James Haskell - open for offers (is the start of the end of French galacticoism?)

According to Auntie, James Haskell (age 26) is a free agent.

Who'll have him?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/13696098.stm

Full report reads:

"No decisions have been made as yet," the source told BBC Sport.

"He's had expressions of interest from clubs from all over the world - Italy, Ireland, Australia - but it was only confirmed he was leaving on Tuesday, until then he was still a Stade Francais player.

"We couldn't really say it came as a shock but it was not an ongoing process James was aware of. Each week they were saying 'we want you to stay' and offering him a contract, so it was all rather confusing, all done in a very Gallic fashion.

"All the players and everyone involved with the club said what a wonderfully committed player he was and that they're all very sad to see him go. But there was the financial impact and they've had to release a lot of players."

As well as the 26-year-old Haskell, Stade have parted company with Ollie Phillips, Hugo Southwell, Arnaud Marchois, Noel Oelschig, Juan Leguizamon and Mauro Bergamasco.

Haskell, who joined Stade from Wasps in 2009, will join up with England next week and his short-term goal is to make manager Martin Johnson's 30-man squad for this autumn's World Cup in New Zealand.

The source added: "He loved his time in Paris, enjoyed his rugby and his rugby benefited from it, as evidenced by his performances in the Six Nations. He felt his time there wasn't quite finished but now England is his priority."

Haskell's contract included the option of a third year but he was aware that his international future could be affected by his choice of club: after the World Cup, England will pick players who are based outside the country only in exceptional circumstances.

Not the end of French galaticoism, Stade are just broke because they've been unsuccessful. A business plan that depended on winning European Cups, TOP14s and happy thoughts doesn't play too well in the bottom half of the league

Notch wrote:Not the end of French galaticoism, Stade are just broke because they've been unsuccessful. A business plan that depended on winning European Cups, TOP14s and happy thoughts doesn't play too well in the bottom half of the league

Sort of begins to qualify my view ofthe unsustainable model of the T14.

That's why England should have central contracts - and a lower wage cap ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A85079668 )

Kingdoms rise, kingdoms fall. Unsustainable and bad for the game? Yes. Will it continue to happen? Yes it will.

Interesting to see where he lands. If England, would he go back to Wasps? I don't think so. Certainly his French 'vacation' has helped him ramp up his play to be very good. In the 6N, he was not the big lunkhead I was used to see. Bath, Gloucester, Pirates, and Sale would be teams which could use him straight away.

Now we know that James Haskell has left Stade Francais but where is he going.

The BBC have done a page on this - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/13696098.stm - wont replicate the whole thing but there are two paragraphs that are interesting:

""He's had expressions of interest from clubs from all over the world - Italy, Ireland, Australia - but it was only confirmed he was leaving on Tuesday, until then he was still a Stade Francais player."


So a Irish Club is in for him - who?

The second part I want to highlight is this one:

"The source added: "He loved his time in Paris, enjoyed his rugby and his rugby benefited from it, as evidenced by his performances in the Six Nations. He felt his time there wasn't quite finished but now England is his priority."

Haskell's contract included the option of a third year but he was aware that his international future could be affected by his choice of club: after the World Cup, England will pick players who are based outside the country only in exceptional circumstances"


Do these two paragraphs hint that he will only go to an English club despite the attention of Italy, Ireland and Australia? If so, where do you think he will go?

Let us know your thoughts on where you think he will end up and which "Irish" club you think has approached him.

Hobo wrote:Let us know your thoughts on where you think he will end up and which "Irish" club you think has approached him.

They only Irish provinces that could have approached him are Munster and Connacht. However I doubt its either of them. Munster need to keep their last non Irish space for a centre and Connacht don't have the means to do it. Leinster and Ulster can't sign any more foreign players. I suspect London Irish is the Irish club.

Really hope that Bergamasco can be lured back to Italy.

red_stag wrote:

Hobo wrote:Let us know your thoughts on where you think he will end up and which "Irish" club you think has approached him.

They only Irish provinces that could have approached him are Munster and Connacht. However I doubt its either of them. Munster need to keep their last non Irish space for a centre and Connacht don't have the means to do it. Leinster and Ulster can't sign any more foreign players. I suspect London Irish is the Irish club.

Clontarf? Bective?

Boyne, you know the BBC use clubs as another name for the provinces. I do myself from time to time.

The Italian teams get extra money from the F.I.R. to bring in Italian players so there's certainly the incentive to do so. However, it's whether the Italian players overseas see playing for Aironi or Treviso as a step down after the heady heights of the Top 14 or English Prem, plus whether the Italian Clubs could afford them. However, I remember seeing somewhere that the Italian clubs are pretty well off in terms of player budget with a figure of around 8 million Euros per annum being bandied about.

Bergamasco would be a great signing for one of the Italian teams.

The Italian teams get extra money from the F.I.R. to bring in Italian players so there's certainly the incentive to do so. However, it's whether the Italian players overseas see playing for Aironi or Treviso as a step down after the heady heights of the Top 14 or English Prem, plus whether the Italian Clubs could afford them. However, I remember seeing somewhere that the Italian clubs are pretty well off in terms of player budget with a figure of around 8 million Euros per annum being bandied about.

Bergamasco would be a great signing for one of the Italian teams.

Haskell is in cloud cuckoo land. Who is this Irish club which is interested in signing him? I hope Ulster aren't interested in him. He wouldn't get on the bench at Leinster and he's not really a Munster type player, so I'm guessing it must Connacht?

Bath might be an option, Geech connection again, did they get on?

Moody, Taylor and Beattie are getting on a bit he would get ahead of Taylor and Beattie in the pecking order IMO althought to be honest I'm not sure which is his best position?.

But would Bath want him?

BATH_BTGOG wrote:Bath might be an option, Geech connection again, did they get on?

Moody, Taylor and Beattie are getting on a bit he would get ahead of Taylor and Beattie in the pecking order IMO althought to be honest I'm not sure which is his best position?.

But would Bath want him?

Is that maybe the brand's main problem, does he even know his best position? And where would that leave Fearns?

Hobo wrote:Now we know that James Haskell has left Stade Francais but where is he going.

The BBC have done a page on this - http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/13696098.stm - wont replicate the whole thing but there are two paragraphs that are interesting:

""He's had expressions of interest from clubs from all over the world - Italy, Ireland, Australia - but it was only confirmed he was leaving on Tuesday, until then he was still a Stade Francais player."


So a Irish Club is in for him - who?

The second part I want to highlight is this one:

"The source added: "He loved his time in Paris, enjoyed his rugby and his rugby benefited from it, as evidenced by his performances in the Six Nations. He felt his time there wasn't quite finished but now England is his priority."

Haskell's contract included the option of a third year but he was aware that his international future could be affected by his choice of club: after the World Cup, England will pick players who are based outside the country only in exceptional circumstances"


Do these two paragraphs hint that he will only go to an English club despite the attention of Italy, Ireland and Australia? If so, where do you think he will go?

Let us know your thoughts on where you think he will end up and which "Irish" club you think has approached him.

I reckon it is likely that he wants to make it clear in any contract negotiations that he must be released/made available for all England related activities and may even go so far as to limit his total number of games/minutes for any potential club (a la the Irish central contracts to try and limit burnout in Irish internationals) if such a request is made by Johnson.

As to which Irish club would be interested, I'd say purely on a needs basis, Munster would be looking for an elite backrow player. Ulster could also be interested if further doubt exists on Ferris maintaining fitness. Leinster have the problem of too many backrow options. Connacht wouldn't be able to afford the Brand. It would be interesting how someone once thought of as trying to develop themselves as an individual Brand would settle in Munster. Grounding someone like Haskell with an Munster pack mentality would be great for him, good for Munster but terrible for Ireland as we would be improving the English backrow.

roddersm wrote:Haskell is in cloud cuckoo land. Who is this Irish club which is interested in signing him? I hope Ulster aren't interested in him. He wouldn't get on the bench at Leinster and he's not really a Munster type player, so I'm guessing it must Connacht?

According to the Irish Times Connacht have finalised their squad for next year, just one more signing (centre apparently) to be announced this week.

Can he play second row as well? If yes then after losing Hines I think it might have been us who asked about him.

If it was Ulster that would not bode well in terms of their optimism regarding Ferris and his knee.

Quinlan's retiring, so it's not entirely impossible that it was Munster. Warwick and Sam T leaving frees up NIQ spots, or have they already been filled?

5 Non Irish spots + 1 Project Player per province:

Munster - Botha, Howlett, Mafi, du Preez, FREE SPOT, Borlase (PP)
Leinster - van der Merwe, Sykes, Berquist, Nacewa, FREE SPOT, Strauss (PP)
Ulster - Afoa, Muller, Wannenburg, Pienaar, Danielli, Payne (PP)
Connacht - over the limit

Well Stag it looks like Munster then as Leinster have so many back rowers they don't know what to do with them. Surely a center would be Munsters priority? Is Mafi staying?

Isn't Strauss IQ next season?

Are there question marks about Wannenburgs future at Ulster? I thought geoff said something about him maybe not getting a new contract of 606?

red_stag wrote:Connacht - over the limit

Really? How can that be allowed? Like I said, according to the Irish Times they've finalised their squad. Are they being given special dispensation to help them this year because of the HC?

roddersm wrote:Well Stag it looks like Munster then as Leinster have so many back rowers they don't know what to do with them. Surely a center would be Munsters priority?

It will be. Munster will sign a centre. They have made that clear.

Connacht have plenty of project players but are over the limit they've Rodney Ah You, Reynecke, Ofisia, Nikora, Jarvis, Loxton, Naoupu, Vainikolo etc.

Ofisa is IQ on residency, but if you look at the Samoa discussion I've asked a question about that.

https://www.606v2.com/t6677-manu-samoa-training-squad-for-rwc


I think I read in the paper (IT or Independent, can't remember) that the IRB have said (or were going to announce) that the Wales U20 team is not a senior team, so Connacht dodged a bullet with Jarvis and Loxton. But didn't read anything further, so maybe there are all sorts of challenges going on behind the scenes.

I thought Connacht were allowed extra non-IQ players?

roddersm wrote:I thought Connacht were allowed extra non-IQ players?

Thats what I thought too. I certainly wouldn't begrudge them one or two.

And that way they'd keep their paws off our academies

I think a lot of people are mistaking James Haskell for his Agent, so lets forgive the mixing up of "club" and "province" just as we forgive the Welsh referring to the Principlality as a Nation

Most likely he would want to go to a Jeff club anyway. He still wants to play international rugby, and unless he has firm release clauses he cant do that from Ireland Italy or Swaziland. This just smacks of his agent trying to inflate his price by suggesting competition for his signature. Its hardly the first time thats been done. There may be real "interest" (ie a enquiry about how much he wants) but it doenst mean that Haskell himslef has an interest in moving to these outposts as anything other than a last resort.

Excuse me but Ulster Rugby is not an "Outpost" and neither are the other Irish provinces.

Cant see either Brian McLaughlin or David Humphreys having the slightest bit of interest in Haskell.

roddersm wrote:Excuse me but Ulster Rugby is not an "Outpost" and neither are the other Irish provinces.

They are when it comes to England selection.

Connacht are allowed a bit of latitude with the NIQ rules. There's every chance if they weren't they'd be struggling to get near the squad numbers they need.

Considering Haskell as a Galactico is being rather optimistic/or blind.He was very ordinary before going to Paris,but as he himself admits, playing in the Top14 helped him progress.

Looking at the signings made by the French clubs, the money is still coming in(and going out).
Sivivatu, Roko,Gito, Evans,Botha x2,Hook,Burgess,MacAlister,Mason et al aren't only moving for the nice weather.

Haskell has certainly benefitted from playing in the Top14. Seems a little ironic that he probably needs to leave France to ensure his place in the England squad but there are benefits for doing that too. He played some good rugby in the last 6Ns. I was never that sure about him but think he's matured a fair bit. Some of that is to do with age but playing in France was probably a big factor too.

red_stag wrote:5 Non Irish spots + 1 Project Player per province:

Munster - Botha, Howlett, Mafi, du Preez, FREE SPOT, Borlase (PP)
Leinster - van der Merwe, Sykes, Berquist, Nacewa, FREE SPOT, Strauss (PP)
Ulster - Afoa, Muller, Wannenburg, Pienaar, Danielli, Payne (PP)
Connacht - over the limit

To expand on what Red Stag is saying, Sykes is a project as well, I believe, so Leinster are 3+2.
My understanding is if anyone is interested in Haskell it is, believe it or not, Leinster. The possibility is an Irish backrower - McLaughlin, Ruddock will comes north at the same time. Ruddock for a year will be good for all concerned.

As has been posted elsewhere it is 4+1 for 2012-13.
In Ulsters case Danielli will not be replaced.
In Leinsters case Strauss will become IQ
Given Munster will sign a 12 then one of the other NIQ players will have to be droped.

I thought you could only have 1 project player? Maybe Skyes is targeted to be the next player to be given project status once Strauss is IQ?

geoff998rugby wrote:Given Munster will sign a 12 then one of the other NIQ players will have to be droped.

I'd imagine it will be Howlett. We have much cover at wing. Keith Earls, Simon Zebo, Denis Hurley, Johne Murphy, Danny Barnes and Scott Deasy.

I'll be gutted if it's Howlett.

I understand your logic, but that guy has become a true Munsterite.

greybeard wrote:I'll be gutted if it's Howlett.

I understand your logic, but that guy has become a true Munsterite.

Yes but he will be nearly 34 years of age at that stage. The alternative is either Borlase or Botha to leave but I think with Buckley out the door and Hayes on his deathbed we would keep the props we have even if Borlase has been as useful as a chocolate teapot so far.

I don’t see why Leinster would be interested in Haskell. Even if McLaughlin goes north for a year (I think Ruddock is still in contract, not sure about Locky) then we still have O’Brien, Heaslip, Jennings, Ryan and McLaughlin in the squad. Haskell could warm the bench for the A’s but I’m not sure “the brand” would be keen on playing B&I cup after the glamour lifestyle he’s become accustomed to.

Howlett is pure class and it would be a real shame to see him leave Irish rugby. Even at 34 I think the guy is one of the best wingers in Europe.

Ruddock at Ulster would be great.

It's great to see you on here Geoff.

Is that true though ?
I think he would be ahead of McLaughlin and Ryan and with squad rotation would play plenty of games.

Don't get me wrong I don't think he will come but if he does it will be Leinster - another cog in maintaining Leinster's dominance.

Ruddock does have 1 more year under contract but if player and Provinces agree it could happen. Ulster are looking for a IQ backrower to strengthening the squad. A years experience at Ulster would do Ruddock and Leinster a world of good.

I'd imagine Munster are surely seeking an IQ backrow too?

greybeard wrote:I thought you could only have 1 project player? Maybe Skyes is targeted to be the next player to be given project status once Strauss is IQ?

Thats the plan - so effectivelyu Leinster are sitting at 3+2 for next year.

they can sign another NIQ player and will not have to drop anybody because Strauss will become IQ in a year

red_stag wrote:I'd imagine Munster are surely seeking an IQ backrow too?

Would you not consider centre more urgent - that seems to be what most Munster fans think

Geoff - I'm assuming we will sign a NIQ centre. But I would think that an Irish backrow would be most welcome.

Sorry mis read you reply.

You mean Ulster and Munster could be fighting over Leinsters surplus backrowers ?!

What is the world coming too

red_stag wrote:I'd imagine Munster are surely seeking an IQ backrow too?

Within the island, or would they be looking at the likes of Wilson and Neil Best?

Just naming names, though. Can't imagine Best fitting in, by all accounts he's a bit of a bridge burner. Backrow seem to be the most highly prized position in rugby at the moment, so I can't see any of the other provinces being willing to help Munster out on that score.

What are the up and coming academy back rows like at Munster?

Someone like Ruddock would benefit hughly at Munster or Ulster.

He would get more games and could return to Leinster a better player.

No Irish provinces could persuade Wilson, no Irish provinces wants to persuade Best

geoff998rugby wrote:Sorry mis read you reply.

You mean Ulster and Munster could be fighting over Leinsters surplus backrowers ?!

What is the world coming too

I know. I've felt Munster have been negligent about backrow development. Quinlan is gone next year. Wallace has little left in him I reckon. We have Donnacha Ryan starting at 6 which can't be a long term option. Niall Ronan isn't a viable option and its been clear for some time. O'Mahony and O'Donnell are still too green with not enough game time. A signing to bridge the gap is needed and a NIQ isn't an option.

Good point Greybeard.

Geoff, I think I know what you'll say here but .... do you think there's any chance of Wilson or, even better, Best returning to Ulster if Ferris doesn't recover?

Speaking of which, any news on Ferris?

Sorry didn't see your post above.