Pacquiao ppv

Rumours are Manny v Vargas had low numbers. It was supposedly around 200k.

Is he not a big star anymore? Did his reputation get hit after the mega fight?

Maybe it's his racist comments?

Imo I think it is because he is over the hill and people don't care anymore.

He still is good and brings some excitement, but it is plain to see he is a shadow of the monster, of a few years back.

Any wonder he wants Floyd back. If he doesn't get the rematch, I expect him to look for Canelo, or even Khan.

I know you guys on here don't care about numbers, but it does reflect on a fighters popularity.

Manny needs to stop ducking the welterweights if he's staying at 47 or go to 40 or even lower for Terence or Lomachenko two very good fights

I agree about Crawford. If he wants to continue, he needs to fight good fighters, THAT can punch.

Manny is trying to con the public by fighting low risk champions, that don't have a dig.

Maybe Manny was just as much to blame for his fight with Floyd not happening sooner

Maybe we owe Floyd something of an apology

I wouldn't say we owe any of them an apology, it's our own fault as we keep buying the tripe that's served up and therefore why do they need to fight the best?

As i've said before he either has to fight the best in the division or retire gracefully, the longer he stays and fights sub par opposition (for him) the more of a hit his reputation will take, especially with those that didn't rate him (wrongly) in the first place

Derbymanc wrote:I wouldn't say we owe any of them an apology, it's our own fault as we keep buying the tripe that's served up and therefore why do they need to fight the best?

As i've said before he either has to fight the best in the division or retire gracefully, the longer he stays and fights sub par opposition (for him) the more of a hit his reputation will take, especially with those that didn't rate him (wrongly) in the first place

Agreed my man.

I don't want to see great fighters become hasbeens.

Derbymanc wrote:I wouldn't say we owe any of them an apology, it's our own fault as we keep buying the tripe that's served up and therefore why do they need to fight the best?

As i've said before he either has to fight the best in the division or retire gracefully, the longer he stays and fights sub par opposition (for him) the more of a hit his reputation will take, especially with those that didn't rate him (wrongly) in the first place

Manny can do whatever he wants for as long as he wants, he earned that right, same with Floyd

I'll buy it

Sad reality is that 200k will still be better than the Ward vs Kovalev numbers

See I wonder how much the fight does in PPV revenue if there were no illegal streams about, probably a lot more

BoxingFan88 wrote:

Derbymanc wrote:I wouldn't say we owe any of them an apology, it's our own fault as we keep buying the tripe that's served up and therefore why do they need to fight the best?

As i've said before he either has to fight the best in the division or retire gracefully, the longer he stays and fights sub par opposition (for him) the more of a hit his reputation will take, especially with those that didn't rate him (wrongly) in the first place

By subpar opposition you mean top 10 welterweights?

So you want him to fight popular fighters who are in the top 10 instead, or show that he is still the best at this advanced age?

He wants him to fight the best Welters. We don't want to see him fight Vargas, similar to Floyd fighting Berto types.

Either fight the best guys, or retire.

AdamT wrote:

BoxingFan88 wrote:

Derbymanc wrote:I wouldn't say we owe any of them an apology, it's our own fault as we keep buying the tripe that's served up and therefore why do they need to fight the best?

As i've said before he either has to fight the best in the division or retire gracefully, the longer he stays and fights sub par opposition (for him) the more of a hit his reputation will take, especially with those that didn't rate him (wrongly) in the first place

By subpar opposition you mean top 10 welterweights?

So you want him to fight popular fighters who are in the top 10 instead, or show that he is still the best at this advanced age?

He wants him to fight the best Welters. We don't want to see him fight Vargas, similar to Floyd fighting Berto types.

Either fight the best guys, or retire.

That's the thing though, the guys around now ARE Vargas level, there is no super star challenger right now

Thurman lost to Porter imo

Brook beat Porter so maybe him

Garcia hasn't even beat a welterweight

So Porter, Brook

Spence is a prospect

We are talking about "names" rather than ability then

I want him to show that he's still the best at his age BF, if not then i'd rather he bowed out of the sport at the top of his game and be remembered NOW as one of the best rather than tarnishing his legacy.

And yes I mean top 10 welterweights, if we're going to tell people he's STILL great now then he needs to be fighting top 3 for me. we all know in this day and age, the rankings are manipulated like nobody's business (still chuckle over the dead boxer being moved UP the ranks) so it has to be top 3 to say he's still one of if not the best.

And as Adam has said the same applies to Floyd fighting Berto types in my eyes, a complete waste of time

Thurman and Brook would beat the snot out of Vargas. It was a soft option and you know it.

Yep this isn't solely a dig at Manny. I have no interest in Floyd fighting soft touches either. I would prefer him to stay retired unless he fights top guys.

Derbymanc wrote:I want him to show that he's still the best at his age BF, if not then i'd rather he bowed out of the sport at the top of his game and be remembered NOW as one of the best rather than tarnishing his legacy.

And yes I mean top 10 welterweights, if we're going to tell people he's STILL great now then he needs to be fighting top 3 for me. we all know in this day and age, the rankings are manipulated like nobody's business (still chuckle over the dead boxer being moved UP the ranks) so it has to be top 3 to say he's still one of if not the best.

And as Adam has said the same applies to Floyd fighting Berto types in my eyes, a complete waste of time

Yeah sorry mate, I misread you and I agree with you, I changed it

I want to see Crawford, that's a style similar to Floyd, see if he learned anything

Contrary to popular belief, Manny does learn from his mistakes

I would gladly watch Crawford vs Manny.

AdamT wrote:Thurman and Brook would beat the snot out of Vargas. It was a soft option and you know it.

They would, but so did Manny

Out of those two, Brook is the only one I see even giving Manny a good fight

Thurman would have major major problems

AdamT wrote:I would gladly watch Crawford vs Manny.

As would I

If Floyd came back against Porter, or Thurman

But Welterweight is rebuilding now, its not what it was 5 years ago

If Floyd fought those two, he would get blasted. People want to see Floyd fight GGG.

It's ok for Manny to fight gimmes. Not Floyd!

AdamT wrote:If Floyd fought those two, he would get blasted. People want to see Floyd fight GGG.

It's ok for Manny to fight gimmes. Not Floyd!

Only haters think Floyd should fight GGG

Its a stupid idea

BoxingFan88 wrote:

AdamT wrote:If Floyd fought those two, he would get blasted. People want to see Floyd fight GGG.

It's ok for Manny to fight gimmes. Not Floyd!

Only haters think Floyd should fight GGG

Its a stupid idea

Mate this forum is far from the worst, but it's 90% haters. I have gave him abuse, when he deserves it. Problem is, when I back him up I am a Flomo, or some other silly name.

You have the Milky types and even Hammersmith (my best friend) who say it like it is and also Chris. I guess you do too.

Banter is fine, but anyone who continuously blasts the two best fighters of the generation, has some issues and show maybe watch something else.

Though the truth is, they are probably really fans underneath and love watching them fight like any real boxing fan should.

AdamT wrote:

BoxingFan88 wrote:

AdamT wrote:If Floyd fought those two, he would get blasted. People want to see Floyd fight GGG.

It's ok for Manny to fight gimmes. Not Floyd!

Only haters think Floyd should fight GGG

Its a stupid idea

Mate this forum is far from the worst, but it's 90% haters. I have gave him abuse, when he deserves it. Problem is, when I back him up I am a Flomo, or some other silly name.

You have the Milky types and even Hammersmith (my best friend) who say it like it is and also Chris. I guess you do too.

Banter is fine, but anyone who continuously blasts the two best fighters of the generation, has some issues and show maybe watch something else.

Though the truth is, they are probably really fans underneath and love watching them fight like any real boxing fan should.

Very good points

I'm a boxing fan, I do have my favourites that I am heavily biased towards (Cotto, Marquez, Donaire)

By far Pacquiao and Floyd are the best of my generation, no one else comes close to those guys

Most of the boxing community is 90% haters, either for one guy or the other, its not just isolated to here

Believe it or not I used to believe what Pacquiao haters said (Sort of being one) not because of him, but because his fan club was so damn annoying, so I have been on that side of the fence. Also because I was new to boxing so had to try to learn and unfortunately the haters were who I learned off to begin with

Pacquiao was apparently a left hand happy guy who had no boxing skill

Except when I started watching Pacquiao and understand his style, I realised that was utter garbage, its especially obvious now that he is less active

So I sort of know how they think, because I used to be one of them

I think it's sport in general. Similar to Messi and Ronaldo. Or maybe Federer, Novak and Nadal.

All great sportsmen have haters. They always say, you are never truly great, until enough jealous losers hate you.

Not saying everyone should like Floyd or Manny, but spouting nonsense like, 'they're not top 20-30 and all past greats beat them,' is absolutely pathetic.

If their eyes worked, they could see the level these two guys operate at. Look what Manny did to Cotto. Look what Floyd did to Corrales.

Just two examples of top, top, elite fighters looking great.

I do like them both, but always believed Floyd was a tiny bit better, so backed him.

I think Marquez and Cotto are also amazing fighters.

Nothing more to add mate great post!

I don't think Floyd would of beat him 6 years ago. I used to think he would, but I think Manny would of been a bit much then.

AdamT wrote:I don't think Floyd would of beat him 6 years ago. I used to think he would, but I think Manny would of been a bit much then.

Maybe,

He also might have been liable to walk into a right hand

Naw the ferocity and the angles would of been too much.

Floyd might of landed some clean counters, but he would have to be more aggressive and put himself in harms way, similar to JMM.

Pac wins with a couple of knock downs.

The rematch might of been different, but for me, Pac would of won all them years ago.

I have mentioned it before.

AdamT wrote:I think it's sport in general. Similar to Messi and Ronaldo. Or maybe Federer, Novak and Nadal.

All great sportsmen have haters. They always say, you are never truly great, until enough jealous losers hate you.

Not saying everyone should like Floyd or Manny, but spouting nonsense like, 'they're not top 20-30 and all past greats beat them,' is absolutely pathetic.

If their eyes worked, they could see the level these two guys operate at. Look what Manny did to Cotto.  Look what Floyd did to Corrales.

Just two examples of top, top, elite fighters looking great.

I do like them both, but always believed Floyd was a tiny bit better, so backed him.

I think Marquez and Cotto are also amazing fighters.

If posters do not think these 2 are top 20-30, then they're entitled to their opinion just like you are to yours. Doesn't make their opinions 'absolutely pathetic'.

It does in my eyes. Especially when they pick every old fighter to beat them.

AdamT wrote:It does in my eyes. Especially when they pick every old fighter to beat them.

Nostalgia is a wonderful thing and sometimes blinds people

No one has an easy night with either of them in their respective primes

The amount of times we incorrectly predict fights shows that WDKSAB

AdamT wrote:Naw the ferocity and the angles would of been too much.

Floyd might of landed some clean counters, but he would have to be more aggressive and put himself in harms way, similar to JMM.

Pac wins with a couple of knock downs.

The rematch might of been different, but for me, Pac would of won all them years ago.

I have mentioned it before.

Not going to argue with that, I also think Floyd slipped a hell of a lot when he fought Manny as well

Not saying Floyd WOULD of lost for sure. I think what I know now, Manny has slipped a little more.

Did I see Lomachenko mentioned as a possible fight for Pacquiao, they only operate three divisions apart after all.

Yeah Pacquiao moves down loma moves up 2

Don't see it tbh

BoxingFan88 wrote:

AdamT wrote:

BoxingFan88 wrote:

AdamT wrote:If Floyd fought those two, he would get blasted. People want to see Floyd fight GGG.

It's ok for Manny to fight gimmes. Not Floyd!

Only haters think Floyd should fight GGG

Its a stupid idea

Mate this forum is far from the worst, but it's 90% haters. I have gave him abuse, when he deserves it. Problem is, when I back him up I am a Flomo, or some other silly name.

You have the Milky types and even Hammersmith (my best friend) who say it like it is and also Chris. I guess you do too.

Banter is fine, but anyone who continuously blasts the two best fighters of the generation, has some issues and show maybe watch something else.

Though the truth is, they are probably really fans underneath and love watching them fight like any real boxing fan should.

Very good points

I'm a boxing fan, I do have my favourites that I am heavily biased towards (Cotto, Marquez, Donaire)

By far Pacquiao and Floyd are the best of my generation, no one else comes close to those guys

Most of the boxing community is 90% haters, either for one guy or the other, its not just isolated to here

Believe it or not I used to believe what Pacquiao haters said (Sort of being one) not because of him, but because his fan club was so damn annoying, so I have been on that side of the fence. Also because I was new to boxing so had to try to learn and unfortunately the haters were who I learned off to begin with

Pacquiao was apparently a left hand happy guy who had no boxing skill

Except when I started watching Pacquiao and understand his style, I realised that was utter garbage, its especially obvious now that he is less active

So I sort of know how they think, because I used to be one of them

I echo the sentiment that Pac is just not given the credit he deserves BF. Been watching him since 2003 and as I remember back then, he was just breaking through as a hardcore favourite and the highest I recall Roach saying he felt Manny could go was 135 - Which gives you an idea of just how much he's ultimately gone above and beyond - achievement wise.

But what perhaps tends to go the least acknowledged is the fact that, for over 10 years, Pac has solely fought on the road, with American refs and judges, most of the time. He is literally thousands and thousands of miles away and always has to acclimatise, yet that is just taken for granted by many of his detractors. Even Macau is over 2000 miles from his homeland! For me, this is one of the reasons why I don't feel comfortable ( nor do I agree) to simply place Floyd higher on the ATG list - Seeing a fighter deliver on the world stage, on multiple occasions, whilst being far from his home country is a consideration that people need to take into account. But with Floyd, and Andre Ward, just last weekend, it's something where we have no way of knowing how they'd cope and ultimately perform. I can't stress enough how much that should be considered.

Also, Pac has had a lot more fights than Floyd and, had Mayweather turned pro at 16, and clocked up the same total, it's doubtful he'd be 67 - 0 , put it that way. As for the Spences, Thurmans and Garcias of this world, does anyone seriously think they will come close to 70 fights by the time they are ready to retire?? Even then, could they fight and win at world-level by that stage?? Highly doubtful.... This another reason as to why I don't read too much into undefeated records, particularly if the fighter has never succesfully fought in several international bouts. But I digress.

Good point actually, Manny always fights on the road that is often overlooked Floyd always at home buzzing his nuts off on lidocaine

Completely disagree with the 'fighting away' ballcox that gets spewed. Manny could have stayed a home fighter in his own country if he wanted, problem is that the money isn't there which is why he didn't. why should any fighter go and fight where they'll earn less just because some fans don't like them.

IF Manny hadn't fought so much in the US then i'd agree but he has and it's not like he touched down and went straight to fight, he (and others) had enough time to acclimitize etc etc.

He's still underappreciated though and he will be until he retires and we see what we're missing

Manny gets a lot of love and fan support in the US so maybe that's overblown

What is perhaps less often factored in is Floyd's use of lidocaine. An injection of that before a fight is just like an amphetamine rush a huge ped imo

Herman Jaeger wrote:Manny gets a lot of love and fan support in the US so maybe that's overblown

What is perhaps less often factored in is Floyd's use of lidocaine. An injection of that before a fight is just like an amphetamine rush a huge ped imo

Do you live under a bridge??? TROLLLLLL!!!

I still don't think it's the same - fighting that far away from home, regardless of how much fans love you or not or how long you've had to adjust. You aren't going to be as comfortable as you'd be at home, with your own countrymen as Judges and Referee... Also, Manny still had to go 12,000 miles away from home (initially and every time thereafter) and execute everything correctly. I just don't see why that should be taken for granted.

Put it this way, if it were such a non-factor, why don't Floyd or Ward do it, just to prove they are as good as those they want to share the company of on the ATG list? Ali, Hagler, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, McCallum, etc. ALL fought internationally and it's undeniable that it lends their resumes more flexibility.

Yes I live under a bridge if you say so..

Lidocaine can sharpen the reactions just like amphetamine so yes I class it as a ped

Yeah i'm not 100 percent certain that the scared of needles tatoo covered pacman is 100 percent clean either. Although I prefer the method of just assuming they're all at it as nothing gets done either way

No doubt it needs to be commended Manny fighting away from home

Love to have seen that Ward Kovalev fight in Russia

No way Ward wins that one

Still an easy win for Ward, unless of course all you like seeing is someone stomping forward in straight lines all night

After the knockdown crowd in Russia would have gone beserk

Sergy'd be buzzing, Ward wouldn't have survived the third..

As I said, he'd just sidestep (like he did) and jab his way to victory as the homecrowd gets as upset as Kov looked in the 11th

You mean hit and hold his way to victory

And by side step you mean move around the ring a lot

Marlonz wrote:I still don't think it's the same - fighting that far away from home, regardless of how much fans love you or not or how long you've had to adjust. You aren't going to be as comfortable as you'd be at home, with your own countrymen as Judges and Referee... Also, Manny still had to go 12,000 miles away from home (initially and every time thereafter) and execute everything correctly. I just don't see why that should be taken for granted.

Put it this way, if it were such a non-factor, why don't Floyd or Ward do it, just to prove they are as good as those they want to share the company of on the ATG list? Ali, Hagler, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, McCallum, etc. ALL fought internationally and it's undeniable that it lends their resumes more flexibility.

Been a few old faces on here this week. Good to see you dropping by Marlon. Trust all is well fella.

Marlonz wrote:
Put it this way, if it were such a non-factor, why don't Floyd or Ward do it, just to prove they are as good as those they want to share the company of on the ATG list? Ali, Hagler, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, McCallum, etc. ALL fought internationally and it's undeniable that it lends their resumes more flexibility.

Ali went where the money was, if someone offered him enough he'd fight in a car park in front of nobody and the others all did the same, too much is made of being a road warrior. Hagler fought Minter in the UK hardly a big deal, Hearns had no significant fights outside America whilst Leonard fought in Montreal as he won Olympic gold there.

Hey BF, nah i mean hit and make his opponent miss, and by sidestep i mean exactly that. Kov walks forward in a straight line, Ward sidesteps out of the way. Boxing 101

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Marlonz wrote:
Put it this way, if it were such a non-factor, why don't Floyd or Ward do it, just to prove they are as good as those they want to share the company of on the ATG list? Ali, Hagler, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, McCallum, etc. ALL fought internationally and it's undeniable that it lends their resumes more flexibility.

Ali went where the money was, if someone offered him enough he'd fight in a car park in front of nobody and the others all did the same, too much is made of being a road warrior. Hagler fought Minter in the UK hardly a big deal, Hearns had no significant fights outside America whilst Leonard fought in Montreal as he won Olympic gold there.

The point is that they did it though, and we have no way of knowing how those who haven't would fare. As for Hagler, I'd say it was a big deal seeing as he was subjected to a barrage of racism - both from Minter himself and the crowd during and after the fight - that's my point, he went through that and still executed to win the world titles. Something Ward and Mayweather have never done and you need to take the consideration that goes with that.

milkyboy wrote:

Marlonz wrote:I still don't think it's the same - fighting that far away from home, regardless of how much fans love you or not or how long you've had to adjust. You aren't going to be as comfortable as you'd be at home, with your own countrymen as Judges and Referee... Also, Manny still had to go 12,000 miles away from home (initially and every time thereafter) and execute everything correctly. I just don't see why that should be taken for granted.

Put it this way, if it were such a non-factor, why don't Floyd or Ward do it, just to prove they are as good as those they want to share the company of on the ATG list? Ali, Hagler, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, McCallum, etc. ALL fought internationally and it's undeniable that it lends their resumes more flexibility.

Been a few old faces on here this week. Good to see you dropping by Marlon. Trust all is well fella.

Ha ha! hey there Milky! Yeah, I'm a blast from the past!...
As for me, I'm slowly recovering from the Flu! Hope you're doing better than me mate!