Andy Tuilagi signs for the Dragons

It's rumbled on for long enough, but he's finally put pen to paper:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15934117.stm

Thoughts?

yeah I saw that this morning. Is it a good signing? is he as destructive as the rest of the family?

He's probably the 'lesser' of the brothers. Never hit the heights of Manu & Ales, but should do a job in the centre. I guess the hope his he will be the wrecking ball the guys like Tovey, Brew, Harries et al can float around and get space.

gcBlues wrote:I guess the hope his he will be the wrecking ball the guys like Tovey, Brew, Harries et al can float around and get space.

That the hope, I'd say. I must admit I don't think I've ever seen him play.

He's certainly the lesser of the professionally contracted brothers (Varvae his younger brother was at Tigers academy but never made it), a centre with pace and power but only just above average in each. He lacks the explosive ball in hand ability of brothers and his handling is rather average but he gets himself over the gainline regularly so will give you good go forward. Not the biggest tackler but doesn't fly out of the line like his brothers which makes him a touch more reliable but again not as explosive.

Should be a good signing if you're after a centre to bring some solidarity to the defence and add some basic go forward grunt to the attack. Just don't expect him to set the world alight.

We do look a bit lightweight in the backs, apart from Brew but he's stuck out on the wing. Often we don't have the penetration from midfield to get over the gain line to put our pace men onto the ball at pace and/or in space. A 'wrecking ball' centre like Tuilagi should help matters. And, Darren Edwards has worked with him before so we shouldn't be getting a player blind. He'll know him inside out and obviously feels he's just what we need.

It's always good to have a Tuilagi in your team!

We have 2!

You could actually make a pretty frightening 7's team out of him & his brothers...

Fereti 'Freddie' Tuilagi
Henry Tuilagi
Olotuli Tuilagi (he is a fa'afafine so doesn't play but is reputed to be the biggest of all of them!)
Alesana 'Alex' Tuilagi
Anitelea Tuilago
Vavae Tuilagi
Manu Tuilagi

Shame as i think that Ashley Smith and Adam Hughes has been excellent. In fact the Dragons backline in general have been great. I dont know where he would fit in?

Sorry luckless I didn't see your post and just did the same article

Oh well, just another NWQ player taking up the places of young Welsh tallent . This is getting rediculous now. The Dragons already have Joe Bedford, Chavhanga, Hugo Ellis, Nigel Hall, Jamie Smith, Tom Willis and I suppose I will leave Dan Way out because although he is English he did come through the Newport ranks. With Tuilagi, that makes it SEVEN NWQ players, and we always have the Dragons looking for the sympathy vote. Something has to be done about this !!!!

LordD

In all fairness Nigel Hall has retired, Hugo Ellis normally plays for Newport and is actually WQ anyway, Jamie smith is a work in progress player however he is second choice behind Martyn Thomas, Tom Willis I think will be leaving at the end of this season as Burns and Buckley will be our first choice hookers. The Dragons really can't be accused of not developing talent. Just look at the Welsh backrow

its about time, think he'll do really well at the dragons as long as hes used for what hes good at (basically what Sam said).

He'll bring some power and pace and a target in midfield to work off, could be a good foil for Hughes and nice to have smith/tuiulagi/hughes making up the midfield options, hourses for courses, blah etc.

LordDowlais wrote:Oh well, just another NWQ player taking up the places of young Welsh tallent . This is getting rediculous now. The Dragons already have Joe Bedford, Chavhanga, Hugo Ellis, Nigel Hall, Jamie Smith, Tom Willis and I suppose I will leave Dan Way out because although he is English he did come through the Newport ranks. With Tuilagi, that makes it SEVEN NWQ players, and we always have the Dragons looking for the sympathy vote. Something has to be done about this !!!!

Hugo Ellis is Welsh Qualified through Welsh parents, I think his Father is Welsh, may have even been capped at Junior levels.

So its only six. But still that is enough.

Comfort i see your point about options, I guess he will inspire a different kind of option for the midfield. I would not like him to be consuming a budget and position that left Young welsh players suffering. No different to any of you.

absolutely measteg, the way i look at foreign signings isnt necessarily per region, but over all 4, this'll be the second NWQ player who could be starting regularly (along with Lualua). thats 6 welsh youngsters playing on average per match weekend in the centres. That and its what the region needs on-field (bar a few beasts shaved and taught to prop).

i think the regions are starting to work, we're producing talent and its all over the pitch, its not like when all 4 regions had at least 1 NWQ player in the backrow starting, more regularly 2.

baby steps!

How is Hugo Ellis getting on?
Am I right in thinking he's that big english 8?

flankertye wrote:How is Hugo Ellis getting on?
Am I right in thinking he's that big english 8?

Not very well, he plays mainly for Newport RFC at semi-pro level now. Not good enough for the Dragons.

On another note, it's all well and good putting a number on the NWQ players in a squad, but what really matters is how many start in a match day 15. So to say that the Dragons are doing anything wrong when their match day 15 is 95% Welsh is a bit absurd. Here's probably our strongest 15:

Phil Price
Lloyd Burns
Dan Way
Luke Charteris
Adam Jones
Dan Lydiate
Gavin Thomas
Toby Faletau
Wayne Evans
Jason Tovey
Aled Brew
Ashley Smith
Adam Hughes
Tonderai Chavanga (South African)
Martyn Thomas

So that's 1 NWQ in our best team, the team we try to put out when possible. The players mentioned previously as NWQ hardly play for us. Our bench isn't much worse in terms of NWQ:

Tom Willis/Rhys Buckley
Nathan Williams
Scott Morgan
Andrew Coombes/Tom Brown
Rob Sidoli/Jevon Groves
Lewis Evans
Joe Bedford
Tom Riley
Steffan Jones

So, only Tom Willis (an ex All Black and our captain) and Joe Bedford. Name me a region, in fact any club in Britain and Ireland, who regular puts out a sqaud with so few non-country qualified players?

Adding Tuilagi is not going to tip us over the edge in terms of NWQ as he will probably be only one of two (with Chavanga) in a match day 15.

Griff wrote:

flankertye wrote:How is Hugo Ellis getting on?
Am I right in thinking he's that big english 8?

Not very well, he plays mainly for Newport RFC at semi-pro level now. Not good enough for the Dragons.

On another note, it's all well and good putting a number on the NWQ players in a squad, but what really matters is how many start in a match day 15. So to say that the Dragons are doing anything wrong when their match day 15 is 95% Welsh is a bit absurd. Here's probably our strongest 15:

Phil Price
Lloyd Burns
Dan Way
Luke Charteris
Adam Jones
Dan Lydiate
Gavin Thomas
Toby Faletau
Wayne Evans
Jason Tovey
Aled Brew
Ashley Smith
Adam Hughes
Tonderai Chavanga (South African)
Martyn Thomas

So that's 1 NWQ in our best team, the team we try to put out when possible. The players mentioned previously as NWQ hardly play for us. Our bench isn't much worse in terms of NWQ:

Tom Willis/Rhys Buckley
Nathan Williams
Scott Morgan
Andrew Coombes/Tom Brown
Rob Sidoli/Jevon Groves
Lewis Evans
Joe Bedford
Tom Riley
Steffan Jones

So, only Tom Willis (an ex All Black and our captain) and Joe Bedford. Name me a region, in fact any club in Britain and Ireland, who regular puts out a sqaud with so few non-country qualified players?

Adding Tuilagi is not going to tip us over the edge in terms of NWQ as he will probably be only one of two (with Chavanga) in a match day 15.

Glad he has signed, wonder when his first match will be.

yeah, can't see the point in criticising the Dragons for signing Tuiagi when they're producing so many Welsh qualified players, now if it was the Blues......

Turkster wrote:yeah, can't see the point in criticising the Dragons for signing Tuiagi when they're producing so many Welsh qualified players, now if it was the Blues......

Exactly, it's not as though we signed him at the expense of a big Welsh ball carrying center - we haven't got any.

shame, am I right in thinking he was a wasps player a few years ago?

Turkster wrote:yeah, can't see the point in criticising the Dragons for signing Tuiagi when they're producing so many Welsh qualified players, now if it was the Blues......

WALES: Leigh Halfpenny; George North, Scott Williams, Jamie Roberts, Shane Williams, Rhys Priestland, Lloyd Williams; Gethin Jenkins, Huw Bennett, Scott Andrews, Bradley Davies, Ian Evans, Dan Lydiate, Sam Warburton (C), Toby Faletau

REPLACEMENTS: Matthew Rees, Ryan Bevington, Ryan Jones, Justin Tipuric, Tavis Knoyle, Dan Biggar, Alex Cuthbert.

to be fair, i dont think theres a problem at any of the regions producing players for wales. the academies have had time to start bedding in, the regions are running out of money to buy "star" imports and are having to turn to their youngsters. and its paying off slowly.

long gone are the days of 13 ospreys + 2. How it should be

Rush, Molitika, Lualala, Filise, Paterson, Tito, Parks, Blair _ all 1st choice, seems you've got a team full of internationals, shame less than half are Welsh.

flankertye wrote:shame, am I right in thinking he was a wasps player a few years ago?

Flankertye, yeah he's a bit of an odd one is Ellis. He played something like England U16s, Wales U18s, England U20s (where he was captain), got a Wasps contract but wasn't getting anywhere so came to Wales to try his luck and push on for Welsh international honours but hasn't got anywhere either. In fairness though Toby Faletau has come through ahead of him and we had Bearman before him and a few new faces too.

Funnily enough his brother joined us too, Arthur Ellis, but I don't think he ever got a game.

Just to add that a lot of NWQs were brought in by Paul Turner. Darren Edwards, who himself has brought in a few NWQs, has stated that he is having a clear out as he wasn't happy with the balance of the squad as it was another coach's legacy and not necessarily players he would have picked. The likes of Willis, Ellis, the prop Ben (Sand) Castle who I haven't seen for quite a while, will not have contracts renewed in my opinion. Edwards seems intent on picking local players first and buying NWQs if no-one is good enough.

Turkster wrote:Rush, Molitika, Lualala, Filise, Paterson, Tito, Parks, Blair _ all 1st choice, seems you've got a team full of internationals, shame less than half are Welsh.

now thats just rude

SO your 1st choice 8 is NWQ, your captain is NWQ, your 1st chocie 10 (ha!) is NWQ....

I'd say only Rush/Filise/Lualua/Paterson/Parks(grhnearsryhs!£$^gsdf?!??!?!?!?!?!?!) are the first choices out of those currently. still, thats too many in my eyes (im a blues fan to boot).

But, you could also say: Gethin Jenkins/Bradley Davies/Warburton/Roberts/Lloyd Williams/Halfpenny/Scott Andrews ( ) are all very strong-performing welsh internationals

and then potentially: Pretorius/Cuthbert/Fish/Hewitt/Tom James/TR Thomas as welsh squad candidates.

they're getting there, its hard to find welsh professional rugby players willing to be paid in pies.

anyway, next season, Delve will come home to replace Rush, Pretorius will cement his place at number 6, and 1 of morgan/tovey will be replacing parks.

anyway, next season, Delve will come home to replace Rush, Pretorius will cement his place at number 6, and 1 of morgan/tovey will be replacing parks.

Outside, now....

Comfort wrote:

and 1 of morgan/tovey will be replacing parks.[/i]

ouch!

Edwards seems intent on picking local players first and buying NWQs if no-one is good enough.

That's what he said in his interview. He is very passionate about producing talent and was responsible for finding Faletau. (I know Turner was in charge but Edwards got him to Dave Parade).

Thanks for filling me in on the Ellis situation, heard he was quite promising a few seasons ago.

I would have responded to LordDowlais, but it seems it was dealt with and dealt with very accurately. We have made some odd signings over the past few seasons to be fair , Tom Willis and Joe Bedford spring to mind. However both should be on their way out at the end of this season. Jamie Smith was some much needed full back cover, we suffered blows to Martyn Thomas then Will Harries if you remember. This seemed the logical option rather than stick our first choice 10 out of position. Still, about 2 would make the starting XV. I think Andy should go to 12 with Hughes outside him. So if anything, I'm not sure where Smith would fit in? He has been great for us to.

Not sure which Region (or whatever you want to call it) Lord supports. Perhaps we can point the finger at his home town for not getting behind their Region?

As I said on the other thread...Yet another non-Welsh player taking up a place where a youngster could be learning his trade. Not good

Jimmy Moz wrote:As I said on the other thread...Yet another non-Welsh player taking up a place where a youngster could be learning his trade. Not good

So which youngster would this be?

Morgannwg wrote:

Jimmy Moz wrote:As I said on the other thread...Yet another non-Welsh player taking up a place where a youngster could be learning his trade. Not good

So which youngster would this be?

I dont follow close enough to name one but surley you cant be saying there is no one Welsh for that position?

Yes, there is Ashley Smith. But there is lack of suitable enough cover behind him and not enough power in the midfield, hence the Tuilagi signing. Smith has been with us since a youngster and learnt his trade via us. Before you bring up Chavanga, we also have Brew, Harries (both capped) with Mike Poole close behind them. Harries is currently injured. The only two worth a mention because they would likely be the only NWQ two to start in our League and Cup games.

Massive hit on Hook

munkian wrote:Massive hit on Hook

But then Hook's hardly seen as a pinnacle of manliness with ball in hand now is he?

Still pleased to see he's signed, just hope the Dragons can get the best out of him and use him at maximum efficiency, like how Wales have recently been doing with Roberts. You really can't depend on these big-hitting centres to get around by themselves.

I hope having Tuilagi in midfield doesn't make us over-reliant on him. It's definitely useful to have a big ball-carrier in midfield but we have to mix things up and use him as a decoy sometimes, not just give it to him to smash it up every time. We need to keep the opposition guessing.

If anything the dragons could do with a couple of non welsh players. The scarlets game showed that we lack experience in the back line and we've missed a big carrier in the centre for a long time. One thing we lack at the dragons is depth. A few injuries and we're picking kids. This signing will add strength to our back-line and tuilagi will give us a new dimension that we currently don't have.
A lots been made of the amount of NWQ players at the regions, but as the WC showed, the talent is there and is coming through. The youngsters will always get a chance, especially with the amount of internationals being played.

manofgwent wrote:One thing we lack at the dragons is depth. A few injuries and we're picking kids.

It doesn't help that Lewis Evans was called up by Wales and then left out of the match-day squad.

luckless_pedestrian wrote:

manofgwent wrote:One thing we lack at the dragons is depth. A few injuries and we're picking kids.

It doesn't help that Lewis Evans was called up by Wales and then left out of the match-day squad.

There are positives too - he gets to train with some of Wale's best players and coaches which will give him drive to play better to get himself into the Welsh squad

I know, Munkian. But with Toby and Dan unavailable as well, we could have done with him for the Scarlets match.

I hope having Tuilagi in midfield doesn't make us over-reliant on him. It's definitely useful to have a big ball-carrier in midfield but we have to mix things up and use him as a decoy sometimes, not just give it to him to smash it up every time. We need to keep the opposition guessing.

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/9391752.Tuilagi_to_bring_flair_as_well_as_physicality/

Reading this interview it looks as though Darren is thinking the same thing.

lewis Evans IS now in the matchday squad but Burns is carrying a knock from the Perp game

Morgannwg wrote:I would have responded to LordDowlais, but it seems it was dealt with and dealt with very accurately. We have made some odd signings over the past few seasons to be fair , Tom Willis and Joe Bedford spring to mind. However both should be on their way out at the end of this season. Jamie Smith was some much needed full back cover, we suffered blows to Martyn Thomas then Will Harries if you remember. This seemed the logical option rather than stick our first choice 10 out of position. Still, about 2 would make the starting XV. I think Andy should go to 12 with Hughes outside him. So if anything, I'm not sure where Smith would fit in? He has been great for us to.

Not sure which Region (or whatever you want to call it) Lord supports. Perhaps we can point the finger at his home town for not getting behind their Region?

Right, have let everyone have their reply to my post on this article and know I am going to give my reaction. This nonsense that most of the NWQ player are not guaranteed a start is pure BULL. Weather they are starting or not, they are still there clogging up the places for the younger WQ players. Whilst I am at it as well, this "project" player debacle has to be looked at as well. If a player is not good enough to break through at,say, an English or South African team, then why should they be given time to develop into a regional team, to me this looks as if the academies at the regions are not working hard enough. To answer Morgannwg's question, I am a supporter of WELSH rugby, and try and go to support all the regions, but as I am from Merthyr Tydfil and had to start again after my region was nullified, I now go to mostly the Blues games as they are closer and easier for me. This was not a rant at all the Dragons signings per say, but a player who is not good enough to make it at a lower end English club is good enough for the Dragons. We only have 4 regions in Wales and they need to be filled up with quality players, mostly Welsh with a tiny sprinkling of quality NWQ players who can make a difference, player with a winning mentality and a professional outlook. I remember when Gary Teichman came to Newport, I was thrilled, as I was when Percey Montgomery came to the Dragons as these types of player make a difference, but if everyone else is happy to see us going down this road then who am I to complain.

munkian wrote:lewis Evans IS now in the matchday squad but Burns is carrying a knock from the Perp game

How come? Who's out?

From the Argus

FLANKER Lewis Evans is set to bolster Newport Gwent Dragons for Sunday’s clash with in-form Glasgow but fellow Wales squad member Lloyd Burns misses out.

The hooker is suffering with a groin injury that he first picked up in the Amlin Challenge Cup win against Perpignan.

Dragons head coach Darren Edwards would have no qualms about throwing Evans straight in, even though the back row forward will spend most of the week preparing for the Test against Australia with the Wales squad.

“Lewis has been a part of a matchday squad for a long time so it’s not a problem,” he said.

Bedwas tighthead Keiron Jenkins returns to the squad to cover for Dan Way, who is struggling with a shoulder injury.

Flanker Darren Waters has caught the eye with Newport in the Premiership and is recalled to the regional squad to replace Andrew Coombs. The back row forward was helped from the field in Friday’s loss to the Scarlets after suffering a pectoral injury.

The Dragons are looking for revenge after they suffered a 24-19 defeat to Glasgow at Firhill in October.