Crusaders v British & Irish Lions, 10 June

Crusaders v British & Irish Lions
10 June 2017
KO: 19:35 NZST (8.35am BST)
Rugby League Park, Christchurch

Live on Sky Sports, Sky Sports HD and SkyGo

Referee: Mathieu Raynal (France)
Touch judges: [tbc]
TMO: [tbc]

A. FORM:

2 June 1993: Canterbury 10 - 28 British & Irish Lions

28 June 1983: Canterbury 22 - 20 British & Irish Lions

25 June 1977: Canterbury 13 - 14 British & Irish Lions

B. TEAMS:

Crusaders
I Dagg, S Tamanivalu, J Goodhue, D Havili, G Bridge, R Mo'unga, B Hall, J Moody, C Taylor, O Franks, L Romano, S Whitelock (capt), H Bedwell-Curtis, M Todd, J Taufua.

Replacements: B Funnell, W Crockett, M Alaalatoa, Q Strange, J Brown, M Drummond, M Hunt, T Bateman.

British & Irish Lions
S Hogg; G North, J Davies; B Te'o, L Williams; O Farrell; C Murray; M Vunipola, J George, T Furlong; AW Jones (capt), G Kruis; P O'Mahony, S O'Brien, T Faletau

Replacements: K Owens, J McGrath, D Cole, M Itoje, CJ Stander, R Webb, J Sexton, A Watson

C. PREVIEW

This is the easy warm up game, right?!

Lots of French refs officiating during this tour, plus Gardner (Aus) and Peyper (SA).

Makes me think, are there no Argentinian refs close to the elite level?

1.Vunipola 2.George 3.Furlong 4. 5.Kruis 6.O'Mahony 7.O'Brien 8.
9.Murray 10.Farrell 11.North 12. 13.Davies 14.Williams 15.

Those must be penned in given that they haven't had a start yet.

Positional changes for those players could happen though. Sexton 10, Farrell 12? Liam Williams at full back? O'Mahony at 8 to accommodate Warburton getting another start?

1.Vunipola 2.George 3.Furlong 4.AWJ 5.Kruis 6.O'Mahony 7.O'Brien 8.Faletau
9.Murray 10.Sexton 11.North 12.Farrell 13.Davies 14.Williams 15.Hogg

16.Best 17.McGrath 18.Cole 19.Itoje 20.Warburton 21.Webb 22.Te'o 23.Daly

I'd like to see something such as above. I'm interested to see the George-Kruis line-out axis, they've been successful for England and Sarries. Vunipola-George-Furlong gives 3 excellent ball carriers in the front row too.

Farrell at 12 feels unlikely but given how toothless the Lions backline has looked I'd enjoy seeing a different shape.

Is O'Brien going to be fit? Otherwise there's room for Warburton and Faletau, with O'Brien possibly playing later in the tour?

There's a real chance for the players playing to lay the marker. Another loss and the pressure will really start to build.

robbo277 wrote:Is O'Brien going to be fit? Otherwise there's room for Warburton and Faletau, with O'Brien possibly playing later in the tour?

There's a real chance for the players playing to lay the marker. Another loss and the pressure will really start to build.

Tipuric was good today. Assuming Warburton plays whatever, is there room for him?

Gatland will give Warburton every chance, but if Gatland is being honest then Warburton would have to be playing better than Tipuric to get the final nod for the first test.

I think Warburton will play the Saders and the Maori and Tipuric will play against the Highlanders. Then Gatland will make a decision for the first test.

Saders are certainly right up there with best club sides in the world. Comparisons across different club leagues are very difficult given the difference in opposition, conditions, ref interpretations, etc. The rugby Saders have produced at their best has been very impressive though. Certainly better than you'd see in a fair few international games.

A simple way to think about the scale of task the Lions have for Saturday is to ask whether they are performing anywhere near the level that the best Champions Cup sides have this season?

Personally I think the tripe thrown up so far has been a hell of a lot below what the likes of Sarries or Clermont (to take the ERCC final) have produced. A few more sides could be added to that if you took their best form - certainly Scarlets, Exeter, Wasps, Munster, Leinster and La Rochelle.

Hopefully the improvements come soon.

With Best out of the reckoning it'll be interesting which hooker stakes his claim.

Owens was good today, but George has his chance to get to number 1 against the Crusaders.

Crusaders

1. Joe Moody
2. Codie Taylor
3. Owen Franks
4. Luke Romano
5. Sam Whitelock (c)
6. Heiden Bedwell-Curtis
7. Matt Todd (vc)
8. Jordan Taufua
9. Bryn Hall
10. Richie Mo'unga
11. George Bridge
12. David Havili
13. Jack Goodhue
14. Seta Tamanivalu
15. Israel Dagg.

Reserves:
16. Ben Funnell
17. Wyatt Crockett
18. Michael Alaalatoa
19. Quinten Strange
20. Jed Brown
21. Mitchell Drummond
22. Mitchell Hunt
23. Tim Bateman.

http://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/93474780/lions-tour-seven-all-blacks-named-in-crusaders-squad-to-take-on-lions

British & Irish Lions (v Crusaders, Saturday, June 10, AMI Stadium, 7.35pm NZST/8.35am BST)

15 Stuart Hogg – Glasgow Warriors, Scotland, 783
14 George North – Northampton Saints, Wales, #792
13 Jonathan Davies – Scarlets, Wales, #778
12 Ben Te’o – Worcester Warriors, England, #815
11 Liam Williams – Scarlets, Wales, #832
10 Owen Farrell – Saracens, England, #780
9 Conor Murray – Munster, Ireland, #790

1 Mako Vunipola – Saracens, England, #787
2 Jamie George – Saracens, England, #818
3 Tadhg Furlong – Leinster, Ireland, #817
4 Alun Wyn Jones (capt) – Ospreys, Wales, #761
5 George Kruis – Saracens, England, #819
6 Peter O’Mahony – Munster, Ireland, #833
7 Sean O’Brien – Leinster, Ireland, #796
8 Taulupe Faletau – Bath Rugby, Wales, #779

Replacements
16 Ken Owens – Scarlets, Wales, #829
17 Jack McGrath – Leinster, Ireland, #827
18 Dan Cole – Leicester, England, #794
19 Maro Itoje – Saracens, England, #825
20 CJ Stander – Munster, Ireland, #831
21 Rhys Webb – Ospreys, Wales, #820
22 Johnny Sexton – Leinster, Ireland, #791
23 Anthony Watson – Bath Rugby, England, #816

I'm.amazed no warbuton on the bench - especially since CJ will be pretty beaten up after 80 minutes yesterday.

Assuming he's been kept for the Maori that'll only be 2 games before the first test.

That is a beastly pack with most of our big ball carriers. I'm not convinced that centre pairing will help our problems in the wide channels though

Has Jones captained the Lions before?

aucklandlaurie wrote:Has Jones captained the Lions before?

He was captain in the 3rd test last time

Wings will have to rely on second/third phase possession from Farrell.

Wonder if we will get a captain from the other 3 nations this tour.

RDW_Scotland wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:Has Jones captained the Lions before?

He was captain in the 3rd test last time

 I have no intention to criticise Jones or the other two captains so far on tour, but I cant help but observe that leadership and direction is something that Gatland will have to address sooner or later.

Scottrf wrote:Wonder if we will get a captain from the other 3 nations this tour.

Why does that matter ? They are all Lions.

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Wonder if we will get a captain from the other 3 nations this tour.

Why does that matter ? They are all Lions.

Team cohesion, perception of fairness etc

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Wonder if we will get a captain from the other 3 nations this tour.

Why does that matter ? They are all Lions.

Team cohesion, perception of fairness etc

I'm sure the actual players are less childish than some of the fans and it doesn't really affect them.

You don't think they care about having a chance to captain the Lions?

king_carlos wrote:Saders are certainly right up there with best club sides in the world. Comparisons across different club leagues are very difficult given the difference in opposition, conditions, ref interpretations, etc. The rugby Saders have produced at their best has been very impressive though. Certainly better than you'd see in a fair few international games.

A simple way to think about the scale of task the Lions have for Saturday is to ask whether they are performing anywhere near the level that the best Champions Cup sides have this season?

Personally I think the tripe thrown up so far has been a hell of a lot below what the likes of Sarries or Clermont (to take the ERCC final) have produced. A few more sides could be added to that if you took their best form - certainly Scarlets, Exeter, Wasps, Munster, Leinster and La Rochelle.

Hopefully the improvements come soon.

Well of course. What did you expect?

The team on Wednesday had yet again never played with each other before. Some of the lads will have only met each other 7 days prior. And, even with an error ridden performance we still could have snatched it at the end.

No doubting we need to improve to be ready for the tests, but no need to press the panic button yet.

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:Wonder if we will get a captain from the other 3 nations this tour.

Why does that matter ? They are all Lions.

They are all equal, but some seem to be more equal than others...

Scottrf wrote:You don't think they care about having a chance to captain the Lions?

No, I think the chances are remote if they haven't any previous experience at a professional level or shown they are capable.

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:You don't think they care about having a chance to captain the Lions?

No, I think the chances are remote if they haven't any previous experience at a professional level or shown they are capable.

That just shows your ignorance. POM is Munster captain.

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm.amazed no warbuton on the bench - especially since CJ will be pretty beaten up after 80 minutes yesterday.

Assuming he's been kept for the Maori that'll only be 2 games before the first test.

That is a beastly pack with most of our big ball carriers. I'm not convinced that centre pairing will help our problems in the wide channels though

That's because Warburton, as captain, will starting the first test come what may. I know Gatland said otherwise, but I don't believe him.

This looks like a likely test team already for me.

The midfield does look a little one dimensional. I'd like to swap either Te'o for Henshaw (who impressed me with his kicking game on Wed) or Davies for JJ (who is the best gamebreaker we have in the centres). I think Te'o/JJ or Henshaw/Daves are two better balanced pairings.

Beyond that, we will probably see Warburton come in on the openside, Owens for George, and Halfpenny at FB.

Still a way to go yet mind...

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:You don't think they care about having a chance to captain the Lions?

No, I think the chances are remote if they haven't any previous experience at a professional level or shown they are capable.

That just shows your ignorance. POM is Munster captain.

Nope, just shows yours, it's his first game for the Lions and he didn't exactly cover himself in glory for his last game for Munster did he ?

cascough wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm.amazed no warbuton on the bench - especially since CJ will be pretty beaten up after 80 minutes yesterday.

Assuming he's been kept for the Maori that'll only be 2 games before the first test.

That is a beastly pack with most of our big ball carriers. I'm not convinced that centre pairing will help our problems in the wide channels though

That's because Warburton, as captain, will starting the first test come what may. I know Gatland said otherwise, but I don't believe him.

This looks like a likely test team already for me.

The midfield does look a little one dimensional. I'd like to swap either Te'o for Henshaw (who impressed me with his kicking game on Wed) or Davies for JJ (who is the best gamebreaker we have in the centres). I think Te'o/JJ or Henshaw/Daves are two better balanced pairings.

Beyond that, we will probably see Warburton come in on the openside, Owens for George, and Halfpenny at FB.

Still a way to go yet mind...

Davies is great form - did you not see his last game in the final ?

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:You don't think they care about having a chance to captain the Lions?

No, I think the chances are remote if they haven't any previous experience at a professional level or shown they are capable.

That just shows your ignorance. POM is Munster captain.

Nope, just shows yours, it's his first game for the Lions and he didn't exactly cover himself in glory for his last game for Munster did he ?

Not his first game for the Lions. Are you even following the tour?

munkian wrote:

cascough wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm.amazed no warbuton on the bench - especially since CJ will be pretty beaten up after 80 minutes yesterday.

Assuming he's been kept for the Maori that'll only be 2 games before the first test.

That is a beastly pack with most of our big ball carriers. I'm not convinced that centre pairing will help our problems in the wide channels though

That's because Warburton, as captain, will starting the first test come what may. I know Gatland said otherwise, but I don't believe him.

This looks like a likely test team already for me.

The midfield does look a little one dimensional. I'd like to swap either Te'o for Henshaw (who impressed me with his kicking game on Wed) or Davies for JJ (who is the best gamebreaker we have in the centres). I think Te'o/JJ or Henshaw/Daves are two better balanced pairings.

Beyond that, we will probably see Warburton come in on the openside, Owens for George, and Halfpenny at FB.

Still a way to go yet mind...

Davies is great form  - did you not see his last game in the final ?

Doesn't mean he wouldn't be better outside Henshaw than Te'o mind.

Hogg excepted this is an impressively Warrenball selection. Whether the pack is good enough for Warrenball to win against what's probably the best club pack (albeit missing Read & S Barrett) in the world is another story

Yes. But I haven't said he isn't

I'm not saying I want to see him out of the test team. I'm merely expressing my opinion that a Te'o/JJ pairing or a Henshaw/Davies pairing is better balanced than the Te'o/Davies pairing.

It's not a preference for individuals, it's a preference for combinations.

cascough wrote:Yes. But I haven't said he isn't

I'm not saying I want to see him out of the test team. I'm merely expressing my opinion that a Te'o/JJ pairing or a Henshaw/Davies pairing is better balanced than the Te'o/Davies pairing.

It's not a preference for individuals, it's a preference for combinations.

Fair enough, but as JD has learned how to pass again I don't think him with Teo is that bad a combo.

munkian wrote:

cascough wrote:Yes. But I haven't said he isn't

I'm not saying I want to see him out of the test team. I'm merely expressing my opinion that a Te'o/JJ pairing or a Henshaw/Davies pairing is better balanced than the Te'o/Davies pairing.

It's not a preference for individuals, it's a preference for combinations.

Fair enough, but as JD has learned how to pass again I don't think him with Teo is that bad a combo.

He's had 2 nearly weeks with Howley to have that Pivac nonsense drummed out of him mind

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

munkian wrote:

Scottrf wrote:You don't think they care about having a chance to captain the Lions?

No, I think the chances are remote if they haven't any previous experience at a professional level or shown they are capable.

That just shows your ignorance. POM is Munster captain.

Nope, just shows yours, it's his first game for the Lions and he didn't exactly cover himself in glory for his last game for Munster did he ?

Not his first game for the Lions. Are you even following the tour?

Ok, so he didn't impress for his first Lions game and he hasn't impressed for Munster recently. Are you suggesting he actually should be Captain or using him as some sort of point ?

I was countering your incorrect 'chances are remote point'. Bored of your flip flopping. Agree to disagree.

Scottrf wrote:I was countering your incorrect 'chances are remote point'. Bored of your flip flopping. Agree to disagree.

So you were just arguing for argument's sake. Righty o. Off you pop.

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

munkian wrote:

cascough wrote:Yes. But I haven't said he isn't

I'm not saying I want to see him out of the test team. I'm merely expressing my opinion that a Te'o/JJ pairing or a Henshaw/Davies pairing is better balanced than the Te'o/Davies pairing.

It's not a preference for individuals, it's a preference for combinations.

Fair enough, but as JD has learned how to pass again I don't think him with Teo is that bad a combo.

He's had 2 nearly weeks with Howley to have that Pivac nonsense drummed out of him mind

Passing is over rated, what he's been focusing on (along with all the backs) is mauling. Now 80 mins of mauls interrupted by scrums, that is rugby!

yappysnap wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

munkian wrote:

cascough wrote:Yes. But I haven't said he isn't

I'm not saying I want to see him out of the test team. I'm merely expressing my opinion that a Te'o/JJ pairing or a Henshaw/Davies pairing is better balanced than the Te'o/Davies pairing.

It's not a preference for individuals, it's a preference for combinations.

Fair enough, but as JD has learned how to pass again I don't think him with Teo is that bad a combo.

He's had 2 nearly weeks with Howley to have that Pivac nonsense drummed out of him mind

Passing is over rated, what he's been focusing on (along with all the backs) is mauling. Now 80 mins of mauls interrupted by scrums, that is rugby!

Let's not forget the apparent Howley tactic of running head first into people over and over again - that will have taken weeks of training!

Not sure that this is the best place to put this, but hey ho. If we had to pick the test team from the showing in the first two games, who would make up the 15? In other words, who are the Lions team v Crusaders trying to displace for a test spot? Still early days though I appreciate. Here's my take so far:

Hogg/Halfpenny - mistakes from both. Different but neither better in their game?
Watson
? None really showing anything.
T'eo
Seymour?
Farrell
Webb
McGrath
Owens
Cole
Lawes
Kruis
Moriaty
Tipuric
Faletau

Have they been the best (or least worst!) so far?

It's the backs that are more difficult to choose from I feel.

My pick on form from two games:

McGrath Owens Cole
Lawes Itoje
Moriarty Tipuric Faletau
Webb Farrell
Seymour Te'o Joseph? Watson
Halfpenny

What is clear is that there's no stand out 13 - big chance for JD2 to stake a claim this weekend.

I wouldn't rule JJ out of it though - you rely a lot on those around you at 13 and he was hardly given much of an opportunity in the Barbarians game.

RDW_Scotland wrote:What is clear is that there's no stand out 13 - big chance for JD2 to stake a claim this weekend.

I wouldn't rule JJ out of it though - you rely a lot on those around you at 13 and he was hardly given much of an opportunity in the Barbarians game.

That's why I picked him. Didn't really make mistakes and did well to take one awful pass.

Yeah, Joseph was my pick pre-tournament.  I wouldn't have taken Davies on tour a few months back, but in fairness he has been in excellent form at the end of the season and Pivac has him playing some lovely rugby (passing, offloading, stepping, try scoring, etc.).  Just hope he's not directed to do differently now!

That looks more like a Test match Lions side to me now.

If that back three cannot score tries we are fecked.

I think that would probably have been Gatland's preferred backs lineup before the tour (maybe Halfpenny). Our strongest lineup so far, but also the toughest challenge.

Scottrf wrote:I think that would probably have been Gatland's preferred backs lineup before the tour (maybe Halfpenny). Our strongest lineup so far, but also the toughest challenge.

I agree, it definitely looks like a test backline to me.

George Carlin wrote:That looks more like a Test match Lions side to me now.

If that back three cannot score tries we are fecked.

They are only going to score tries if the centres pass them the ball. Hopefully JD2 will stay in Scarlet's mode for the game and do just that. If not, all may be lost.

There's been a real lack of strike moves from the backs. I really want to see the backs engineer a position to have North galloping into space at pace with Hogg on his shoulder. A first phase move to really build some confidence in the backs!

Yet another Welsh Captain!

So I guess will be playing the Welsh way again.

Really hope this is the last we see of Gatland on a Lions Tour.

Could put North at 13 if Davies doesn't play well