Scotland v Samoa, 11 November

by **George Carlin** Wed 01 Nov 2017, 5:14 pm

First topic message reminder :

Scotland v Samoa, 11 November - Page 3 Scot_f10

Scotland v Samoa, 11 November - Page 3 Samoa_12

SCOTLAND V SAMOA
11 November 2017
14:30 GMT (UTC+0)
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh

Live on BBC One, Connected TV, online & the BBC Sport app & Radio Scotland 810MW

Referee: Nic Berry (Australia)
Touch judges: [tbc]
Television match official: [tbc]

A. Head to Head

10 Played 10
8 Won 1
1 Drawn 1
1 Lost 8
254 Points 155

B. Recent Form

10 October 2015
St James' Park, Newcastle
33 – 36 to Scotland

8 June 2013
Mr Price Kings Park, Durban, South Africa
27 – 17 to Samoa

23 June 2012
Apia Park, Apia
16 – 17 to Scotland

27 November 2010
Pittodire, Aberdeen
19 – 16 to Scotland

20 November 2005
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
18 – 11 to Scotland

4 June 2004
Westpac Stadium, Wellington, New Zealand
3 – 38 to Scotland

18 November 2000
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
31 – 8 to Scotland

C. Teams

SCOTLAND
Scotland v Samoa, 11 November - Page 3 Gordon10

Scotland v Samoa, 11 November - Page 3 Gordon10

Stuart Hogg, Tommy Seymour, Huw Jones, Alex Dunbar, Lee Jones, Finn Russell, Ali Price (all Glasgow Warriors); Darryl Marfo, Stuart McInally, WP Nel, Ben Toolis (all Edinburgh), Jonny Gray (Glasgow), Barclay (captain - Scarlets), Hamish Watson (Edinburgh), Ryan Wilson (Glasgow).

Replacements: George Turner, Jamie Bhatti, Zander Fagerson, Tim Swinson (all Glasgow), Cornell Du Preez (Edinburgh), Henry Pyrgos, Peter Horne (both Glasgow), Chris Harris (Newcastle).

SAMOA
Scotland v Samoa, 11 November - Page 3 Jerry-10

Scotland v Samoa, 11 November - Page 3 Jerry-10

Ah See Tuala, Paul Perez, Kieron Fonotia, Reynold Lee-Lo,David Lemi, Tim Nanai Williams, Pele Cowley;Jordan Lay, Manu Leiataua, Donald Brighouse, Josh Tyrell, Chris Vui (capt), Piula Fa'asalele, TJ Ioane, Jack Lam.

Replacements: Motu Matu'u, James Lay, Hisa Sasagi, Fa'atiga Lemalu, Ofisa Treviranus, Mealani Matavao, AJ Alatimu, Alapati Leiua.

by **NeilyBroon** Fri 10 Nov 2017, 8:57 am

EWT Spoons wrote:I'm hopeful when Graham gets back from injury he can get a run in the Edinburgh side and hopefully make the step up to international level. His biggest hurdle though is that he's tiny.

Vincent Clerc, Shane Williams not exactly large units but made an impact. Jason Robinson wasn't huge (though he was a bit of a pocket battleship).

I think if Graham continues to develop his already good skillset he could skin most modern large players. I think we definitely worry about size too much in the backs - the forwards are the only ones we need to worry about being lightweight/small. Look at the crap large wingers - Simon Danielli anyone?

by **RDW** Fri 10 Nov 2017, 8:58 am

There's a long way to go with Graham yet - he hasn't even made his competitive professional debut!

by sensisball Fri 10 Nov 2017, 10:03 am

Yes still room for small, quick wingers. Most T14 teams have one large and one small (ish) winger. La Rochelle's top try scorer last year GabrielLa Croix, is pretty small: 5 ft 7 and 12 stone 8, but he is a devastating finisher. Decent defender as well.

by TJ Fri 10 Nov 2017, 10:15 am

What about Nick Grigg? 5'9" and 14 stone according to Wiki but seems to be a pretty good centre both attacking and defending

by tigertattie Fri 10 Nov 2017, 10:47 am

I've no problem with tiny wingers.

Look at it this way, you have to choose between Tim Visser, Simon Danielli, Nikki Walker and Shane Williams

Who do you pick?

Williams, despite his size, we a competent defender. Sure he wouldn't knock guys back, but he chased them, went round the legs and brought them down or he'd just close his eye and run into the other fella and hope for the best.

Visser is a monster of a man, but absolutely Keeks his breeks at the prospect of tackling someone.

by EWT Spoons Fri 10 Nov 2017, 11:45 am

I guess with Graham (as RDW says) we don’t know how he’s going to do yet. He’s not started a competitive game for Edinburgh, but if he can fulfil the promise shown at youth level then I’m hopeful he’ll make a mark at international level.

On the size thing, I guess it depends on how he develops both physically and in terms of his game. He’s only smaller than Hoggy by a couple of stones and cm, and he seems to be doing ok . So if he can bulk up a bit as he develops and is still able to maintain his pace and step then he could be a very capable player, certainly in an attacking sense at least.

by Mad for Chelsea Fri 10 Nov 2017, 11:48 am

Agree that Graham looks an exciting prospect, though still early days obviously. Hope he can get fit, get a run of games for Edinburgh, and show what he can do.

by jimbopip Fri 10 Nov 2017, 12:41 pm

Well lads, time to nail one's colours to the big wooden pole with the square-ish patch of linen on it. Braveheart

Renzo and Toonie are both preaching the gospel of high-tempo-fast ball-mobile forwards-heads up rugby allied to aggressive defence and a fairly brutal approach to winning collisions around the breakdown. Glasgow seem to be having some success with it domestically, not so much in Europe. Obviously success or failure in the next three games will very much depend on how well Scotland can implement/ adapt to this style of play. Since 9-15 are all currently plying their trade under Renzo then I think we're pretty much seeing our strongest backs there.
Duncan Taylor for Alex Dunbar, Sean Maitland for Lee Jones are possible improvements. Visser won't be recalled as long as he continues to black out when asked to consider the adjectives "aggressive" and "brutal".
In the pack the back 5 are very mobile and all look like they will make ground with ball in hand.
I am especially pleased to see Toolis start rather than GG, who should now be sixth choice at best.
The injury to Mr Chinhook may prove to be quite serendipitous since the choice seemed to be between a biggish hooker who doesn't do much in the loose and Turner, a small one who does lots in the loose. Now we've got a decent sized hooker who knows how to play as a flanker. I fully expect Scotland to try to run Samoa off the field from the first to the last minute. If Samoa can't hold on to the ball for extended periods then they will be in for a long afternoon.
Which brings me to our good fortune to play Samoa first.They are a decent team but are in transition. Their 10 has only ever played one professional match as a stand-off! Barcs and Hamish From The Glen must get under his skin early on and stay there like scabies on a Pilton smack head.

The excellent On Top Of The Moon site provides this little nugget;
Forwards
27.4 Average age 27.6
174 Test caps 66
884kg Pack weights 883kg

So our pack are younger, more experienced AND HEAVIER. How often will we see that? (Especially without Mr Chinhook).

I really think this Samoa team will allow us to play and that Toonie has picked a team that can play. Braveheart

by **RDW** Fri 10 Nov 2017, 12:48 pm

Surprised at our pack being heavier, but the Samoan pick isn't the tallest.

Their locks are 6ft 4 and 6ft 5 so id love to see Toolis (6ft 7) and Jonny (6ft 6) really make a nuisance of their lineout to starve them of possession.

In reading a Townsend interview I was also reminded of the horror show in the World Cup that was our restarts vs Samoa - every time we got points we'd then lose the ball at the restart and they pretty much scored straight away. it has been the Scottish curse for as long as I can remember - hopefully Townsend can fix it!

by TJ Fri 10 Nov 2017, 1:02 pm

like scabies on a Pilton smack head.

by reallybored Fri 10 Nov 2017, 1:15 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Surprised at our pack being heavier, but the Samoan pick isn't the tallest.

Their locks are 6ft 4 and 6ft 5 so id love to see Toolis (6ft 7) and Jonny (6ft 6) really make a nuisance of their lineout to starve them of possession.

In reading a Townsend interview I was also reminded of the horror show in the World Cup that was our restarts vs Samoa - every time we got points we'd then lose the ball at the restart and they pretty much scored straight away. it has been the Scottish curse for as long as I can remember - hopefully Townsend can fix it!

I remember losing a restart against the Pumas during RWC11 that effectively cost us a QF spot.

Seems ridiculous that it's been such an achilles heel despite being an area of the game that can be drilled.

by tigertattie Fri 10 Nov 2017, 2:27 pm

reallybored wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:Surprised at our pack being heavier, but the Samoan pick isn't the tallest.

Their locks are 6ft 4 and 6ft 5 so id love to see Toolis (6ft 7) and Jonny (6ft 6) really make a nuisance of their lineout to starve them of possession.

In reading a Townsend interview I was also reminded of the horror show in the World Cup that was our restarts vs Samoa - every time we got points we'd then lose the ball at the restart and they pretty much scored straight away. it has been the Scottish curse for as long as I can remember - hopefully Townsend can fix it!
I remember losing a restart against the Pumas during RWC11 that effectively cost us a QF spot.

Seems ridiculous that it's been such an achilles heel despite being an area of the game that can be drilled.

It's one of those times where we're to honest/naive

Watch other teams like the ABs or England and you'll see that then the ball is kicked, the person who is best placed to catch it gets ready, but unlike Scotland where our players stand where they are and watch as the ball comes in, these other teams have their forwards move towards the catcher and pretty much make a little obstructive wall in front of him.

In essence, we need to do what Nigel says and cheat fairly!

by jimbopip Fri 10 Nov 2017, 2:53 pm

TJ wrote:
like scabies on a Pilton smack head.

Thanks TJ.

I came across a wonderful simile on another forum: someone described Siua Halakonukonuka as a,

"Benidorm pub landlord version of Oor Wullie" Laugh

I thought my trousers would never dry.

by tigertattie Fri 10 Nov 2017, 4:11 pm

jimbopip wrote:
TJ wrote:
like scabies on a Pilton smack head.

Thanks TJ.

I came across a wonderful simile on another forum: someone described Siua Halakonukonuka as a,

"Benidorm pub landlord version of Oor Wullie"

I thought my trousers would never dry.

Jimbo must be the only person on this forum that uses words like "simile" and "adjective"

and he seems to have learned the quote function!

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 5:20 am

tigertattie wrote:
jimbopip wrote:
TJ wrote:
like scabies on a Pilton smack head.

Thanks TJ.

I came across a wonderful simile on another forum: someone described Siua Halakonukonuka as a,

"Benidorm pub landlord version of Oor Wullie"

I thought my trousers would never dry.

Jimbo must be the only person on this forum that uses words like "simile" and "adjective"

and he seems to have learned the quote function!

It's only taken six and a half years, but I feel like a very proud parent.

Now we just need to work on the potty mouth.

by aucklandlaurie Sat 11 Nov 2017, 7:18 am

Good first half by Scotland in the Rugby League they are leading Samoa 14 - 6, Samoa have been trying to smash them and Scotland are weathering, gutsy half by Luke Douglas older brother of Wallaby Kane Douglas.

by funnyExiledScot Sat 11 Nov 2017, 11:16 am

George Carlin wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
jimbopip wrote:
TJ wrote:
like scabies on a Pilton smack head.

Thanks TJ.

I came across a wonderful simile on another forum: someone described Siua Halakonukonuka as a,

"Benidorm pub landlord version of Oor Wullie"

I thought my trousers would never dry.

Jimbo must be the only person on this forum that uses words like "simile" and "adjective"

and he seems to have learned the quote function!
It's only taken six and a half years, but I feel like a very proud parent.

Now we just need to work on the potty mouth.

One step at a time GC. He's still waiting on his trousers to dry, so let's target potty training first!

Am feeling optimistic about today. I think the Samoans will keep it close for 50 - 60 minutes but with the team we have we should be able to take the wind out their sails and make it count later on. Need a big game from Russell though to keep them guessing.

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 12:23 pm

Yes, for all of the massive expectation on his shoulders, I would like to see Russell further his international development this year.

By that I mean that he needs to show his judgement is improving and that forcing something which is not on can lose his team the game. He has all of the razzle dazzle, nobody is denying that. However, if his team is behind, he needs to lose the mindset that he needs to pull off miracles all the time. In that respect, his team mates need to take some of that pressure from him. Having Ali Price on his elbow and Dunbar outside him really has to help.

by jimbopip Sat 11 Nov 2017, 12:58 pm

I tend to agree with you on this GC, though not on the feccin potty mouth you inbred barsteward.
Dancer has all the talent to be the best 10 since Toonie but he has to develop the parts of his game which aren't mercurial. When Glasgow were trailing Exeter by two points with five minutes to go I couldn't help thinking that our best chance of winning would be a pragmatic pick and drive, repeat as necessary and then slot a drop goal. Jonny Wilkinson, Ronan O'Gara, Jonny Sexton, Dan Carter hell even Dan Parks (especially Dan Parks) would have done that every day of the week. Instead Glasgow continued to try to blow the Chiefs away and ended up being Matawalued. But you are right, that is a team decision and he should have been helped by older and wiser heads.
Hopefully we'll see an improvement in his game management this season: because we have no real alternative at 10, certainly no-one in the same galaxy as him.

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:06 pm

jimbopip wrote:I tend to agree with you on this GC, though not on the feccin potty mouth you inbred barsteward.

by jimbopip Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:07 pm

Can't wait for kick off. I really think that set of backs will destroy Samoa.

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:35 pm

My god, have you seen the jakey nightclub wear that will be on our backs today?

White and purple.

by jimbopip Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:44 pm

Jakey Nightclub-Ware! Did he not play open-side flanker for Harlequins in the 1978-9 season?

On the subject of jerseys: the free market has just passed the final damning verdict on Warren Gatland's tenure as Lions' coach; Lovell Sports are offering a FREE Lions jersey with every replica jersey bought between now and Christmas (or however long it takes to get rid of the feccin things).

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:53 pm

Who is the young blonde lady interviewing Dougie Fife and Frodo on the SRU live feed?

I haven't heard her speak yet but at the moment, I don't disapprove.

An upgrade on Hazel Irvine aesthetically, is what I'm saying.

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:55 pm

George Carlin wrote:Who is the young blonde lady interviewing Dougie Fife and Frodo on the SRU live feed?

I haven't heard her speak yet but at the moment, I don't disapprove.

An upgrade on Hazel Irvine aesthetically, is what I'm saying.

Edit: Jaysus, I'm tired of platitudes. Is there any professional rugby team which doesn't "bring a lot of physicality"?

Apart from Edinburgh, that is.

by jimbopip Sat 11 Nov 2017, 1:55 pm

Wait till you hear Dougie Fife speak. Mogadon and Buckie for breakfast methinks.
p.s. Stadtler and Waldorf would both be an upgrade on Hazel Irvine and funnier too.

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:29 pm

Well here we go - hoping there's not a repeat of the world cup game!

by tigertattie Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:31 pm

You know we don't see Glove on here much these days. Is he too famous for the likes of us now?

by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:33 pm

Incredible! What a start

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:35 pm

Which is the best live feed for this? I cannot watch is and I recall that the SRU Twitter is bloody slow.

by tigertattie Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:38 pm

Marfo is enjoying his debut so far

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:40 pm

This is a bit of a 7s game so far which will play into Samoan hands. Need some kind of structure!

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:46 pm

Nothing in that - Dunbar was a dummy runner.

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:48 pm

Marfo doing well at the breakdown

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:52 pm

Is this the first scrum on 19 minutes??

Our wide defence is very passive - NZ will rip us to shreds if we keep that up.

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:54 pm

Not sure about that - Marfo dominated him opposite number l

by Eejit Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:54 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Marfo doing well at the breakdown

Fair play to him, he’s doing well so far.

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 2:56 pm

Can't help but think we're kicking too early and often in attack - we're using it every time.

by tigertattie Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:00 pm

Something is wrong with Nel

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:02 pm

Game on! Samoa with a lot of possession just now

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:04 pm

We're looking flat. Need better accuracy!

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:11 pm

Was just about to say Huw Jones hadn't done much yet!

by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:11 pm

That Huw Jones character is rubbish at scoring tries....

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:15 pm

tigertattie wrote:Something is wrong with Nel

He had fractured his arm!

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:16 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:
tigertattie wrote:Something is wrong with Nel

He had fractured his arm!

Big jessie. Jim Telfer would have used it to chin his opposite number.

by tigertattie Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:18 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:
tigertattie wrote:Something is wrong with Nel

He had fractured his arm!

Thought he looked groggy. Thought it was a head or shoulder knock. He played for about 5 mins with it. Bad times

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:18 pm

Great forwards try! McInally has played well

by **RDW** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:19 pm

Comfortable lead at half time but don't think we've played overly well!

by **George Carlin** Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:20 pm

Any more prop injuries and we are monumentally fecked.

by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 11 Nov 2017, 3:22 pm

Its been a bit disjointed but there are some good individual performances in there, Toolis is going well as is Marfo on debut. Price is playing well and suits Finn's game so well

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