Lions Announcement - Round 2

First topic message reminder :

Forwards: Tadhg Beirne, Jack Conan, Luke Cowan Dickie, Tom Curry, Zander Fagerson, Taulupe Faletau, Tadhg Furlong, Jamie George, Iain Henderson, Jonny Hill, Maro Itoje, Alun Wyn Jones, Wyn Jones, Courtney Lawes, Ken Owens, Andrew Porter, Sam Simmonds, Rory Sutherland, Justin Tipuric, Mako Vunipola, Hamish Watson.

Backs: Josh Adams, Bundee Aki, Dan Biggar, Elliot Daly, Gareth Davies, Owen Farrell, Chris Harris, Robbie Henshaw, Stuart Hogg, Conor Murray, Ali Price, Louis Rees-Zammit, Finn Russell, Duhan van der Merwe, Anthony Watson, Liam Williams.

Kyle Sinckler called up to replace injured Andrew Porter who suffered toe injury in Leinsters defeat to Glasgow

Unlucky for Porter but really pleased for Sinckler. Going to be great over there if he can avoid injuries himself. Does this mean we can revisit the squad calling game!

Missing out on the eve of a tour is heartbreaking. Same happened to Peter Clohessy in 1997. Tom English was talking the other day about how the tour manager tried to get his Lions kit back but Claw didn't want to return it. Keith Wood was asked to go and persuade hm. When Wood went into his room, he saw the player was an absolute emotional wreck, so told him to keep the gear. He gave it away to local clubs when he returned to Ireland.

Here's hoping Sinckler can do a Paul Wallace for the tour,

Who is next on the rank for that position?

'He’s showed some excellent form of late and I hope he continues to stick two fingers up to me about leaving him out in the first place.”

Lol.

No 7&1/2 wrote:'He’s showed some excellent form of late and I hope he continues to stick two fingers up to me about leaving him out in the first place.”

Lol.

What’s funny?!

No 7&1/2 wrote:Unlucky for Porter but really pleased for Sinckler. Going to be great over there if he can avoid injuries himself. Does this mean we can revisit the squad calling game!

Agree with you 7.5
Really impressed with Sinckler since the Lions announcement, he wore his heart on his sleeve and showed how much it meant to him but even better was how he applied himself in the face of that disappointment. Great character

Well done Kyle

The Oracle wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:'He’s showed some excellent form of late and I hope he continues to stick two fingers up to me about leaving him out in the first place.”

Lol.

What’s funny?!

The comment amused me as I'm sure he intended it to (to the general public).

Lions Watch

Watching the Saints v Exeter game

Saints 18-5 up with 14 men, 2nd half just started

Lawes having a great game. Dan Biggar showing yet again why there really shouldn't be any discussion who should be the Lions test 10

On a side note for the Scottish national side, it's great to see Hutchinson and Skinner having outstanding games

Sam Simmonds has just gone off, after a tackle from Lawes. He was limping but didn't appear to need any assistance. Later shot showed him with ice on his ankle.

flyhalffactory wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Unlucky for Porter but really pleased for Sinckler. Going to be great over there if he can avoid injuries himself. Does this mean we can revisit the squad calling game!

Agree with you 7.5
Really impressed with Sinckler since the Lions announcement, he wore his heart on his sleeve and showed how much it meant to him but even better was how he applied himself in the face of that disappointment. Great character

Well done Kyle

Really? Personally I wish the called someone else up after all the waterworks. Great character would be to just get on with it and not go crying to the media.

Collapse2005 wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Unlucky for Porter but really pleased for Sinckler. Going to be great over there if he can avoid injuries himself. Does this mean we can revisit the squad calling game!

Agree with you 7.5
Really impressed with Sinckler since the Lions announcement, he wore his heart on his sleeve and showed how much it meant to him but even better was how he applied himself in the face of that disappointment. Great character

Well done Kyle

Really? Personally I wish the called someone else up after all the waterworks. Great character would be to just get on with it and not go crying to the media.

Crying to the media implies he chased a journo until they talked to him. That didn't happen.

Delighted for Sinckler. He's a terrific tighthead who I'd back to go well in the warm-ups and push for a place in the test 23.

Disappointing for Porter though who's been impressive this season. It's always such a shame to see players ruled out before the start of the tour.

Agree, happy for Sinckler and I think he will go very well for Lions.  Shame for Porter who I also thought would have gone well for Lions.

If I were putting a Lions squad together (which is probably very fortunate for Lions chances of success) I would have had both Sinckler and Porter in the squad.  Not sure who I would have omitted.  I would not have taken Mako, though he plays on the other side of the scrum.

Absolutely gutted for Porter - the best you can say is that he's a young man and this won't be his only time at this rodeo.

https://twitter.com/FagersonMatt

An absolute gutter for Matt.

Too bad for Porter, I think he's as good as Furlong - let's hope we keep him fit. Great for Sinckler, he was a bit unlucky to be left out. I think he's a class player and should be on the bench with Furlong starting.

flyhalffactory wrote:https://twitter.com/FagersonMatt

An absolute gutter for Matt.

He's not the prop though, right?

mikey_dragon wrote:Too bad for Porter, I think he's as good as Furlong - let's hope we keep him fit. Great for Sinckler, he was a bit unlucky to be left out. I think he's a class player and should be on the bench with Furlong starting.

flyhalffactory wrote:https://twitter.com/FagersonMatt

An absolute gutter for Matt.

He's not the prop though, right?

Porter being as good as Furlong is a big call! For me Furlong is the top TH in rugby at the moment.

I rate Porter very highly and had him in my Lions squad before the announcement though.

Matt is the back row, Zander the prop. I think FHF may have meant to post that in the Scotland thread but ended up here by accident. A shame for Matt as he produced some of his best international performances in the Six Nations. I'll hold my hands up and admit that his performance against England was well above what I honestly thought he could do at international level from watching him for Glasgow.

mikey_dragon wrote:Too bad for Porter, I think he's as good as Furlong - let's hope we keep him fit. Great for Sinckler, he was a bit unlucky to be left out. I think he's a class player and should be on the bench with Furlong starting.

flyhalffactory wrote:https://twitter.com/FagersonMatt

An absolute gutter for Matt.

He's not the prop though, right?

Afternoon Mikey

No (I suppose it's a bit out of context) posted it on the wrong thread

king_carlos wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Too bad for Porter, I think he's as good as Furlong - let's hope we keep him fit. Great for Sinckler, he was a bit unlucky to be left out. I think he's a class player and should be on the bench with Furlong starting.

flyhalffactory wrote:https://twitter.com/FagersonMatt

An absolute gutter for Matt.

He's not the prop though, right?

Porter being as good as Furlong is a big call! For me Furlong is the top TH in rugby at the moment.

I rate Porter very highly and had him in my Lions squad before the announcement though.

Matt is the back row, Zander the prop. I think FHF may have meant to post that in the Scotland thread but ended up here by accident. A shame for Matt as he produced some of his best international performances in the Six Nations. I'll hold my hands up and admit that his performance against England was well above what I honestly thought he could do at international level from watching him for Glasgow.

Yeah mate, I posted that on the wrong thread
Matt is a tad light at 110-112kg (considering Faletau, not the largest is 122kg albeit 10kg heavier than Sam Simmonds who I've heard is pretty tasty ) Sayimg that he's only just turned 22 so the weight will come on in a few years. He had a great match against England but like Gray and Cummings he didn't kick on from that game during the rest of the tournament. He is part of an exciting crop of youngsters coming through at Glasgow

4 South Africans who play for Munster, including 2 in the squad to face the Lions, injured in ‘fire pit accident’. Not sure of details but hope they’re ok:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/57387445

The Oracle wrote:4 South Africans who play for Munster, including 2 in the squad to face the Lions, injured in ‘fire pit accident’.  Not sure of details but hope they’re ok:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/57387445

Sounds really nasty. Hopefully they all make swift recoveries.

Different sport but I remember when Shane Warne made his comeback in Australian domestic cricket for their T20 franchise league when it launched, a few days before the first game he had his comeback delayed by burning his hand whilst making breakfast for his kids. The initial response from many was it being a ridiculous way to miss a game until Warne posted a picture of his blistered, red raw and very painful looking bowling hand and suddenly the same fans went "oh s**t that's probably fair enough then".

Working in kitchens as a chef I saw plenty of injuries from accidents involving chef knives but the worst injuries I've seen by far are all burns of various kinds. Ones relating to fryers and hot oil have been the worst but seen plenty from grills, pans, BBQs, etc as well. Burns are absolutely horrible injuries especially when on your hands as it's pretty much impossible to do anything without aggravating the burn which then hurts like hell.

Bloody hell, sounds like Snyman and de Allende doubtful then.

That would be huge if they were both out.

Supersport Article

De Allende explains what happened

Jesus Christ. That certainly wasn't the smartest idea

Think Stander has a bbq and fire pit business too

https://fireboks.ie/about/

Im guessing it was DeAllende who threw the petrol on the fire

The steak holders

just throwing fuel on the fire.

From what I read, their burns were considered superficial. So hoping they both can play.

Reminds me of the Frankie Boyle joke:

People say that stopping the terrorist at Glasgow Airport saved a number of Scottish people from being horribly burned. That seems inconsistent with the three planes of Scottish tourists that flew the same day to their holidays in Malaga.

Collapse2005 wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Unlucky for Porter but really pleased for Sinckler. Going to be great over there if he can avoid injuries himself. Does this mean we can revisit the squad calling game!

Agree with you 7.5
Really impressed with Sinckler since the Lions announcement, he wore his heart on his sleeve and showed how much it meant to him but even better was how he applied himself in the face of that disappointment. Great character

Well done Kyle

Really? Personally I wish the called someone else up after all the waterworks. Great character would be to just get on with it and not go crying to the media.

Heaven forbid a player should actually allow their emotions to come out. His interview about being gutted on missing selection was after a man of the match performance where he talked about how he felt the need to set an example to the younger players at the club. I suspect when Gatland saw that he saw a man desperate to play for the Lions but who also was capable of being mature and respected member of the squad.

First thing Sincks did was offer his commiserations to Porter, which was the right thing to do after being called up as his replacement.

Emotion equals passion, I would rather have 23 players with passion than 23 without.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Collapse2005 wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Unlucky for Porter but really pleased for Sinckler. Going to be great over there if he can avoid injuries himself. Does this mean we can revisit the squad calling game!

Agree with you 7.5
Really impressed with Sinckler since the Lions announcement, he wore his heart on his sleeve and showed how much it meant to him but even better was how he applied himself in the face of that disappointment. Great character

Well done Kyle

Really? Personally I wish the called someone else up after all the waterworks. Great character would be to just get on with it and not go crying to the media.

Heaven forbid a player should actually allow their emotions to come out. His interview about being gutted on missing selection was after a man of the match performance where he talked about how he felt the need to set an example to the younger players at the club. I suspect when Gatland saw that he saw a man desperate to play for the Lions but who also was capable of being mature and respected member of the squad.

First thing Sincks did was offer his commiserations to Porter, which was the right thing to do after being called up as his replacement.

Lots of really good players missed out, Sinkler made it all about himself which was pretty weak in my view. If anything he set a bad example to younger players. Tears or no tears he had a fairly average year so can count himself lucky.

Just as a reminder about that interview https://twitter.com/PlanetRugby/status/1391088852887085057?s=19

Firstly talks about Bristol thanking his teammates family and the fans. Then is asked specifically about his week and the lions and asked 8f he used it as motivation. His reply saying it had been tough and didn't want to play the victim and wanted to set a good example to the kids, says its tough as it meant so much for him to be a lion. He says he wants to use the Anderson and upset and channel it to winning with Bristol for the fans.

All that after tweeting: honestly gutted not to be involved. Appreciate the messages of support. Not a time to feel sorry for myself and blame others. Let's get behind the squad, wishing the boys all the best.

The interview also came after his stand out performance.
So yeah can't agree with collapse there.

Fair play to the lad and I really expect him to force himself into the matchday squad. It's quite refreshing to see players in this light rather the robotic rolled out answers that we normally get.

Sinckler had an average year by his standards but outside of the Irish pair he's still the next best tighthead the Lions had available.

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Fair play to the lad and I really expect him to force himself into the matchday squad. It's quite refreshing to see players in this light rather the robotic rolled out answers that we normally get.

Top man
Totally agree with you Sarge, most of the interviews these days are almost pre-scripted, I thought to show such raw emotions revealed how much rugby means to Sinckler, he also was very humble and emphasised he didn't want to be seen as the victim. Fully deserves his spot

In recent weeks, a quick review of headlines shows Mike Brown, Beno Obano, Andre Esterhuizen, Ben Morris, Will Addison, Levani Botia, Matias Alemanno, David Ribbans, Damian Mckenzie, Lachlan Swinton, Sam Skinner have all seen red cards. I'm sure I've missed some.

Post-match discussion has also highlighted incidents where Robbie Henshaw, Codie Taylor, Sevu Reece, Tyrel Lomax, and Dave Ewers could easily have been red-carded. Again, there are probably other such cases.

There are some very experienced players in that list. It's hard to see how, in this environment, the Lions will avoid picking up reds acoss the tour. The same goes for the Springboks, though they usually don't play in tour matches outside the Tests, so will have fewer occasions to offend.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jun/14/biosecure-bubble-can-help-forge-lions-bonds-says-ken-owens

Anyone know the full details of the bubbles? They going full on like England?

No 7&1/2 wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jun/14/biosecure-bubble-can-help-forge-lions-bonds-says-ken-owens

Anyone know the full details of the bubbles? They going full on like England?

I'd presume full bubbles as with the cricket when they were touring over the winter. If they get a case in the camp this close to the Japan game and it runs through the staff then they'd have massive issues.

Does that mean the isolation from everyone after training or more the ability to mix within the squad in free time? Haven't followed the cricket protocols.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Does that mean the isolation from everyone after training or more the ability to mix within the squad in free time? Haven't followed the cricket protocols.

With cricket the players were in very strict bubbles (i.e. all backroom staff, hotel staff, chefs, etc catering to the players were bubbled as well hence it was so expensive) but the players could mix with teammates within the bubble.

In the Six Nations England were in a less strict bubble (some players did come and go after testing negative) but in the hotels they had to eat separately and couldn't mix. The canteen looked like a school exam hall with individual tables set up 2 metres apart for the players. To be honest I didn't really get that when they were doing maul practice half an hour before hand though!

To me the cricket set-up seemed to make more sense with their very strict bubble, 2 weeks quarantining in your room before joining the bubble, but once that is set-up with everyone testing negative you can let the staff mix more. That set-up has taken a mental toll on players though. Given England have just been hammered by NZ there have been suggestions by some that England are the only cricket team citing bubble fatigue and it's an excuse but in reality NZ, Australian and Indian players have also found it extremely tough.

When India were touring Australia earlier in the year there were rumours of some players with no history of mental health issues on antidepressants due to the strain. That was during a landmark Test series win for India away in Australia as well so not just a case of 'when a sports team is doing badly cracks appear'. That India team is outstanding, winning most their games and still struggled with the bubbles.

Ta. Makes sense. I had a horrible feeling that they may have been going the way of England and just trying to keep distance at all times other than training and matches.

Re the cricket performance id say its probably more to do with the inexperienced and not as yet brilliant top order and middle order at least in the recent past we could have relied on Stokes to win us one game with an epic fight back.

It was set out really early before we met and got together. We were told to wear our mask. We know how vigilant we have to be and how strict we need to be,” said Harris, who was described by Gregor Townsend in March as one of the world's best defensive No13s.

“We need to call each other out if anyone isn’t following the protocols. It’s really important that we do that because we can’t risk catching it and risk it spreading.” A social committee has already been assembled with a key date looming in the diary on Friday when England clash with Scotland in the group stage of Euro 2020.



“The game will be on in the team room. The Scotland game was on in the team room on Monday afternoon,” Harris said. That was an unfortunate loss but there will hopefully be a bounce-back next week. All the football will be on in the team room when possible. There are boys who are into football who will be watching that. It’s something that’s put on that we can do together.”


Saw the above on rugby pass. Sounds a more balanced approach than Englands has been taken but clearly the law has been laid down. Hopefully the Scottish lads take the loss well on Friday.

Murray nterview

AWJ thinks he can make it back in time to take part on the tour....

No 7&1/2 wrote:It was set out really early before we met and got together. We were told to wear our mask. We know how vigilant we have to be and how strict we need to be,” said Harris, who was described by Gregor Townsend in March as one of the world's best defensive No13s.

“We need to call each other out if anyone isn’t following the protocols. It’s really important that we do that because we can’t risk catching it and risk it spreading.” A social committee has already been assembled with a key date looming in the diary on Friday when England clash with Scotland in the group stage of Euro 2020.



“The game will be on in the team room. The Scotland game was on in the team room on Monday afternoon,” Harris said. That was an unfortunate loss but there will hopefully be a bounce-back next week. All the football will be on in the team room when possible. There are boys who are into football who will be watching that. It’s something that’s put on that we can do together.”


Saw the above on rugby pass. Sounds a more balanced approach than Englands has been taken  but clearly the law has been laid down. Hopefully the Scottish lads take the loss well on Friday.

As they are all vaccinated the risk is less so they can probably have less restrictions in terms of mixing outside of training. Just got to keep the masks on. England during the 6N was at risky time and the French insisted on a lot of tough measures as travelling for sport at that time wasn't really allowed in and out of France. Hopefully we're past the point we need super strict bubbles and an element of commonsense can be used.

Oakdene wrote:AWJ thinks he can make it back in time to take part on the tour....

No point. Weeks if stand down instead of working the lineout drills and ensuring peak fitness just means he's likely to be undercooked when he gets there. Not fair to him or those busting a gut in training.

formerly known as Sam wrote:the French insisted on a lot of tough measures as travelling for sport at that time wasn't really allowed in and out of France.

That worked out well for them - they went from 2 from 2 to 3 from 5 once they had their Covid outbreak, and were very fortunate in the Wales game get to win that extra win. Could have easily been beaten and stayed on 2.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

Oakdene wrote:AWJ thinks he can make it back in time to take part on the tour....

No point. Weeks if stand down instead of working the lineout drills and ensuring peak fitness just means he's likely to be undercooked when he gets there. Not fair to him or those busting a gut in training.

By all accounts AWJ thinks he can be fit for the first test.

How very selfless of him.