Wales v Australia Saturday 10th November 2018 New TMO laws to be trialled.

Wales v Australia

Date: Saturday 10th November 2018

Venue: Principality Stadium, Cardiff

Kick Off: 5:20pm

Referee: Ben O'Keeffe (New Zealand)

TV Coverage: Live on BBC Two and S4C

Wales will face Australia at the Principality Stadium in Cardiff on Saturday 10th November during the Under Armour Series 2018. This will be the second of four autumn internationals to be played by Wales in 2018. The two teams will compete for the James Bevan Trophy, which was created in 2007 to celebrate 100 years of rugby between Wales and Australia.

Wales have lost their last 13 matches against the Wallabies, most recently losing 21-29 during the 2017 autumn series. The last time Wales beat Australia was a 21-18 victory at the Millennium Stadium in 2008.

Wales and Australia have contested a total of 41 rugby test matches since their first meeting in 1908. Wales have won 10 of those matches, whilst Australia have won 30 matches. There has also been one drawn match between the two sides, which occurred at the Millennium Stadium in 2006.

LAST 3 MATCHES Wales

3/11/18 Wal 21 - 10 Sco
16/6/18 Argentina 12 - 30 Wal
9/6/18 Argentina 10 - 23 Wal

LAST 3 MATCHES Australia

23/6/18 Aus 16 - 20 Ire
16/6/18 Aus 21 - 26 Ire
9/6/18 Aus 18 - 9 Ire

Teams TBA

So How does everyone think this one will pan out ? Australia are a massive bogey side for Wales, they always seem to know how to win against us, I cannot see anything different happening this weekend either, I am predicting an Australia win by 10pts.

Nothing in the last game against Scotland convinced me that this Wales side has improved since we last played Australia, I am not very confident at all.

Although, I would love to be proved wrong.

According to Viagogo there are only 330 tickets left for this game. It's nice to see it will be near full capacity.

Well the game v Scotland saw Wales win their first opening November international for 16 years.

I wonder will they get their first win v Australia in 10 years. Id imagine Welsh fans will be quite confident that they will?

It's so long since we beat Australia that it's hard to envisage it happening!

Our defence was good against Scotland, which is promising, but on the other hand Scotland had a few cases of white line fever, which you'd imagine the Wallabies will be too canny to suffer from if they get in those positions.

Collapse2005 wrote:Well the game v Scotland saw Wales win their first opening November international for 16 years.

I wonder will they get their first win v Australia in 10 years. Id imagine Welsh fans will be quite confident that they will?

Why on earth would you think that? When we’ve tried and failed on something like 13 occasions on the bounce then of course we’re not going to be confident. I am pretty confident that we could screw it up though. But there’s nothing to indicate that we should be confident. We’ve played worse Wallabies teams with stronger Welsh teams in the last 13 games and still lost.

Mainly because Wales are a good side and Australia are struggling a lot. I fancy a Welsh win.

Will Wales keep the same line up for this game? Or will Gatland make some changers?

Biggar for Ascome? for instance.

LD are you at all familiar with the rugby championship? Not one of Australia’s last three games were against Ireland. Dearie me.

We've had a good run against Wales which I would normally take comfort in, but I think the Wallabies are a real chance of losing all three matches this tour as other than Pocock and usually Hooper, none of the players are producing consistently good performances and the coaching seems to be below the standard of the rest of the strong nations. I've reached the point of still supporting the Wallabies as you have to as a supporter, but my expectations of success are gone for the moment. With players like Folau and Beale we will always have a punchers chance but without better coaching we wont be a consistent threat.

On the other hand I think Wales at the moment look to be a team that know where they are going. As long as they don't psyche themselves out I think they grab the win.

Collapse2005 wrote:Mainly because Wales are a good side and Australia are struggling a lot. I fancy a Welsh win.

But Wales are unable to put teams to the sword. And Aus keep in touch and then know how to put a game away.

If Webb were playing, perhaps with Sam and Faletau and Liam at 15 then maybe but I jus think they 'll lose by a few points again

Taken from WOL:-

A big refereeing change comes into force this weekend to try and stop one of rugby's most annoying things

It will be trialled at the Wales v Australia game

This weekend sees the start of World Rugby's revised trial for Television Match Officials.

The closed trial will revise the scope of the TMO in the November Tests hosted by Tier one nations, with the aim of stopping excessive use that can impact the flow of a game.


So what exactly is happening and why this weekend and not last weekend?

What are the changes then?

One of the big changes will see 'on the run' chat between officials and the TMO removed, with the onus shifting more onto the on-the-field referee to make decisions.

The full list of changes include:

1.Try scoring should be an on-field decision with the referee being responsible, but the team of four can all contribute.

2.The current list of potential infringements for which a TMO can be referred will be retained, but any referral needs to be prompt, clear and consistent.

3.The ‘on the run’ chat between the match officials and TMO for foul play will be removed with the onus on the referee, who should only refer to the TMO issues that are clear and obvious serious acts of foul play, including penalty kick, yellow card or red card as a potential sanction in order to protect player welfare.

4.Match officials can review foul play up to when the game restarts, when a penalty is kicked to touch and when foul play footage becomes available.

5.Proposal include live broadcast of the TMO in action.

Why are they doing this?

The key objective of the review was to look at current practice with a view to cut down on the time impact of TMOs, while ensuring accurate decisions were still being made.

Excessive dialogue between TMOs and referees has caused much annoyance to fans over recent years, with games often becoming stilted by long and regular breaks in play as referees consult the TMO over almost every big decision.

Things came to the fore in this year's Super Rugby competition, with Reds boss Brad Thorn and Sunwolves coach Tony Brown vocal after their players received controversial yellow cards.

Another incident saw Australian referee Angus Gardner send France's Benjamin Fall off against New Zealand this summer with the help of the TMO, only for World Rugby to overturn the decision - citing that "the referee's decision to issue the red card was wrong".

Rugby Australia staunchly defended their official and asked for clarity after the governing body had suggested Gardner was incorrect.

World Rugby Chairman Bill Beaumont said: “World Rugby is committed to regularly reviewing our match officiating protocols to ensure that they are in the best-possible shape to support accurate and consistent match official decision-making and uphold our player welfare focus without adversely impacting on the match.

“This Television Match Official review reflects that commitment and I would like to thank everyone who participated in the process and look forward to seeing the trial in practice this November.”

Who came up with it?

A high-profile working group worked alongside World Rugby chief Brett Gosper and their rugby committee chairman John Jeffrey to approve the changes.

Welsh referee Nigel Owens, former Ireland international Jamie Heaslip and New Zealand assistant coach Ian Foster were just some of the names involved with the review.

Here's the full working group:

John Jeffrey (Chair), Brett Gosper (World Rugby CEO), Brett Robinson (Rugby Australia/World Rugby Rugby Committee Member), Alain Rolland (World Rugby High Performance 15s Match Officials Manager) Ben Skeen (TMO, NZR), Lyndon Bray (SANZAAR Match Officials Manager), Nigel Owens (Referee, WRU), Joe Schmidt (Coach, IRFU), Jamie Heaslip (International Rugby Players), Steve Jamieson (World Rugby TV Producer/Broadcast), Rowan Kitt (TMO, RFU), Angus Gardiner (Referee, NZR), Ian Foster (Coach NZR),, Mark Egan (World Rugby Head of Competitions and Performance) and Mark Harrington (World Rugby Head of Technical Services).

Why this weekend?

Obviously, there has already been Test rugby played last weekend - with Wales' win over Scotland in Cardiff just one in case you hadn't noticed.

So why not start the trial then rather than the following weekend.

Well, it appears to be that the answer is as simple as this weekend's matches fall into World Rugby's November Test window.

It does seem a little strange that two different Test matches played a week apart could have different methods of using the TMO, but that's the case here.

What's the bets Wales lose because of a dodgy TMO decision.

Collapse2005 wrote:What's the bets Wales lose because of a dodgy TMO decision.

Yep! I'd place strong odds on that.

I'm sure it will become clearer in the match itself but the on the run chat they want to eliminate actually saves stopping the game. Seems a bit contradictory.

Just saw this on the England v New Zealand match thread:

Sgt_Pooly wrote:

NZu20 side for JWC final 2011

1 Solomona Sakalia
2 Codie Taylor
3 Ben Tameifuna
4 Steven Luatua
5 Brodie Rettalick
6 Brad Shields
7 Sam Cane
8 Luke Whitelock
9 TJ Perenara
10 Gareth Anscombe
11 Charles Piutau
12 Lima Sopoaga
13 Francis Saili
14 Mitchell Scott
15 Beauden Barrett

Anscombe keeping Beauden Barrett out of the 10 shirt.

Sam Davies was our outside half at this tournament, and he's well down the pecking order.

A quick scan...very quick scan..highlights this one for me as a possible big problem one:

3.The ‘on the run’ chat between the match officials and TMO for foul play will be removed with the onus on the referee, who should only refer to the TMO issues that are clear and obvious serious acts of foul play, including penalty kick, yellow card or red card as a potential sanction in order to protect player welfare.


Seems to suggest that if a ref don't see it, it didn't happen.  Now whilst purists like myself might agree with the idea that the ref's eyes should be the main arbiter as too often Local TV editorialising can lend undue weight to incidents off the ball..............  ie, TV directors become refs to an extent in what they direct their camera men to concentrate on.

The problem is though - if I'm actually reading the point correctly - that such a ruling that there can be no ongoing chat will not do away with the cameras or that director choosing what to concentrate on.  If fans don't like an incident, if replay keeps showing it.... if ref ignores it and if TMO can't call attention to it...........

Controversy magnet for the Always Afflicted

Wales: Leigh Halfpenny; George North, Jonathan Davies, Hadleigh Parkes, Josh Adams; Gareth Anscombe, Gareth Davies; Nicky Smith, Ken Owens, Tomas Francis, Adam Beard, Alun Wyn Jones, Dan Lydiate, Justin Tipuric, Ross Moriarty

Replacements: Elliot Dee, Rob Evans, Dillon Lewis, Cory Hill, Ellis Jenkins, Tomos Williams, Dan Biggar, Liam Williams

Australia: Dane Haylett-Petty; Israel Folau, Samu Kerevi, Kurtley Beale, Sefa Naivalu; Bernard Foley, Will Genia; Scott Sio, Tolu Latu, Allan Alaalatoa, Izack Rodda, Adam Coleman, Jack Dempsey, Michael Hooper (capt), David Pocock

Replacements: Tatafu Polota-Nau, Sekope Kepu, Taniela Tupou, Rob Simmons, Ned Hanigan, Nick Phipps, Matt To'omua, Jack Maddocks.

Referee: Ben O'Keeffe (New Zealand)

Assistance referees: Romain Poite (France), Brendon Pickerill (New Zealand)

TMO: Simon McDowell (Ireland)

Ah LP, you beat me to it.

Bugger.

Folau on the wing seems a waste

I really can't call this match. The Wallabies have given us some tunings in Cardiff even when we've been fairly confident.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I really can't call this match. The Wallabies have given us some tunings in Cardiff even when we've been fairly confident.

All the bookies have made Wales favourites for this, I cannot for the life of me understand why.

Bit of impact on our bench. Could be interesting if we are close, depending on how/if Gatland uses it.

LordDowlais wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I really can't call this match. The Wallabies have given us some tunings in Cardiff even when we've been fairly confident.

All the bookies have made Wales favourites for this, I cannot for the life of me understand why.

Because Australia are pretty rubbish and they are, I guess, looking beyond the head-to-head results.

LondonTiger wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I really can't call this match. The Wallabies have given us some tunings in Cardiff even when we've been fairly confident.

All the bookies have made Wales favourites for this, I cannot for the life of me understand why.

Because Australia are pretty rubbish and they are, I guess, looking beyond the head-to-head results.

I have seen worse Aussie sides than this come up here and show us our arrises, and after the way we played against Scotland, I am not that confident at all.

Which Aussie side for example was worse?

Collapse2005 wrote:Which Aussie side for example was worse?

A few years ago, England absolutely smashed them the week prior, they then came to Cardiff, we were mullering their scrum, but we still managed to lose it.

Or the side we lost to with a last minute try.

they were worse than this side.

Are you referring to the game in 2016 when Wales lost 8–32? Or the game in 2014 when Wales lost 28–33?

Collapse2005 wrote:Are you referring to the game in 2016 when Wales lost 8–32? Or the game in 2014 when Wales lost 28–33?

Circa 2013/2014. I cannot remember the date. sorry.

No problem.

Anyway, I am surprised to see Adam Beard starting, I thought they would have gone with Cory Hill, as Adam being playing well for Ospreys this season ? I have not seen that much of him to be honest.

I think Wales should believe this is their year to do it

And it's not because Oz are rubbish but because Wales are good

They are 3rd in the world on merit and are at home. They have a good flowing game yet they also have the players to slow the opposition ball. This is Gatland's one big failing and it is his last chance before the WC to fix it. Three of the region's are going well which is 1 more than usual so makes players more compeditive.

LordDowlais wrote:Anyway, I am surprised to see Adam Beard starting, I thought they would have gone with Cory Hill, as Adam being playing well for Ospreys this season ? I have not seen that much of him to be honest.

Beard did very well in the summer. His selection, along with Nicky Smith, Josh Adams and to a certain extent Dan Lydiate all strike me as selections that are looking towards the WC. Either in terms of seeing whether they are up to top international level, or whether they are better than the incumbents in their positions.

The back row selection for the WC will be tricky, as you are looking at probably only 5 back rowers to be taken as we have no real lock/back row double up. When you then think you are choosing between Lydiate, Shingler, Jenkins, Navidi, Moriarty, Davies, Faletau, Wainwright, Tipuric, you are just lucky that Warburton was taken out of the equation!

I predict a Welsh win

...so congrats to Australia in advance, I suppose....

chris_501 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Anyway, I am surprised to see Adam Beard starting, I thought they would have gone with Cory Hill, as Adam being playing well for Ospreys this season ? I have not seen that much of him to be honest.

Beard did very well in the summer. His selection, along with Nicky Smith, Josh Adams and to a certain extent Dan Lydiate all strike me as selections that are looking towards the WC. Either in terms of seeing whether they are up to top international level, or whether they are better than the incumbents in their positions.

The back row selection for the WC will be tricky, as you are looking at probably only 5 back rowers to be taken as we have no real lock/back row double up. When you then think you are choosing between Lydiate, Shingler, Jenkins, Navidi, Moriarty, Davies, Faletau, Wainwright, Tipuric, you are just lucky that Warburton was taken out of the equation!

Beard did do well in the summer and Hill wasn’t all that great last week, so it makes sense to promote from the bench and I’d rather that than Ball jump straight back in.

Fair play, Lydiate played well last week and we undoubtedly need to try and counter Pocock and Hooper. It again makes sense not to throw Jenkins straight in. A little harsh on Wainwright, who I also believe didn’t get on last week, but then again I’d expect him to play v Tonga.

RiscaGame wrote:

chris_501 wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Anyway, I am surprised to see Adam Beard starting, I thought they would have gone with Cory Hill, as Adam being playing well for Ospreys this season ? I have not seen that much of him to be honest.

Beard did very well in the summer. His selection, along with Nicky Smith, Josh Adams and to a certain extent Dan Lydiate all strike me as selections that are looking towards the WC. Either in terms of seeing whether they are up to top international level, or whether they are better than the incumbents in their positions.

The back row selection for the WC will be tricky, as you are looking at probably only 5 back rowers to be taken as we have no real lock/back row double up. When you then think you are choosing between Lydiate, Shingler, Jenkins, Navidi, Moriarty, Davies, Faletau, Wainwright, Tipuric, you are just lucky that Warburton was taken out of the equation!

Beard did do well in the summer and Hill wasn’t all that great last week, so it makes sense to promote from the bench and I’d rather that than Ball jump straight back in.

Fair play, Lydiate played well last week and we undoubtedly need to try and counter Pocock and Hooper. It again makes sense not to throw Jenkins straight in. A little harsh on Wainwright, who I also believe didn’t get on last week, but then again I’d expect him to play v Tonga.

Where was Hill poor ?

I didn’t say poor, I said wasn’t all that great. Considering a few of the papers I’ve seen said Hill was a 6/10 and AWJ pretty much an 8, it’s pretty fair to suggest he wasn’t all that great.

RiscaGame wrote:I didn’t say poor, I said wasn’t all that great. Considering a few of the papers I’ve seen said Hill was a 6/10 and AWJ pretty much an 8, it’s pretty fair to suggest he wasn’t all that great.

Alright Andy

Think Wales are ready to win this. Their record against SH teams is terrible and oz are currently the most hot and cold side around at the moment. The boks run hot and cold across matches, the Wallabies do it within a match.

Capable of stunning plays one minute, defensively inept the next. One things for sure, a lot of things are going to happen in this match as oz try to get their burners on. The Welsh consistency across the side should see them ahead overall. Oz will rely on big plays to win this.

How have their half backs been playing, Taylorman? I don't see much of the Rugby Championship.

Genias been really poor mostly, he can be up there with the best but lately hes gone missing. Foley is the most divisive player in the Wallaby camp, most fans cant stand him, partially due to the odd treatment of Quade Cooper, whos been consigned as the highest paid Reds player to non reds NRC sides.

Foley will set up a try, kick goals, make errors, miss tackles and of course is the first to be blamed for a loss.

Theyll both need to click here. Are they both in this side? Havent seen the side. They tried Beale at 10 without luck and Toomuas gone well on return, could end up at 10 world cup if cheika will ever drop foley.

Yes, it's Genia and Foley tomorrow.

I never like facing Genia.

You'd hope we're wise to his sniping by now.

Yeah fair

Just saw on twittor (BBC sport) that Wales have won six in a row. Didn’t really pay attention to how many wins we’ve had, before that. Fair play to them.

I should have been clearer and added a about us being wise to his sniping. I have a horrible feeling he'll be at it again tomorrow!

Don’t forget we have King of the Snipers too in Gareth Davies. Looking forward to a good snipe-off!

Can’t beat it.

I’ve seen enough rugby over the years to convince me that we’ll never beat Australia (or NZ for that matter). Happy to be proved wrong on this one.

Come on Wales, if you don't do it today, you never will.