Usyk vs Joshua 2

Fight seems back on for June, presumably at the Tottenham Stadium.
Usyk received permission from his government to take fight.
Lomachenko also given permission to fight Kamboses Jr

In the end Joshua has only had a minor reshuffle within his team rather than making wholesale changes to it as was expected after the first fight, so the curiosities lie a little more with Usyk in terms of preparation. Namely whether or not the events back home night impact his focus and commitment, and I guess the fact that he is now 35 and has been fighting only once a year since leaving Cruiser. Albeit he's a pretty fresh 35 year old.

You'd imagine that Usyk will be in command again if Joshua doesn't take him out early and I suspect Usyk might fancy the stoppage this time given how tired Joshua was towards the end back in September.

Volume and mauling has never been Joshua's style and I'm sure we've seen how many pundits and pros have suggested this is what he'll need to resort to if he's going to beat Usyk, even if that runs the risk of him tiring even earlier if it doesn't work. I just can't see him changing all that much given the circumstances so I'd expect him to approach it the way he usually does, upright, trying to work off a jab and concentrating on trying to land power shots to the head.

If Joshua has a better night than last time then I don't rule out that he could win even using that style, especially if Usyk isn't quite as sharp again. But that style coupled with the slight hesitancy and vulnerability which seems to have crept in since the Ruiz loss? He'd be right up against it in that case.

I might feel differently the nearer it gets (if indeed it gets confirmed) but for whatever reason I'm not really too excited about this. Usyk won the first fight relatively comfortably and I want to see an undisputed fight as soon as possible given how infrequently these guys have been fighting recently.

I guess the romantic fan in me just feels there's more glory, and that it looks better on a fighter's CV, if they really have to earn a rematch for the titles and prove it by beating another couple of genuine contenders to get back to the front of the queue.

Think the loser of the fight could easily retire tbh.

Yes Chris, I find it hard to predict how the rematch will go. Joshua will have to improve that's for sure. I felt that if it had been a 15 round fight Usyk would have stopped Joshua as he was gaining confidence and hitting Joshua with telling blows in the latter part of the fight.

Think you guys forget Holmes v Spinks 2...

Where the smaller fighter wet himself when Larry steamed out...Larry won the first 5 and the 14th and at least had six rounds after that were debatable and got stiffed..

Hagler v Hearns...Probably the only way Hearns loses that fight..

Surely a half decent Coach can get Joshua to sprint out of the traps....Hard to box a three stone heavier guy swarming.

AJ only needs to land once..

My guess is he does it...ko 3.

AJ has to get nasty and not let Usyk get set. Something from his earlier days such as when he won his first title against Martin. Punch, and punch HARD. Otherwise this will just end up going the same way as the first fight, with Joshua tired and clueless.

He lands, he hurts Usyk and there's no way back. He simply has to go for it. He's a 240lb 6ft 6 inch behemoth with sledgehammers in his fists. ****ing use them man!

Usyk won the first fight well but rounds 4-6 showed he can be outboxed, after eight rounds I had it even. I don't think AJ necessarily needs to go gung ho, increase the work rate and actually throw the right hand. If he's landing the right he will put Usyk on the back foot, im backing him to turn the tables.

Soul Requiem wrote:Usyk won the first fight well but rounds 4-6 showed he can be outboxed, after eight rounds I had it even. I don't think AJ necessarily needs to go gung ho, increase the work rate and actually throw the right hand. If he's landing the right he will put Usyk on the back foot, im backing him to turn the tables.

Problem with not going gung ho...Is that It gives a Champion Boxer that is ten times more talented time....

As for the right hand probably the second biggest Heavy upset of alltime was devised by Futch which allowed Braddock to neutralise Baer's right hand..

The cream of Soccer players...Basketball players...Footballers thrive on time and space...

Sure AJ can win by upping his rate but prefer to see him jump on him from his POV.

Though in fairness I hope Usyk knocks him out...Now he has made money the Bruno act has gone and he is Mr Street all of a sudden.

Under normal conditions I would say that Usyk would be significantly better in the rematch. He won the title in only his third fight at heavyweight and so he himself was still adjusting to the extra muscle mass he was adding as well as his tactics etc to reduce the likelihood of not seeing a punch and being knocked out. However these are not normal conditions for Usyk. AJ needs to focus on landing some bombs without running out of energy.

North Korea has tabled $90m bid to host this bout. Obviously never going to happen but the stadium looks magnificent - 120,000 seater

Some quotes coming out from Hearn today:

Cut off date for the fight, from Hearn/Joshua perspective, is July 23 - Joshua ‘needs’ to fight twice in 2022.

Hearn claims he has a deal to hold rematch in London - either Wembley or Tottenham stadium

Usyk’s team wants as much money as possible and have supposedly decided on Saudi Arabia.

Usyk has lost 22lbs in weight

Could be all bravado from Hearn but I see no logical opponent for Joshua if Usyk can’t fight by July 23.

I've said it before that Joshua needs to develop a straight jab. The so called experts are wrong in saying Joshua needs to wade in. He isn't Chisora who's happy to take a punch to land one. If Joshua can get a jab working as a weapon not just as a range finder for the right hand then he can win, if not Usyk will likely win in the same manner as last time.

Robert Garcia will be Anthony Joshua’s lead trainer for the rematch.

Mochyn du wrote:I've said it before that Joshua needs to develop a straight jab.  The so called experts are wrong in saying Joshua needs to wade in.  He isn't Chisora who's happy to take a punch to land one.  If Joshua can get a jab working as a weapon not just as a range finder for the right hand then he can win, if not Usyk will likely win in the same manner as last time.

Isn't that a sad state of affairs that AJ could unify with slow hands dodgy Footwork and a second class jab..

The 80s are often derided but Tubbs had fast hands.. Good feet....Witherspoon good defence and generalship....Thomas one of the best jabs in Heavy history....

Frank had a good jab and his right was tasty..

Pick all of them to beat him..If Usyk survived 5 rounds he could beat Bruno but Frank's jab would be a problem for a smaller man....Usyk Isn't quick..

Leonard was wonderfully skilled but Hearn's jab owned him...Until he tired.

Jeff Navarro wrote:Robert Garcia will be Anthony Joshua’s lead trainer for the rematch.

Any news on if this fight is officially made yet ??

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Jeff Navarro wrote:Robert Garcia will be Anthony Joshua’s lead trainer for the rematch.

Any news on if this fight is officially made yet ??

There’s been leaks that it’s July 23 in Jeddah.
But for the last 3 weeks Hearn keeps ‘promising an announcement’ but nothing yet.

Official announcement finally due sometime next week according to Hearn.
But Usyk’s manager says that fight will be on August 20, in Saudi Arabia.
Hearn says it’s an equal 50/50 split.

Disgraceful the ease in which these rich promoters..Boxers and golfers think its okay to legitimise serial human rights abuses and the disgrace in the Yemen..

No morals...No principles...Just sad.

Twas always thus unfortunately Truss - whoever puts up the most money usually gets what they want.

"Joshua’s promoter, Eddie Hearn, suggested any rematch would be in Britain, in February or March." quoted shortly after AJ lost to Usyk.

Have to say - I'm calling massive BS on that one...

Who'd have thought it - a boxer promotor talking absolute garbage.

Tbh it shows how confident Joshua/Hearn were on winning the first fight.
Offering 50/50 split for the potential rematch. Ruiz Jr got no way near that split.
So once Joshua got beat, Hearn was screwed as he knew Usyk will want ever last penny - as is his right of course.

Anthony Joshua has signed an exclusive deal with DAZN, 2 PPV fighters per year. Supposedly worth $50m per fight.
Adam Smith from Sky boxing not very happy.

Jeff Navarro wrote:Official announcement finally due sometime next week according to Hearn.
But Usyk’s manager says that fight will be on August 20, in Saudi Arabia.
Hearn says it’s an equal 50/50 split.

This was finally confirmed this afternoon

Jeff Navarro wrote:Anthony Joshua has signed an exclusive deal with DAZN, 2 PPV fighters per year. Supposedly worth $50m per fight.
Adam Smith from Sky boxing not very happy.

Dazn is doomed to fail....Canelo has been beaten...Bivol is not marketable... Joshua is on the way out...Benn isn't top quality...and Sky have got the better platform and scooped up plenty of Olympians..In the UK...

In the US...Crawford lacks the X factor...Porter does too and lighter weight fighters struggle to sell unless they are controversial like Prince Naz or Mexican....

Hearn should have stayed with SKY...May think it is clever to bypass them but is AJ still a huge draw. ??.. Fury is number 1 by a mile.

Dazn has more than 15 million subscribers worldwide, so while all things can fail, I think "doomed to fail" is a little strong. From a boxing perspective, they've clearly gone with the idea that if they have the two biggest boxing names in sport, they can masquerade as a prestige boxing channel while basically serving up junk the rest of the time (outside of Munguia and Garcia, I don't think anyone else is demanding seven figures from DAZN regularly), and then you hope the PPV buys from AJ and Canelo can break you even there while you make money from having JESSE RODRIGUEZ VS. SRISAKET SOR RUNGVISAI as your main fight literally every week.

Canelo got 15 million for Bivol...Fury has been paid more for all his last few fights as has AJ..

Usyk beats AJ he is pretty much finished...

I see your point Raf and it's a well reasoned tweet....Just with the standard of living chaos to come on both sides of the Atlantic and the lack of name fighters.

Not sure it will succeed...Certainly Haney. Spence and Crawford lack identity....The kid that beat Luke Campbell could be a star but I don't think he is good enough..

Alvarez's purse was $15mil but that doesn't include his 70% share of the PPV.

His purse was 15 million...

Alvarez got a guaranteed $15m + $25m from PPV share. This was confirmed by DAZN.

His purse was officially 15 million...Fury and AJ's purses are higher..

Not worth arguing about..Like Whyte taking 300k purse and moaning he only got 8 million for Fury because of his purse declarations..

Officially AJ and Fury get paid bigger purses...

Purses for their last fights

Alvarez- $15mil
Joshua- $13.8mil
Fury- $29.5

That Fury figure needs to put into context though, it was a mandatory defence where he received 80% of the purse bid, prior to that he received $5mil for the third Wilder fight. It's also estimated that Alvarez is worth more than Joshua and Fury combined.

Fury's official guarantee vs Wilder was $5 million. He got more (supposedly) for the Whyte fight but given the fact that, as Arum likes to say, they're still counting the digital purchases, it's safe to say it was almost certainly, like literally every Fury fight barring the second Wilder fight, a loss making expenditure. Fair play to him though. He's made $100m without ever actually being bankable. That's a helluva achievement.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:... Usyk beats AJ he is pretty much finished...

And where would that put Heavyweight boxing? We have a retired Fury + shenanigans (will he / won't he), we have a possibly retired Wilder (will he / won't he return), we have a twice beaten AJ, we have a Usyk who didn't want to hang around too long (and that was even before the Ukraine war), we have a Dillian Whyte who looked bad in losing to Fury, we have a Joe Joyce ...

No name Bertie wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:... Usyk beats AJ he is pretty much finished...

And where would that put Heavyweight boxing?  We have a retired Fury + shenanigans (will he / won't he), we have a possibly retired Wilder (will he / won't he return), we have a twice beaten AJ, we have a Usyk who didn't want to hang around too long (and that was even before the Ukraine war), we have a Dillian Whyte who looked bad in losing to Fury, we have a Joe Joyce ...

Yeah, there is a slight concern that the division could revisit its doldrum days of 2004 - 2008 if all of Fury, Joshua, Usyk and Wilder are to put the finishing touches on their careers (or simply get old and over the hill) within the next couple of years or so. Decent-length reigns, unifications and generally impressive showings might all dry up again if those four depart at or around the same time.

I think their exits are likely to be more staggered, though. We all knew Fury wasn't going anywhere. Joshua is going to be in a tough spot if he loses again to Usyk, but I don't see him hanging them up. He's just too bankable and still favourite to beat most of the pretenders on their way up. I wouldn't be surprised if Usyk is the first of the bunch to depart - can't quite put my finger on why, but I get the feeling that if / when he eventually loses he'll call it a day. Given his age, the fact that he's only been fighting once a year since 2018 (mostly through no fault of his own) and the delicate situation in Ukraine which might necessitate his involvement in some way again before long, he may only have a couple of fights or so left. Although he's done well at Heavy and his win over Joshua was excellent, I do think he has lost a step since his Cruiserweight peak. As for Wilder, I just think he doesn't know anything else and despite the Fury hammerings is still in love with the innocent part of the sport - basically getting in there and doing damage. Can see him going on for a while yet.

But Wilder's next move will be interesting. Presumably he'll want to win a title or a portion of it again, but Fury ain't fighting him for a fourth time and if Wilder-Joshua couldn't be made between 2016 and 2019 I don't see why it would be made now. I guess he'll be hoping for Usyk to win again. You pretty much know if you give Usyk a date and venue he'll show up, and Wilder will fancy his chances against him.

Usyk looks broader than ever...Joshua seems to be full of muscle again...

Still think AJ wins this time....If Garcia can make him storm out like Holmes v Spinks 2 the Ukrainian cruiser will probably soil himself...

No flash tactics.....No being clever.....Just jump on him...If you land he goes....

Visualise Hagler v Hearns..AJ..

I'm going with a Usyk repeat. Unless Joshua has learned how to throw a straight ramrod jab then it's the same as last time. Joshua has of course a puncher's chance.

AJ speaking about the first fight says he thought he looked like Ali in the ring (to be clear he means this how he felt inside the ring, not on a rewatch) and nobody in his camp told him otherwise so he kept going with what he thought was working. Interesting statement, because he definitely fought like a guy who thought he was boxing well enough, although I'm not sure how he mentally explained the fact that his right eye was swollen shut, but you probably do need to change trainers if apparently no one in your camp can see/has the balls to tell you you're getting pumped.

Yeah I saw those comments, raf. A bit strange as neither Joshua nor his team had the look of men who believed he'd won that fight when the final bell went. Not sure I really buy his statement that he was surprised when the verdict was announced. All a bit moot though, I guess, as he went on to say that, upon watching the fight back, he acknowledges that Usyk beat him by three rounds (his words).

Reasons for Joshua to be confident going into this. Usyk's that little bit older and has been fighting once a year since 2018. Even for a world class fighter that's a bad combination when you're 35 and someone who relies on sharpness and timing. I assume Usyk will be focused and properly prepared, because those things have always been a hallmark of his...But you can't be sure given the somewhat bumpy road he's been on since the last fight and how his attention has been divided. Not to mention that Joshua still did okay in the first fight despite deploying what most considered the wrong tactics. He was well beaten, but not absolutely disgraced the way some people were acting.

I'm still going for Usyk to win again but I'm expecting a better showing from Joshua.

One problem I foresee for A J trying to jump on Usyk is that he has been gunshy since Ruiz jr..

Sure he beat 20 stone Ruiz by Boxing defensively and Pulev is a past it stiff..

He will have to accept shots to land his own against a better boxer and can he do that ??

Picking AJ primarily because over 24 rounds he should land a shot flush somewhere and I don't think Usyk with his Cruiser chin can take it..

But Not with any confidence.

No way does Joshua beat Fury.

They didn't look convinced, but there was an idiot who shouted "brilliant AJ" while AJ was being humbled, so some members of his team clearly thought he was pitching a masterclass. I also vaguely remember seeing a video of AJ talking about he looked like Usyk in the ring when he slapped around Ruiz' Butterbean tribute, so maybe he isn't the best judge of his own work.

I personally thought AJ was only down a round after nine before Usyk stepped it up and closed the show, so I can understand him thinking he was looking good.

More I rewatch the first fight, more I like AJ's chances. I was pretty early on Usyk, so from a personal bragging rights perspective, I'd be chuffed if he kept 3/4, but the first fight was close enough and I think given the difference in age and overall experience, it's possible AJ will have improved more in the interim.

Sky Sports won the rights to the fight in the UK. Naturally will be on Sky Sports box office.
Sky Sports and BBC where the front runners.
DAZN seems like dropped the ball. Sign Joshua on a 10 fight deal but lose to Joshua ex tv partner...

Sky Sports Box Office price increase to £26.95 for the rematch.
Sky supposedly paid £25m to show the fight.
At that price point, Sky has to sell 926,644 to break even.

Ring magazine title on the line after Fury vacated

A good opportunity to move on from Fury, if that’s the case. He’s been a big disappointment hasn’t he? I guess we missed out on a good one when he was forced out of the unification so as to maul with Wilder again.

The *lineal-champ* stuff was nonsense, too. So let’s move on from that concept at least for the heavyweight division, which was anything but lineal throughout the last hundred years.
With his retirement (let’s take him on his word here-that takes some suspension of disbelief, I know) the line is broken once again, so it’s hard to see how there is any credibility in that monicker even if ‘they’ decide the next undisputed title holder deserves to be called ‘lineal’?

WBC has announced Fury must confirm via written statement of his retirement by August 26. Should he confirm retirement, Wilder will fight for vacant title.

Usyk won the the first fight with his boxing ability, speed and stamina towards the later rounds. I'm a little bit concerned for him after reports that he has "bulked" up. and wonder if that will have slowed him down as his speed was a big factor in the first fight. I am finding it hard to pick a winner as I didn't think Usyk had a chance in the first fight, but I'm leaning towards Joshua this time.

The Usyk weight gain stories seem to be misleading. Usyk says he lost weight and now has regained the same amount. Claims he’ll be around the same weight as last time.

Jeff Navarro wrote:The Usyk weight gain stories seem to be misleading. Usyk says he lost weight and now has regained the same amount. Claims he’ll be around the same weight as last time.

He just looks more muscle bound than he did before the first fight.

After the first fight I was kind of in that camp which felt that Joshua needed to make a rematch a dirty, attritional kind of deal - work on leaning, shortening the punches to the body, using his size and weight to smother Usyk and setting a hellish pace early, even if it ran the risk of gassing and getting taken out after the midway stage if it didn't work.

Now I'm not so sure. Kind of like how Wilder's attempts to reinvent himself for the third Fury fight was always going to go out of the window after a round or so once the stuff hit the fan and Fury made an adjustment. You know what you're good at and what's got you this far, and you should focus on heightening those strengths as best you can sort of thing, rather than over-complicate it. Even if Joshua did change his mindset and wanted to become an on-top mauler who kept things in the phone booth, there's the question of the offensive footwork he'd need to implement that kind of style against Usyk. Not something he's shown before, albeit Heavyweights seldom need to.

I've come round to the way of thinking that Joshua should keep it centre-ring and try to establish foot position there instead. Not be so cautious in the face of possible counters, accept he's going to take a few but be willing to throw the right as hard and straight as he can when the chance presents itself. Usyk didn't run first time out and there's no reason to think he will here, either, so Joshua will have his opportunities. I think he expended valuable energy by too much unnecessary bouncing and fencing in the first fight, when he should have been planting his feet.

I'm not sure how likely he is to pull it off fighting like that, but the more I think about it, the more I'm leaning away from the idea of him trying to fight Usyk as the 'bigger man'. Just don't think he's got the footwork, attitude and stamina for that. Needs to believe in his jab and commit to it (Usyk's jab is more perfunctory and really just a shot to keep his opponent's mind occupied, which Joshua needs to try and not fall for) and back himself to punch at the same time as Usyk. Usyk's not all that hard to hit - more hard to hit cleanly, and if Joshua can avoid falling into the trap of second-guessing himself and being wary of the shots coming back he'll have chances to make his power count.

I've still got Usyk 60:40 to win this in my mind overall.

https://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/joshua-vs-usyk-2-free-to-watch-on-megogo-streaming-vpn-required-3982015

Can't see how if you are much bigger and stronger than someone you wouldn't want to use those advantages..

Hagler and Holmes in Hearns and Spinks 2 realised making a smaller better boxer engage more than he wanted to was where victory lay..

AJ's best way to win is by taking Usyk out of his comfort zone and by forcing him to the ropes and cutting off routes he can achieve that.

The first fight wasn't a shutout by any means and Usyk has foolishly put on weight at the detriment to speed and stamina..

AJ can win by engaging him early and often..Save the centre ring stuff for a better boxer in Fury if he fights Usyk.