Welsh Derby Weekend

Cardiff Blues v Dragons

Friday 6th October

Referee: Nigel Owens (WRU, 156th competition game)
AR1: Dan Jones (WRU). AR2: Adam Jones (WRU)
TMO: Tim Hayes (WRU)
BBC2 Wales: 7.30pm


Cardiff Blues: R Williams, A Cuthbert, R Lee-Lo, W Halaholo, T James, J Evans, L Williams (captain), B Thyer, K Dacey, T Filise, S Davies, D Welch, J Navidi, O Robinson, N Williams. Replacements: M Rees, C Domachowski, K Assiratti, G Earle, J Turnbull, T Williams, S Shingler, M Morgan.

Dragons: H Amos, A Hewitt, T Morgan, J Dixon, J Rosser, G Henson, S Pretorius, B Harris, E Dee, L Brown, M Screech, C Hill (captain), J Thomas, O Griffiths, J Benjamin. Replacements: L Belcher, L Garrett, L Fairbrother, J Davies, A Wainwright, O Leonard, A O'Brien, W Talbot-Davies.


Ospreys v Scarlets

Saturday 7th October

Referee: John Lacey (IRFU, 65th competition game)
AR1: Dan Jones (WRU). AR2: Joy Neville (IRFU)
TMO: Olly Hodges (IRFU)
S4C: 7.20pm


15 Dan Evans, 14 Cory Allen, 13 Kieron Fonotia, 12 James Hook, 11 Jeff Hassler, 10 Dan Biggar, 9 Rhys Webb;

1 Nicky Smith, 2 Scott Otten, 3 Ma’afu Fia, 4 Bradley Davies, 5 Alun Wyn Jones (captain), 6 Dan Lydiate, 7 Olly Cracknell, 8 James King.

Bench:

16 Sam Parry, 17 Paul James, 18 Dmitri Arhip, 19 Lloyd Ashley, 20 Dan Baker, 21 Tom Habberfield, 22 Sam Davies, 23 Owen Watkin.


Scarlets:


15 Leigh Halfpenny, 14 Johnny Mcnicholl, 13 Jonathan Davies, 12 Hadleigh Parkes, 11 Steff Evans, 10 Rhys Patchell, 9 Gareth Davies;

1 Wyn Jones, 2 Ken Owens (captain), 3 Samson Lee, 4 Jake Ball, 5 Lewis Rawlins, 6 Aaron Shingler, 7 Will Boyde, 8 Tadhg Beirne.

Bench:

Ryan Elias, Dylan Evans, Werner Kruger, David Bulbring, Josh Macleod, Aled Davies, Paul Asquith, Scott Williams.



There's plenty to discuss ahead of the derby games this weekend.

Both of the homes sides have struggled so far this season, and the visiting sides would love to make matters worse for them. The Scarlets are setting the pace for the other regional sides, while the Dragons need to start winning games away from home to show they're making real progress under Bernard Jackman.

How do we see things going?

Bernard Jackman on the Blues:


"I am expecting a big performance from them – they are not going to rate us highly. They can't. They are not going to be afraid of us.

"We need to make sure we pitch up and perform. Look at the talent they have. They've got 426 caps in their squad, we have 98.

"They have four times as many caps and if getting capped is a good test of your quality, well then they should beat us by four times the score.

"If you look at their player budget and the amount of caps they have, they will be hot favourites. It's just reality. We are away from home as well."


http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/dragons/15570309.Jackman__I_won__39_t_rush_to_cover_Dragons__39__injury_crisis_with_others__39__discards/

I agreed with what Bernard was saying when I read about it and I still do now. Shame we aren't allowed to play Blacker in this. A few of our injuries like Landman, Warren and Charlie Davies are possibly fit for us. Hopefully Amos and Hewitt are too.

Used to look forward to the West Wales derby but glad I'm missing this one tbh. Even in the past if the Scarlets were the form team you could see the Ospreys raising their game and winning, but we're so devoid of confidence and anything resembling a cohesive unit, turks will have bp before half time. Glad I'm out of the country

Does anyone have experience of watching/streaming these games from overseas?

Breadvan wrote:Used to look forward to the West Wales derby but glad I'm missing this one tbh. Even in the past if the Scarlets were the form team you could see the Ospreys raising their game and winning, but we're so devoid of confidence and anything resembling a cohesive unit, turks will have bp before half time. Glad I'm out of the country

Funny I usually feel confident going into the Ospreys games, but this time I am almost dreading it. I can't shake the feeling that the wheels are going to come off in this game and itll send us into a it of a tail spin (like the Euro semi for the Ospreys last season). If the Ospreys hadn't lost their last few, or if our defence was more solid last week I may have been a bit more positive.

I don't think the Scarlets will be complacent though. The players will know that their defence wasn't great against Connacht - they said as much after the game - and you'd think the coaches will know that Connacht's defence wasn't up to much either.

I've updated the OP with the referee appointments.

SS, you've got nothing to worry about mate. The teams are so far apart in skill level, tactics, coaching, man management and the basics, Scarlets will walk this. Not even a big crowd will pull the Ospreys through there such is the divide in the support.

Cardiff XV v WRU XIX.
Evens it up I guess.

Cardiff Dave wrote:NotCardiffsoontobeWRU XV v WRUGwent XIX.
Evens it up I guess.

Fixed

munkian wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:NotCardiffsoontobeWRU XV v WRUGwent XIX.
Evens it up I guess.

Fixed

Ewe mischief-making?

Cardiff Dave wrote:

munkian wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:NotCardiffsoontobeWRU XV v WRUGwent XIX.
Evens it up I guess.

Fixed

Ewe mischief-making?

Only as much as you clart

Amos and Hewitt both passed fit

Cardiff Blues: R Williams, A Cuthbert, R Lee-Lo, W Halaholo, T James, J Evans, L Williams (captain), B Thyer, K Dacey, T Filise, S Davies, D Welch, J Navidi, O Robinson, N Williams. Replacements: M Rees, C Domachowski, K Assiratti, G Earle, J Turnbull, T Williams, S Shingler, M Morgan.

Dragons: H Amos, A Hewitt, T Morgan, J Dixon, J Rosser, G Henson, S Pretorius, B Harris, E Dee, L Brown, M Screech, C Hill (captain), J Thomas, O Griffiths, J Benjamin. Replacements: L Belcher, L Garrett, L Fairbrother, J Davies, A Wainwright, O Leonard, A O'Brien, W Talbot-Davies.

'ave it. Nothing on the bench though

'The Gwent region have lost their last 25 away games in the competition since winning at Treviso in March, 2015 and have not beaten a fellow Welsh region since they visited the Arms Park and beat the Blues in December 2014.'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/41475198

Both miserable runs we could do with ending tomorrow. But I'm never that hopeful when we're on the road.

The Blues haven't been great this season, but that would only make it worse if they won.

Some Blues fans on twitter are losing their poopie over our injury 'mindgames'

Bless em

I reckon it'll be close. Just a few points in it.

My prediction: Blues 25-27 Dragons

I think we'll either win or get bummed.

munkian wrote:Some Blues  fans on twitter are losing their poopie over our injury 'mindgames'

Bless em

I saw that. As far as I can see, the only players involved on Friday who were on that injury list are Amos and Hewitt, who were never ruled out of contention for this game. So that barely counts as mind games.

Oh, and Jared Rosser.

There is going to be carnage in Welsh rugby this weekend. Scarlets I would imagine will be on a bonus point within 20/30 mins.

I do not know about the other game though, two poor sides, bereft of confidence, full of injuries, it could be like two bald men fighting over a comb. Or it could be a good game between two poor sides, on results this season though, I will plump for Cardiff.

I will be at the CAP tomorrow night, never miss these games, but I might take my turn to drive, so I can then hurry everyone along when the game finishes and get home.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

munkian wrote:Some Blues  fans on twitter are losing their poopie over our injury 'mindgames'

Bless em

I saw that. As far as I can see, the only players involved on Friday who were on that injury list are Amos and Hewitt, who were never ruled out of contention for this game. So that barely counts as mind games.

Oh, and Jared Rosser.

Amos and Hewitt were clearly injured last week and our bench does back up there was a problem too. Blouse fans must be pretty twitchy about this game.

You can understand it if they are. They haven't won at home yet and the last thing they want is for us to end our away-day / derby losing streak at the Arms Park.

I wonder if Martyn Williams will say 'there's only one team winning this' before the game like he did in 2014

LordDowlais wrote:There is going to be carnage in Welsh rugby this weekend. Scarlets I would imagine will be on a bonus point within 20/30 mins.

I do not know about the other game though, two poor sides, bereft of confidence, full of injuries, it could be like two bald men fighting over a comb. Or it could be a good game between two poor sides, on results this season though, I will plump for Cardiff.

I will be at the CAP tomorrow night, never miss these games, but I might take my turn to drive, so I can then hurry everyone along when the game finishes and get home.

I wouldn't say Dragons or their fans are bereft of confidence ?

munkian wrote:I wouldn't say Dragons or their fans are bereft of confidence ?

I'm glad you are confident munk.

Ospreys:


15 Dan Evans, 14 Cory Allen, 13 Kieron Fonotia, 12 James Hook, 11 Jeff Hassler, 10 Dan Biggar, 9 Rhys Webb;

1 Nicky Smith, 2 Scott Otten, 3 Ma’afu Fia, 4 Bradley Davies, 5 Alun Wyn Jones (captain), 6 Dan Lydiate, 7 Olly Cracknell, 8 James King.

Bench:

16 Sam Parry, 17 Paul James, 18 Dmitri Arhip, 19 Lloyd Ashley, 20 Dan Baker, 21 Tom Habberfield, 22 Sam Davies, 23 Owen Watkin.


Scarlets:


15 Leigh Halfpenny, 14 Johnny Mcnicholl, 13 Jonathan Davies, 12 Hadleigh Parkes, 11 Steff Evans, 10 Rhys Patchell, 9 Gareth Davies;

1 Wyn Jones, 2 Ken Owens (captain), 3 Samson Lee, 4 Jake Ball, 5 Lewis Rawlins, 6 Aaron Shingler, 7 Will Boyde, 8 Tadhg Beirne.

Bench:

Ryan Elias, Dylan Evans, Werner Kruger, David Bulbring, Josh Macleod, Aled Davies, Paul Asquith, Scott Williams.

Hewitt and Rosser out. Amos late fitness test. Least the Blouse can relax now, that there were no mind games.

Warren and Gasson start.

Hope it doesn't come down to benches, but what a half.

Was worried when we drew the sin bin period.

Smashed, in the the end.

That was a great game, blues really pulled their finger out in the second half. But the dragons played some superb rugby in the first half, shame they didn't have a decent bench.

Dragons backline looking very classy.

Jarrod Evans looking very comfortable this season, Seb Davies should keep his place in the test team this autumn.

I really enjoyed that last night, great game cracking atmosphere, reminded me of the old days.

Right, now I'm off to Bargoed for the afternoon. Come on MERTHYR.

LordDowlais wrote:I really enjoyed that last night, great game cracking atmosphere, reminded me of the old days.

Right, now I'm off to Bargoed for the afternoon. Come on MERTHYR.

A good match like last nights will hopefully inspire today’s games too.

Breadvan wrote: SS, you've got nothing to worry about mate. The teams are so far apart in skill level, tactics, coaching, man management and the basics, Scarlets will walk this. Not even a big crowd will pull the Ospreys through there such is the divide in the support.

We shall see.

I don’t think the pride and fight has left the Ospreys. They will be a wounded animal, and we may well be a bit up ourselves and over confident.

Flip me that was way too close for comfort. Personally I think Rhys Webb may be looking for something to do for the next 6-8 weeks though.

Good win. Tense game. Typical derby I suppose. Ospreys didn't create much or anything at all from memory. Scarlets getting over the line a number of times, creating something from the smallest of opportunities as they have a knack of doing lately. Thought Steff Evans was great again. So spontaneous and creates a lot. But in the end it was a close game perhaps due to Scarlets indiscipline? Ospreys only looked like scoring from penalties really so if they'd kept their discipline I think it would have been a much more comfortable win (as in less close). 

Was rooting for the Scarlets so glad they won (always had a soft spot for them and consider them my 2nd team!). 

Do you really think Webb will be cited for the elbow, SS? Is that what you mean? Thought he might have been penalised for it but felt it was probably low end as it was more of a glancing blow (not sure it connected at all really) during the scuffle. Handbags really.

Griff, I saw two punches and an elbow (accusations of a gouge too), but I’m will admit that disputed throwing a full pint across the room at the time, I am slightly tipsy right now

Also add the 11pts that were of radar from the tee it wasn’t so close.  I don’t like using the L word (league) but a fan of that code told me the Ospreys play like it’s alway tackle one, the Scarlets like it’s akways tackle 5/6

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Also add the 11pts that were of radar from the tee it wasn’t so close.  I don’t like using the L word (league) but a fan of that code told me the Ospreys play like it’s alway tackle one, the Scarlets like it’s akways tackle 5/6

Taxi for Spiderman

The Ospreys started the season at 12/1, dark horses to lift the title. Before this evening's result they were 66/1. After 6 games they have 6 points, the least of any team in the Pro14 with the exception of the Kings. Add to this they are losing Webb and Biggar at the end of the season and it is astounding. I cannot fathom what is going on at the Ospreys right now.

If they don’t replace their coaching team now they never will.

Coaching team schmoaching team. They're a crap tram carried by a few very good players. Take them out and they are awful.

Artful_Dodger wrote:The Ospreys started the season at 12/1, dark horses to lift the title.  Before this evening's result they were 66/1.  After 6 games they have 6 points, the least of any team in the Pro14 with the exception of the Kings.  Add to this they are losing Webb and Biggar at the end of the season and it is astounding.  I cannot fathom what is going on at the Ospreys right now.

Ditto Cardiff.

We only like having one decent region at a time in Wales! Used to be the Ospreys but they've now handed the reins over to the Scarlets so have decided to lower their standards so as not to steal the Scarlets' limelight

munkian wrote: I think we'll either win or get bummed.

Well...I wont that one