Usyk vs Joshua 2

First topic message reminder :

Fight seems back on for June, presumably at the Tottenham Stadium.
Usyk received permission from his government to take fight.
Lomachenko also given permission to fight Kamboses Jr

Inventing Johnson Klute wrote:Well know, his defence stats were not better and that's my point.  

If this was a fight between two middleweights I genuinely think people would have a different opinion.  Usyk was a passenger for very large parts of the fight, throwing pop jabs and simple combinations that had little effect.  For anyone who has ever watched boxing, it was clear that Usyk was panicked in certain parts if the fight and people only ever panic when they think they might lose.  

I don't get how you can think Uysk was a passenger for very large parts of the fight when he threw over 200 punches more than Joshua through the course of the fight. He was the busier man. Though Joshua was certainly a passenger for the last three rounds when he ran out of energy. The only time I saw Uysk looking panicked was in the 9th, which was when Joshua threw everything he had at his opponent, a bit like Holyfield's 'prophecy' round against Lewis.

88Chris05 wrote:Joshua's next move is going to be interesting. Unfortunately I can see another long break between now and his next fight...But let's assume the Heavyweight landscape doesn't change all that much in whatever time he takes.

I think an ideal scenario for him would be Fury giving up / being stripped of the WBC, which would likely fall into Wilder's hands, and then facing Wilder at some point in 2023.

I do think Joshua should retire and count his millions. He's short of the very top bracket of the division occupied by Uysk and Fury. But if he does fight on a 'redemption' tear up against Wilder probably makes the most sense.

Anthony Joshua was like that person at a wedding who decides to give a speech even though he wasn’t asked.

Fury just un-retired again
Which raises the bizarre question why on earth did he drop the Ring title?

Whatever that post fight ring speech of AJ was - I think that was the "real" AJ - swearing and more or less airing out his frustrations with the mountains of criticisms he personally has felt come his way, giving a form of justification of his achievements and direction in life and then he gives props to Usyk.  I haven't seen the fight yet - I only listened to a former two time world champion give a commentary of the fight - then I read the comments here.   That there were different viewpoints to how the fight went sort of makes the split-decision less controversial because some felt it was a clear win for Usyk.

So Hearn name drops Whyte 2 or Wilder as Joshua’s December fight.
Basically meaning Whyte 2 then.

Speaking about the fight. I think I had AJ up 2-1 after three, and he looked like he'd changed a few things, more body work, changed levels more. Varied his stance. Then I think Usyk goes 4-5. AJ took the Seventh on my arm, at which point I have it 4-3 Usyk. A clear Usyk 8th. Then the ninth. Don't have the punch stats, but I feel like AJ threw everything into that round, and from there it was one-way traffic. I looked at the missus as the ninth was happening and told her this is a disaster, because AJ almost never looks good immediately after he has an opponent in trouble when he's facing better fighters. Klitschko cracked him after he went down. Ruiz dropped him after he went down. And now, Usyk basically pitched a shut out from 10-12 after AJ looked to have turned it around. 116-112. I thought it was a really good fight, and made you appreciate the difference between good heavyweight (Zhang Cs Hrgovich) and the top dogs, because difference in quality between the two fights was incredible. Basically two different sports.

Usyk clearly won the fight but was never really dominant and outclassing Joshua. Similar to the first fight, when both guys started off and were fresh it was a close run thing. I thought Joshua tired in both fights which opened the door for Usyk to showcase himself a bit but I think it would wrong to conclude that it equated to a masterclass. Once a boxer tires, irrespective of how good they are, they will be vulnerable.

In context, its impressive that Usyk can win giving away such large size advantages. But the pudding does seem somewhat overeeged - maybe this is to protect Joshua who they want to establich a narrative can only be beaten by master boxers. For me Usyk is a very good boxer but is limited in how he can fight at heavyweight. Joshua is only a reasonable boxer for me (Frank Bruno level). Ive long felt back foot fighting in boxing is over credited as its easier to fight a style to make an aggresor miss than to be the agressor and land punches. And some of this creeps into Usyks work at heavy. He boxes well, but Im not convinces its a masterclass even against a Joshua who is quite limited in what he can do. But with the differnce in size, its not unsurprising.

Well all I can say is that Joshua was better in this fight than he was in the first, but still not good enough to beat Usyk. So where to from here?

Joshua's performance after the fight suggests that despite his wealth and outstanding career he is a guy with self esteem issues.

Greatness may have gone but no reason he can't bag an alphabet..Wilder would be a huge fight if one has a belt.

Usyk had his number but he still only beat Chisora by a round..

A big heavy who is less cumbersome should be licking their lips

Actually give Whyte a shout

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:  

Actually give Whyte a shout

Of course you do . One of these days you'll call a Usyk fight right, big boy

Usyk was the deserved winner. A J was much more competitive in this fight and defence was tighter but apart from the odd flurry such as in the 9th round he never looked like taking Usyk out. It is no disgrace though as the Ukrainian is simply the better and smarter boxer whose movement is too much for A J.

Where now for A J? Well he should do his best to avoid Usyk who he does not match up well against. A J should stick to fights against lesser lights for the next couple or three fights - rebuild confidence and repair his reputation and in a couple of years' time Usyk may be past his best or may have been toppled opening the door for A J.

CaledonianCraig wrote:Usyk was the deserved winner. A J was much more competitive in this fight and defence was tighter but apart from the odd flurry such as in the 9th round he never looked like taking Usyk out. It is no disgrace though as the Ukrainian is simply the better and smarter boxer whose movement is too much for A J.

Where now for A J? Well he should do his best to avoid Usyk who he does not match up well against. A J should stick to fights against lesser lights for the next couple or three fights - rebuild confidence and repair his reputation and in a couple of years' time Usyk may be past his best or may have been toppled opening the door for A J.

I'm pretty much with this.

Despite not winning as comfortably as I first thought, Usyk never really looked in trouble bar a brief spell in the 9th. He basically controlled the fight with AJ just not really doing anything. I was expecting AJ to really go after him from the off....put the pressure on him and make him feel his weight/height advantage. Instead, AJ just plodded around, throwing the odd jab and weaving from side to side.

I really don't know where AJ goes from this, he seems to have lost his identity as boxer. For Usyk, I see Fury taking him without too much hassle (majority points win perhaps).

The melt down post-fight by AJ was frankly embarrassing, you could see Usyk just looking at him in bewilderment.....I found it quite hard to watch.

I'm pretty sure I saw Usyk eye-rolling when Anthony was burbling on,just before the "three cheers for Usyk" bit. I guess that's why Mickey Duff used to be at Frank Bruno's shoulder during the post-fight interview. He should have been protected by his team - common sense tells you that you're not going to at your best at that point. Anthony's "street, street street" rhetoric is so tiresome. Lots of boxers including Bruno have the same story, or worse, but can get over themselves and evolve ...

Theres good fights out there for Joshua that he can make plenty of money from. I think his problem is that his boxing ability has always been playing catch up with his marketed image. Hes been presented almost from his from his first fight a great heavyweight champion and that the public were witnessing something special unfolding. He was given very opportunistic fights and titles early on to legitimize him as great champion and had a whole media team and platform telling him that from day 1. But hes never been able to grow into that billing and perhaps his bizzare post fight melt down was frustration at that.

From today's Telegraph

Anthony Joshua broke down in tears before explaining that his erratic behaviour in the immediate aftermath of his thrilling defeat to Oleksandr Usyk was a consequence of the anger he felt towards himself.

Upon conceding a split decision in the fight in Jeddah, a furious Joshua stalked towards the changing room before returning to the ring, grabbing Usyk's WBA and Ring Magazine belts and dropping them outside the ropes.

He then confronted Usyk, saying "you're not strong, how did you beat me? How? I had character and determination", before addressing the crowd with a confused rant about his past and his own shortcomings as a boxer.

Carl Froch accused him of stealing Usyk's moment while his gym mate and sparring partner Frazer Clarke said he should have been "saved from himself" by his team, who "hung him out to dry".

Hours later, as he reflected on a third professional defeat that places him on the periphery of the heavyweight division's elite, he choked back the tears before holding his head in his hands to mask his anguish.

"Am I proud of myself? It's really, really hard for me to say I'm proud of myself. I don't feel anything....just....I'm upset. Deep down in my heart. Ah man....ah. Trust me. F-----g hell man," he said.

Like anyone, when you're angry you might do stupid things, so I was mad. But then I realised 'oh s--t this is sport, let me do the right thing and come back'. I just spoke from my heart.

It's been so tough. You see AJ holding it together. I'm a hustler so I try and put things together. But it comes at a cost, a big cost. It will never break me, but it takes real strength not to break me.

And this was a little crack in the armour because I took a loss. With the speech I was just speaking about where I had come from. I was on the road....really.



"I made a transition through boxing, which helped me change my life. Bringing me closer to God and meeting so many amazing people. I just laid it all on the line with my speech.



"Let's not forget the champ Oleksandr Usyk who put on an incredible performance. I can't remember what I said in the ring because I felt so passionate, but I want to say thank you to him for taking part in a great, historical fight as well. It takes two to tango."

DAZN’s deal with Joshua is £100m for two PPV fights per year - this fight wasn’t part of that deal.
So I doubt they’ll be wanting him to be facing tune ups if they are paying him £50m per fight. And a dud opponent isn’t really gonna shift many PPVs.
Whyte or the trilogy with Ruiz seems about right

Am assuming Joe Joyce is not going to get a WBC shot any time soon so why not forget about the tired warhorses and take on Joyce?

Joyce is fighting Parker.
Joyce is already WBO mandatory and if he beats Parker he’ll be WBC #2.

It has been said by many that AJ has been learning on the job due to a lack of an amateur career a late start to boxing and rapid success that propelled him higher than his skill set and experience would normally allow.  After the Usyk vs AJ 2 fight someone said that AJ rather than spending 10 months in the gym and fighting once a year should be fighting every 3 to 4 months.   In my view the real learning only comes in the ring in real competitive boxing and not in the gym.  So I agree that AJ should have been fighting more regularly and his fights should have included reasonably difficult warm up fights.

Derek Smalls wrote:From today's Telegraph

Anthony Joshua broke down in tears before explaining that his erratic behaviour in the immediate aftermath of his thrilling defeat to Oleksandr Usyk was a consequence of the anger he felt towards himself.

Upon conceding a split decision in the fight in Jeddah, a furious Joshua stalked towards the changing room before returning to the ring, grabbing Usyk's WBA and Ring Magazine belts and dropping them outside the ropes.

He then confronted Usyk, saying "you're not strong, how did you beat me? How? I had character and determination", before addressing the crowd with a confused rant about his past and his own shortcomings as a boxer.

Carl Froch accused him of stealing Usyk's moment while his gym mate and sparring partner Frazer Clarke said he should have been "saved from himself" by his team, who "hung him out to dry".

Hours later, as he reflected on a third professional defeat that places him on the periphery of the heavyweight division's elite, he choked back the tears before holding his head in his hands to mask his anguish.

"Am I proud of myself? It's really, really hard for me to say I'm proud of myself. I don't feel anything....just....I'm upset. Deep down in my heart. Ah man....ah. Trust me. F-----g hell man," he said.

Like anyone, when you're angry you might do stupid things, so I was mad. But then I realised 'oh s--t this is sport, let me do the right thing and come back'. I just spoke from my heart.

It's been so tough. You see AJ holding it together. I'm a hustler so I try and put things together. But it comes at a cost, a big cost. It will never break me, but it takes real strength not to break me.

And this was a little crack in the armour because I took a loss. With the speech I was just speaking about where I had come from. I was on the road....really.



"I made a transition through boxing, which helped me change my life. Bringing me closer to God and meeting so many amazing people. I just laid it all on the line with my speech.



"Let's not forget the champ Oleksandr Usyk who put on an incredible performance. I can't remember what I said in the ring because I felt so passionate, but I want to say thank you to him for taking part in a great, historical fight as well. It takes two to tango."

This is a hatchet job. The actual conversation went

Usyk - You're strong.
AJ - I don't care about strong. I've got to have skills. Skills win boxing.
Usyk - unintelligible.
AJ - You're not strong. How did you beat me? How? *Because of skill*

He then follows it up with "I had character and determination". Pretty pathetic attempt at making an already unhinged rant look worse.

That's a really good point, No Name. Say that once Parker/Joyce is out of the way he could take that fight, and it would be a genuinely anticipated one which he could promote as high-risk blah-blah-blah, Sky Sports gubbins.
Naturally a Wilder show-down would be huge and if he's really lucky he may get the Fury fight down the line.. the case for him as the number one fighter in the world is comprehensively closed as long as Usyk is around, but he can stay active and still have three big fights but a few tune ups would be a great idea in my opinion.

Moving forward, I'm surprised there are so many "where does he go" comments. Whyte is there as a Winter fight. And then Usyk has said its Fury or nothing, while Fury has been stripped of his belts multiple times before, so I'd be surprised if AJ wasn't fighting for possibly vacant belts by 2024. My real concern is that given the drop off between the main event and Zhang-Hrgovic (who is supposedly the 8th best heavyweight on the planet), the heavyweight division is going to stink in two years.

Jeff Navarro wrote:DAZN’s deal with Joshua is £100m for two PPV fights per year - this fight wasn’t part of that deal.
So I doubt they’ll be wanting him to be facing tune ups if they are paying him £50m per fight. And a dud opponent isn’t really gonna shift many PPVs.
Whyte or the trilogy with Ruiz seems about right

Exciting times......

They should forget Whyte. He was dreadful against Fury and slapping him around does nothing for Joshua at this stage.

With or without the WBC being on the line, just find a way to get Joshua and Wilder in a ring together. The post-Wlad era has been dominated by Fury, Wilder and Joshua and while all of them should really have faced off against each other, we did at least get the Fury-Wilder trilogy. It would be absurd for a star like Joshua to retire without having faced either of the other two of his leading contemporaries given the overlap of their championship careers.

It's still a legacy fight even if there's no title on the line. If Wilder does bring the WBC to the table, then all the better. It's the only alphabet title Joshua hasn't held and it's a fight which doesn't need any selling.

I can't see there being much appetite for Usyk III. Guys like Hrgovic and Frank Sanchez aren't ready yet or don't sell enough yet. Who knows with Fury, but he'd be looking at Usyk in the near future in any case. Joyce too much hassle to make politically and too risky, with not enough gain.

Really no other fight which seems doable in the near future which excites when it comes to Joshua, apart from the Wilder one.

88Chris05 wrote:They should forget Whyte. He was dreadful against Fury and slapping him around does nothing for Joshua at this stage.

With or without the WBC being on the line, just find a way to get Joshua and Wilder in a ring together. The post-Wlad era has been dominated by Fury, Wilder and Joshua and while all of them should really have faced off against each other, we did at least get the Fury-Wilder trilogy. It would be absurd for a star like Joshua to retire without having faced either of the other two of his leading contemporaries given the overlap of their championship careers.

It's still a legacy fight even if there's no title on the line. If Wilder does bring the WBC to the table, then all the better. It's the only alphabet title Joshua hasn't held and it's a fight which doesn't need any selling.

I can't see there being much appetite for Usyk III. Guys like Hrgovic and Frank Sanchez aren't ready yet or don't sell enough yet. Who knows with Fury, but he'd be looking at Usyk in the near future in any case. Joyce too much hassle to make politically and too risky, with not enough gain.

Really no other fight which seems doable in the near future which excites when it comes to Joshua, apart from the Wilder one.

I agree to an extent.. but Whyte is more marketable now for Joshua..

Two big names at the "crossroads"... Big fight for sure...and as someone alluded to AJ wants big purses.

Whyte is obvious

Think AJ has Bruno syndrome....Sold out a little to whitey to become marketable and probably hates himself for it.

The rant the other night shows a guy with a lot on his mind..

Shouldn't worry a panto will be on offer for him..

Truss, it's been obvious that he's had a lot on his mind for a long time.
His "I didn't do amateur because I was livin' the thug life" spiel is the distillation of his bitter persona for a while now.
As you say," selling out to whitey" is something that's anathema to him, or so he said in a BLM speech, two years ago. In that same speech he lauded himself as an ex-gangsta who is now a genius  businessman. The sad truth is of course that he goes to wherever the highest bidder asks him to go as respect to his main job.I can sympathise with him to a certain extent, as he clearly resents the criticism that (as too was Bruno called) that  he is a bit of a phoney.
I actually felt sorry for him when he put on a goonish voice to imitate the critics when he went on about Jack Dempsey and Marciano.
As I said previously, an old school manager would have pulled him out if that situation toot sweet.

I think Wilder will want to go for an AJ fight as he sees vulnerability. He'll likely deal with Helenius in double quick time then he will probably start calling out Joshua in detrimental fashion, which of course will start the ball rolling.

Then light the blue touch paper and stand back.

Usyk wants to fight Tyson Fury to unify all the belt.  He thinks he can beat Tyson Fury.  Can he?  

Usyk now has had 24 competitive rounds with AJ.  In those 24 rounds he was never knocked down and never seriously in trouble.  He was able to evade AJ's punches but was also able to ride AJ's punches when they connected to his chin and his abdomen.  As AJ correctly stated in his post fight speech / ramble - AJ is physically stronger and bigger than Usyk and should have won.  The only reason why AJ was unable to beat him was NOT because he was unable to get off his punches - it was because Usyk was too skilful for him.

So Usyk was able to evade / ride AJ's punches and AJ punches harder than Tyson Fury.  Fury is more skilful and has better movement than AJ but he doesn't have AJ's power.  So maybe Usyk could beat Tyson Fury on points by outworking him.

Seems like Whyte won’t be Joshua’s next opponent. Daniel Dubois was hinting they’ve reached a deal with Whyte.

No name Bertie wrote:Usyk wants to fight Tyson Fury to unify all the belt.  He thinks he can beat Tyson Fury.  Can he?  

Usyk now has had 24 competitive rounds with AJ.  In those 24 rounds he was never knocked down and never seriously in trouble.  He was able to evade AJ's punches but was also able to ride AJ's punches when they connected to his chin and his abdomen.  As AJ correctly stated in his post fight speech / ramble - AJ is physically stronger and bigger than Usyk and should have won.  The only reason why AJ was unable to beat him was NOT because he was unable to get off his punches - it was because Usyk was too skilful for him.

So Usyk was able to evade / ride AJ's punches and AJ punches harder than Tyson Fury.  Fury is more skilful and has better movement than AJ but he doesn't have AJ's power.  So maybe Usyk could beat Tyson Fury on points by outworking him.

I can't agree with that, the main reason Usyk won was because AJ wouldn't let his hands go and at this point in his career is too worried about getting hit.

He can't let his hands go like Rocky Marciano, because he's not fu**ing fourteen stone that's why. He's eighteen stone. He's heavy.

Duty281 wrote:He can't let his hands go like Rocky Marciano, because he's not fu**ing fourteen stone that's why. He's eighteen stone. He's heavy.

That's the trouble with the new breed of heavyweights, they can't put combinations together and are better businessmen than fighters

Harsh? Mills Lane, even, suggested that Anthony get back in the ring with much more frequency on a post fight interview.
I really think that if we get Joshua versus Fury in a year or two from now it will have the whiff of a Lewis/Tyson about it


And if it's on Saudi Arabia, another country neither fighter professes to know much about -and they don't want to either, is my hunch, because as as with Ukraine, Anthony will deduce that it's not very nice!

.

No name Bertie wrote:Usyk wants to fight Tyson Fury to unify all the belt.  He thinks he can beat Tyson Fury.  Can he?

Seems a tad strange saying this, as we're talking about the current 1 and 2 in the division and two top fighters....But I honestly see Fury winning this (if it happens) relatively easily.

Catchweight summed it up quite well in an earlier post on this thread. Usyk has a set way of fighting at Heavyweight which he'll struggle to deviate from by the looks of things. He's slower and less adventurous than he was as a Cruiser, and obviously less powerful too. Stands basically no chance of hurting any semi-durable Heavyweight in the first few rounds. Can jolt and stun you later on when you're tiring and accumulation plays a part, as he showed a couple of times against Chisora and Joshua. But essentially he's trading on his angles, making the opponent second-guess themselves and being the fitter man down the stretch.

Fury's too versatile to lose to that, for me, as well as just being too big. Unlike Joshua he's a lot more comfortable fighting on the inside, rough housing and throwing shorter punches. He's also got excellent stamina and conditioning himself, even in physically draining fights.

I don't see a way for Usyk to work his way around all those problems. I think Fury takes control after a few rounds and possibly stops him.

88Chris05 wrote:

No name Bertie wrote:Usyk wants to fight Tyson Fury to unify all the belt.  He thinks he can beat Tyson Fury.  Can he?

Seems a tad strange saying this, as we're talking about the current 1 and 2 in the division and two top fighters....But I honestly see Fury winning this (if it happens) relatively easily ....

I don't see a way for Usyk to work his way around all those problems. I think Fury takes control after a few rounds and possibly stops him.

You put together a reasonable argument but as always we need to see them fight to be certain - especially as it is against two undefeated fighters.

Here is part of AJ's post fight ring speech:

AJ wrote:...  I'm not a 12 round fighter, look at me, I'm a new breed of heavyweight, cos all them heavyweights, Mike Tyson, Sonny Liston, Jack Dempsey, "o o you don't throw combinations like Rocky Marciano" , cos I ain't 14 stone, that's why!  I'm 18 stone. I'm heavy.  It's hard work

I still haven't worked out why AJ grabbed two belts off Usyk / Usyk's trainer, raised them up to the crowd and then threw them out of the ring.  According to Eddie Hearn AJ was frustrated with the sanctioning bodies for controlling his schedule and for having to pay sanctioning fees.  This goes against the claim that what we saw in the ring was AJ beating himself up, frustrated with himself that he lost.

ps: We learned from AJ's ring speech that the reason why AJ went into boxing, and went into boxing late, was because he feared he would likely be going to prison, and he wanted to know how to look after himself in there.  So he must have been 18 at the time.  Then unknown to himself at the time, he had natural talent and his rise in the amateurs and professional ranks was prodigious.

Glenn Feldman was the judge that scored the fight in Anthony Joshua's favour.   His full scorecard has led some to suggest that he scored his card before the fight.

Rd......  Usyk ......... AJ ............ Winning after Rd.
01........ 09 (009)... 10 (010)..... AJ
02........ 09 (018)... 10 (020)..... AJ
03........ 09 (027)... 10 (030)..... AJ
04........ 10 (037)... 09 (039)..... AJ
05........ 09 (046)... 10 (049)..... AJ
06........ 09 (055)... 10 (059)..... AJ
07........ 10 (065)... 09 (068)..... AJ
08........ 10 (075)... 09 (077)..... AJ
09........ 09 (084)... 10 (087)..... AJ
10........ 10 (094)... 09 (096)..... AJ
11........ 10 (104)... 09 (105)..... AJ
12........ 09 (113)... 10 (115)..... AJ

After four rounds if there is an accidental clash of heads and the fight is stopped the person leading on the scorecards wins.

Safe to say Feldman was high as a kite. 5-1 AJ after 6 rounds, then giving the 12th to AJ. Madness.

They could easily sort out this judging nonsense. Have seven judges, take off the four widest scores (two at each end), and go with the three in the middle.

I've said it before but Judges should be asked to justify there scorecards, even more so with something contentious as the 12th round (am i using that word right, who knows).

You might not agree but if someone can justify the whys and where's it's easier to accept.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Km88hz7qQMY

Feldman has a supervisor to answer questions on his behalf, presumably all judges are like this?

Derbymanc wrote:I've said it before but Judges should be asked to justify there scorecards, even more so with something contentious as the 12th round (am i using that word right, who knows).

You might not agree but if someone can justify the whys and where's it's easier to accept.

They can fall back on ring generalship and defense BS. And categories like that.

Split decision gives AJ a handle to keep his status...

As with this he lost to a P4P fighter (At cruiser) garbage..Hearn trots out he only lost by split for the next year..

Usyk is not a pound for pounder at Heavy . He is a fleshy guy who any top heavy should slap.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Derbymanc wrote:I've said it before but Judges should be asked to justify there scorecards, even more so with something contentious as the 12th round (am i using that word right, who knows).

You might not agree but if someone can justify the whys and where's it's easier to accept.

They can fall back on ring generalship and defense BS. And categories like that.

Split decision gives AJ a handle to keep his status...

As with this he lost to a P4P fighter (At cruiser) garbage..Hearn trots out he only lost by split for the next year..

Usyk is not a pound for pounder at Heavy .  He is a fleshy guy who any top heavy should slap.

I mean actually explain it, not fall back on that Love sacks but i know what you mean Truss plus, lets be honest, it suits the promoters so it's never gonna happen. I agree with the p4p fighter bit but not your last bit, he's a very very good heavy, we'll have to see what happens with Fury.

88Chris05 wrote:

No name Bertie wrote:Usyk wants to fight Tyson Fury to unify all the belt.  He thinks he can beat Tyson Fury.  Can he?

Seems a tad strange saying this, as we're talking about the current 1 and 2 in the division and two top fighters....But I honestly see Fury winning this (if it happens) relatively easily.

Catchweight summed it up quite well in an earlier post on this thread. Usyk has a set way of fighting at Heavyweight which he'll struggle to deviate from by the looks of things. He's slower and less adventurous than he was as a Cruiser, and obviously less powerful too. Stands basically no chance of hurting any semi-durable Heavyweight in the first few rounds. Can jolt and stun you later on when you're tiring and accumulation plays a part, as he showed a couple of times against Chisora and Joshua. But essentially he's trading on his angles, making the opponent second-guess themselves and being the fitter man down the stretch.

Fury's too versatile to lose to that, for me, as well as just being too big. Unlike Joshua he's a lot more comfortable fighting on the inside, rough housing and throwing shorter punches. He's also got excellent stamina and conditioning himself, even in physically draining fights.

I don't see a way for Usyk to work his way around all those problems. I think Fury takes control after a few rounds and possibly stops him.

I'm not disagreeing with you per se, because as much as I love Usyk, I don't know how he gives up 60lbs and half a foot against Fury, and wins... but Fury took a helluva lot of shots against Wallin, who isn't even in the same stratosphere as Usyk. Then of course if you go far back, he's been dropped by two relatively pillowfisted straight lefts by Cunningham and Pajkic. I'd make him the favourite because weight classes exist for a reason, but the only time he's actually looked good against Southpaws is when they were 40+ never beens.

Fury showed in Wilder 2 what a good pressure fighter he can be.. That was against a one punch ko artist.. Against a fleshy Cruuser that can't bang at Heavy should be an easy night.

Spinks was a wonderful technician but not with Iron Mike swarming.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Fury showed in Wilder 2 what a good pressure fighter he can be.. That was against a one punch ko artist.. Against a fleshy Cruuser that can't bang at Heavy should be an easy night.

Spinks was a wonderful technician but not with Iron Mike swarming.

To be fair to Spinks, he'd filled his pants before the bell went so was always going to struggle.