Ulster squad additions

First topic message reminder :

All of the following will be contracted to Ulster next year - I don't know the nature of each contract though

Niall Annett
Jerry Cronin
Craig Gilroy
Paddy Jackson
Adam Macklin
Luke Marshall
James McKinney
Ian Porter

Will supply a fully list shortly - still no mention of Bryan Young. Also no mention of Gaston yet

Eddie was not one of the three interviewed.

However, inspite of what others have said elsewhere Dublin pull the purse strings for all Provinces.

I tend to agree I think it is a canny agent, Constable ?, upping the anti for obvious reasons.

If Bowe was in line for an IRFU contract then the money would be the same at both Ulster and Munster, this doesn't sound like an agent trying to up the anti.

I'd imagine if he's looking at Munster then he must have doubts about Ulster.

If he genuinely wanted to come back to Ulster I'd have thought the contract negotiations would be straight forward.

Bloody hell rodders. Someone tells you a player looked at a teams facilities at some unspecified point in the past and you have a nervous meltdown.

You have no context to interpret that.

Notch I've been arguing with Sin E all day....I'm emotionally fragile here....

...besides this isn't just someone, this is Geoff!

Do the IRFU pay the whole salary of the centrally contracted players or do each province "top up" in addition?

If Geoff could tell us, say, when this took place we'd be able to gauge its significance. Before or after the 10th February when the Munster website posted this;

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/news/10095.php

The successful conclusion of the Laulala deal followed closely that of James Downey but their ambition to add Tommy Bowe and Rhys Ruddock would seem to have been thwarted with the news that Bowe has indicated that should he accept an IRFU contract, the pull of home is the deciding factor in him choosing Ulster rather than Munster.

Ruddock is also understood to have decided to remain with Leinster rather than accept the Munster offer.

Obviously if it tok place within the last week or so there would be a different set of implications.

What I know about Tommy Bowe is that he has agreed with Humphreys to join us but I don't know if anything has been signed. What I have been told today is he has looked around Munster - I do not know when this occurred.

The observation around Tommy's agent could well be preferals rather than the core contract and money - as mentioned his salary would be the same at both Provinces.

What I know about the coaching role is 3 people were interviewed (Kirwan and EOS were not any of those 3) . Cheika was there on Friday and looked like a man interested in the role. Sexton has been interviewed for a coaching role but I dont know which one - someone else said it was the head coach role.

That is it - the rest is much conjecture on my part as anyone elses

MrsP wrote:Do the IRFU pay the whole salary of the centrally contracted players or do each province "top up" in addition?

Central contract are indeed split contracts - the central element paid by Dublin the core contract paid by the Province

Graham Henry is without a job at the moment right?

My observation about perferals ????
was meant to be with reference to non money aspects i.e length of contract.

Are Ulster offering 2 years and he wants 3 for example.

I known it's hard to think about it but we have to accept that the agent may have used the 'draw of going home' aspect as a way to get more from the Munster contract.

I REALLY hope not. How could he...?

That is not the case because the contract value will be the same for both Provinces.

ok, but arent their other stipulations to negotiate apart from the salary? Or am I thinking of it too much like football players?

Pretty marginal - lenghth of contract is the only biggy I can think of

I find it hard to believe a player of Bowe's calibre is having to play hard ball with his contract negotiations.

If there is a delay then I'd imagine it comes down to Bowe struggling to make his mind up as to where the best move would be.

If I were in his shoes the uncertainty around the Ulster coaching set up would definitely make me think twice until that is resolved.

ok, but arent their other stipulations to negotiate apart from the salary? Or am I thinking of it too much like football players?.

Length, bonuses, wages, image rights, lawyers fees, expense arrangements, insurance agreements etc...

Even for a player who is keen to sign for a club/province/region the small print can take quite a while to agree.

To be honest with you rodders, I expect an announcement on his future after the Six Nations and not a day sooner. I never expected him to announce ANY move during the 6N as he's focusing on Ireland.

I agree Notch it will be cleared up after the 6N....as well as the coaching set ups at Ulster and Munster...... the Munster rumours seem to be gathering pace again though and there's never smoke without fire......

Gathering pace?

The only munster rumour I have heard is Geoff mentioning that at some point tommy looked at munster.

Yea mainly Geoff but theres a couple of recent posts up his FB page by people hearing hes considering joining Munster....does anyone follow his twitter?

Exactly - he has obvious been down there to take a look but at the same time he has, at least, verbally, agreed to join Ulster.

We are still in the box seat lads.

Rodders the amount of crap posted on the rugby Facebook sites beggars belief.

I don't doubt that stand but you never know.

Munster stated he was not coming to Munster and if they were playing games with an agent with that statement, they wouldn't have signed Howlett and Laulala.

I bet the issue with the delay of signing for Ulster is that he isn't getting a central contract and Ulster have to come up with the cash*.

Hope you lot are grateful to Munster for not allowing themselves to be used to up his wedge to go to Ulster.

edit: or Humphreys has to persuade the IRFU to give him a central contract.

He is getting a central Contract.

In fact if memory serves me right there was some deal with Ospreys in that the IRFU paid part of his contract for next year anyway. This was to ensure he was avaialble when Dublin wanted him.

Ulster have had a similar arrangement with the SRFU regarding Daneilli, albeit for a smaller amount.

geoff998rugby wrote:He is getting a central Contract.

In fact if memory serves me right there was some deal with Ospreys in that the IRFU paid part of his contract for next year anyway. This was to ensure he was avaialble when Dublin wanted him.

Ulster have had a similar arrangement with the SRFU regarding Daneilli, albeit for a smaller amount.

Paying the Ospreys (or Leicester for Geordan) wouldn't be that unusual for when they are on Ireland duty particularly in a world cup year when he would miss a lot of the start of the season.

You claim he is getting a central contract, yet you don't know why he hasn't signed even though he is going to Ulster ?

edit: I could understand it not being announced prior to the welsh game, but now (with a long lay-off in the middle) ? If he was on a central contral, Ireland would want to announce it when tommy is here - not when he is back in wales.

Sin what about these rumours that Earls is off to Connacht and Bowe is coming in to play 13 at Munster?

If I was in charge at ulster I would have wanted to announce this before the ospreys game to build up interest and raise ticket sales during the 6N. You can't always get what you want though and the search for a new coach is of paramount importance. I would assume is is where the main focus lies.

Sin e I not party to every dealing within Ulster rugby so it is hardly surprising I do not have a complete picture but I do have contacts with people who will be wearing white shirts on Friday night at Ravenhill, and I dont mean supporters !

I think they get an insight into some real information at the club as opposed to groundless rumour.

Geoff is like the gandalf of Ulster rugby on these forums! He speaks, we listen

roddersm wrote:Sin what about these rumours that Earls is off to Connacht and Bowe is coming in to play 13 at Munster?

Heard he was offered a central contract to go there alright, but decided he would stay with Munster and take the hit on the pay cheque!

Sin é wrote:

roddersm wrote:Sin what about these rumours that Earls is off to Connacht and Bowe is coming in to play 13 at Munster?

Heard he was offered a central contract to go there alright, but decided he would stay with Munster and take the hit on the pay cheque!

geoff998rugby wrote:Sin e I not party to every dealing within Ulster rugby so it is hardly surprising I do not have a complete picture but I do have contacts with people who will be wearing white shirts on Friday night at Ravenhill, and I dont mean supporters !

I think they get an insight into some real information at the club as opposed to groundless rumour.

In all honesty though, would anyone (especially Tommy) be telling anyone, least of all his potential team mates, what the financial arrangements are? Maybe some just think that anyone and everyone will get a central contract now. Tommy has shown his hand in that IRFU/Ulster know the Ospreys are happy to let him leave and if he wants to at least play in the celtic league, he doesn't have a great bargaining position as Munster and Leinster are not going to compete for his signature.

Whatever his value to the national team is, he isn't such a valuable comodity at club level in that Leinster have Nacewa and lots of good young talent, Munster have Howlett and some very good young talent and Ulster, while not having an outside back of Howlett or Nacewa stature, they have one fairly experienced back, Trimble and some good young ones coming through.

So Munster and Leinster's best backs are bought in?

Interesting...

[and so the merry-go-round continues...]

Don Alfonso wrote:So Munster and Leinster's best backs are bought in?

Interesting...

Howlett would have been one of the best outside backs on the planet when he first came to Munster but fairplay to the younger ones this year they pulled off a 6/6 for the Heineken Cup pool stages. Kearney is showing up very well for Leinster now, but they also have had some outstanding backs in the last couple of years like Hickie, Girvan and Shane Horgan who have just retired or have been injured. Nacewa is the most prominent back they have at the moment, but the way Kearney is playing, he is fast catching up with him.

Ah, c'mon, Sin. Leave the bait alone. I didn't actually mean for you to bite - more a wry remark on the amount of WUMing we've all been indulging in over the last couple of days.

Genuine question - will Borlase be with Munster next season? When is his contract up?

It's alright lads, for those who doubted Geoff the Uafc is reporting that tommys mam has said he will be coming home to ulster. Crisis averted

Tommys mam is involved now

Just feicin announce he's signing for SOMEONE and end this charade!

Just checked back and it was the 12th Janaury I was told he was going to sign for Ulster - that is a hell of a long time for it to drag on.

Standulstermen wrote:It's alright lads, for those who doubted Geoff the Uafc is reporting that tommys mam has said he will be coming home to ulster. Crisis averted

Come on Tommy lad, mammy always knows best!

His da was in the Ulster Rugby box on Friday night. Apparently he's a giant of a man - at least 6' 7". Also apparently he didn't say whether or not Tommy was coming home

Did you ask him rava?

Gee sounds like Tommy is the runt of the litter!

Don Alfonso wrote:Ah, c'mon, Sin. Leave the bait alone. I didn't actually mean for you to bite - more a wry remark on the amount of WUMing we've all been indulging in over the last couple of days.

Genuine question - will Borlase be with Munster next season? When is his contract up?

Isn’t he with Connacht on loan next year? or is that this year? He’s a project player so he’s here on a 3 year deal at least, he joined in 2010 so that would keep him in the country till the end of next year.

He won’t get a look in at Connacht with White and Ah You next season.

Mickado wrote:

Don Alfonso wrote:Ah, c'mon, Sin. Leave the bait alone. I didn't actually mean for you to bite - more a wry remark on the amount of WUMing we've all been indulging in over the last couple of days.

Genuine question - will Borlase be with Munster next season? When is his contract up?

Isn’t he with Connacht on loan next year? or is that this year? He’s a project player so he’s here on a 3 year deal at least, he joined in 2010 so that would keep him in the country till the end of next year.

He won’t get a look in at Connacht with White and Ah You next season.

His contract is up at the end of this season (2 year one) and he has played about 3 games in total for Munster. Think he had back problems. He is gone to Connacht already until the end of this season. I suppose it all depends now on how he does at Connacht until the end of the season as to whether he comes back to Munster or not. Don't think he will be staying with Connacht anyway.

Mickado wrote:

Don Alfonso wrote:Ah, c'mon, Sin. Leave the bait alone. I didn't actually mean for you to bite - more a wry remark on the amount of WUMing we've all been indulging in over the last couple of days.

Genuine question - will Borlase be with Munster next season? When is his contract up?

Isn’t he with Connacht on loan next year? or is that this year? He’s a project player so he’s here on a 3 year deal at least, he joined in 2010 so that would keep him in the country till the end of next year.

He won’t get a look in at Connacht with White and Ah You next season.

His contract is up at the end of this season (2 year one) and he has played about 3 games in total for Munster. Think he had back problems. He is gone to Connacht already until the end of this season. I suppose it all depends now on how he does at Connacht until the end of the season as to whether he comes back to Munster or not. Don't think he will be staying with Connacht anyway.

That's interesting. Will his contract be up before he is IQ?

Surely it can't be if he is to be a "project" player? If they let him go early a la Sykes, fair enough, but surely his initially agreed ocntract has to cover the period needed for him to become IQ?

Thats my understanding, all Project contracts have to be for 3 years - this was the case for Diack and Payne and I have always understood that that the IRFU insisted on this.

geoff998rugby wrote:Thats my understanding, all Project contracts have to be for 3 years - this was the case for Diack and Payne and I have always understood that that the IRFU insisted on this.

That's exactly my understanding too, how could he be a project player if he's not IQ by the end of his contract?