Silly Season Transfer Rumours 19/20

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mikey_dragon wrote:It’s an unfortunate coincidence I think, but his injury record was exemplary before he linked up with Bath.

His last lengthy injury was a collarbone issue suffered in a Wales training camp. Probably a bit of a mixed bag. It's hard once you start getting injuries to get out of the cycle as often one leads to another, Falatau managed to break the same arm some four or five months apart. Something Billy Vunipola managed as well.

I think Carlos is right. With the financial squeeze clubs are going to look for more value for money and less marquee names. Johnny May certainly found that when he went to discuss his new contract as did Ben Youngs.

That is a good bit more than he will get at Edinburgh i guess!

It is s short career at the end of the day, can't blame him for looking after his own interests

Who'd have thought a player that joined with the intention of qualifying via residency would be off at the first sign of more cash. Didn't he play got Montpellier before Edinburgh as well?

If he can get a three year deal at £300k a year whilst still getting selected for Scotland he'll be sorted financially going into his late twenties and the opportunity for one more big contract before retiring home to SA. From the business side of things good choice. On the basis of wanting to win trophies and accomplishments then probably not the greatest choice but how many top sides spend their salary cap on fancy wingers, not many in England.

BigGee wrote:That is a good bit more than he will get at Edinburgh i guess!

It is s short career at the end of the day, can't blame him for looking after his own interests

It's more than what Jonny May is on.

Welly wrote:

BigGee wrote:That is a good bit more than he will get at Edinburgh i guess!

It is s short career at the end of the day, can't blame him for looking after his own interests

It's more than what Jonny May is on.

Well I guess that is the premium that Worcester will have to pay to pull in big players. You would imagine he will have a release clause negotiated in!

You do wonder as well if that is the sort of player Worcester should be spending their money on, especially given he is going to going to be away with Scotland a lot.

Hell of a loss if Duhan leaves Edinburgh - it has mercenary for hire written on it. You need to do everything to keep him there. The team is close to building something good and you feel a weapon like VDM is vital to that.

It wouldn’t be good business for Wuss either. They could probably use the money to invest up front and at halfback.

I think Edinburgh have Mata, Ritchie, Watson and Duhan all up for contract renewal. Never going to keep all four realistically from a financial standpoint.

mikey_dragon wrote:Hell of a loss if Duhan leaves Edinburgh - it has mercenary for hire written on it. You need to do everything to keep him there. The team is close to building something good and you feel a weapon like VDM is vital to that.

It wouldn’t be good business for Wuss either. They could probably use the money to invest up front and at halfback.

Hougaard at scrum half and then Weir and Searle at flyhalf are good options for Wuss. I'd agree though spend the cash on the tight five. A destructive Bok prop would probably be better value.

Carlos, you're right they won't keep all of those 4. Watson is at an age where if he waits two more years the big offers might not be there. If he goes now then he could get a very hefty three year deal that'll set him up post rugby. Ritchie and Mata might stay, Mata has opted to stay despite interest before. Certainly the winger is the bottom of the list of those three when it comes to importance to the squad.

Both Scottish teams could be getting picked clean this year, we are really going to struggle to hang onto any of our good players I think.

The English salary cap is reducing and a lot of English clubs don't have massive budgets at the minute. Tigers estimate they are losing something like a million quid a month in turnover because there's no crowds in the stadium.

French teams on the other hand might be throwing money around who knows.

Having said that if Tigers are losing Taufua I bet we could get Ritchie for less and I'd take that.

Player movement will be unpredictable for a few years I think. Wages already seemed to be coming down a bit judging by rumours. Nadolo joined Tigers for circa £200k a year. Brilliant money of course in the scheme of things but not what you'd have expected him to fetch a few years back when French clubs were paying big, the Prem salary cap had been raised and Japan had joined the market.

I think that sort of offer for Duhan will be the exception rather than expectation. At Worcester Duhan and Hougaard would be the clear marquee players outside the cap then the rest of their squad has a lot of good players in it but they don't have many names that jump out as big earners.

Nadolo took less money at Tigers because his wife wanted to be in an English speaking country and he wanted to play international rugby again. He'd made the big money and then decided there's more to life than just money (easy decision when the bank balance looks good already).

I think 200k is an optimistic estimation. I was quite interested to see what you got him for when he signed and seen reports ranging from 250k to 300k, a fair price really for his age and ability.

Sgt_Pooly wrote:I think 200k is an optimistic estimation. I was quite interested to see what you got him for when he signed and seen reports ranging from 250k to 300k, a fair price really for his age and ability.

Rumours at the time were that we could only offer May £200k so he opted to go and used the cash instead to bring in Nadolo. Unlike Montpellier we wouldn't stand in his way regards international rugby and his wife wanted to be in an English speaking country following the birth of their first child.

At the same time Ben Youngs took a substantial pay cut as well.

Wait until you see the Irish exodus in 2021 if the IRFU don't get their fingers out. There will no doubt be offers flying about and there are plenty of quality, young players that Farrell has chosen to ignore for international duty.

It's ok Pete, you have plenty of NZ and South African players that can take their place

The question is, why aren't Ireland targeting more islanders like everyone else? Unless Aki counts...

Talk that Dean Richards is in talks to bring Carl Fearns to KP.

Now THAT would be a signing. It would also suggest that our back row injury problems are bigger (longer term) than we thought.

Imagine Wilson, Gary Graham and Carl Fearns in the same back row...ouch.

Edit

We're also being linked with Argentina Players Grondona (back row) and Mateo Carreras (back three).

Pete330v2 wrote:Wait until you see the Irish exodus in 2021 if the IRFU don't get their fingers out. There will no doubt be offers flying about and there are plenty of quality, young players that Farrell has chosen to ignore for international duty.

Might help you out with a number of the older players opting to take contracts overseas with the younger guys more likely to be swayed with the promise of more international recognition. Ireland are sort of stable at their level by hanging onto their older pros. You seems to have plenty of good young players, keep those and build them up in the good structures the provinces have in place. 

Big issue will be where there's dual qualified players who other unions might want to tempt but Ireland can't really complain about that.

Mikey, 5 year residency rules now. Much harder to bring in Boks and Kiwis to bolster the international squad now.

Adam Hastings has apparently signed for Gloucester for next season.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Talk that Dean Richards is in talks to bring Carl Fearns to KP.

Now THAT would be a signing. It would also suggest that our back row injury problems are bigger (longer term) than we thought.

Imagine Wilson, Gary Graham and Carl Fearns in the same back row...ouch.

Edit

We're also being linked with Argentina Players Grondona (back row) and Mateo Carreras (back three).

What exactly do they do in training??? So many long term injuries but I would still be a bit surprised with Fearns, unless he's not enjoying P2??

Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

I would agree ordinarily...but it depends how long term our injuries are. We are still short of Hardie, Welch, Chick...
De Walt the number 8 is apparently back to full fitness now, so might get a bench appearance this weekend along with Mark Wilson.

But Carl Fearns is one of those powerhouses you would take anyway.

At 31 (32 shortly after the season ends) it'll be his last big contract and a short term option for Falcons. Another flanker in the same age bracket as Hardie Van Der Walt, Wilson and Welch. Could lead to you needing to rebuild the backrow en masse in the near future. He'd certainly make an impact this season if he's fit.

Well Dean does like experience so age isnt a problem (Nili Latu wasnt young when he signed and was a massive player for us)...and the one thing we probably miss in the back row is some sheer power and mass.
De Walt will help in that mind.

Graham is a key player and Collett is finally showing the ability we all expected a few years back. Chick is still young and a key player when he is fit.

I don't think Hardie will be with us much longer, and Welch is a broken man these days. I dont think hell come back as a first choice. He'll be a good back up and managed properly.  

Basham, Tom Marshall are all being brought through now in the Euros (they need a stone on them physically ) and Farrar is ahead of them and clearly rated by Dean. Hes a unit at 6 but he wil also develop physically.  

Thats leaves Guy Graham who i believe is out on loan.

So im not really worried about us ending up with an aging back row.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

Where is Cippers going, championship? Glaws were linked with Jarrod Evans as well as Adam Hastings. Losing Jarrod would be a huge blow, he’s the second coming. If only a certain deluded coach would give him game time.

Seems a bit weird. Cipriani played very well for Gloucester and according to reports, however accurate they may or may not be, he was happy there. Hope he lands well somewhere.

mikey_dragon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

Where is Cippers going, championship? Glaws were linked with Jarrod Evans as well as Adam Hastings. Losing Jarrod would be a huge blow, he’s the second coming. If only a certain deluded coach would give him game time.

They've confirmed they are looking to the future and the present with a Hastings, Lloyd Evans and young George Barton. I can't see them going after another flyhalf with those three on the books and Twelvetrees able to cover unless that flyhalf wants to join immediately as with Hastings not joining until the summer and Twelvetrees injured they are looking a bit light.

Doc, the horrible business surrounding the death of Miss Flack hit Cipriani hard. I wonder if he's planning to love a long way away and start again. Head to Japan and start fresh. At his age the Japanese league should allow him to play for longer and will top up his pension nicely.

doctor_grey wrote:Seems a bit weird.  Cipriani played very well for Gloucester and according to reports, however accurate they may or may not be, he was happy there.  Hope he lands well somewhere.  

His form after Lockdown 1 was pretty horendous, perhaps in part for reasons Sam outlined. He was pulled early from their first game of this season at Welford Road and has not been seen since.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

Where is Cippers going, championship? Glaws were linked with Jarrod Evans as well as Adam Hastings. Losing Jarrod would be a huge blow, he’s the second coming. If only a certain deluded coach would give him game time.

They've confirmed they are looking to the future and the present with a Hastings, Lloyd Evans and young George Barton. I can't see them going after another flyhalf with those three on the books and Twelvetrees able to cover unless that flyhalf wants to join immediately as with Hastings not joining until the summer and Twelvetrees injured they are looking a bit light.

Doc, the horrible business surrounding the death of Miss Flack hit Cipriani hard. I wonder if he's planning to love a long way away and start again. Head to Japan and start fresh. At his age the Japanese league should allow him to play for longer and will top up his pension nicely.

He was recently engaged to a woman with school age kids (and a grand child) so may not want to be moving too far away. I wonder if there are any Celeb Reality Shows coming up?

LondonTiger wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

Where is Cippers going, championship? Glaws were linked with Jarrod Evans as well as Adam Hastings. Losing Jarrod would be a huge blow, he’s the second coming. If only a certain deluded coach would give him game time.

They've confirmed they are looking to the future and the present with a Hastings, Lloyd Evans and young George Barton. I can't see them going after another flyhalf with those three on the books and Twelvetrees able to cover unless that flyhalf wants to join immediately as with Hastings not joining until the summer and Twelvetrees injured they are looking a bit light.

Doc, the horrible business surrounding the death of Miss Flack hit Cipriani hard. I wonder if he's planning to love a long way away and start again. Head to Japan and start fresh. At his age the Japanese league should allow him to play for longer and will top up his pension nicely.

He was recently engaged to a woman with school age kids (and a grand child) so may not want to be moving too far away. I wonder if there are any Celeb Reality Shows coming up?

The only two of note I believe have finished and shortly to finish. The Jungle of somewhere in Wales, I think has finished but I have no real idea. Strictly final is this weekend with my wife's prosecco already chilling in the fridge.

Unsure what else it could be. The Japanese season is short so he wouldn't have to spend that much time away from home and would be back for the summer holidays.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:Danny Cipriani leaves Glaws with immediate effect. Leaves them a bit short unless someone else is in bound soon.

Not sure Falcons need another backrow though he is a beast.

Where is Cippers going, championship? Glaws were linked with Jarrod Evans as well as Adam Hastings. Losing Jarrod would be a huge blow, he’s the second coming. If only a certain deluded coach would give him game time.

They've confirmed they are looking to the future and the present with a Hastings, Lloyd Evans and young George Barton. I can't see them going after another flyhalf with those three on the books and Twelvetrees able to cover unless that flyhalf wants to join immediately as with Hastings not joining until the summer and Twelvetrees injured they are looking a bit light.

Doc, the horrible business surrounding the death of Miss Flack hit Cipriani hard. I wonder if he's planning to love a long way away and start again. Head to Japan and start fresh. At his age the Japanese league should allow him to play for longer and will top up his pension nicely.

He was recently engaged to a woman with school age kids (and a grand child) so may not want to be moving too far away. I wonder if there are any Celeb Reality Shows coming up?

The only two of note I believe have finished and shortly to finish. The Jungle of somewhere in Wales, I think has finished but I have no real idea. Strictly final is this weekend with my wife's prosecco already chilling in the fridge.

Unsure what else it could be. The Japanese season is short so he wouldn't have to spend that much time away from home and would be back for the summer holidays.

I had completely forgotten about his loss, it must have hit him extremely hard.  In that context, I certainly get it and truly feel for him.  I thought Mick Cleary's column in today's Telegraph was quite good.  He is really one of the last truly attacking creative 10s in England.   Good luck to him.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2020/12/16/wherever-stand-danny-cipriani-one-thing-sure-rugby-will-duller/

I see we are linked still with Fearns.

Its been met with mixed feelings by the falcons fans. All of them seemingly saying we need to use the kids. Now i ama hige advocate of the kids, i constantly say it on here...however if Welch and Hardie are out long term, and no info about Chicks injury either...then for me its a no brainer to bring in an experienced unit like Fearns. The kids we have are great but they all need to get a few mince pies in them...(except Farrar whos a unit. )

Would you take Fearns at your club?

GeordieFalcon wrote:Would you take Fearns at your club?

Prior to Jasper Wiese and Cyle Brink joining this season, yes. Now I think Tigers are pretty stacked in the back row and would be better off throwing that money at a lock.

I know Leicester are pish at the minute but Jasper Wiese has been genuinely excellent since arriving. He reminds me a lot of Jono Ross for Sale. He just seems to do everything well the entire time he's on the pitch. Never going to challenge Vermeulen or PSdT for the Boks similar to Ross but doesn't mean he can't be brilliant in the Premiership.

I rate Fearns but whenever I heard his rumoured wage offers I remember just thinking, seriously? He's a unit and great in contact but frequently seemed to have as much speculation around him as top international back rows and I'm not sure he's at that level. If he were to join Falcons for more cash than Wilson is on I personally would say you're getting short changed.

If he was joining for more than Mark id be furious.

If Fearns were to sign on the cheap I'd be surprised. When he re-signed with Lyon amongst the Gloucester compensation stuff it was rumoured that Lyon offered him nearly double the contract he'd signed with Gloucester. He's rarely seemed an easy bloke to manage. Part of his reasoning for backing out of that Gloucester contract was Eddie Jones saying in a phone call that he needed to get fitter if he wanted to play for England and Fearns taking objection to it.

Obviously a lot has changed in terms of recruitment and wages since then but there are still clubs who will offer good money for a reliable and physical number 8 so I wouldn't expect him to come cheap unless it's just a short term deal to the end of the season to keep Fearns playing and in the shop window.

Fearns had offers from English clubs before he joined Rouen in the summer. Saints were supposedly one of them. I'd be surprised if Falcons got Fearns for less than £250k per season as his Rouen contract was allegedly pretty healthy.

In that case im not sure id be looking to bring him in.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/55337040

Jack Singleton remaining at Gloucester longer term.

Sanderson mentioned in an interview last season that Sarries were prepared for the possibility that loan players may not return if they settled elsewhere. I wonder if others will take a similar path?

Isiekwe isn't flourishing at Saints yet but Earl and Malins have been good for Bristol, are in/around England matchday squads, are playing at a club with impressive facilities and cash.

Lozowski's starts for Montpellier thus far have been at 10 with his first start at 13 tonight against former club Wasps outside the fantastic Arthur Vincent at 12. It's a shame that Fekitoa is injured as Gopperth/Fekitoa vs Vincent/Lozowski would be cracking head-to-head. A rotated Wasps side has Paolo Odogwu at 13 though so could be interesting in defence if Montpellier get front foot ball.

Elsewhere in that game is Alfie Barbeary vs Louis Picamoles at number 8 for either side though...

Singleton to Sarries was always an odd move though. As an England international and first team regular you agree to go and sit behind arguably the best hooker in the NH for two years. One year as it transpires but it's hurt his international ambitions already with Dunn now third choice and George/LCD by far the preferred test combo. At Glaws Singleton should be good enough to be the regular first choice.

Apparently Mateo Carreras has done an interview on Twitter in which he has confirmed he is joining us.

Might suggest also that the Santiago Grondona rumours might be true aswell...

Which means the Carl Fearns rumours are nothing...

George missing half the season with England and the Sarries rotation meant he'd have seen plenty of top end game time had the salary cap fiasco not hit them. Even bench time in the Champions Cup and playoffs would give him more big game exposure than starting for Worcester (or Gloucester currently) in fairness.

Given we are discussing hooker specifically it's worth noting that Yeandle was still starting ahead of LCD as recently as the 2018/19 Premiership playoff games for Exeter. So LCD was well installed as England's second choice hooker before starting the biggest games for Chiefs.

I thought it was a good move for Singleton to be honest, particularly as he was moving back to his home club that he was familiar with. Just a shame his form deserted him last season. Still a talented player and only 24.

Sarries have Woostencroft who I think is a massively underrated player. Great and probably cheap back up to George for me. Singleton seemed to me as an expensive back up though I suppose he wasn't an international when he agreed to go back to Sarries.

Chiefs are really good at rotating their players. LCD pretty much went from recovering from injury back to playing for England. Makes sense for Chiefs to manage him and use their club captain to ensure he's going to be fit and firing for the big games later in the season.

TRP suggesting Huw Jones is also heading south from Glasgow to the Premiership.

London Irish the favourites to sign him with Quins and Sarries also interested.

He would probably be the least surprising of the likely Glasgow departures in all honestly, seeing as we have hardly played him!

Rumour has it Saints are recruiting Tom Smith, Mooj, Tiny, and Garry Pagel to come back and play the front row, Timmy Rodber to partner Courtney Lawes in the second row, Budge on the flank, Pat Lam to come back and play 8, Matt Dawson to play 9, Paul Grayson to play 10, Ben Cohen to play 11, Bruce Rehana at 14 and Ben Foden at the back.

Not saying this will all happen, but even now, they could plus up the team significantly...........

I'm sure we all thinking of Tom Smith and his family as he undergoes yet more rounds of chemotherapy to combat the stage 4 colonorectal cancer he was diagnosed with last year. One of the best props to ever pull on a Northampton, Scotland and Lions shirt.

sensisball wrote: I'm sure we all thinking of Tom Smith and his family as he undergoes yet more rounds of chemotherapy to combat the stage 4 colonorectal cancer he was diagnosed with last year. One of the best props to ever pull on a Northampton, Scotland and Lions shirt.

Yeah, great point which should be recognised.  Glad you brought this up.
What he is going through is terrible.  Great player.  Great man.  Best wishes and more.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/55395847

Jamie Bhatti signs for Bath from Edinburgh to injury cover Lewis Boyce.

Bhatti should not have left Glasgow and got stuck behind Schoeman and Sutherland at Edinburgh. Currently battling for third choice for Scotland with Dell. This move looks like a win-win and a precursor to a permanent move if it goes well

Sadly as a lovely Xmas present the Bulls announced their new signing by showing a disguised photo that's clearly Marcel Coetzee. He's been bought out a year early which should mean Ulster having a few spare quid to replace him. How do you replace the unreplaceable?

They must be desperate for Coetzee to play at 8 against the B&I Lions, it’s not as if they have lots of money - i guess Bulls are the exception if they’re bringing all these players home. Munster have a spare 8 (Coombes) that you can try for.

Leinster have three number 8's of high quality in my opinion. Doris, Deegan and Conan. Ruddock even plays there. Surely Ulster can tease one up north.