Japan 2019 - Pool A Ireland Japan Russia Samoa Scotland

by **LondonTiger** Mon 09 Sep 2019, 12:10 pm

First topic message reminder :

Team	Played	Won	Drawn	Lost	Tries	PF	PA	+/-	BP	Points
Japan	3	3	0	0	9	87	41	+46	2	14
Ireland	3	2	0	1	11	74	22	+52	3	11
Scotland	3	2	0	1	13	98	27	71	2	10
Samoa	3	1	0	2	7	53	81	-28	1	5
Russia	3	0	0	3	1	19	125	-106	0	0

Japan 30-10 Russia
Ireland 27-3 Scotland
Russia 9-34 Samoa
Japan 19-12 Ireland
Scotland 34-0 Samoa
Ireland 35-0 Russia
Japan 38-19 Samoa
Scotland 61-0 Russia

12 October 2019 Ireland v Samoa Fukuoka Hakatanomori Stadium, Fukuoka
13 October 2019 Japan v Scotland International Stadium Yokohama, Yokohama

Two games left. If Ireland get a TBP win on Saturday they qualify for the quarter finals irrespective of the result on Sunday. Any other result and they need to wait and see what happens between Japan and Scotland.
Any win for Japan and they will top the group (in fact a draw or losing with two bonus points will guarantee the same)
Most interesting scenario is if Ireland win without a bonus point - opening up a chance for Scotland to top the group if all 3 teams end up on 15pts and Scotland are able to keep their points difference ahead of Ireland.

by majesticimperialman Wed 09 Oct 2019, 10:38 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:Engerland v France has been cancelled. A bit farcical.

I wouldnt be surprised if the two sides agreed to cancel.

My understanding is it is nothing to do with England or France. World Rugby took the decision to cancell because of the typhoon on the way.

It is a shame they could not find a venue they could use to play the game, rather than cancell the game all together.

by tigertattie Wed 09 Oct 2019, 11:19 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:Engerland v France has been cancelled. A bit farcical.

I wouldnt be surprised if the two sides agreed to cancel.

Cancelled? Source!?!

by Taylorman Wed 09 Oct 2019, 11:45 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:Engerland v France has been cancelled. A bit farcical.

I wouldnt be surprised if the two sides agreed to cancel.

...we get a NZ Ireland quarter then.

Nice... thumbsup

agree its farcical, particularly if it costs a place and I'd say Scotland as the higher seed have reason to grumble.

and they should have been played 1 vs 2 last

by Guest Thu 10 Oct 2019, 12:20 am

If anything the confusion checks the likes of NZ and SA's QF prep, so that's probably a good thing. If NZ are gearing up to face Japan or Scotland, they don't really need to do too much work - no offence to either. If it's Ireland, they could easily become their France, and it's an early bullet train back to the airport for the ABs.

by Taylorman Thu 10 Oct 2019, 12:31 am

If they 'could be France' then they might also end up like them for the same match last world cup.

hammered... thumbsup

by Guest Thu 10 Oct 2019, 12:35 am

Or, you know, the team that has the ABs number. 2-1 to Ireland in the last 3, isn't it, T?

by Taylorman Thu 10 Oct 2019, 12:51 am

Yes, that selective stat is something pointed out a lot. Last years win in Dublin was very good, Chicago had a bit of a surprise element, a bit like how Japan over Ireland did.

I also know its 28 from 31 losses.

This Ab side is coming together nicely. Our midfield is on top of its game and was one of the earlier concerns, AL Brown probably the form centre of the tournament. 3 very good 9's, Barrett and Mo'unga running play.

They'll respect Ireland who will need to score early as they're terrible at scoring when they're down. Even facing defeat against Japan they managed to be on their own goal line at full time.

by Guest Thu 10 Oct 2019, 12:54 am

Not sure you can cash in on the results from guys who are long dead tbf. This 4 year cycle is what really matters. Think Ireland have it in them to spoil the ABs and nick a win, if any team can.

by Taylorman Thu 10 Oct 2019, 1:18 am

Yep they could, that's why we play them, don't think they will though. Recent thrashing by England and a loss to Japan won't fill them with confidence.

Good win over Scotland though so theyre obviously hot and cold at the same time. So are the ABs who crashed in Perth, but as usual remedied that in quick time.

Ireland were up and down in the warmups and in the 6N, so I dont see them putting three good ones in a row up.

But yes, they could nick a win here.

by Collapse2005 Thu 10 Oct 2019, 8:21 am

If you are going to reference the thrashing to England which really was quite meaningless then you should really also reference the fact that a lower ranked side to England thrashed NZ in an actual rugby championship match. Yes NZ are playing well now but Ireland nearly always have a big game in them every year.

Full strength side v Samoa
IRELAND (v Samoa): Jordan Larmour (Leinster); Keith Earls (Munster), Robbie Henshaw (Leinster), Bundee Aki (Connacht), Jacob Stockdale (Ulster); Johnny Sexton (Leinster), Conor Murray (Munster); Cian Healy (Leinster), Rory Best (Ulster, capt), Tadhg Furlong (Leinster); Iain Henderson (Ulster), James Ryan (Leinster); Tadhg Beirne (Munster), Josh van der Flier (Leinster), CJ Stander (Munster).

Replacements: Sean Cronin, Dave Kilcoyne, Andrew Porter, Jean Kleyn, Peter O’Mahony, Luke McGrath, Joey Carbery, Andrew Conway.

by SecretFly Thu 10 Oct 2019, 9:33 am

Whether it was a bit of a phoney war until this point,.... well, it doesn't matter now. Japan bluffed the bluffers if so.

If Ireland are capable of shrugging off all that has happened this year and getting their minds really focused on work rather than mental confusion, hesitancy and nervousness (something I see a lot of) then this is the game where it just has to begin.

They have to win. They have to get the bonus point. They have to score a decent crop of points. And they have to defend like their lives depended on it. They have to do all these things because if one of them doesn't work out, they may need the others.
....oh and it all has to be ultra slick and ultra confident to get the home media off their backs Before any prospective QF rather than After one. Part of me really wants a performance to wipe their noses in it especially. But of course, then they'd be back to the other extreme of bragging positivity

So........ anyway, no pressure on the team Whistle

But seriously, I do think this side can fire up IF they get rid of the tension that has been so apparent. Don't think it's a tension of non-belief in themselves. I just think it's a certain hesitancy about when to give it plenty of juice and when to hold off. A lack of fluidity mucked up by tension.

by **rodders** Thu 10 Oct 2019, 11:11 am

Taylorman wrote:Yes, that selective stat is something pointed out a lot. Last years win in Dublin was very good, Chicago had a bit of a surprise element, a bit like how Japan over Ireland did.

I also know its 28 from 31 losses.

This Ab side is coming together nicely. Our midfield is on top of its game and was one of the earlier concerns, AL Brown probably the form centre of the tournament. 3 very good 9's, Barrett and Mo'unga running play.

They'll respect Ireland who will need to score early as they're terrible at scoring when they're down. Even facing defeat against Japan they managed to be on their own goal line at full time.

Damn it, they've worked out our achilles heel!

by Ninjarugby Fri 11 Oct 2019, 8:20 am

I didn't see a thread for the Ireland/Samoa game so I'll post here.
IF (big IF), Samoa beat Ireland & Ire don't get a losing bonus pt then Scot will qualify for the 1/4 finals with a canceled game. I think Townsend & Scottish rugby will have a different view.
A bit of spotlight put on Bundi Aki this week due to his Samoan connections & heritage. It would be pretty funny if he answered Samoa's Haka with one of his own although I can't really see that happening.
Conner O Shea & Italy have every right to feel aggrieved but his last game in charge was a draw with the AB's.
And finally Eddie Jones just had to have a say and blame Scotland for not getting through if the game is called off. Fair enough but hard work trying to like the guy. I'm sure the Scottish players, coaches are feeling unnerved & this certainly doesn't help.

by The Great Aukster Fri 11 Oct 2019, 8:47 am

Eddie Jones is an arrogant wind-up merchant. He couldn't stop smirking when saying how disappointed he was that their hardest game was called off.

by hugehandoff Fri 11 Oct 2019, 8:51 am

All along we heard about the risk of typhoons and that there contingencies in place.....only now we discover that those contingencies are just cancellations. Very poor organisation and of course these affected matches should be played elsewhere wherever that is. Fly both teams to Hong Kong, Auckland or Sydney etc and just play the match. We all know if it was NZ or Eng then this would not be happening. Fingers crossed for Scotland's match to go ahead on Sunday.

by Tattie Scones RRN Fri 11 Oct 2019, 8:55 am

The Great Aukster wrote:Eddie Jones is an arrogant wind-up merchant. He couldn't stop smirking when saying how disappointed he was that their hardest game was called off.

He's a wretched little Jeremy Hunt. Yes it doesn't affect you and you're not bothered by the call off, but perhaps spare a thought to the thousands of English fans who've been saving up for years for the trip of a lifetime to see their team play.

by Ninjarugby Fri 11 Oct 2019, 9:02 am

Very quiet from Bill Beaumont & Agustin Pichot. 2 months ago JS told us Pichot had a number of BIG opinions. Very mouthy indeed but lets see these guys step up to the plate now.
I've been & gone to Japan already but I have friends landing in Tokyo today to hopefully get another flight to Fukuoka I assume today. I'm guessing those flights could easily be cancelled. It wouldn't surprise me to see quite a few empty seats in the stadium tomorrow morning. Thankfully the Irish, (and Samoan) supporters already in Japan might have traveled earlier this week.

by Collapse2005 Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:07 am

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:Eddie Jones is an arrogant wind-up merchant. He couldn't stop smirking when saying how disappointed he was that their hardest game was called off.

He's a wretched little Jeremy Hunt. Yes it doesn't affect you and you're not bothered by the call off, but perhaps spare a thought to the thousands of English fans who've been saving up for years for the trip of a lifetime to see their team play.

Yeah at times Eddie Jones is a prize tool. Very unsympathetic comments from him re the cancellations. He comes across very smug lately. As much as I like most of the England team, England are starting to set themselves to head towards a cliff.

by tigertattie Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:11 am

I see Mark Dodson (SRU CEO) has rolled out the lawyers in anticipation of the game being called off.

I dont get how a laywer can get involved for WR following through with an outcome that was already set out (that if a game cant proceed its delcared a draw)

The rolling out of the ambulance chasers (likely employed by GC and FES) is as unsporting as WR's lack of proper contingency plans!

by SecretFly Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:16 am

I think the lawyers are there to be ready to demand a cancellation of the Scottish game if Ireland are smashed by Samoa.... Whistle

by **rodders** Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:48 am

I see Ireland now aren't happy with the state of the pitch for the Samoa game.... I have to say I am rapidly losing interest in this farce of a tournament...

by eirebilly Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:52 am

Seen images of it rodders and it looks like it will rip up in seconds.

In all other major sporting events, they get better and better. Not sure we can say this about the RWC, one of the worst yet.

by SecretFly Fri 11 Oct 2019, 11:04 am

I hear the pitch has been resurfaced three times since WC began? Correct?

Yeah, if true then it's well bedded in for the Ireland game. Cool

I think the WC has allowed itself to be used as an organising dry-run for the Olympics.
Japan, lovely place, lovely people, more than capable of holding a Rugby WC, but this time - weather, rules, closed roofs when not necessary, reffing decisions..... it's not been a great WC for smoothness, fluidity and competency.
Not blaming Japan. World Rugby bosses, the boys that tell every one else all the time that the game has to move on.... well, just do the basics right World Rugby, and organise a competent and fair contest.

by Collapse2005 Fri 11 Oct 2019, 11:25 am

rodders wrote:I see Ireland now aren't happy with the state of the pitch for the Samoa game.... I have to say I am rapidly losing interest in this farce of a tournament...

Yeah there have been some pretty poor issues lately. I blame world rugby.

by Poorfour Fri 11 Oct 2019, 11:32 am

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:Eddie Jones is an arrogant wind-up merchant. He couldn't stop smirking when saying how disappointed he was that their hardest game was called off.

He's a wretched little Jeremy Hunt. Yes it doesn't affect you and you're not bothered by the call off, but perhaps spare a thought to the thousands of English fans who've been saving up for years for the trip of a lifetime to see their team play.

Which, if you actually read the interview, he did:

An arrogant wind-up merchant said this to some journalists, who wrote:"Everyone's disappointed - we wanted to play against France," said Jones. "We have put a lot of physical work, emotional, tactical work into it, but the situation is one we don't control."

"I've just been walking around the streets and there are lots of people with disappointed faces. It's difficult for them, because this was going to be a special occasion, and we feel for them. We're lucky to have such great supporters."

"We found out officially this morning. There were rumours flying around last night so we were glued to our phones. We were preparing for the game, and when the game was on we were in game mode, and when the game was off we were in preparation mode. We can't control it. We're told what to do. We're participants in the tournament so we're told what to do."

“It is a great opportunity for us to regenerate, refocus and put a bit more petrol in the tank, so we’re really happy with it,” Jones said. “We had an idea before we came that it could happen and therefore, in case it does, you have to accumulate points in your games to put yourself in the right position. We’ve been talking about it all the time, about the possibility this was going to happen.”

“That is the way the laws are. All I can be happy with is my situation, I can’t compare [it] to someone else’s situation.”

Sources: BBC Grauniad

by mikey_dragon Fri 11 Oct 2019, 11:46 am

Eddies sleepy face just happens to look smug.

by Poorfour Fri 11 Oct 2019, 12:09 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Eddies sleepy face just happens to look smug.

And he's great at giving provocative soundbites. But when you listen to him talking in context, he comes across as much more humble and considered than he does in snippets. Except when he's being, as he puts it, "a bit naughty".

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 2:55 pm

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:Eddie Jones is an arrogant wind-up merchant. He couldn't stop smirking when saying how disappointed he was that their hardest game was called off.

He's a wretched little Jeremy Hunt. Yes it doesn't affect you and you're not bothered by the call off, but perhaps spare a thought to the thousands of English fans who've been saving up for years for the trip of a lifetime to see their team play.

Tbf he's paid to win with England, and it's not as if he's anything but his own man. No thoughts are being spared for anything else at this stage of the tournament but he could do with a better press officer/PR team helping him out perhaps.

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 2:57 pm

Ninjarugby wrote:Very quiet from Bill Beaumont & Agustin Pichot. 2 months ago JS told us Pichot had a number of BIG opinions. Very mouthy indeed but lets see these guys step up to the plate now.

Good point. Pichot happy to run his mouth at any and every opportunity where the player selection is relevant. Don't want to rub it in but you absolutely make your own bed - and he should lie in it. This is poor all round, let's be honest. No one comes out with credit from this, really, and it should never, ever happen again - the contingency plans were clearly not good enough. It's one day that's being rearranged. One day. That's all that was needed.

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 3:00 pm

rodders wrote:I see Ireland now aren't happy with the state of the pitch for the Samoa game.... I have to say I am rapidly losing interest in this farce of a tournament...

The pitches do seem odd. Dry, yet clumpy. Not like the old MS pitch that would come up in clods of mud, but like a dry version of that. The state of modern rugby pitches today is pretty impressive, it's hard to find a bad one.

Sadly, how much of this is due to hosting in a country where rugby is a fringe sport? Probably quite a lot. I don't imagine any other major country would have failed to reschedule games - whether different days, different stadia, or whatever - were there 1 day where games could not be payed because of the weather.

Multi purpose stadia are a great idea...until they're not.

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 3:00 pm

SecretFly wrote:I think the WC has allowed itself to be used as an organising dry-run for the Olympics.

Precisely that.

by Engine#4 Fri 11 Oct 2019, 4:05 pm

Ireland's tactics for Samoa exposed https://mobile.twitter.com/BBCSPORTNI/status/1182549916339470336

For those who don't want to click - they are lifting a part of the turf and hiding the ball underneath

by SecretFly Fri 11 Oct 2019, 4:19 pm

That's all we need. World Rugby are sensitive boyos these days.

"Ireland disqualified for bringing Rugby into disrepute by mocking turf covering on field of play."

by Engine#4 Fri 11 Oct 2019, 4:53 pm

SecretFly wrote:That's all we need. World Rugby are sensitive boyos these days.

"Ireland disqualified for bringing Rugby into disrepute by mocking turf covering on field of play."

Yet they'll say nothing when New Zealand take it a step further and hide loose forwards offside under the rug in the knockout stages.

by Pie Fri 11 Oct 2019, 5:45 pm

England are more undercooked than my wife's Thanksgiving turkey.......Jones now has to get past Aus and then NZ....Aus perhaps, NZ...night night Eddie.

by Old Man Fri 11 Oct 2019, 5:55 pm

Engine#4 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:That's all we need. World Rugby are sensitive boyos these days.

"Ireland disqualified for bringing Rugby into disrepute by mocking turf covering on field of play."

Yet they'll say nothing when New Zealand take it a step further and hide loose forwards offside under the rug in the knockout stages.

Geez mate, don’t you think that is just a tad over the top?

by SecretFly Fri 11 Oct 2019, 5:59 pm

Only when they're uncovered.

by Poorfour Fri 11 Oct 2019, 6:03 pm

Pie wrote:England are more undercooked than my wife's Thanksgiving turkey.......Jones now has to get past Aus and then NZ....Aus perhaps, NZ...night night Eddie.

Because Australia don't look well below their best and NZ aren't remotely undercooked either?

Australia huffed and puffed against Georgia today, and Wales should never have allowed them back into the game. Their scrum is much improved, but England (and Ireland) did at least as well against Wales's scrum and I would still fancy them to have the edge up front. This match is not going to be dissimilar to an Autumn International opener. England have to be quick out of the blocks, but they've shown the ability to do that.

As for New Zealand, they did well against South Africa, and ran in big scores against Canada and Namibia - but Canada and Namibia are 21 places and 30 ranking points below them. They haven't really shown anything of what they're capable of - except that South Africa showed that if you play with ferocity, you can get them on the back foot. England are very capable of doing that - and can probably sustain it for 60 minutes rather than 40, which gives them a chance.

by Taylorman Fri 11 Oct 2019, 9:06 pm

Old Man wrote:
Engine#4 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:That's all we need. World Rugby are sensitive boyos these days.

"Ireland disqualified for bringing Rugby into disrepute by mocking turf covering on field of play."

Yet they'll say nothing when New Zealand take it a step further and hide loose forwards offside under the rug in the knockout stages.

Geez mate, don’t you think that is just a tad over the top?

Yes there are still those that think the key to NZ's success is cheating. Thats why everyone ends up saying...in shock...geez, NZ have gone to another level...if I could count the times NZ turn it on when theyre looking 'undercooked'.. Rolling Eyes

Of all sides here NZ have far more potential, new wingers, new 10,15 combo, new loosie setup, new front row now Franks has gone. Huge midfield and 9/10 depth. They havent even started. I see another storm brewing.

Sure all that are also reasons to falter terribly, but I dont see that happening purely because the sides at this comp are lower in quality than previous tournaments.

by Taylorman Fri 11 Oct 2019, 9:38 pm

What if Samoa were to beat Ireland to no points tonight. Wouldnt that be something else. Cant see it but it would mean the Scots lawyers, CEOs, reporters can all get off the case. I think its disrupting the sides prep, especially when Japan get accused of wanting the game called off.

Poor. Focus on what you can control, and let World rugby do its job without having to pander to the bias of some not willing to take into account the safety factor as willingly as others.

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 9:41 pm

I doubt they've got Ryan Wilson leading the solicitors tbh T. Doubt it's made any impact on Scotland whatsoever. Legal challenge is fair in this instance. Very harsh to cancel games and knock teams out - they'll have to justify their decisions in the courts. Imagine Italy will be mounting something as we speak.

by Taylorman Fri 11 Oct 2019, 9:52 pm

The Italy match is a non event in terms of the quarters. They were not going to beat NZ in a month of Sundays. Yes they were robbed of the chance but anyone suggesting an upset as has happened is in la la land. NZ put 60 on Italy twice in Rome since the last world cup, and those are during the AI's when we are at our worst for the season, no one else has got near doing that. Them away from home? Nah.

That was all about those players retiring looking to spend their final test in a major stadium vs the no. 1 side.

Thats no reason to launch a case against a typhoon. Common sense seems to go out the door for some.

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:21 pm

It's not a non event. Even if they didn't win, they'd give NZ a game, and that means loss of form, injuries, red card suspensions etc. - as well as the very outside chance that Italy beat them.

by Taylorman Fri 11 Oct 2019, 10:31 pm

miaow wrote:It's not a non event. Even if they didn't win, they'd give NZ a game, and that means loss of form, injuries, red card suspensions etc. - as well as the very outside chance that Italy beat them.

Yes, like any game, but that’s not enough to launch a legal battle. It’s just a game that now isn’t their last. Those items, mostly exceptions, re irrelevant in context of the decision. Likelihood is they’ll get crushed by 50 and nothing else will happen. Wow, that’s worth contesting for

by Guest Fri 11 Oct 2019, 11:16 pm

So the possibilities of a game don't matter. In which case I'm sure you wouldn't argue with the ABs going out were roles reversed. Because it doesn't matter if the ABs were favourites. Rules are rules. Also no givesies backsies - so stop the legal stuff!

by Taylorman Sat 12 Oct 2019, 1:48 am

Well we had similar at the cricket, didn’t force a legal battle then when popular opinion was everyone else would have.

One side managed to take the typhoon impact out of play, the other didn’t. Again, one of the 2007 tournament learnings. Don’t let things out of your control determine your fate. Win and you remain in control. Italy didn’t so became vulnerable to things outside their control.

Scotland face the same.

by Engine#4 Sat 12 Oct 2019, 3:14 am

Taylorman wrote:
Old Man wrote:
Engine#4 wrote:
SecretFly wrote:That's all we need. World Rugby are sensitive boyos these days.

"Ireland disqualified for bringing Rugby into disrepute by mocking turf covering on field of play."

Yet they'll say nothing when New Zealand take it a step further and hide loose forwards offside under the rug in the knockout stages.

Geez mate, don’t you think that is just a tad over the top?

Yes there are still those that think the key to NZ's success is cheating. Thats why everyone ends up saying...in shock...geez, NZ have gone to another level...if I could count the times NZ turn it on when theyre looking 'undercooked'..

Of all sides here NZ have far more potential, new wingers, new 10,15 combo, new loosie setup, new front row now Franks has gone. Huge midfield and 9/10 depth. They havent even started. I see another storm brewing.

Sure all that are also reasons to falter terribly, but I dont see that happening purely because the sides at this comp are lower in quality than previous tournaments.

Ah lighten up kiss

by Taylorman Sat 12 Oct 2019, 3:33 am

? That was lightening up appletini

by Pie Sat 12 Oct 2019, 4:10 am

Taylorman wrote:Well we had similar at the cricket, didn’t force a legal battle then when popular opinion was everyone else would have.

One side managed to take the typhoon impact out of play, the other didn’t. Again, one of the 2007 tournament learnings. Don’t let things out of your control determine your fate. Win and you remain in control. Italy didn’t so became vulnerable to things outside their control.

Scotland face the same.

Only the dumb

You lost

by Taylorman Sat 12 Oct 2019, 5:25 am

So did Italy. So will Scotland if they don’t play.

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