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KP_fan wrote:

msp83 wrote:So India is getting back on the field tonight, kicking off their WTC campaign. Rohit has already confirmed Jaiswal will open, and Gill drop down to 3. When all the talk of Yashasvi taking over from Pujara at 3 was going on, I felt he should open, particularly since the team views Gill as the eventual successor to Virat Kohli at 4. Going forward, I see a top 4 of Jaiswal, Abhimanyu Easwaran/Devdutt Padikkal/Rohan Kunnummal, Gill, Ruturaj Gaikwad.

Eswaran has been hard done by......Jaiswal was jumped over him
Mayank Agarwal should not be ruled out...he has batted very well in FC and has a decent test match showing also.

And don't forget the favorite boy of seniors and BCCI in KL Rahul...as soon as he is fit he will walk back into the 11

Its been tough on Easwaran. Think Mayank and KL might find it difficult to now fight their way back in. Particularly if Yashasvi has a good start to his career. KL might still make a comeback when Rohit leaves, but I hope Easwaran, Rohan and even Padikkal will make better cases for themselves.
As for Yashasvi jumping over Abhimanyu, though its tough on the latter, think is the right call. Jaiswal scored hundreds on his Ranji, Duleep and Irani trophy debuts. He's versatile and has shown adaptability as indicated by his IPL success. And, its not much noted these days, but he's a handy parttimer with the ball, he very much was for the U-19s, hope he'll get a few chances right away to work on that secondary skill of his...

Rain ruining the first day of the India Bangladesh test. Akash Deep had time to add to the good initial impression that he has created by picking up 2. Bangladesh did well to hang in there, Mominul has looked the best in some time, skipper Shanto was going well before getting undone by Ravichandran Ashwin. The rains have been staying on rather unusally for the region at this point of the yar, and the weather could involve more in the game.
As India went in with 3 quicks, bowling first had kind of become necessary. But there was already some turn for Ashwin. Bangladesh have strengthened their spin unit by bringing in Taijul Islam.
India will hope the overhead conditions will keep the quicks in the game, though even Bumrah was finding it tough with the low and slow nature of the track, even though he was getting the ball to move. Responsibility on th batting unit, to bat big...
Ravindra Jadeja 1 short of 300 test wickets.
Shakib Alhasan, very likely, might be playing his last test for his side. Shakib has expressed his wish to retire after the home series against South Africa. But the BCB has made it clear that they are not equipped with the ability to ensure security for Shakib, and that it will have to be the responsibility of the government. Seems the board is done with Shakib, Bangladesh's greatest cricketer so far in their cricketing history.

Another Kamindu ton then! Think the last player to have this kind of a start to his test career was Michael Hussey. Kamindu so far, has clearly outdone the Australian.... There will surely be stronger challenges he will have to face up to, and there will be low points... but seems to have a good temperament, and a solid game to overcome those challenges... Would like to see him given a few more overs...

Sri Lanka doing quite well since Sanath Jayasuriya took over as interim coach, the results have improved, and the players seem more confident and focused... Will Sanath be willing to take up a more regular role? Will SLC make him an offer?

The ball was already turning big for SL spinners, and even Kane Williamson was hanging on for dear life! New Zealand has a real fight on their hands to survive this one...

msp83 wrote:
Shakib Alhasan, very likely, might be playing his last test for his side. Shakib has expressed his wish to retire after the home series against South Africa. But the BCB has made it clear that they are not equipped with the ability to ensure security for Shakib, and that it will have to be the responsibility of the government. Seems the board is done with Shakib, Bangladesh's greatest cricketer so far in their cricketing history.

Shakib might be seeking asylum in India and some Western cricketing nations I hear.
US most likely to accept him.

SL 602 /5d
NZ 88 a.o
Has there been a bigger difference in first inning scores in a test match?

NZ fans in England wake up and see Williamson is still in so it can't be too bad. Oh, hang on.....

KP_fan wrote:SL 602 /5d
NZ 88 a.o
Has there been a bigger difference in first inning scores in a test match?

This is the record, from a very long time ago. It appears that today's match is second

ENG 903/7d
AUS (fo) 201 & 123
England won by an innings and 579 runs

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/australia-tour-of-england-1938-61342/england-vs-australia-5th-test-62652/full-scorecard

KP_fan wrote:SL 602 /5d
NZ 88 a.o
Has there been a bigger difference in first inning scores in a test match?

One I've found that's bigger. WI v E at Kingston 1929-30. E made 849 (Sandham 325) and WI replied with 286. Follow-on not imposed and rain and a double hundred from a young George Headley led to a draw.

Another WI Test , v Pakistan at Bridgetown in 57-58, saw P f-on 473 behind only for Hanif to bat for eternity to save the match.

Oops. Forgot a famous one in Hutton's match at The Oval in 1938.*

England 903 for seven
Australia 201

No doubt there are more...

* KP - didn't see your earlier post about this match. But it seems the Sandham/Headley match outdoes Galle today.

Another huge deficit was at Brisbane in 1946-47 when England were caught on a Gabba sticky.

Australia made 645 and England 141.

E made 232 to Pakistan's 708 at The Oval in 1987 but still managed to save the match.

Ah, found another one. SA 682 at Lord's in 2003 after E had made 173.

Tom blundell counter attacking taking Jayasuriya apart!

Game is well and truly over NZ 340 behind with 5 wickets in hand but they're gonna go down playing their shots

Spinners getting taking apart now maybe time to turn back to the quicks

297-8 in 2nd innings for NZ nearly all over for them now

An innings and 154 run win in the end for SL. Peris (on debut) and Jayasuriya both getting nine wickets each. 2-0 series win, very impressive.

India/Bangladesh has only had 35 overs in three days, so unlikely to be anything but a draw.

No rain and yet no play today.
Super Soppers, ground Covers that many less richer boards can arrange weren't there.
While BCCI was busy finalizing jersey sponsors and IPL auctions, India loses 8 WTC points

After the Afghanistan-NZ disaster, we have this absolutely appalling nonsense from Kanpur. Don't think they should have any more test matches played over here, should stick to the Vajpayee Stadium for any test in UP if they have to play. And the BCCI needs to take a long hard look at themselves. Making themselves the laughing stock of the world! No basic facilities for a test match! And on the IPL front, they are continuing with the Impact Player nonsense, because the broadcasters want it, though many senior players including skipper Rohit Sharma expressed their doubts and possible damaging impact on Team India...

Sri Lanka completed the job despite some New Zealand resistance. NZ batters kept playing their shots, and after KW and Conway yesterday, Blundell, Phillips and Santner had some success, meaning SL had to work slightly harder today. But debutant Nishan Peiris and Prabath Jayasuriya kept striking through, sharing 18 of the 20 NZ wickets for the match! If Jayasuriya took a5for in the first innings, Peiris followed it up one of his own in the 2nd innings.
Disappointing end of the tour for New Zealand after they put up a strong fight in the first test. One thing they'd be happy with, is that both Rachin and Mitchell, the relative new batters in the lineup, have runs under their belt going into that India tour. And Williamson going strong as is Latham. Conway has been inconsistent though, and they need him to hit his straps for the next assignment... And their spinners are mediocre, Santner isn't a test spinner, Ajaz has picked up wickets in this part of the world including the just concluded Lanka tour, and of course that 10for in India, but he still is pretty mediocre... Glenn Phillips comes across as their least worst spin option at the moment. And I feel they should use Ravindra's bowling a bit more. Can't be worse than Santner or Ajaz really.
And for god's sake, play Boult whenever he's available...

Indian Bowling and especially Bumrah rolled BD over quite fast.
Pitch had a little bit of assistance for seamers, no pace...just quality of Indian bowling.

160 overs left in the game
Can India conjure a win.
They need to get a lead of 200 and still leave 60 overs to bowl BD out.

What a Pity if it most likely ends in a Draw due to bad BCCI management

India with 51 off three overs! Definitely going for it.

India broke records of fastest 50, 100, 150, 200 and 250 by a team in test cricket today

India went down swinging too much for my liking, opening up the possibility of a loss also.
They needed to bat until 15 minutes before lunch and get 150 to 200 ahead

Certainly given themselves a chance with 285 in 34.4 overs!

Bangladesh need to bat 80 overs or so to save a draw. Maybe a bit less depending on their positivity. There's virtually no chance of an Indian loss.

From my POV scoring another 120 runs in this inning would have been better than chasing 120

Ashwin has looked like taking wicket every over and has gotten both
With new ball on a slow tuners he gets quite some zip
A catch dropped at slip
BD have to show more intent else they will choke

Bangladesh 26/2 at stumps, trailing by 26. One of those two was the nightwatchman, however.

Set up for a good final day. 98 overs will be bowled, because cricket does that odd thing where they'll extend play as long as necessary to get the overs in on day five, and the weather looks absolutely perfect, so I think India are favourites.

Bangladesh need to try and go at three runs per over plus tomorrow. They can't just try to stonewall at 2 an over.

There is 8 hours of play tomm ( 9:30 to 17:30)
with 40+20 min for lunch and tea
Effectively 7 hours, where theoretically 105 overs should be bowled.
Today in 7 hours they bowled only 85.
OK...remove 20 overs for change of 2 innings.. and DRS were reset 3 times for 3 innings played today and 9 in total were taken.

But still 20 overs short is a lot short..
Hope they can do atleast 95 overs tomm.......bowl SL out in 65 overs and chase down whatever in 30 overs ....say 180 odd max

Yeah, but because it's day five, they'll extend the play as long as necessary to get the 98 overs in. So as long as the light holds (which it should) there'll be 98 overs (minus two for a changeover). And it should be enough for India to get the job done on a day five pitch.

Indian team, thankfully didn't follow the BCCI's lead, and did everything to bring life to a dead contest. Jaiswal was outstanding, and KL played another just in time innings and displayed all those qualities that make the team management keep going back to him despite all the letdowns over the years. Even Virat for that matter, looked much better when he played with that intent. Gill did a good job, and in his brief stay, the skipper made a telling statement. Bangladesh are 2 down, and there will be serious last pressure on them. Mehidy talked about safety first, yes they should play risk-free cricket, but should guard against getting bogged down. That will be the sureshot way to lose the game. Keep the runs coming, and if they manage to bat up to tea, they would go a long way in saving the game. Ashwin did look very threatening towards the end of the day and there sould be a bit more for him and Jadeja to work with. But the pitch is far too slow and low, and once the ball gets older, it will be that much tougher for the bowlers...
Poor pitch, poor stadium conditionspoor weather, and yet, we are in with the chance of a result going into day 5. Draw still very much the favorite, but an Indian win isn't outlandish at all. Hard to see India lose from here, will require something like a 36 all out scenario to play out. If Bangladesh bat 60 overs and set India a target of 150 to get in 35 overs, and if the Indians end up losing a clump of early wickets, that last innings will become real tricky... Shakib and Mehidy aren't Jadeja and Ashwin, but they are match-winners in their own right. But for them to get to work, the batting unit will have to deliver for Bangladesh...

But Duty, its not quite a day 5 pitch... And its a low slow one at that, soft wicket that will be even more lifeless as the ball gets old. Bangladesh's approach will be key. If they stay positive enough, they should have a good chance at saving this...
In Mushfiqur, Shakib and Mominul, they have some serious experience with decent records. Skipper Shanto seems to have found form in the last test at last, and Liton Das, while not being the smartest with shot selection always, has the ability to take on the best of the bowlers. And with Mehidy now slated to come in at 9, the batting lineup has length too.
After yester's debacle, I didn't think there will be much to look forward to on day 5, but India's intent with the bat, and the skillset of their bowlers have opened up posibilities at least...

How grateful are India now for Ben Duckett coming over and teaching them Bazball?

Joking aside, I hope India get the win as a reward for positive cricket, when it would have been easy to let the game drift and still take the series win

Well, I hoped for drama, but there's no close finish brewing here.

Bangladesh 94/7. Jadeja 3/3.

All out by lunch. Bumrah, some lovely slower balls, taking the last three.

India will need just 95 to win.

The intensity of Indian bowling & pressure was too much for BD
62 overs left in the day and Ind should win this with 40 overs to spare

This was Indian cricket firing on all cylinders, displaying the full might of it's batting, spin bowling, bowling all-rounders and pace attack on non spinning pitches.

The opposition was mediocre & home crowd support was a factor that weight in & yet it's clear that Gambhir era is aiming for testing the limits of their strength in preparation for the 5 tests in Aus and the WTC final.

Dravid would never have envisaged such an approach which resulted in India batting only 54 overs in a test to overhaul ~390 runs of opponent across in 2 innings in effectively less that 2 full days of play.

Rohit displays an amazing faithfulness in switching between & executing radically opposite coaches' visions in the blink of an eye.

India needs to maintain their quality vs NZ in 3 tests where I am sure the flavor of pitches will turn towards slow turners like the ones served to Eng & with Kuldeep coming in for a seamer.
Bumrah will be rested for 2 games I would think.

In the end it was a bit of a walk in the park. But don't be taken in by that 4th innings, this was some seriously intense stuff from India... The bowlers yet again, doing the job. When Shanto and Mushfiqur were in the middle, it seemed Bangladesh will be able to weather the early loss of Mominul and put up a fight. But then came Ravindra Jadeja. He had to wait till the last man in the first innings to take his first wicket of the game, that took him to 300 test wickets, thus completing a fabulous double of 300 wickets and 3000 runs. Don't forget even the legendary Vinu Mankad didn't come close to achieving that, only Kapil Dev and Ravichandran Ashwin from India giving Jadeja company in the list. Then in the 2nd innings, introduced after an hour of play, Jadeja took 3 wickets in 3 overs to take the game away from Bangladesh. It was like Ashwin in the last test. Went wicketless in the first innings, wasn't called in for action in the first hour of the decisive day, was facing up to a bit of a partnership, and then he demolished the opposition batting. The 2 of them have combined even better than Kumble and Harbhajan I feel.

And what to say about Jasprit Bumrah! Just an absolute champion... Had a bit of an off-day by his standard on the opening day, but turned it around just when India needed him to. The guy isn't a fan of getting rested for test matches, but India will have to take the call, not sure they'll rest him for 2 games against New Zealand, but at least 1 for sure. He's not playing the T-20s against Bangladesh, and rightly so. He doesn't need to play T-20 internationals other than World Cups... Mohammed Shami has started bowling at the NCA nets and he's taking it slow, the building back... He's not picked for Rest of India for the Irani Trophy, so unlikely for that first test against New Zealand. If he's available, they should actually consider resting Bumrah for 2 games at least... And give young Akash Deep the entire series... Rotate Bumrah/Shami/Siraj around him. And hopefully, Kuldeep too, will get a look in...

Jaiswal's 20th Test innings sees him qualifying for the best-Test-average table where he sits behind only....Bradman.

Time to retire as an average of 64 will almost certainly be the best he'll ever do - at least in the long run.

msp83 wrote:In the end it was a bit of a walk in the park. But don't be taken in by that 4th innings, this was some seriously intense stuff from India... The bowlers yet again, doing the job. When Shanto and Mushfiqur were in the middle, it seemed Bangladesh will be able to weather the early loss of Mominul and put up a fight.

To be honest I am disappointed by BD's show and left wondering how did this team beat Pak in Pak 2-0?
Or The corollary "How bad must be Pak to have lost 2-0 to this rather medicore BD side"?

I would like India to show they can take on Lanka in Lanka

This series win also means India have won every test series at home since the loss to England in 2012.

That series win by England in 2012 gets better by the day.

Shakib retires
Tim Southee quits as captain. Tom Blundel new captain

Blundell or Latham? Think its the latter, the long-term deputy to Williamson. Latham was passed over for the top job when they appointed Southee. But Southee has been well short of his best in recent times, and someone like Matthew Henry is kept out of the side it has to be remembered. With Wagner retired and Boult not considered for tests, this is becoming the end of NZ's golden generation of quicks... Southee does have a decent record in India, and might as well start the first test, but he'll need a performence of note very soon to hold on to that position I feel.
William O'Rourke seems to be a find. Then there is Henry, not exactly a youngster but should have good miles in his legs yet. Will Jamieson end up like Cummins, or will it be another sad Shane Bond-like story in terms of injury ravaged career? Hope it is going to be the former.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2024/10/08/champions-trophy-final-switch-india-pakistan/

Next year’s Champions Trophy final could be switched from Lahore to Dubai if India qualify, creating the possibility that there will be no certainty over the venue until days before the final.

But India have not played an international match in Pakistan since 2008. There is as yet no indication that the Indian government will relax their ban on touring Pakistan. As previously reported, there is a strong possibility that the ICC will ultimately find a different venue for India’s matches – including, if they advance that far, the final itself.

The final, on March 9, has been awarded to Lahore. But Telegraph Sport understands that alternative options are being informally considered in case India reach the final, with Dubai likely to be the new venue.

This scenario opens up the extraordinary scenario that the venue for the final will not be known until March 6, just three days before the final, depending on whether India qualify. Until then, two grounds would have to prepare to stage the final, with competing teams and match officials, media and fans alike unsure of the venue.

As well as India’s group games and potentially the final, a semi-final would also need to be staged outside Pakistan should India reach the final four. As well as Dubai, Abu Dhabi and potentially Sharjah also have the facilities to host games at late notice if needed.

What an absolute joke. Stop pandering to India. If they don't want to play in Pakistan, boot India out of the competition.

India declare the same squad for the test series vs NZ as they had vs BD minus Yash Dayal would imply 3 spinners +2seamer composition.

Dayal released to play Ranji season that just started and did pretty well in first Round.

Bumrah made Vice Captain would imply he will play atleast 2 if not all 3 tests. He has been politely vocal in aspiring for test captaincy.

The appointment of VC is not a norm for home tests and becomes relevant now that Rohit has announced he will miss either T1 or T2 in Aus , presumably a baby on way for Mr & Mrs Rohit.

There are many equals in this test side in line for captaincy including Pant, Gill, Rahul & hence it's possible Bumrah might have asked for it to quash any doubts on first among equals.

Bumrah won't mind playing all 3 tests vs NZ as this is all that he plays until T1 in Australia.
In a 5 bowler combination on spin friendly pitches he will be bowled sparingly and will be more a heavy weapon insurance in case opposition starts running away than a stock bowler.
Axar will be the spinner to sit out.

India's 297-6 vs BD today is by far the highest T20is score among major nations, beating Eng's 267 vs WI last year.

India's T20 team has shaped well inspite of many retirements post world cup......lots and lots of depth.
Test team is also balanced.....ODIs need to be optimized.

Pitch at Bengaluru vs NZ for tomm's game.
Dry, Light brown, I think Red Soil underlying, slow turn but with reasonable bounce.
NZ has won only two tests in Indian first in 1969 & last in 1988 that's 36 years back

KP_fan wrote:India declare the same squad for the test series  vs NZ as they had vs BD minus Yash Dayal would imply 3 spinners +2seamer composition.

Dayal released to play Ranji season that just started and did pretty well in first Round.

Bumrah made Vice Captain would imply he will play atleast 2 if not all 3 tests. He has been politely vocal in aspiring for test captaincy.

The appointment of VC is not a norm for home tests and becomes relevant now that Rohit has announced he will miss either T1 or T2 in Aus , presumably a baby on way for Mr & Mrs Rohit.

There are many equals in this test side in line for captaincy including Pant, Gill, Rahul & hence it's possible Bumrah might have asked for it to quash any doubts on first among equals.

Bumrah won't mind playing all 3 tests vs NZ as this is all that he plays until T1 in Australia.
In a 5 bowler combination on spin friendly pitches he will be bowled sparingly and will be more a heavy weapon insurance in case opposition starts running away than a stock bowler.
Axar will be the spinner to sit out.

I think Bumrah's rather unusual run-up and action make it a bit easier for him phisically than more conventional fast bowlers - doesn't have a hugely long or fast run up, and the effort he puts into each delivery comes more from the fluidity of movement than a 'throw yourself to the floor' effort like Mark Wood. I don't think it's an action you could possibly replicate with anyone else (I suspect Bumrah has some hypermobility in his shoulder or wrist to generate the pace and angle of delivery), but it certainly works for him. Wierdly, I have seen some people question the legality of his action, but of all the quick bowlers, he seems to me to have about the least observable flexing of the elbow during the delivery.

D'half.
I know they're far more lenient about bowling actions now than they were in the past. But to me Bumrah's deliveries look extremely dodgy.

But then I reckoned that Malinga, who had a straight arm action, actually threw as his arm was so low that his deliveries became chucks. Indeed you sometimes see fielders who want to get the ball back to the keeper as quickly as possible doing those below-the-shoulder round-arm throws a la Malinga.

Tony Lock had a slingy action and they reckoned he threw his fast yorker ball. Indeed he was called for chucking and went away and remodelled his action.

Difficult to judge Bumrah on today's throwing interpretations. But I reckon that in years gone by he would have been called. Of recent England bowlers, Steve Finn's action always looked a bit questionable to me, but all this may just be me not understanding the new guidelines.

sirfredperry wrote:D'half.
I know they're far more lenient about bowling actions now than they were in the past. But to me Bumrah's deliveries look extremely dodgy.

But then I reckoned that Malinga, who had a straight arm action, actually threw as his arm was so low that his deliveries became chucks. Indeed you sometimes see fielders who want to get the ball back to the keeper as quickly as possible doing those below-the-shoulder round-arm throws a la Malinga.

Tony Lock had a slingy action and they reckoned he threw his fast yorker ball. Indeed he was called for chucking and went away and remodelled his action.

Difficult to judge Bumrah on today's throwing interpretations. But I reckon that in years gone by he would have been called. Of recent England bowlers, Steve Finn's action always looked a bit questionable to me, but all this may just be me not understanding the new guidelines.

Chucking is most commonly known as throwing a ball, which happens when the bowler straightens his arm while throwing the ball. The action is considered illegal, and the ball is deemed to be illegitimate. The rule against chucking relates to bending the arm at the elbow. The extent of bending the arm has recently been codified by the ICC, which permits flexing the elbow to a maximum of 15 degrees.

On rules for Chucking today or in any era, I doubt if Bumrah could be ever called
In Italics is the law for chucking which in simple terms means bowlers today should not bend his elbow more than 15deg.
In earlier eras the rule was same in principle but subject to naked eye judgement & no objective degree of flexing stated.

Bumrah is on the other side of chucking i.e he does not bend his elbow at-all....hyper-extends the bolt straight arm.

Smith back down to 4 then as Green on the long term mend. Next year's ashes looks a final stop for a lot of a very old Aussie side