How would big Frank have faired on the current scene?

by Michaels, Sean Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:24 am

In his own words, 'there were a fair few cups of tea around in my day'.

He only ever lost to World Champions or future World chapions in an era that was significantly tougher than the current one. Furthermore he arguably ran out of gas against Smith and Witherspoon when both matches were his to throw away.

How does he fair against the likes of the K's and Haye? In my eyes his achievements prior to beating McCall were greater than becoming World champion. I feel he would be in the top 5 current heavies with a shout at being undisputed number 1.

by **88Chris05** Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:27 am

In the top five? Certainly. A shot at being undisputed number one? Never. He may have a puncher's chance against Wladimir, but I can't for the life of me see how Bruno gets past Vitali.

by Rowley Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:27 am

He beats Haye for me, have seen nothing at heavy to suggest Haye has huge power and for me he does not maintain anywhere near the work rate to make Frank's stamina become an issue, the brothers would both be a bridge too far for Frank but I'd make him a favourite against pretty much anyone else out there, which I suspect says more about them than it does Frank.

by **HumanWindmill** Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:35 am

I sometimes feel that it has become the norm to focus on those things which Bruno couldn't do and neglect the things which he could.

On the positive side, he possessed a very potent jab. This was no pawing range finder, but a battering ram of a weapon with reasonable accuracy. Both Klitschkos have stood head and shoulders above the motley crew which serves as the modern heavyweight division courtesy of superb jabs and physical strength. Bruno possessed the same qualities.

If Frank could make Lewis decidedly uncomfortable by skewering him on the end of a jab I could see him doing the same to either of the Klitschkos. Beat them? Probably not, but I don't believe they'd find him an easy night's work, and his honest endeavour, coupled to that jab, would keep him a lot more competitive than most of their opponents have been.

by huw Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:35 am

rowley wrote:He beats Haye for me, have seen nothing at heavy to suggest Haye has huge power and for me he does not maintain anywhere near the work rate to make Frank's stamina become an issue, the brothers would both be a bridge too far for Frank but I'd make him a favourite against pretty much anyone else out there, which I suspect says more about them than it does Frank.

Agreed although I would say he has a chance against either Klit, more with Wlad as I feel Franks power and size would scare Wlad into a shell and Frank could win by being busier. Vitali he would have a chance but only very slim as I can't help but think Frank would be troubled at some point and when that happens feel Vitali would take advantage of a staggering non-hugging Frank.

by Mind the windows Tino. Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:37 am

I agree with rouuley that he would beat Haye. Would just stick that jab in his face and force Haye to step out of his comfort zone before hurting him and either stopping him or sending Haye back into his shell in the same way as Wladimir.

I actually think he would make more of a fight with Wladimir than Haye did. Frank was prepared to step up to the plate much more than David and would at least be in range more often than Haye. That may well mean he gets busted up and stopped, but it at least gives him a chance to get some big shots off, and his jab would give Wladimir some problems.

Vitali would be too much for him. I would expect him to outlast Frank and be able to take his shots much better than Frank could withstand Vitali's. Late stoppage for me.

by Rowley Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:39 am

Agree Huw, perhaps didn't write my post well enough but would absolutely give Frank a chance against either brother but do feel you'd have to make both of them favourite, think against Wlad you are talking about two guys both a bit vulnerable when tagged but think the current version of Wlad is a little more adept at getting through such a crisis and that is an area we never really saw Frank add to his arsenal at any point in his career.

by Michaels, Sean Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:40 am

Very bored and trawling through old you tube footage. He looks pretty slow although more than sound technically.

I have to think that I could get Wlad out of there before he gassed. He had a heavy dig but more importantly he looked to have a great chin. too good as it seemed he only ever went down after a culmination of barnstorming shots. Can't see Wlad stunning him then going in for the KO as the likes of Smith and Witherspoon did.

Vitali is a different kettle of fish. Not sure on that one.

by Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:34 am

A fight against Vitali would go the same way as the Danny Williams fight I think.

Vitali is just too awkward and strong, he would beat Frank all over the place.

by coxy0001 Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:54 am

Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn wrote:A fight against Vitali would go the same way as the Danny Williams fight I think.

Vitali is just too awkward and strong, he would beat Frank all over the place.

Frank is a far better fighter than Williams ever was.

For me he has the reach to compete with both of them if i'm to be honest. Having had to double check Bruno's was 82", Vitali's 80" and Wlad's 81" - he wouldn't have to get himself in range as he'd already be there if throwing his own punch. Wouldn't have to do a Haye/Adamek in terms of manoevering himself into a position to get inside their big long rangy jabs.

And lets not forget Frank could box. Really box. As mentioned he threw fights away that were his to win, competeted with Lewis before doing Franks usual of catching a big punch and not taking a knee.

For me Wlad is too cautious and Frank has the physical attributes to force him backwards and take a close but comfortable UD. I'd back him 10/10 times to win that one as well. He could whack and Wlad would be even less inclined to let his punches flow and leave a gap to that chin.

Vitali is the big horrible one. For me Frank is the better technical fighter, it's just whether he can cope with the pace or make Vitali dance to his tune. As proved in other fights (and as i said above) Frank could box, he had the reach to compete with Vitali's jab etc. Frank wouldn't win every time, but he'd certainly give Vitali more than a run for his money more often than not.

by bhb001 Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:13 pm

Good question, Alma. I think Vitali does well, but Wlad would be intimidated

by coxy0001 Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:13 pm

Not sure Wlad lasts any longer than 2 rounds to be honest, doesn't do going backwards well and Tyson with his foot on the gas would certainly do that.

Vitali has the chin and durability to take a beating before Tyson gasses and runs out of ideas how to knock his man out, stops him late for me unless Tyson has his head screwed on

by **HumanWindmill** Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:17 pm

The thing with Vitali is that we've seldom seen him take more than one punch at a time. They said that Jess Willard's chin was impregnable until he ran into Dempsey, but Dempsey was hitting him with more than a single punch at a time. Neutral corner or not, Willard was getting knocked out that day.

Tyson had the handspeed and the technique to hit Vitali with several shots at a time. If Vitali is still standing after a few combos he's favourite, in my book.

But would he be still standing?

by **ShahenshahG** Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:26 pm

Depends if Tyson is scared or not. If he goes for it and early- I think he wins on points or LKO after wearing out Vitali quite early, Vitali does lumber around though he got decent technique. If he is timid then Vitali establishes rhythm and makes Tyson look like a bitch on the end of one twos and leaning on him and throwing him around.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:16 pm

HumanWindmill wrote:The thing with Vitali is that we've seldom seen him take more than one punch at a time. They said that Jess Willard's chin was impregnable until he ran into Dempsey, but Dempsey was hitting him with more than a single punch at a time. Neutral corner or not, Willard was getting knocked out that day.

Tyson had the handspeed and the technique to hit Vitali with several shots at a time. If Vitali is still standing after a few combos he's favourite, in my book.

But would he be still standing?

must ask the question windy does vitali end up being caught by combinations to the chin? the size difference is absolutely massive, you can talk about willard -dempsey but to compare willards skillset to vitalis would be shameful. vitali is nimble on his feet and is extremely good at making full use of his advantages, his trademark back step is basic but he does it so well that people that arent his size struggle so much its a joke. also vitali is a master of timing when fighters are charging in at him this is over looked. it seems to be put down as a gimme that tyson is able to get at him but prime for prime i dont think tyson is able to get many opportunities to get to vits chin.

by **HumanWindmill** Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:26 pm

AlexHuckerby wrote:
HumanWindmill wrote:The thing with Vitali is that we've seldom seen him take more than one punch at a time. They said that Jess Willard's chin was impregnable until he ran into Dempsey, but Dempsey was hitting him with more than a single punch at a time. Neutral corner or not, Willard was getting knocked out that day.

Tyson had the handspeed and the technique to hit Vitali with several shots at a time. If Vitali is still standing after a few combos he's favourite, in my book.

But would he be still standing?

must ask the question windy does vitali end up being caught by combinations to the chin? the size difference is absolutely massive, you can talk about willard -dempsey but to compare willards skillset to vitalis would be shameful. vitali is nimble on his feet and is extremely good at making full use of his advantages, his trademark back step is basic but he does it so well that people that arent his size struggle so much its a joke. also vitali is a master of timing when fighters are charging in at him this is over looked. it seems to be put down as a gimme that tyson is able to get at him but prime for prime i dont think tyson is able to get many opportunities to get to vits chin.

I'm not suggesting that Willard was as accurate or refined as Vitali, Alex, but his skillset was almost exactly the same. Wide stance, tendency to pull back from a jab, potent jab of his own ( yes, Willard had a very good jab, ) genuine kayo power in the overhand right, and nimble on the feet for such big men. The only things Vitali has in his arsenal to better Willard's in keeping a man off him are his accuracy and extra workrate, in my opinion. Willard was, after all, a bit of an oaf as far as throwing quick punches was concerned, and possessed the accuracy of a stopped watch, except that Willard only got it right one and a half times per day.

It's down to opinion, but I believe that if Tyson could get past Tony Tucker to outjab (!) him and outscore him, then he'd have more than an outside chance of getting inside Vitali Klitschko to let the serious leather fly.

by **ShahenshahG** Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:53 pm

HumanWindmill wrote:
AlexHuckerby wrote:
HumanWindmill wrote:The thing with Vitali is that we've seldom seen him take more than one punch at a time. They said that Jess Willard's chin was impregnable until he ran into Dempsey, but Dempsey was hitting him with more than a single punch at a time. Neutral corner or not, Willard was getting knocked out that day.

Tyson had the handspeed and the technique to hit Vitali with several shots at a time. If Vitali is still standing after a few combos he's favourite, in my book.

But would he be still standing?

must ask the question windy does vitali end up being caught by combinations to the chin? the size difference is absolutely massive, you can talk about willard -dempsey but to compare willards skillset to vitalis would be shameful. vitali is nimble on his feet and is extremely good at making full use of his advantages, his trademark back step is basic but he does it so well that people that arent his size struggle so much its a joke. also vitali is a master of timing when fighters are charging in at him this is over looked. it seems to be put down as a gimme that tyson is able to get at him but prime for prime i dont think tyson is able to get many opportunities to get to vits chin.

I'm not suggesting that Willard was as accurate or refined as Vitali, Alex, but his skillset was almost exactly the same. Wide stance, tendency to pull back from a jab, potent jab of his own ( yes, Willard had a very good jab, ) genuine kayo power in the overhand right, and nimble on the feet for such big men. The only things Vitali has in his arsenal to better Willard's in keeping a man off him are his accuracy and extra workrate, in my opinion. Willard was, after all, a bit of an oaf as far as throwing quick punches was concerned, and possessed the accuracy of a stopped watch, except that Willard only got it right one and a half times per day.

It's down to opinion, but I believe that if Tyson could get past Tony Tucker to outjab (!) him and outscore him, then he'd have more than an outside chance of getting inside Vitali Klitschko to let the serious leather fly.

Think Vitali is a bit too clever to allow too much of that - I think he will take a shot then grab on to wear Tyson abit. I think its majorly down to Tysons courage on the night - he goes in and accepts a few belters and goes all out crazy on Vitali to knacker him - He has the opportunity to beat him.

Dempsey Willard is on the surface is a good comparison but Dempsey wasn't ever intimidated - Tyson has shown sometimes that he can be - both in and out of the ring. I think where Tyson falls down in comparison to Dempsey is that his Peekaboo style is rather obvious and as Holmes showed -can be stalled albeit temporarily - whereas Dempsey loks like he is going in face first but does his little subtle bit to throw bombs with either hand, while the opponent is trying to capatalise on the seemingly easy target.

by **HumanWindmill** Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:57 pm

Certainly agree that Dempsey came from a variety of angles, Shah, and it's also worth remembering that he was one of the best infighters in heavyweight history. Tyson certainly wasn't. He was too upright and just wanted to fiddle about until he could get back to mid range, from which he was absolutely lethal.

You fellas may well be right. Maybe Vitali does frustrate Tyson on the way in and wear him down.

Would have been interesting, for sure.

by **ShahenshahG** Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:03 pm

I reckon the clincher is that when Tyson was getting frustrated he would grab and wrestle the opponent into a position where he had the room to work. If he tries to wrestle Vitali...he will exhaust himself.

by Michaels, Sean Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:04 pm

HumanWindmill wrote:The thing with Vitali is that we've seldom seen him take more than one punch at a time. They said that Jess Willard's chin was impregnable until he ran into Dempsey, but Dempsey was hitting him with more than a single punch at a time. Neutral corner or not, Willard was getting knocked out that day.

Tyson had the handspeed and the technique to hit Vitali with several shots at a time. If Vitali is still standing after a few combos he's favourite, in my book.

But would he be still standing?

by Michaels, Sean Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:11 pm

Michaels, Sean wrote:
HumanWindmill wrote:The thing with Vitali is that we've seldom seen him take more than one punch at a time. They said that Jess Willard's chin was impregnable until he ran into Dempsey, but Dempsey was hitting him with more than a single punch at a time. Neutral corner or not, Willard was getting knocked out that day.

Tyson had the handspeed and the technique to hit Vitali with several shots at a time. If Vitali is still standing after a few combos he's favourite, in my book.

But would he be still standing?

It didn't quote?

Windy, I don't usually watch old stuff but due to my arse being like a watercannon I caught up a bit today. Can't believe the punishment Ali took before the stoppage against Frazier. Likewise what Bruno took against Smith and Witherspoon. Just feel with the standing 8 count more fashionable these days, Bruno could have taken anything the K's could throw. Wlad would succomb to Bruno's KO power but there's a possibility the Vitali fight would be very similar to Bonecrusher and Witherspoon results. Neither better, but just had a bit more in the tank than Frank.

by **HumanWindmill** Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:17 pm

That's why I wouldn't write Frank off either, Sean.

He'd certainly have a go at matching either of them, jab for jab, and he'd have the ambition to let the heavy artillery go, also, even if it meant coming under fire himself. We're so used to the success and dominance of the brothers that it's hard to bet against them, so I might make Bruno an outsider, but, like you, I certainly wouldn't dismiss his chances.

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:22 pm

Be the third best heavyweight in the world........I'd even give him a shout at knocking out Vlad...If he lands the big one....

Frank was hard work for anybody...compact..good jab and very powerful....(lost his bottle against Tyson in the 2nd)

However he was manufactured and had no survival instinct...

Make no mistake he'd give the Klits trouble and if he was in his prime post-Klits he'd clean up for me..

by DaveVDK Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:24 pm

Cant see him beating eathier Klitschkos , dont see him having many problems with anyone else though

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:38 pm

perhaps and i really do mean perhaps - povetkin could keep it close and take the last few on workrate with the faster hands when frank tires due to povetkins work rate. though povetkin is still somewhat of an unknown quantity in truth.

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed Nov 09, 2011 6:39 pm

Povetkin wouldn't be around in the later rounds....

Guy is garbage..

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 7:34 pm

like i said perhaps

by rycoys Wed Nov 09, 2011 7:59 pm

haye would be far to quick for big frank , he would be an absolute nightmare for him , frank would struggle for 5 or 6 rounds with haye being illusive and using a counter right all night untill franks legs give way , frank with wlad would be a borefest with a ud to wlad and vitali would ko him in 2 ,

by **ShahenshahG** Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:10 pm

rycoys wrote:haye would be far to quick for big frank , he would be an absolute nightmare for him , frank would struggle for 5 or 6 rounds with haye being illusive and using a counter right all night untill franks legs give way , frank with wlad would be a borefest with a ud to wlad and vitali would ko him in 2 ,

Illusive yes - Elusive no. Haye runs backward - no point being elusive if you cant use it to get in. Frank keeps him at the end of his jab and clocks him on the way in. Haye takes his sock off and loses by TKO due to injury.

by mikeymax71 Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:38 pm

I have to agree that Frank over the years has been harshly criticized, especially about his chin. However, I will be in the minority here as I think he would lose to Haye. Haye's athleticism, speed and power will be too much for Frank. In the early rounds I think Frank's jab will be key but I also expect Haye will be able to move in range more easily against Frank, who did not have the best footwork and land his shots as well. I could see Frank scoring a flash knockdown in the early rounds but eventually tiring as Haye lands his bombs in combinations. Haye in 7-8 rounds for me.

I would also favour Tyson to destroy Wlad as I just do not see Wlad being able to stay away from Mike for the first 6 rounds, and it would only take one punch from Tyson to hurt Wlad and finish him off.

I agree Vitali is made of sterner stuff, but for me, his lack of caution and willingness to engage will be his downfall, as Tysons far superior foot speed will allow Mike to get in to position to land his bombs and with his quicker hands would land more than Vitali. If Lewis and Corrie Sanders could hurt Vitali, then I am sure Tyson could as well and with his added ferocity would see him eventually wear down or cut Vitalii for a TKO win.

I would also fancy Bruno's chances with both brothers as their styles or assets would make it it easy for Frank to land his own punches. I think Vitali's durability could see him outlast Frank but, still to see how Vitali reacts at being hit often and I think Frank would test this. I think Frank could nick this on a close decision but might have to be holding on late on like he did against McCall.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:39 pm

ShahenshahG wrote:
rycoys wrote:haye would be far to quick for big frank , he would be an absolute nightmare for him , frank would struggle for 5 or 6 rounds with haye being illusive and using a counter right all night untill franks legs give way , frank with wlad would be a borefest with a ud to wlad and vitali would ko him in 2 ,

Illusive yes - Elusive no. Haye runs backward - no point being elusive if you cant use it to get in. Frank keeps him at the end of his jab and clocks him on the way in. Haye takes his sock off and loses by TKO due to injury.

Although I could see Frank hitting air for a lot of the night I just wonder as to whether David would be happy walking in on a guy that has a better win - KO ratio than either Klit and a slight reach advantage on both as well. That being said Bruno doesn't exactly have the defensive awareness that either Klitschko has and there is a chance he would leave his chin out and allow Haye to come in and land right hands and due to the fact that Haye isn't punching upwards as much he most probably will be able to keep his balance whilst coming in. But all this depends on Haye's mindset, and really he hasn't shown anything to suggest he's willing to take the necessary type of risks to take out someone like Bruno at Heavyweight... So although it is still partially unknown I would have to go with Bruno in a borefest...

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:47 pm

mikeymax71 wrote:I have to agree that Frank over the years has been harshly criticized, especially about his chin. However, I will be in the minority here as I think he would lose to Haye. Haye's athleticism, speed and power will be too much for Frank. In the early rounds I think Frank's jab will be key but I also expect Haye will be able to move in range more easily against Frank, who did not have the best footwork and land his shots as well. I could see Frank scoring a flash knockdown in the early rounds but eventually tiring as Haye lands his bombs in combinations. Haye in 7-8 rounds for me.

I would also favour Tyson to destroy Wlad as I just do not see Wlad being able to stay away from Mike for the first 6 rounds, and it would only take one punch from Tyson to hurt Wlad and finish him off.

I agree Vitali is made of sterner stuff, but for me, his lack of caution and willingness to engage will be his downfall, as Tysons far superior foot speed will allow Mike to get in to position to land his bombs and with his quicker hands would land more than Vitali. If Lewis and Corrie Sanders could hurt Vitali, then I am sure Tyson could as well and with his added ferocity would see him eventually wear down or cut Vitalii for a TKO win.

I would also fancy Bruno's chances with both brothers as their styles or assets would make it it easy for Frank to land his own punches. I think Vitali's durability could see him outlast Frank but, still to see how Vitali reacts at being hit often and I think Frank would test this. I think Frank could nick this on a close decision but might have to be holding on late on like he did against McCall.

Unsure if we are talking about the same Vitali here, whilst Vitali has been in a couple of scraps unlike his brother he is hardly the first to want to engage in a war! The difference is with the likes of Lewis is that these are big men in terms of height and reach and can get in on Vitali, Vitali never to my knowledge gets hit with big combinations add in a big height difference and reach with Tyson having to get really close and throw very high taking away some power, add into the fact that when peopl get into that sort of range Vitali like his brother enjoys hugging and leaning on his opponent and as we know, Tyson has very little inside game, so am unsure that he would be able to get the big bombs off in that way very often...

No doubt Tyson can hurt him with the power he has displayed, but to finish him I am not too sure and to be honest Tyson wasn't the greatest at keeping a relentless pace for 12, he even said himself he always had stamina problems thats why it was a good thing his fights didn't last that long. To be honest it's no real wonder with the fact he puts everything into every punch and the amount of weight on a 5"10 frame takes it's toll.

by **ShahenshahG** Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:51 pm

I can see where you're coming from Mikey/Alex - but the fact is there is no opponent or performance (In Wlads case) that could justify anything other than a Frank Win.

Barrett - Ko'ed by Valuev of all people
Valuev - Quite probably Audley Harrison in a yeti suit.
Audley Harrison - Usman Ahmed in a Harrison Suit
John Ruiz - A journeyman at his peak about a decade ago.

Wladimir - who he ran away from with a token attack at the end.

by **ShahenshahG** Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:52 pm

Barrett - Correction* Outpointed in MD and Knocked down by the slowest punch ever thrown*

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:57 pm

ShahenshahG wrote:I can see where you're coming from Mikey/Alex - but the fact is there is no opponent or performance (In Wlads case) that could justify anything other than a Frank Win.

Barrett - Ko'ed by Valuev of all people
Valuev - Quite probably Audley Harrison in a yeti suit.
Audley Harrison - Usman Ahmed in a Harrison Suit
John Ruiz - A journeyman at his peak about a decade ago.

Wladimir - who he ran away from with a token attack at the end.

Well, thats pretty much what I'm saying, there isn't really a performance that justifies Haye win, in theory I could definitely see Haye causing Bruno problems, and perhaps even winning, but he has never shown that type of performance or mindset against a good enough fighter so like I said I would have to go with a Bruno win in a borefest.

by Super D Boon Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:01 pm

People forget that Fwank wasn't that big a heavy certainly not by today's behemoth like standards.

He might struggle against someone like Valuev even but agree with the consensus I can't see him beating either K and think that Wlad's chin issues is a bit of a myth, given that Wlad was splattered by very hard punchers. Bruno wasn't that big a puncher at the highest level so don't see Bruno with even a puncher's chance against WK. Bruno might be number three but never, ever gets past the Klitschkos.

by Nico the gman Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:01 pm

Definitely think Big Frank could win a version of the title and if he clocks Wlad I think he could have him over, no way would Frank be out muscled by the Kbros either.
Nothing in the Heavyweight division that Bruno would have any reason to fear apart from the Kbros, the rest are garbage.
Bruno did well against Lewis till he got caught and Haye ain't no Lewis,I feel its a 50/50 fight Bruno well capable of knocking Haye out but Haye has the power in his right hand if he connects.
With regard to the Kbros and Tyson, I think prime Tyson wrecks Wlad early and knocks out or stops Vitali by the half way point.

by Super D Boon Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:04 pm

I also give Haye the win over Bruno. Bruno might outwork Haye and probably be leading on the cards by about the tenth and Haye lands a big right, Bruno had a poor chin goes down. Even worse was Bruno's survival skills, when he took a bomb he just seemed to cover up let the punches come, he never knew how to hold on. Haye by late TKO.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:04 pm

Nico the gman wrote:Definitely think Big Frank could win a version of the title and if he clocks Wlad I think he could have him over, no way would Frank be out muscled by the Kbros either.
Nothing in the Heavyweight division that Bruno would have any reason to fear apart from the Kbros, the rest are garbage.
Bruno did well against Lewis till he got caught and Haye ain't no Lewis,I feel its a 50/50 fight Bruno well capable of knocking Haye out but Haye has the power in his right hand if he connects.
With regard to the Kbros and Tyson, I think prime Tyson wrecks Wlad early and knocks out or stops Vitali by the half way point.

to compare Haye and Lewis is like comparing Apples to Oranges, they're completely different type of fighters, just because he puts in a good performance against one, doesn't really mean he can cause the other one the same type of problems, the styles are so different that it makes it a slightly unknown factor.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:06 pm

Super D Boon wrote:I also give Haye the win over Bruno. Bruno might outwork Haye and probably be leading on the cards by about the tenth and Haye lands a big right, Bruno had a poor chin goes down. Even worse was Bruno's survival skills, when he took a bomb he just seemed to cover up let the punches come, he never knew how to hold on. Haye by late TKO.

Must say once tagged his skills were Audley Harrisonlike.

by Super D Boon Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:09 pm

Bruno was as robotic as the K bros only smaller. His power at the top level was nothing to write home about and is overrated on the basis that he momentarily wobbled Tyson, which as I argued on another thread he was nowhere near finishing Tyson when he had him hurt. Given he landed some flush punches on Witherspoon who just shook them off and McCall too. Bruno's power was overrated. Wlad takes a bomb from Bruno and doesn't get finished off.

by Super D Boon Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:11 pm

AlexHuckerby wrote:
Super D Boon wrote:I also give Haye the win over Bruno. Bruno might outwork Haye and probably be leading on the cards by about the tenth and Haye lands a big right, Bruno had a poor chin goes down. Even worse was Bruno's survival skills, when he took a bomb he just seemed to cover up let the punches come, he never knew how to hold on. Haye by late TKO.

Must say once tagged his skills were Audley Harrisonlike.

Yeah that's a pretty accurate reflection. Bruno was real amatuerish when he got pegged even though the rest of his attributes are far better than Embarrison's.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:12 pm

To be fair Witherspoon and McCall don't get stopped by many, to be fair Witherspoon chin isn't the greatest but he didn't tag him clean all night, he has good power, not great, probably good enough to put Haye and Wladimir into a bit of trouble however.

by Super D Boon Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:19 pm

Maybe but not sold on Bruno stopping Wlad at all. Still don't see the punchers chance. Wlad got caught by a few massive punches against Sanders not just one shot.

Remember it well Witherspoon just shrugged off a flush punch by Bruno but that was ages ago maybe I'll rewatch the fight. I think he was up on the cards against the Spoon and Bonecrusher but his power was not good enough to get them out of there via one punch or an accumulation.

Bruno was devastating at that level just below the top tier with I suppose his most emphatic win coming against an old and fat Coetzee and maybe Bugner. I think the fact he battered a lot of bums and oldsters plus the way overhyped Tyson "wobble" gives the impression that Bruno was a massive banger when he wasn't.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:24 pm

I would never say Bruno was a massive banger, but I think he had the power to stop most... If he catches Wlad well I think he could have him in big trouble, maybe not have him out in one but wobbly legs etc.

Bruno was rather basic but not bad at all, I think the fact he was the first man to wobble Tyson is looked on a bit too much as well but it must be noted that he still wobbled him and if he can wobble Tyson who probably had a better chin than Wladimir, he can wobble Wladimir.

by Nico the gman Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:25 pm

AlexHuckerby wrote:
Nico the gman wrote:Definitely think Big Frank could win a version of the title and if he clocks Wlad I think he could have him over, no way would Frank be out muscled by the Kbros either.
Nothing in the Heavyweight division that Bruno would have any reason to fear apart from the Kbros, the rest are garbage.
Bruno did well against Lewis till he got caught and Haye ain't no Lewis,I feel its a 50/50 fight Bruno well capable of knocking Haye out but Haye has the power in his right hand if he connects.
With regard to the Kbros and Tyson, I think prime Tyson wrecks Wlad early and knocks out or stops Vitali by the half way point.

to compare Haye and Lewis is like comparing Apples to Oranges, they're completely different type of fighters, just because he puts in a good performance against one, doesn't really mean he can cause the other one the same type of problems, the styles are so different that it makes it a slightly unknown factor.

Wasn't comparing Lewis( an ATG heavyweight)merely stating that against a fighter of Lewis's calibre Bruno did OK,Haye as we all know is a small Heavy or pumped up cruiser which ever way you want to look at it.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:28 pm

Nico the gman wrote:
AlexHuckerby wrote:
Nico the gman wrote:Definitely think Big Frank could win a version of the title and if he clocks Wlad I think he could have him over, no way would Frank be out muscled by the Kbros either.
Nothing in the Heavyweight division that Bruno would have any reason to fear apart from the Kbros, the rest are garbage.
Bruno did well against Lewis till he got caught and Haye ain't no Lewis,I feel its a 50/50 fight Bruno well capable of knocking Haye out but Haye has the power in his right hand if he connects.
With regard to the Kbros and Tyson, I think prime Tyson wrecks Wlad early and knocks out or stops Vitali by the half way point.

to compare Haye and Lewis is like comparing Apples to Oranges, they're completely different type of fighters, just because he puts in a good performance against one, doesn't really mean he can cause the other one the same type of problems, the styles are so different that it makes it a slightly unknown factor.
Wasn't comparing Lewis( an ATG heavyweight)merely stating that against a fighter of Lewis's calibre Bruno did OK,Haye as we all know is a small Heavy or pumped up cruiser which ever way you want to look at it.

Fair enough, must have been lost in translation then and for that I apoligise, friend. Wink

by ONETWOFOREVER Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:29 pm

Bruno would be up there but I don't see him beating a Vitali Klitshcko. The fact he wobbled Tyson is a joke to me. Tyson was not in any real trouble. Getting clipped on the chin can cause you to loose balance as it did it Tyson's case. Bruno fought like a scared rabbit most of the time in that fight, smothering Tyson and not allowing him to let his hands go. When he did let them go Bruno had a matter of seconds.

by AlexHuckerby Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:36 pm

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:Bruno would be up there but I don't see him beating a Vitali Klitshcko. The fact he wobbled Tyson is a joke to me. Tyson was not in any real trouble. Getting clipped on the chin can cause you to loose balance as it did it Tyson's case. Bruno fought like a scared rabbit most of the time in that fight, smothering Tyson and not allowing him to let his hands go. When he did let them go Bruno had a matter of seconds.

Although I don't think he had Tyson in massive trouble you surely cannot take away the fact that he had Tyson in trouble for a moment. He clocked Tyson, Tyson wobbled and you could see it on his face the fact he didn't throw back right away and went against the ropes he was hurt, not massively but a good combination from Bruno landing clean could have had him on the floor. Alas Bruno didn't possess these kind of boxing skills but please don't try and take away the fact he was the first man to hurt Tyson, because he clearly was.

by Nico the gman Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:44 pm

No probs Alex

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