn't been much different in Wales, ever, in the professional era and before.  This dwindling of fans as a result of soccer is a red herring, IMO.

The Rebel season or just after perhaps? 1999, 2000? Biggest crowd i've ever witnessed at CAP was against Newport at around this time. Would've been when Tony Brown was doing his thing.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/rugby-union-rebel-clubs-secede-from-wru-1173329.html
http://www.blackandambers.co.uk/Page/Content/519

As your capacity is only around 12k then this sort of proves the point - biggest crowd EVER 12k. Again, when have attendances ever been massive???

I don't know about other areas but living in Swansea, the casual fan who doesn't go the Ospreys but loves the 6 nations etc just doesnt rate the rugby on offer by the Region. They'd rather sit at home and watch the game or spend money vice the price of a ticket,in the local watching premier league footy. Ospreys have marketed the region to the death and reduced prices, had offers on but ppl just don't want to come. My boy plays football on a Sunday, all the conversations you hear is about the premier league and the swans. Even during 6 nations time. Unless the Ospreys have a Leinster style period of dominace and play champagne style rugby. The crowds will stay the same.

[quote="Breadvan"]I don't know about other areas but living in Swansea, the casual fan who doesn't go the Ospreys but loves the 6 nations etc just doesnt rate the rugby on offer by the Region. They'd rather sit at home and watch the game or spend money vice the price of a ticket,in the local watching premier league footy. Ospreys have marketed the region to the death and reduced prices, had offers on but ppl just don't want to come. My boy plays football on a Sunday, all the conversations you hear is about the premier league and the swans. Even during 6 nations time. Unless the Ospreys have a Leinster style period of dominace and play champagne style rugby. The crowds will stay the same. [/quote]

Spot on BV add ....The Liberty is soulless... . The O's have had no real success .. Many once rugby folk now have season tickets to the Swans...as you say the talk is about the Swans...

This conversation has come up a lot of times, and I know the old St Helens ground isnt suitable and is (was when I left) in a poor state, but it feels right in the middle of Swansea, even if it is probably not much less of a walk from the station than the Liberty stadium, which is just sort of plonked right down in the corner of a retail park

I'd love the Ospreys to move back to a redeveloped St. Helens. Just move the pitch 50 or so yards down the mumbles rd so it doesn't interfere with the cricket and you could fit a 12-14k seater in.

Breadvan wrote:I'd love the Ospreys to move back to a redeveloped St. Helens. Just move the pitch 50 or so yards down the mumbles rd so it doesn't interfere with the cricket and you could fit a 12-14k seater in.

Breadvan I wouldn't, that would put us back playing in one of the Club team grounds, do you honestly think former Neath, Bridgend and Aberavon fans going to St. Helens to support the Ospreys, I doubt it would even be called that, some part of Swansea would be in the name, NO that is not the way forward IMO.

Purely selfish reasons for me tho We definitely need our own place. Especially when the lib is expanded. Something like Sales ground...