Glasgow Warriors vs Bath

First topic message reminder :

Warriors team for the math on Sunday:

15 Stuart Hogg

14 Tommy Seymour
13 Rob Dewey
12 Graeme Morrison
11 Colin Shaw

10 Duncan Weir
9 Chris Cusiter

1 Ryan Grant
2 Pat MacArthur
3 Michael Cusack
4 Richie Gray
5 Alastair Kellock (Captain)
6 Robert Harley
7 John Barclay
8 Ryan Wilson

Substitutes

16 Dougie Hall
17 Gordon Reid
18 Ed Kalman
19 Tom Ryder
20 Chris Fusaro
21 Henry Pyrgos
22 Troy Nathan
23 Federico Aramburu

Cusack back in the front row, no place for Beattie, and a resumption of the bosh-bash center-pairing of Morrison and Dewey

[quote="funnyExiledScot"]Yes, one in particular was horrible following a bizarre effort from Seymour to catch the ball (as a former fullback I expected better from him).

Hogg is still raw, but ball in hand he's a real prospect. Always looking to challenge Bath and always looking around with his head up. Not something we've had much of with Scottish fullbacks in recent times.

Weir, a deserved MOTM, also had some raw moments. That silly fly hack in the opening moments in particular showed naivity. He should have grabbed that ball and set it up properly. That could have cost us.

But these are young players and they will make mistakes. What really matters to me is that not only do these young lads have potential, but they are being selected on merit and delivering on the big stage against good sides.

What's also postive is that Glasgow were missing some good and important players. Add Low, Thompson, Beattie, Jackson and DTH to that match day squad and you've actually got some depth.[/quote
y
Sadly Low and Beattie seem to have lost all semblance of form. Alphabet out for the season and unlikely SL would start Jackson and Weir unless he plays Jackson at 12? Seems welded to Morrison for his 'defensive' ability.

Otherwise great to see the youngsters playing so well.

fES, what I like about them is that they show little fear, play what is in front of them, and try to make things happen - if they can keep those traits, reckon we'll be well set

Agreed, that's what I liked about Hogg in particular. Not at all afraid to have a crack at the opposition and try things, and his try showed good awareness of where the defenders were. Weir also made a nice break and showed some nice touches.

I do wonder about what will happen when Jackson returns. Personally I wouldn't break up Weir and Cusiter, and would rather see Jackson given a chance at centre, perhaps using Morrison or Nathan at 13. Not one to try in the HC, but might be worth a look for 20 minutes in a Rabo12 game, just to see how it runs.

Logically, that sounds worth an experiment - think we have 2 Rabo rounds after the first two Heino rounds, so may as well give Jackson a shot at 12 in those if he's ready. But leave Cusiter-Weir well alone

Only problem with that is that Robinson probably sees Jackson as his starting 10 for the 6N so will want Cuss Jackson gametime.

I would like to see Weir at 12 - get some game time there and then he can debut for Scotland at 12

justified sinner wrote:Only problem with that is that Robinson probably sees Jackson as his starting 10 for the 6N so will want Cuss Jackson gametime.

I genuinely hope he hasn't decided on who his 10 will be for the 6 Nations. Far too early to make that decision. At present, Weir is by a distance our best option, and for that reason (TJ), I don't want to see him shifted from 10.

I think Jackson will have to come on from the bench to begin with. The question is really whether he comes on for Weir or for Morrison. I guess you have to judge each match situation on its merits.

funnyExiledScot

fair enough

Not sure about about a Weir - Jackson 10 -12 combo as they are both pretty lightweight and both of them are prone to miss tackles or are naive in defense. At international level I really don't think that would be a good idea!

hopefully Robinson doesn't just pick Jackson if Weir is playing well - I'd happily have Weir start on this current form!

NDL I think would have been a viable option at 12 for Scotland but he has been superb at 13 for the burgh. The defensive effort he Scott put in against Irish was very good. Weir, Scott and NDL would be my pick to start in the 6n

That would be great to see but would he really risk such an inexperienced 10-12 axis in the 6 nations? I personally don't see why not but can't see it happening!

As a neutral this was a dreadful game to watch-last 5 seconds excepted.Could not believe that Geech is coach of one of those sides.Would not get too excited about Scottish Rugby based on this match as both sides were poor and created zilch.
Glad that Robo team won,mind!

Yup zilch.

...other than the two tries...

Well I'm absolutely gutted with that performance from Bath, had territory and possession but couldn't do anything with it.

They should have put the game away by halftime if they were capable of creating anything remotely dangerous with all that ball.

They almost deserved that last minute sandbagging to be honest.

Taffineastbourne wrote:As a neutral this was a dreadful game to watch-last 5 seconds excepted.Could not believe that Geech is coach of one of those sides.Would not get too excited about Scottish Rugby based on this match as both sides were poor and created zilch.
Glad that Robo team won,mind!

Errmmmm a heroic tackling / defensive performance from Glasgow and one nicely worked try one well taken opportunist effort.

Bath threw everything they had and it proved to be too little too slow.

Abendenem (sp) looked lively i must say

Just in from the game had a few pints on an empty stomach so may need to edit this post in the morning!

Bath should have won them game, they always seemed like one broken tackle away from a try but we stuck at it and when given the chance we scored.

I don't think it was Weirs best game alround but for a 21 year old he is playing at a level way beyOnd reasonable expectations. Harley was my man of the match, was everywhere and I hope when they agreed his new contract they added a "tackle" bonus. , of they did he is on a cracking little earner!

Hogg was good also, he can kick but today was not his best.

Doubt we will make the last eight but as in previous years we might get ko'd but we will take someone else with us!

IanBru wrote:Yup zilch.

...other than the two tries...

Talk me through the creativity in both tries,please.First was down to rubbish/non-existant defence and the second was a lucky bounce.Am I missing something???

Dot,

just back from Stravaigin man - great night. Mom was defo Gray. Tackled everything that moved.

Who was the moronic lock (No. 5) for Bath - what a Grade A. Holly Wilaboobie

That guy (Bath No. 5) has the look of Courtney Laws all over him - i.e. crap

haha im all over that comment couldn't agree more

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:That guy (Bath No. 5) has the look of Courtney Laws all over him - i.e. crap

Bath No. 5 was Ryan Caldwell.

funnyExiledScot wrote:

justified sinner wrote:Only problem with that is that Robinson probably sees Jackson as his starting 10 for the 6N so will want Cuss Jackson gametime.

I genuinely hope he hasn't decided on who his 10 will be for the 6 Nations. Far too early to make that decision. At present, Weir is by a distance our best option, and for that reason (TJ), I don't want to see him shifted from 10.

I think Jackson will have to come on from the bench to begin with. The question is really whether he comes on for Weir or for Morrison. I guess you have to judge each match situation on its merits.

Completely agree that you shouldn't mess with a halfback hinge that is working as well as Cuss and Weir.

In terms of whether Jackson will get a shot at IC, I think that Lineen will only chance it against an opposition midfield of a suitable size (and possibly where the game in question is impossible to win/lose at that stage). There was no way he'd have slung in Jackson against Banahan for example. Probably correctly.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Dot,

just back from Stravaigin man - great night. Mom was defo Gray. Tackled everything that moved.

Who was the moronic lock (No. 5) for Bath - what a Grade A. Holly Wilaboobie

This is utterly unrelated to the OP, but I wanted to mention that I really miss the Stravaigin and the pubs around Gibson Street in general...

Meant to say that I thought it was a massive call from Lineen to substitute John Barclay right after he'd taken off Ali Kellock - any thoughts?

Interesting that a certain J Beattie Esq picked up a MOTM award in Ayr's narrow win (18-17) over Plymouth in the B&I Cup - messrs J Welsh and a young R McAlpine also featured for Ayr

An interesting assessment of the youngsters coming thru in the Scottish game in this morning's Herald: Potent youth - early doors, yet, but it does look promising

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:An interesting assessment of the youngsters coming thru in the Scottish game in this morning's Herald: Potent youth - early doors, yet, but it does look promising

Wipe that silly grin off your face this morning

On second thoughts, don't! Savour the moment. Well done to the two Scottish teams at the weekend. Hopefully the spur to better things and hopefully the fans will get out and support them in the next round and beyond. Did I tell you that Glasgow are my second favourite team?

Aye, ye may have mentioned it!! No counting chickens here, by any stretch, jsut delighted at the way the youngsters in particular are playing the game - heads-up rugby played with no fear - fantastic and long may it continue. Some results will go against both teams, but as you say, we'll savour the moment just now

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Meant to say that I thought it was a massive call from Lineen to substitute John Barclay right after he'd taken off Ali Kellock - any thoughts?

I thought it was a silly call at the time but Fusaro came on and was lively. Had a whiff of pre-meditated substitutions though which I'm not a fan of. Ryder is a form player so could understand that one, but Barclay was having a decent game. On the one hand he should be applauded for having faith in a young player like Fusaro, but at the time I thought it was daft.

Not as daft however as McGeechan taking off Heathcote and bringing on Donald. That was moronic. Heathcote had a great handle on the conditions and was kicking beautifully. Donald's first contribution was to poor the ball over the dead ball line. Not a smart move that at all.

As for MOTM, a player who deserves a mention was Dan Hipkiss. Comfortably the most dangerous attacker on the pitch and had Bath been able to read his offloads Glasgow would have been in trouble. Well handled by Glasgow in the second half though.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:An interesting assessment of the youngsters coming thru in the Scottish game in this morning's Herald: Potent youth - early doors, yet, but it does look promising

Whilst I love the enthusiasm, there's a bit too much hyperbole in that article for me. Has Hogg been "sensational" all season? Is Matt Scott really "terrorising" some of the best defenses in the game?

Feet need to be glued to the ground, lest we fall into the "golden generation" nonsense that has plagued the Irish rugby team and the England football team.

Other nations have promising youngsters as well. Homer was excellent for London Irish, and Heathcote was every bit as good as Weir on Sunday.

I'm optimistic, more so in this crop of youngsters than ever before, but there's a colossal difference between performing at club level and at international level, and there's still so much for these guys to learn.

funnyExiledScot wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:An interesting assessment of the youngsters coming thru in the Scottish game in this morning's Herald: Potent youth - early doors, yet, but it does look promising

Whilst I love the enthusiasm, there's a bit too much hyperbole in that article for me. Has Hogg been "sensational" all season? Is Matt Scott really "terrorising" some of the best defenses in the game?

Feet need to be glued to the ground, lest we fall into the "golden generation" nonsense that has plagued the Irish rugby team and the England football team.

Other nations have promising youngsters as well. Homer was excellent for London Irish, and Heathcote was every bit as good as Weir on Sunday.

I'm optimistic, more so in this crop of youngsters than ever before, but there's a colossal difference between performing at club level and at international level, and there's still so much for these guys to learn.

Totally agree, fES, but glass is half full at the moment

funnyExiledScot wrote:

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:An interesting assessment of the youngsters coming thru in the Scottish game in this morning's Herald: Potent youth - early doors, yet, but it does look promising

Whilst I love the enthusiasm, there's a bit too much hyperbole in that article for me. Has Hogg been "sensational" all season? Is Matt Scott really "terrorising" some of the best defenses in the game?

Feet need to be glued to the ground, lest we fall into the "golden generation" nonsense that has plagued the Irish rugby team and the England football team.

Other nations have promising youngsters as well. Homer was excellent for London Irish, and Heathcote was every bit as good as Weir on Sunday.

I'm optimistic, more so in this crop of youngsters than ever before, but there's a colossal difference between performing at club level and at international level, and there's still so much for these guys to learn.

Good to have some optimisum, but as you say, lets not fall into the trap that most other nations (you know who you are) seem to of calling them 'World Class' after a few good games. Hopefully they can continue to grow and slot into the international set up, so that we can be competitive in the 6 nations over the next few years

Great wins though (although Glasgow were a bit on the lucky side to be against a team that had decided to learn from the Scotland team on not using possesstion and territory)

Funny wasn't it to see a Scottish side make the most of its opportunities and score tries at each and every opportunity, and yet the opposition dominated territory and possession and didn't cross the line once.

A welcome reversal!!

Something seriously wrong at Bath at the moment. Other than scoring a bucketload of tries during 2 weeks of the LV, we've looked flakey all season. To lose to a team like Glasgow in the manner we did was shocking, and to score no tries??? Geech needs to seriously toughen these guys up. With some of the names and talent available, we should not be losing these games.

I agree with that - Bath did not play to the sum of its parts. Banahan was missed, but Stuart Barnes was right to say that Bath shouldn't need to rely so heavily on one player.

The Bath scrum wasn't as good as I thought it would be, and neither Taylor nor Louw played to their reputations. Vesty at 12 wasn't effective and when Bath did get in behind the Glasgow line, the team lost shape for the second wave and didn't challenge the Glasgow defenders through the middle, but rather went lateral towards touch. The attacking shape was all wrong from Bath, and the tackling and defensive effort from Glasgow was just too good.

Thought Biggs looked dangerous with ball in hand, but he didn't see that much of it

....and when he did get the ball it was mainly on the switch because the backs had drifted wide, and Glasgow were reading it. When the game broke up he was dangerous but Glasgow barely missed a tackle, and when the did, the cover was good.

Leinster will be a different kettle of fish for Glasgow though. Their wrap around moves make it much harder for a simple rush to be effective so Glasgow will have to adapt. The good news is though that Glasgow can improve on Sunday's performance most certainly. Weir has played better this season and I think Nathan instead of Dewey would be a good move.

Hopefully Leinster will persist without Jennings, so that Barclay can make a mess of the breakdown.

Stats for the match on ESPN site: Glsa vs Bath

Why does this remind me of the Karate Kid

Kellock - sub off
Ryder - sub on
MacArthur - sub off
Hall - sub on
Nathan - sub on
Dewey - sub off

Alot of metres run with the ball there from Weir - also from Ryan Wilson.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Thought Biggs looked dangerous with ball in hand, but he didn't see that much of it

Hence my earlier post. He's probably still damaged from Delon Armitage's "welcome" though....

Does anyone think Johnny Beattie will get his shirt back at 8 from Ryan Wilson? Not likely on current from anyway.

I think Beattie has lost interest in playing for the Warriors. He’s not been the same since he was injured and now finds himself having to fight for a place that everyone knew was his. Whether he’s the sort of person who gets frustrated by that I don’t know. The best thing for Beattie and Scotland is to get him a new club next season. I would love the old Beattie back but I just don’t think we’ll see him playing like that in a Glasgow shirt again.

He can come down to Exe Chiefs, an abrasive 8 would be just the ticket

Scot Abroad wrote:I think Beattie has lost interest in playing for the Warriors. He’s not been the same since he was injured and now finds himself having to fight for a place that everyone knew was his. Whether he’s the sort of person who gets frustrated by that I don’t know. The best thing for Beattie and Scotland is to get him a new club next season. I would love the old Beattie back but I just don’t think we’ll see him playing like that in a Glasgow shirt again.

Beattie had attitude problems before his main breakthrough year in 2010. That season everything seemed to come togehter he had a good year for Scotland and Glasgow, last season as you say since his injury he has been a shadow of the player he was. I am sure some team will take a punt on him, but perceived attitude problems in two of his last three seasons, may have cost him the big contract he would have been certain to get otherwise.

Wilson in my opinion is nowhere near where Beattie is when both are top of their game, certainly not yet anyway. Should Beattie go, I can see another Number 8 being brought in.

I agree with that view, Wilson isn't yet able to dominate a game in the same way that Beattie did consistently when at his peak.

In the spring of 2010 Beattie was genuinely challenging Parisse for the mantle of best 8 in Europe. His carries were full of power, his work at the tail of the line out was excellent and he seemed to have unlimited reserves of energy. Of the "killer B's" that season he was the star act, making the carries whilst the other two cleaned out the rucks and competed for the ball.

Wilson had a good game on Sunday and made some yards, but he wasn't destructive in contact and at times his hands let him down. Early days of course and he's a big prospect, but in my mind it would be a wise club to take a chance with Beattie.

Wasps might be a good pick. They have a track record of rescuing out of sorts internationals and making good, plus their pack could use a bit of oomph, and Beattie plus a returning Haskell and Rees coming back to fitness has the look of a very handy back row indeed.

I wouldn't be jumping at a Wasps contract until the financial side of the club is sorted out, and of course with the Brand intending to return there himself next season, playing time might still be a hurdle for JB - time to head to the Chiefs

The Brand is better at 6, and I'd have thought moving to a club in financial difficulty would be like a home away from home for a Scottish player??

Exeter would be a step down in any case. They've fired their bolt, now it's just a slog to see whether they or Newcastle will get relegated

Right, outside now