About v2Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
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Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Rugby Fan Sun 15 Aug 2021, 3:18 pm
https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-union/rugby-australia-to-scrap-giteau-law-after-yet-another-bledisloe-belting-20210815-p58iw9.html
Rugby Australia is set to scrap the contentious ‘Giteau Law’ criteria as soon as this year’s spring tour in an attempt to bolster the Wallabies after yet another Bledisloe Cup belting. As the Wallabies licked their wounds travelling from Auckland to Perth on Sunday, the Herald can reveal RA plans to broaden the pool of players that coach Dave Rennie has at his disposal by loosening the controversial Giteau Law...
...How the rule will change is still being examined by Marinos plus RA board members and former Wallabies Phil Waugh and Daniel Herbert.
Eddie Jones has previously called for the limit to be reduced to 40 Test caps. One option would be to bring the number of Tests required to qualify for overseas-based selection down as few as 15 or 20 Tests, which is just under two full international seasons.
Another would be to allow Rennie to handpick as many players as required, as he did with Samu Kerevi last week. Prominent players who are currently overseas and do not meet the existing 60-Test criteria include Rory Arnold, Will Skelton, Tolu Latu and Sean McMahon, but there are almost 100 Australian professionals with Super Rugby experience playing overseas.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by sensisball Sun 15 Aug 2021, 4:08 pm
It would make sense, the current situation is a deterrent to no up and coming players as the potential financial rewards in Europe are far above those available to players remaining in OZ.
If you get the chance to go and play abroad at say Clermont, e.g. Miles AMATOSERO who is a 19 year old giant lock, why would you stay and wait on the off chance that you get capped?
If Australia could play Will Skelton (La Rochelle) and Rory Arnold with Ritchie Arnold (both Toulouse) on the bench it would transform their lineout and scrum. Don't think they have 60 caps between them.
If you get the chance to go and play abroad at say Clermont, e.g. Miles AMATOSERO who is a 19 year old giant lock, why would you stay and wait on the off chance that you get capped?
If Australia could play Will Skelton (La Rochelle) and Rory Arnold with Ritchie Arnold (both Toulouse) on the bench it would transform their lineout and scrum. Don't think they have 60 caps between them.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Geordie Mon 16 Aug 2021, 9:25 am
Agree....plus they can now look at other youngsters abroad....young Lynagh for example?
They would have a massive second row...
They would have a massive second row...
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by mikey_dragon Mon 16 Aug 2021, 10:00 am
100? That's a lot. Aus definitely have some good locks playing in France! Not sure if the ones at London Irish are retired though. Like SA, Aus have some top players playing overseas and if they get them back in Green & Gold then the future for the Wallabies looks a lot less bleak (which is what some are predicting).
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by lostinwales Mon 16 Aug 2021, 10:12 am
I am not convinced Skelton would go back anyway. Maybe now there has been a regime change, but there was something about the way in which he left that makes me wonder if he was upset about the setup
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Hazel Sapling Mon 16 Aug 2021, 10:22 am
Long overdue. Australia Rugby is in poor financial health and it allows them to let the highly paid players to go to Japan, France or England, whilst also acting as a deterrent for clubs recruiting the young guys (market value will fall for Skelton, for example, if he is missing a month or two for the Rugby Championship every year).
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by doctor_grey Mon 16 Aug 2021, 10:38 am
I guess the timing works well with England are expanding to 13 - 14 top level clubs. Some of the players will be home grown, but others will have to come from somewhere.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Brendan Mon 16 Aug 2021, 7:34 pm
It is interesting to see the reactions on Oz and NZ sites to this.
In Oz most think few players would make a difference to their squad and that Skelton is no better than what they have. I think they think he is still the same as when he left. Other see it as a good thing and could be used to better use the money tied up in keeping players at home at underage and grassroots.
NZ seems to be all about the Trans Tasman and what will they do.
I think it has good and bad.
Pros is they can better use the money to rebuild Union in Oz. They also get players playing in Europe so their front row can learn to scrimmage. They also can bring players home at the end of their careers to help teach the youngsters.
Cons international is important but I wonder if RA will use it as a reason to not develop SR Au. Like in soccer might cause a disconnect with fans at international when a kid who left Oz at 18 as a no one gets a cap at 25.
In Oz most think few players would make a difference to their squad and that Skelton is no better than what they have. I think they think he is still the same as when he left. Other see it as a good thing and could be used to better use the money tied up in keeping players at home at underage and grassroots.
NZ seems to be all about the Trans Tasman and what will they do.
I think it has good and bad.
Pros is they can better use the money to rebuild Union in Oz. They also get players playing in Europe so their front row can learn to scrimmage. They also can bring players home at the end of their careers to help teach the youngsters.
Cons international is important but I wonder if RA will use it as a reason to not develop SR Au. Like in soccer might cause a disconnect with fans at international when a kid who left Oz at 18 as a no one gets a cap at 25.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Guest Mon 16 Aug 2021, 10:23 pm
Not sure playing in Europe is the be all and end all for scrummaging, Brendan! NZ used to be accused of being poor scrummagers but their scrum is generally strong even though the All Blacks players have always played at home and in Super rugby.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Brendan Mon 16 Aug 2021, 10:47 pm
The Oracle wrote:Not sure playing in Europe is the be all and end all for scrummaging, Brendan! NZ used to be accused of being poor scrummagers but their scrum is generally strong even though the All Blacks players have always played at home and in Super rugby.
It's being in a team where they work on it to a high level compared to the Oz system while NZ might be good at scrumaging that choice is not open to OZ players.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by mikey_dragon Wed 18 Aug 2021, 9:02 pm
I agree the current players are good, but in addition I would bring in Rory Arnold, Will Skelton and Tolu Latu. Bernard Foley is probably a good pick if you have another good kicker in the squad, and whatever happened to Tevita Kuridrani? Out of favour?
I think SA picked a bunch of uncapped players in who are based in Europe so they wouldn't get poached, but going forward I imagine more will be playing overseas. Another reason why they're probably not in a rush to cap Jacques du Plessis is because he's already tied to them. Jasper Wiese, Joseph Dweba, and Nicolaas Janse van Rensburg would get into most international teams one way or another. Ruan Botha and Jason Jenkins are also tied to SA but I imagine they would be on most international teams' radar.
I think SA picked a bunch of uncapped players in who are based in Europe so they wouldn't get poached, but going forward I imagine more will be playing overseas. Another reason why they're probably not in a rush to cap Jacques du Plessis is because he's already tied to them. Jasper Wiese, Joseph Dweba, and Nicolaas Janse van Rensburg would get into most international teams one way or another. Ruan Botha and Jason Jenkins are also tied to SA but I imagine they would be on most international teams' radar.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Old Man Wed 18 Aug 2021, 9:22 pm
You need to remember that SARU has Felix Jones, he was assistant coach during the RWC, but is now coaching consultant based in Europe.
His job is essentially to assess the SA players playing in Europe, and he is there to address communication and alignment with these players.
One of those tasks is to identify the form of the uncapped players that can be called up into the Springbok camp.
I think this is the first of his kind, quite innovative an appointment by Rassie
His job is essentially to assess the SA players playing in Europe, and he is there to address communication and alignment with these players.
One of those tasks is to identify the form of the uncapped players that can be called up into the Springbok camp.
I think this is the first of his kind, quite innovative an appointment by Rassie
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by mikey_dragon Wed 18 Aug 2021, 9:28 pm
I don’t doubt that either and it’s a great appointment, but I’m sure SA are also fed up of losing players. Two of your guys start at second row for France…
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Old Man Wed 18 Aug 2021, 9:44 pm
Well, I can rant about SA losing players to other countries and give you my honest opinion about it, but it won’t do any good, will just draw out negative comments from other country’s fans, so I just keep it to myself.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by No 7&1/2 Thu 19 Aug 2021, 8:19 am
There are layers of issues for areas like this. I was one of those hoping Pichot got in for WR last time as he was very open in the issue of money at international level which isn't popular but is going to be key. Clearly better rates of pay for international players can provide a better pull factor towards their 'own' team.
How you can possibly stop an exodus away from.your own league? Practically impossible when you can earn far more abroad. England seem to be one of the most successful nations in stopping this but there's clearly alot of money in the home league which helps.
I've said a couple of times that England needs to get better in capping dual qualified players arranging more second string matches could certainly help and may help fill the coffers too.
How you can possibly stop an exodus away from.your own league? Practically impossible when you can earn far more abroad. England seem to be one of the most successful nations in stopping this but there's clearly alot of money in the home league which helps.
I've said a couple of times that England needs to get better in capping dual qualified players arranging more second string matches could certainly help and may help fill the coffers too.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Old Man Thu 19 Aug 2021, 8:52 am
I have always wondered how football has so much more money than rugby union.
It is merely down to popularity of the sport?
How many more professional leagues are there in football than rugby union
It is merely down to popularity of the sport?
How many more professional leagues are there in football than rugby union
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by No 7&1/2 Thu 19 Aug 2021, 9:12 am
Certainly in Britain and more over the world in general the interest in football is miles higher. The sport has always had more money in England due to supporters attending games and also chairmen and other investors who have helped prop up the sport in a lot of areas. These days its sponsors and tv money, again like rugby this is focused on the top teams.
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Re: Australia To Scrap Giteau Law
by Old Man Thu 19 Aug 2021, 11:38 am
There is a possibility the Rugby Championship will be moved to Europe
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