European Tour - Seve Trophy

Bit late in offering up this weeks ET extravaganza.... Well it's matchplay team event, designed to rival the presidents cup and give the european tour an extra team event.

Late change to the team for Continental Europe with and Injury to Alvaro Quiros, Raphael Jacquelin has been called into the team as the next in line on the qualifying list.

So what do we know about this relatively new offering.

1. The events inception back in 2000 was the birth of an idea from the great Seve himself. This was a time when the teams had playing captains and despite his form the great man carried his team to victory. To this day that remains the only victory Continental Europe have managed. The Mantle being held by GB&I in ebery subsequent event since.

2. The original event held at Sunningdale, we now move onto St Nomme la Breteche in france, with JVD captaining in his home land. Paul McGinley captains GB&I for a 2nd time in hope that another victory may enhance his chances of moving upto the big leagues and becoming a future RC captain.

3. Miguel Angel Jiminez will have the honour this year of hitting the opening tee shot at the event in memory of Seve himself who did so back in 2000 at Sunningdale. Fellow compatriot and RC captain JM Olazabal will be ever present to keep an eye on proceedings and maybe looking at who could do a job for him this time next year.

So to the teams for this year:
Europe:
T Bjorn
A Hansen
P Hanson
A Noren
M Mannasero
F Molinari
R Jacquelin
P Larrazabal
MA Jiminez
N Colsaerts
GB&I
L Westwood
D Clarke
I Poulter
J Donaldson
M Foster
S Dyson
R Fisher
D Horsey
R Rock
S Jamieson

So work out your pairings and winners from those of the above.

Briefly onto the challenge tour, a good win for Tommy Fleetwood last week in Kazahkstan taking the challenge tours richest regular event prize. After a slow start from Fleetwood a couple of top 3's and now a win have rocketed him up the rankings to No1 on the money list

2 other englishman in the top 5 on the CT list this year #4 Daniel Denison and #5 Jamie Moul. The rest of the top 5 made up with #2 Ricardo Santos of portugal and frenchman #3 Ben Herbert.

Herbert is the exception though and will no longer be competing on the CT and has no need to worry about gaining full exemption by way of his money list ranking. herbert has 3 victories on the CT already this year so has already gained his full exemption for the tour for remainder of this year and all of next.

We went to the first Seve Trophy at Sunningdale and I have been quite disappointed that it is has not grown in stature in the ensuing years, in fact it seems to have diminished. We watched Seve play a miracle shot from behind some trees on the 17th hole when he beat Monty (the rival captain). After they'd moved on, we stood behind said trees and I still can't understand to this day how he managed to do it - drew the ball out of the rough, through a very small gap and onto the green. Pure genius! Still got the T-shirt

So do those finishing in the top of the CT get membership to the 2012 European tour season? If so what evants can they play?

Mac:

The top 20 on the CT Order of merit gain exemption to the tour Proper. With regards to what events they can play is dependant on where in the top 20 they finish. For example last years runner up on the OOM Matt Haines local lad to me whom i've had the pleasure to play with many times, received the same level of exemption as the person who wins Q School overall effectively a full exemption into the bigger events played the whole of the Desert swing, Qatar, Dubai etc. Also played in events like last weeks KLM Open.

the further down the rankings the less chance of playing bigger events but gain full exemption to events such as Sicilian Open, Hassan Deux etc. There is then a re-rank done in June as to what level of card they have dependant on success on tour. So the events are very much down to what exemption level they earn

Early scores on the doors;

GB&I - Up in 3 of the first 4 matches on the couse

Bad start for Andrey Burmakin in the Russian Open in the Challenge Tour, he's +25 after 9 holes, out in 61!!

6 11 7 4 6 7 4 9 7 = 61

WOW!!

EmmDee57 wrote:Bad start for Andrey Burmakin in the Russian Open in the Challenge Tour, he's +25 after 9 holes, out in 61!!

6 11 7 4 6 7 4 9 7 = 61

WOW!!

Makes you wonder how he qualifies for a tournament like that.

i'm assuming by his name he is a local pro with an invite to play the event, as I cannot find anything about him on the CT before today, and have to say even i think I could do better than that

Maybe it's Maurice Flitcroft dressed up as a Russian??

There was another guy on the challenge tour last week that shot 103

Shooting numbers like that on any tour would surely seriously make you question why you play the game for a living

Maybe he's just related to some oligark.

Maverick wrote:Early scores on the doors;

GB&I - Up in 3 of the first 4 matches on the couse

And now up in all 5 matches almost half way through the first round...... I wonder is McGinley still clinging to the under dog tag

I think McGinley can use this provided GB&I win the match overall as his makeweight to a full RC captaincy

Mav

Did you not win a friendly club match last night?

I would think that gives you a better claim to a ryder cup spot than anyone winning the seve trophy.

Mav, I think McGinley will be a Ryder cup captain whatever the result this week, he won back in 2009 so a second victory would make absolutely sure.

McLaren wrote:Mav

Did you not win a friendly club match last night?

I would think that gives you a better claim to a ryder cup spot than anyone winning the seve trophy.

Yes Mac i did. Care to elaborate on how you come to that conclusion....

As in the seve trophy is of such dire quality that winning your club match is a better indication of meriting a ryder cup spot.

Really? did i just have to explain that????????????????????

Now that he's becaming famous, I tried to find some info about him and discovered that Mr. Andrey Burmakin is a pro at another very posh 'Golf and Yacht Club' from around Moscow and perhaps the secret of his score lies in this line from his resume: " Andrey starts his golf career at Moscow indoor golf-center". So, it may well be that this is his first outdoors experience . And the resume finishes with: "You can take lessons with Andrey in Enlish (sic!), German and Russian". Still moving along nicely at 30-over after 12 holes...

As a statement of status and poshness of that particular club, I read that among other events, they've recently "hosted the First Aristocratic Games where has been announced the «Best Golf, Polo and Yacht Award 2011»..."

Back to Earth - great start from GB&I in France, still leading in 5 out of 5...

Yes Mac you did, because you can come across as a sarcastic git...

But that aside, what a stupid thing to say, so your saying that just because this is a lesser event Olly won't get an indication of how some youngsters perfomr in team matchplay e,g Matteo or Noren.....

Your points on this forum today are at best baffling

Jesus mav, who knew taking the pi55 out the seve trophy was of limits. I am so very sorry.

Dont understand the gip the seve trophy gets.. Ok its not going to be that important in the context of other trophies or tournaments but there are a few excellent players playing this year and gives some benefit to the younger members who havent played in a ryder cup etc before. Also, with professionals they dont play much team matchplay anyway, so always more practice for them.

not saying it's off limits Mac, just seems another case of your humour not showing through as anything other chidlish...

For me the Seve trophy is a non entity and totally pointless playing pesronally as I said on another thread a better thing to would be having Europe inclusive of GB&I playing on the same side against a team from Asia this would do a couple of things. Help set up a rivalry that can be used to promote healthy competition. Give the whole of team europe good matchplay experience instead of exhibition experience to those like Foster for example that won't make an RC, and may draw in the bigger players e.g Rory, Luke et al and would be a better test in a non RC year

Burmakin now +30 for 12 holes.... Really........

I can't see the Seve trophy lasting too many years.

First year since the great man's death resulted in a few big names playing (in Poulter's case not making FedEx round 3 was the main factor), but next year they will stuggle to secure any big names as increasing demands on their time. Without a selection of top players then I can't see it surviving.

How about a Europe / USA / Rest of World "Ryder Cup" instead of the President's Cup and the Seve Trophy. Each team has 12 players. Same format as the Ryder Cup. In foresomes and fourballs each team puts out 4 pairings, two playing one opponent and the other two playing the other opponent. Each round in Day 1 and Day 2 will have 6 matches rather than 4 matches. I would guess 1 extra hour of daylight is needed but given the Ryder Cup is played in UK in September then the problem is easily solved by moving to a sunnier climate of bringing the date foward. Sunday singles would be 18 matches, but plenty time to get 18 matches played in a day.

May sound complicated, but its not when you think it through.

ScottieD18 wrote:I can't see the Seve trophy lasting too many years.

How about a Europe / USA / Rest of World "Ryder Cup" instead of the President's Cup and the Seve Trophy.

How about nothing to replace this pointless event................

John,

Your probably right, but seems like the "Rest of the World" wanted a team competition which lead to the President's Cup, then Europe created the Seve Trophy to make sure the USA did not get an advantage in playing team golf every year.

My idea means the pointless Seve Trophy is no more, but the President's Cup becomes a World event. I think the players and fans would prefer this format.

Interesting to see the CT website is not showing Burmakin completed round score just his tee time for tomorrow...

However last check was +36 through 15 holes so even if he par'd in the remaining holes he would of shot a 108. However if he continued in the same vain he was on target for something like a 112........

Looks like he had a slightly better back 9 then!!

I take your pointSvottie,

I just think a team event shoud be about representing a geographical entity.

Hence, i believe the RC to be the only one that fulfills that criteria in that it's continent v continent.

The Presidents Cup and Seve Trophy are flawed events IMO and i don't buy this "valuable matchplay experience" stuff at all.

Maverick wrote:Interesting to see the CT website is not showing Burmakin completed round score just his tee time for tomorrow...

However last check was +36 through 15 holes so even if he par'd in the remaining holes he would of shot a 108. However if he continued in the same vain he was on target for something like a 112........

Maybe they told him to NR or took him off the course. See there is another guy +23 thru 12.

Looks to be heading towards a successful day for GB&I just waiting to wrap up a 4-1 lead after thursdays fourballs.

Not sure about the NR, can't really see that being the case, but certainly he must be walking around the locker room head hung in shame, is now starting to make me wonder about the quality on the CT as so many are having such poor scores in recent weeks.

This mad Russian hacker is making me think that if Donald Trump ever got his much publicised course to host a European Tour event, I can see him getting a tee off time and posting this type of score!!

Don't mention Trump getting a tour event Mac will have a hissy fit stating some reason it shouldn't be allowed.

Our favourite Hall Of Fame nominee off to a terrible start in Russia.

7 4 4 7 5 4 8 5 6 50 5 8 8 8 5 6 5 7 4 56 106 34


Par 4 4 3 5 4 3 4 5 4 36 4 4 4 3 4 5 3 5 4 36 72
Yards 430 404 191 586 428 182 454 564 452 3691 480 477 470 189 374 569 223 570 448 3800 7491
Metres 393 369 175 536 391 166 415 516 413 3374 439 436 430 173 342 520 204 521 410 3475 6849

What a great score 106...

Unsurprisingly he didnt hit one green in reg or one fairway but good for him he got up and down 3 times.

He parred the last so maybe he will be on a high for tomorrrow....

kwinigolfer wrote:Our favourite Hall Of Fame nominee off to a terrible start in Russia.

Not great... last year he came top of the Russians here. Vancsik must be one of the most acomplished guys in terms of past performances (apart from Forsyth probably) playing this year on the Challenge Tour...

106 that's just a joke, who an earth lets these players play in these tournaments, it must have been embarrassing for the guy himself!!

Is anybody else finding the Vivendi a total bore fest?

ScottieD18 wrote:John,

Your probably right, but seems like the "Rest of the World" wanted a team competition which lead to the President's Cup, then Europe created the Seve Trophy to make sure the USA did not get an advantage in playing team golf every year.

My idea means the pointless Seve Trophy is no more, but the President's Cup becomes a World event. I think the players and fans would prefer this format.

Europe didn't create the Seve Trophy, Seve did. It was his idea which he took to the ET and they went with it. The PGA tour created the President's Cup because they were fed up with losing the Ryder Cup and wanted something they could win. The players also wanted something they'd be paid to play in because obviously they don't earn enough money on the regular Tour.

I just don't get the bile and vitriol which is being heaped on the Seve Trophy. If you don't like it, don't watch it or comment on it

Ladyput,

It's not a case of bile or vitrol and I was as a big a fan of Seve as anyone after being at Lytham for 7 days during the 1979 Open. I am sure I'll tune in at some point over the weekend, but I won't plan my day around it nor record it on Sky and watch it x6 in the evening.

I think the point I am trying to make is that I cannot see how the Seve Trophy will endure. Accoding to press reports Oli had to apply some pressure to get some of the top players to play as this was the first event since Seve's death. In two years times the pressure on the top player's schedules will probably be greater and I would guess most of them won't play.

Possibly the Seve Trophy will become like an Under 21 International football match. If so and they get the money to finance it then fine, but I think most TV golf fans will not be too interested.

Why? I can see these guys play every other week on the Tour and dividing Europe into GB&I and Continetal Europe doesn't create any emotional attachment to one side over the other.

If the top players are not involved and the viewing figures are low then they will stuggle to get the sponsership.

What is going on with the challenge tour event? Two players 19 over through 12 & 15 holes and another 20 over through 15. The guy who shot 106 thankfully (for his playing partners and specators I presume) pulled out I think.

Sand, there was someone heading for worse than 106 yesterday but looks like he didn't hand his card in as it's not showing on the website now. He was out in 61 and was last recoreded at +36 through 15 holes.

Even at my worst this season with the sh@nks, I couldn't post anything as high as that.

I wouldnt think its too hard to raise the prize money/funding for the Seve trophy with it based in Paris.Not over expensive to run and a decent TV revenue as well.
If there is a space in the schedule most of the guys will be happy to pitch up and play.Pro golfers dont forget.
Never going to rival the RC but still worth doing IMO

Maverick wrote:Don't mention Trump getting a tour event Mac will have a hissy fit stating some reason it shouldn't be allowed.

Wrong, I would actually like to see his course get the open. That way some of the classics are left alone and not tuned into courses suitable for modern tour golf. In fact he would get the open every year if I was in charge.

EmmDee57 wrote:Sand, there was someone heading for worse than 106 yesterday but looks like he didn't hand his card in as it's not showing on the website now. He was out in 61 and was last recoreded at +36 through 15 holes.

Even at my worst this season with the sh@nks, I couldn't post anything as high as that.

See the guy now last, shot 95 then 100 today. Nice 2 days work

McLaren wrote:

Maverick wrote:Don't mention Trump getting a tour event Mac will have a hissy fit stating some reason it shouldn't be allowed.

Wrong, I would actually like to see his course get the open. That way some of the classics are left alone and not tuned into courses suitable for modern tour golf. In fact he would get the open every year if I was in charge.

Considering your stance on how trump is destroying scotland and it will do nothing for the economy other than fill his wallet I find your stance on this bizarre... Still im not getting into another Trumped up argument over it....

See the PGA club pro's are taking on their counter parts in the USA this weekend in the Club pro version of the RC

LadyPutt wrote:

ScottieD18 wrote:John,

Your probably right, but seems like the "Rest of the World" wanted a team competition which lead to the President's Cup, then Europe created the Seve Trophy to make sure the USA did not get an advantage in playing team golf every year.

My idea means the pointless Seve Trophy is no more, but the President's Cup becomes a World event. I think the players and fans would prefer this format.

Europe didn't create the Seve Trophy, Seve did. It was his idea which he took to the ET and they went with it. The PGA tour created the President's Cup because they were fed up with losing the Ryder Cup and wanted something they could win. The players also wanted something they'd be paid to play in because obviously they don't earn enough money on the regular Tour.

I just don't get the bile and vitriol which is being heaped on the Seve Trophy. If you don't like it, don't watch it or comment on it

Is this not what this forum is about??

Much better from Kafelnikov in Russia today, and good rounds by Fleetwood and Pavan.

PS: Don't disagree with most of LadyPutts' sentiments about the Presidents Cup but don't believe the US Team gets paid - rather a sizeable contribution is made in their name to charities of their choice. Doesn't the same apply to the Ryder Cup as well in the wake of Woods etc beefing about not getting paid?

Anyway, the Seve Trophy looks to have gained some energy today and it should be a good weekend.

Nice recovery from the continentals today...
Pavan is another promissing Italian and would love to see him on the main tour next year. Great score today on a tough course.

Just a thought related to the discussion about Vivendi Cup. I can see why many (mainly from the GB&I side like most of us) would find it somewhat pointless and not that exciting, but I'm quite happy that it is there and hopefully will grow in popularity here in future. It is quite clear that it is a much more popular and interesting event, relatively speaking, for the golf lovers from the continental Europe. It's not hard to see why golfers from other European countries traditionally want to measure up with GB&I which have dominated this sport for centuries... I'm pretty sure part of Seve's idea was based on such sentiments and motivations...
And as long as they seem to find some reasonable sponsorship and play it in a nice place like Paris and when many of the top players seem to enjoy it, why not!?

Unfortunately, I've seen that Rory managed to score another small PR own goal these days by posting a picture where he is almost naked and doing some biomechanics training somewhere in Leeds, while the others are playing Seve's trophy and I saw already lots of negative comments he received for that... (currently those comments have been removed). Pitty, really...

No individual with 2 points through 2 matches yet. Very uncommon.