Newport Gwent Dragons 2016/17 thread

[Luckless Pedestrian]

First topic message reminder :

I understand that some players haven't had a break for a while, but still, either it's a must-win game (with a bonus point) or it isn't.

[Stone Motif]

Until they sort out the transport infrastructure it would be a nightmare for 'home' and away fans.

Why ?

They are directly linked to the A465 and they have decent train and bus stations. There is plenty of parking, I agree that the ground is not up to standard, but that can be worked on. People seriously need to understand that life does go on outside the cities, and that there are decent transport links in the valleys. There would be no difference to Dragons being put in Ebbw Vale if the ground is brought up to standard as what we are doing now by having Scarlets based in Llanelli.

Except much lower density of people, much poorer transport infrastructure and much lower land values

[LordDowlais]

They'd have to pick up EXP for less than a mil. But glad to see you understand ownership us key now, any time you want to refute your earlier rants you go ahead.

Stone I have always understood it. You just got all in a huff because I questioned how Dragons manged to secure funding for the Bisley terrace, yet no funding to fix the playing surface. But hey ho, that's all in the past now. Either way, Dragons are going to need a place to play, and when they get it, it will need to have work done whether it's at RP or anywhere else in Wales.

[Guest]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Yes. Interesting comments from the WRU. The WRU don't come across like they're really up for taking over the Dragons. They don't seem enthusiastic that they have this great opportunity to get their own regional side that they can mould and do what they want with it (I appreciate the potential down sides to this from a fans perspective). By saying they're not getting involved, not going to try to influence anyone, that they're not going to try to sell the concept, give the fans and shareholder the info about what they plan to do, etc. they're coming across very half ars*d. Does make me consider my earlier comment from last week that I wonder whether deep down they know the shareholders will reject it, they want them to reject it because really they just want to be seen to be doing all they can, but in reality they want to do something else somewhere else. Maybe paranoia on my part. But put some f*cking enthusiasm into it, WRU. See the concept if you're really keen on making this work.

[LordDowlais]

Until they sort out the transport infrastructure it would be a nightmare for 'home' and away fans.

Why ?

They are directly linked to the A465 and they have decent train and bus stations. There is plenty of parking, I agree that the ground is not up to standard, but that can be worked on. People seriously need to understand that life does go on outside the cities, and that there are decent transport links in the valleys. There would be no difference to Dragons being put in Ebbw Vale if the ground is brought up to standard as what we are doing now by having Scarlets based in Llanelli.

Except much lower density of people, much poorer transport infrastructure and much lower land values

Sorry you are wrong.

Llanelli and Ebbw Vale have roughly the same population, 33,000 to 35,000. Then when you take into account how populated the surrounding area's are, Llanelli is nowhere near as densely populated as Ebbw Vale and the surrounding areas. How do you reckon that Ebbw Vale has poorer transport infrastructure than Ebbw Vale ? How you explain this should be good. There is not much difference to the M4 in that area than there is to the new A465 up in Ebbw Vale. Unless you have been living under a rock for the past 15 years, you would now that the whole A465 has been ripped up and re-structured for the new duelling project. In fact, it is the same as the M4 is around Llanelli to Camarthen.

People's ignorance to anything north of the M4 is astonishing.

[Stone Motif]

They'd have to pick up EXP for less than a mil. But glad to see you understand ownership us key now, any time you want to refute your earlier rants you go ahead.

Stone I have always understood it. You just got all in a huff because I questioned how Dragons manged to secure funding for the Bisley terrace, yet no funding to fix the playing surface. But hey ho, that's all in the past now. Either way, Dragons are going to need a place to play, and when they get it, it will need to have work done whether it's at RP or anywhere else in Wales.

Clearly you didn't understand it so don't shift the goalposts. You claimed that the lack of investment equated a lack of ambition, largely because Neither Council, awash in EU money garnered from being the biggest hole in Europe, would invest in a ground they could secure money against but NCC wouldn't invest in a ground they couldn't.

There is nowhere in Wales that can sustain pro rugby beyond the four where it currently exists. Even then it is marginal without a much better TV deal. If the Dragons go we are down to three or three plus an investment- shorn development region akin to Connacht circa 2003-9

[LordDowlais]

There is nowhere in Wales that can sustain pro rugby beyond the four where it currently exists. Even then it is marginal without a much better TV deal. If the Dragons go we are down to three or three plus an investment- shorn development region akin to Connacht circa 2003-9

Sorry I do not agree. If Llanelli can sustain a pro rugby team, then there are plenty of other areas that can as well.

[Stone Motif]

Until they sort out the transport infrastructure it would be a nightmare for 'home' and away fans.

Why ?

They are directly linked to the A465 and they have decent train and bus stations. There is plenty of parking, I agree that the ground is not up to standard, but that can be worked on. People seriously need to understand that life does go on outside the cities, and that there are decent transport links in the valleys. There would be no difference to Dragons being put in Ebbw Vale if the ground is brought up to standard as what we are doing now by having Scarlets based in Llanelli.

Except much lower density of people, much poorer transport infrastructure and much lower land values

Sorry you are wrong.

Llanelli and Ebbw Vale have roughly the same population, 33,000 to 35,000. Then when you take into account how populated the surrounding area's are, Llanelli is nowhere near as densely populated as Ebbw Vale and the surrounding areas. How do you reckon that Ebbw Vale has poorer transport infrastructure than Ebbw Vale ? How you explain this should be good. There is not much difference to the M4 in that area than there is to the new A465 up in Ebbw Vale. Unless you have been living under a rock for the past 15 years, you would now that the whole A465 has been ripped up and re-structured for the new duelling project. In fact, it is the same as the M4 is around Llanelli to Camarthen.

People's ignorance to anything north of the M4 is astonishing.

The infrastructure is better but the ignorance is yours if you think that the Heads of the Valleys equates to a motorway, and that's before we get into Newport having the third busiest rail interchange in the country from whence you can be in London in under two hours . So yeah, exactly the same. That's why here's exactly the same population and density of jobs etc in Ebbw Vale as there is in Newport .

Llanelli is a one off sustained by a crazy amount of private investment, situated in a rural area hat has always supoorted the town rugby team. I see you've decided not to try and compare Newport Swansea and Cardiff in terms of density. I suppose these are exactly the same as Ebbw as well.

[Stone Motif]

There is nowhere in Wales that can sustain pro rugby beyond the four where it currently exists. Even then it is marginal without a much better TV deal. If the Dragons go we are down to three or three plus an investment- shorn development region akin to Connacht circa 2003-9

Sorry I do not agree. If Llanelli can sustain a pro rugby team, then there are plenty of other areas that can as well.

OK why did Ebbw's benefactors and Samuels jack and run then? Because unlike you, they realised that the valleys cannot support pro sport.

[munkian]

Until they sort out the transport infrastructure it would be a nightmare for 'home' and away fans.

Why ?

They are directly linked to the A465 and they have decent train and bus stations. There is plenty of parking, I agree that the ground is not up to standard, but that can be worked on. People seriously need to understand that life does go on outside the cities, and that there are decent transport links in the valleys. There would be no difference to Dragons being put in Ebbw Vale if the ground is brought up to standard as what we are doing now by having Scarlets based in Llanelli.

Its well over an hour on the bus from Newport for example and its hardly a double decker plus most of them aren't a direct journey.

Trains to Ebbw Vale from Newport are over an hour and you have to change in Cardiff. Its then a 40 min walk from Ebbw Parkway.

There isn't 'plenty of parking' for 5k plus fans.

[Stone Motif]

Only an imbecile could have lived in south Wales(fitting carpets and revolutionising rainwater management man and boy for nearly forty years) and not notice you can travel east to west very easily in Wales but going north to south is a nightmare.

[munkian]

Only an imbecile could have lived in south Wales(fitting carpets and revolutionising rainwater management man and boy for nearly forty years) and not notice you can travel east to west very easily in Wales but going north to south is a nightmare.

This. If its an early KO then you have little chance of making it from work in the South if you are driving and zero chance if you need to use public transport.

[Stone Motif]

It's almost like there's enormous geographical constraints that have shaped movement and settlement patterns for centuries isn't it?

[munkian]

It's almost like there's enormous geographical constraints that have shaped movement and settlement patterns for centuries isn't it?

Thats crazy talk.

[LordDowlais]

The infrastructure is better but the ignorance is yours if you think that the Heads of the Valleys equates to a motorway, and that's before we get into Newport having the third busiest rail interchange in the country from whence you can be in London in under two hours . So yeah, exactly the same. That's why here's exactly the same population and density of jobs etc in Ebbw Vale as there is in Newport .

You need to take a look at the A465 and the M4 around Camarthen. They are both dual carriageway. Whats the difference ? Also, why would I need my train station to have a direct line to London to be able to support my region ?

Llanelli is a one off sustained by a crazy amount of private investment, situated in a rural area hat has always supoorted the town rugby team. I see you've decided not to try and compare Newport Swansea and Cardiff in terms of density. I suppose these are exactly the same as Ebbw as well.

Why would I compare a moderately sized town to a city ? I am comparing apples with apples. Ebbw is nowhere near as suitable as any of the cities for a region. But, if Llanelli can sustain a pro rugby team, then by the same model, so could Ebbw Vale, or any other larger town in Wales.

[Cardiff Dave]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Some interesting comments in this and other related articles.

Why wouldn't Hazell sell to a private investor but he will to the WRU is the big question. They know what the sodding ground is worth, they've got too much money tied up and in it.

Collusion?

[Stone Motif]

It's almost like there's enormous geographical constraints that have shaped movement and settlement patterns for centuries isn't it?

Thats crazy talk.

I see the Cardiff Capital Region are showing a lack of ambition and hiving off £750m of their city Deal money to build the metro and link the valleys to the coastal growth areas. If only there were a local transport expert on call who could explain to them that this is a lunacy, as the valleys are perfectly well connected oases of economic boom and the money should go to the moribund, declining cities instead.

[Cardiff Dave]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Yes.  Interesting comments from the WRU.  The WRU don't come across like they're really up for taking over the Dragons.  They don't seem enthusiastic that they have this great opportunity to get their own regional side that they can mould and do what they want with it (I appreciate the potential down sides to this from a fans perspective).  By saying they're not getting involved, not going to try to influence anyone, that they're not going to try to sell the concept, give the fans and shareholder the info about what they plan to do, etc. they're coming across very half ars*d.  Does make me consider my earlier comment from last week that I wonder whether deep down they know the shareholders will reject it, they want them to reject it because really they just want to be seen to be doing all they can, but in reality they want to do something else somewhere else.  Maybe paranoia on my part.  But put some f*cking enthusiasm into it, WRU.  See the concept if you're really keen on making this work.

Crossed my mind too and they're doing a fine job of cheesing off the shareholders. Wonder what'll be in the info pack?

[Cardiff Dave]

It's almost like there's enormous geographical constraints that have shaped movement and settlement patterns for centuries isn't it?

Fecking valleys!

[Stone Motif]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Some interesting comments in this and other related articles.

Why wouldn't Hazell sell to a private investor but he will to the WRU is the big question. They know what the sodding ground is worth, they've got too much money tied up and in it.

Collusion?

Wonder if the WRU loan is being used as a lever to force central control.

[XR]

Trains to Ebbw Vale from Newport are over an hour and you have to change in Cardiff. Its then a 40 min walk from Ebbw Parkway.

Sorry for being picky but you can technically get a direct train from Newport to ebbw vale, trains from pye corner are on the ebbw line. If you went from Newport to Cardiff and then on to ebbw vale, you're wasting time. Just get on at pye corner.

[Stone Motif]

Trains to Ebbw Vale from Newport are over an hour and you have to change in Cardiff. Its then a 40 min walk from Ebbw Parkway.

Sorry for being picky but you can technically get a direct train from Newport to ebbw vale, trains from pye corner are on the ebbw line.   If you went from Newport to Cardiff and then on to ebbw vale, you're wasting time. Just get on at pye corner.

I'd love to see a thousand people turn up there and all try getting on a train at once mind

[munkian]

Trains to Ebbw Vale from Newport are over an hour and you have to change in Cardiff. Its then a 40 min walk from Ebbw Parkway.

Sorry for being picky but you can technically get a direct train from Newport to ebbw vale, trains from pye corner are on the ebbw line.   If you went from Newport to Cardiff and then on to ebbw vale, you're wasting time. Just get on at pye corner.

Pye Corner not exactly central either.

And yeah - I can't see it being more than two carriages.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

I wish it was spelt Pie Corner.

[mikey_dragon]

Only an imbecile could have lived in south Wales(fitting carpets and revolutionising rainwater management man and boy for nearly forty years) and not notice you can travel east to west very easily in Wales but going north to south is a nightmare.

[mikey_dragon]

I've driven by Pye Corner. It can't be much given its location. There is another station at afon village in Rogerstone. That used to have trains from Ebbw that go to Cardiff but again it wasn't a big train station, it was like one platform.

[Cardiff Dave]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Some interesting comments in this and other related articles.

Why wouldn't Hazell sell to a private investor but he will to the WRU is the big question. They know what the sodding ground is worth, they've got too much money tied up and in it.

Collusion?

Wonder if the WRU loan is being used as a lever to force central control.

Dunno, but i'm sure they want Dave whatever.
Has anyone answered that big question yet btw? Be interesting to know also who these investors waiting in the wings are, if the WRU do takeover.

[munkian]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Some interesting comments in this and other related articles.

Why wouldn't Hazell sell to a private investor but he will to the WRU is the big question. They know what the sodding ground is worth, they've got too much money tied up and in it.

Collusion?

Wonder if the WRU loan is being used as a lever to force central control.

Dunno, but i'm sure they want Dave whatever.
Has anyone answered that big question yet btw? Be interesting to know also who these investors waiting in the wings are, if the WRU do takeover.

I thought the idea was the WRU were going to get the Dave and the team up to scratch over the next 3-4 years before looking for private investment ?

[Cardiff Dave]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Some interesting comments in this and other related articles.

Why wouldn't Hazell sell to a private investor but he will to the WRU is the big question. They know what the sodding ground is worth, they've got too much money tied up and in it.

Collusion?

Wonder if the WRU loan is being used as a lever to force central control.

Dunno, but i'm sure they want Dave whatever.
Has anyone answered that big question yet btw? Be interesting to know also who these investors waiting in the wings are, if the WRU do takeover.

I thought the idea was the WRU were going to get the Dave and the team up to scratch over the next 3-4 years before looking for private investment ?

Read it on twitter. Think it was Hazells mate. Also....

"Talks are still ongoing between the WRU, the region and potential external investors."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/39274402

[munkian]

That was back on the 14th mind.

[Cardiff Dave]

That was back on the 14th mind.

I know. Anything changed then?

[mikey_dragon]

On another note, what is the deal with Halfpenny? Was it the WRU, or Mr Holland's lack of ambition as some would put it?

[Cardiff Dave]

On another note, what is the deal with Halfpenny? Was it the WRU, or Mr Holland's lack of ambition as some would put it?

Dunno and what's Holland's ambition got to do with anything? The organ grinder decides.
Anyway, back to the main subject of this thread....

[mikey_dragon]

On another note, what is the deal with Halfpenny? Was it the WRU, or Mr Holland's lack of ambition as some would put it?

Dunno and what's Holland's ambition got to do with anything? The organ grinder decides.
Anyway, back to the main subject of this thread....

Good question.

[Cardiff Dave]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/15190214.CHRIS_KIRWAN__WRU_s_leading_duo_must_not_take_backseat_in_takeover_debate/

Good article from Kirwan as per

Some interesting comments in this and other related articles.

Why wouldn't Hazell sell to a private investor but he will to the WRU is the big question. They know what the sodding ground is worth, they've got too much money tied up and in it.

Collusion?

Wonder if the WRU loan is being used as a lever to force central control.

Dunno, but i'm sure they want Dave whatever.
Has anyone answered that big question yet btw? Be interesting to know also who these investors waiting in the wings are, if the WRU do takeover.

I thought the idea was the WRU were going to get the Dave and the team up to scratch over the next 3-4 years before looking for private investment ?

Why would they wait 3-4 years? Sooner the better, shewerly.
Reckon they wouldn't do much to Dave other than lay a plastic pitch which could be rolled up at a later date, as required, if you get my drift. Not sure what you mean by getting the team up to scratch. I'm guessing cash. Lots of it.

[Guest]

'Over the next 3-4 years' does mean starting now, Dave. You can't just buy a load of players and expect them to be a good team from day one. The development of the team, if it's done, would start soon but would take 3-4 years.

[Stone Motif]

'Over the next 3-4 years' does mean starting now, Dave. You can't just buy a load of players and expect them to be a good team from day one. The development of the team, if it's done, would start soon but would take 3-4 years.

Starting from a very low point as well. I don't think there's one aspect of the game we're consistently even average at, anything good comes as a result of individual talent. Coaching team needs an overhaul and we need an entirely new pack plus replacements. This on top of ground improvements already highlighted. Then there's the pace as Griff says, all this improvement needs to take place relative to other teams improvements with zero prospect of additional competition monies.

[Cardiff Dave]

'Over the next 3-4 years' does mean starting now, Dave. You can't just buy a load of players and expect them to be a good team from day one. The development of the team, if it's done, would start soon but would take 3-4 years.

Meant to add, "before looking for private investment".
Should be looking everyday for this kinda thing.

[Cardiff Dave]

Curious tweet yesterday regarding a proposed £1.2m of "private investment" last year. Looks like FoNR are looking into it. Could be nowt, could be something. Worth following up I spose.

[Stone Motif]

On a plus note, fantastic to see Swansea and Cardiff can't make it as far as us jokers in the losers cup

[Cardiff Dave]

On a plus note, fantastic to see Swansea and Cardiff can't make it as far as us jokers in the losers cup

Chokers and jokers. Tiz the Welsh way.

[munkian]

Dragons > Blues

[Luckless Pedestrian]

On a plus note, fantastic to see Swansea and Cardiff can't make it as far as us jokers in the losers cup

It'll go back to being a rubbish tournament now.

[Stone Motif]

On a plus note, fantastic to see Swansea and Cardiff can't make it as far as us jokers in the losers cup

Chokers and jokers. Tiz the Welsh way.

You can add flat track bullies where Swansea are concerned. What an utterly sh1t team they are without AWJ willing them along.

[Stone Motif]

Turk's're showing total lack of ambition by signing two of our rejects - GRJ choosing to stand on his now two feet a few miles further west gets a yay from me.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

It does amuse me how some cast-offs are magically less cast-offish than others.

[Cardiff Dave]

Turk's're showing total lack of ambition by signing two of our rejects - GRJ choosing to stand on his now two feet a few miles further west gets a yay from me.

Both Welsh, boxes ticked etc.

[mikey_dragon]

Thank god. Can we also do a swap; Knoyle for Evans?

[Cardiff Dave]

FoNR agm this evening, isn't it? Wonder if anybody attending will have some inside info to share.

[munkian]

FoNR agm this evening, isn't it? Wonder if anybody attending will have some inside info to share.

NEWPORT RFC & NEWPORT GWENT DRAGONS STATEMENT
By Newport RFC | 05/04/2017
It is likely that the meeting will be held in the second week of May, with a date to be finalised shortly. Aside from the formal circular and notices, there will be an extensive Question and Answer information sheet that addresses a number of matters arising from initial meetings. Whilst it is targeted at shareholders, all information will also be placed on the websites of Newport RFC and Newport Gwent Dragons, given the wider interest that exists.

[Cardiff Dave]

FoNR agm this evening, isn't it? Wonder if anybody attending will have some inside info to share.

NEWPORT RFC & NEWPORT GWENT DRAGONS STATEMENT
By Newport RFC | 05/04/2017
It is likely that the meeting will be held in the second week of May, with a date to be finalised shortly. Aside from the formal circular and notices, there will be an extensive Question and Answer information sheet that addresses a number of matters arising from initial meetings. Whilst it is targeted at shareholders, all information will also be placed on the websites of Newport RFC and Newport Gwent Dragons, given the wider interest that exists.

Qs cherry picked by the board, I spose.

Still find it all incredible. Maybe it's not a good idea to own your own ground these days. Also wonder if Dave has been utilised to its full potential, I wonder.

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