Pick your starting XV for Wales v Ireland

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:36 pm

First topic message reminder :

Go on then.

by NeverMySoul Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:34 pm

Blues fan!

by NeverMySoul Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:37 pm

Why ask that question as well? I am not a Dragons fan but I really like Faletau. I am not a Scarlets fan and really like Aaron Shingler.

by Gatts Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:23 pm

Form is temporary by its nature and there is much more to it than that. Class is permanent and throwing every player into a mix based on form is not in the best interests of a team, its what England have been forced to do but it is not the way gatland works; Jenkins is an example and Henson even being considered is another. He brings players into the mix gradually and keeps a strong core whilst trying out youth whenever he can. He makes mistakes, Prydie and Hook for example, but his selection policy is sound, definitely forward thinking and well balanced.

by bedfordwelsh Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:34 pm

We do have a settled core of players now which allows us to introduce the odd new cap here and there.

There is a chance for someone to gain experience on the winw this 6 Nations at least.

by maestegmafia Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:38 pm

I think AW Jones and Charteris is a big hit to the squad, both very good players. The likely candidates to take over, Davies and Evans have got a lot of work to do.

by bedfordwelsh Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:43 pm

morning maes,

AWJ not out for whole tournament though is he, or have I missed that bit.

A few seasons ago Evans was touted as next best thing but has had horrible run of luck with injuries, this is a great opportunity for him now, agree Davies needs to pull his socks up and get back to season or so a go form.

R Jones has been playing really well there so is a good option as cover but as mentioned this could be great chance for Gatland to blood another youngster.

The pack is very settled really even if we suggest that Davies is now 1st choice lock, so slotting in an in-experienced 2nd rower into the pack wouldn't be that big an ask - though do think he will and should start with Davies and Evans.

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:49 pm

wales606 wrote:I cant believe some people are trying to drop Warburton and Roberts? - Did they watch the WC.

Roberts and Warburton have been playing well for their region since returning, and certainly dont deserve to lose their starting places to player who have a few caps between them and have done nothing of note on the international scene.

On that basis you'd never pick a new player ever again and you'd have to play the same players for every match, even when they're cr@p, until they die, and then we'd have to give up playing Test rugby.

by NeverMySoul Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:57 pm

My sentiments exactly luckless! I'd even go as far to say that Warburton is playing poorly at the moment. Tipuric is playing outstandingly. As for Roberts; if he was fit then of course he'd probably be in, but he has been out for a while and JD and Beck are putting their hands up.

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:09 pm

I think a centre pairing of Ashley Beck and Jonathan Davies could really work. Beck's more of a playmaker than Roberts is and could bring the best out of Jonathan Davies in the same way Regan King did.

by **rodders** Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:13 pm

luckless_pedestrian wrote:
wales606 wrote:I cant believe some people are trying to drop Warburton and Roberts? - Did they watch the WC.

Roberts and Warburton have been playing well for their region since returning, and certainly dont deserve to lose their starting places to player who have a few caps between them and have done nothing of note on the international scene.

On that basis you'd never pick a new player ever again and you'd have to play the same players for every match, even when they're cr@p, until they die, and then we'd have to give up playing Test rugby.

Thats how it works in Ireland.... Whistle

by maestegmafia Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:14 pm

Same way as Ashley Beck and Jamie Roberts could be interesting. Or Beck and Henson should Henson look good at 12 the next few weeks.

I have a terrible fear that Roberts might not recover from his injuries sufficiently in time even though he is likely to be playing for the Blues next weekend.

by bluestonevedder Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:19 pm

Similarly with Pocock for Australia, no one other than Warburton should be considered for the 7 jersey for a very long time!

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:22 pm

bluestonevedder wrote:Similarly with Pocock for Australia, no one other than Warburton should be considered for the 7 jersey for a very long time!

Irrespective of form?

by bluestonevedder Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:24 pm

Going on his current form and form at the WC (actually, every cap he's gained to this day) he certainly deserves to start. I don't think there's another 7 in the NH at the moment that has Warburton's presence on the pitch. He certainly doesn't deserve to lose his starting place.

by Pot Noodle Miner Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:25 pm

1. Jenkins
2. Rees
3. Jones
4. Davies
5. Evans
6. Lydiate
7. Warburton
8. Faletau
9. M.Phillips
10. Priestland
11. North
12. Roberts
13. J.Davies
14. L.Halfpenny (much better on the wing than FB. has'nt really performed that well in the 15 jersey IMO)
15. Byrne

16. Bennett
17. P.James
18. R.Jones
19. J.Tipuric
20. R.Webb
21. J.Hook
22. A.Beck

Webb on the bench ahead of L.Williams simply because he is just as elusive and makes alot less mistakes

Beck in as centre cover and i would like to see Cuthbert given a chance off the bench in at least 1 of the games.

as for Henson.. its hard to beleive there are people thinking about him being in the Welsh squad at the moment, are you judging him from the form he was in 3 years ago? thats just mad, let him play week in week out and then make a decision whether to take him to Australia in the summer, hes just not up to international standard at the moment

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:27 pm

You're damn right about Henson.

by Rory_Gallagher Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:29 pm

bluestonevedder wrote:Going on his current form and form at the WC (actually, every cap he's gained to this day) he certainly deserves to start. I don't think there's another 7 in the NH at the moment that has Warburton's presence on the pitch. He certainly doesn't deserve to lose his starting place.

Sean O'Brien.

by bluestonevedder Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:31 pm

O'Brien as a 6, not as a 7. Warburton's a better out and out 7. Yes, O'Brien is a world class 6, definitely, and a more than competent 7. Vice versa, Warburton wouldn't make a better 6 than O'Brien.

by Rory_Gallagher Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:34 pm

Personally I disagree. He can play all 3 to a fantastic standard. Also, SOB's ability to slow down ball and make turnovers is hugely underrated. He made 5 turnovers against bath in the HEC. Also his support lines are fantastic. He is generally a very all around player, and will be Ireland's 7 for a long time I feel.

by wales606 Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:35 pm

bluestonevedder wrote:O'Brien as a 6, not as a 7. Warburton's a better out and out 7. Yes, O'Brien is a world class 6, definitely, and a more than competent 7. Vice versa, Warburton wouldn't make a better 6 than O'Brien.

SOB is slotted into 7 because Ferris is such a good 6 and Heaslip is such a good 8.

SOB does not do the 7 role really, Heaslip is more of a fetcher for Ireland.

by bluestonevedder Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:37 pm

No problem, disagreeing is what makes good debate and I respect your opinion. I just feel that for the prototypical roles expected of a 7, Warburton is the better option. no doubt, a backrow comprising SOB at 6 and Warbs at 7 could be starting for the Lions.

by bluestonevedder Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:38 pm

wales606 wrote:

SOB is slotted into 7 because Ferris is such a good 6 and Heaslip is such a good 8.

SOB does not do the 7 role really, Heaslip is more of a fetcher for Ireland.

And partly because of the injury to Wallace. If he had been fit, the backrow would've looked a lot more different, possibly with Ferris and SOB alternating for starts.

by bedfordwelsh Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:52 pm

[quote="Pot Noodle Miner"]1. Jenkins
2. Rees
3. Jones
4. Davies
5. Evans
6. Lydiate
7. Warburton
8. Faletau
9. M.Phillips
10. Priestland
11. North
12. Roberts
13. J.Davies
14. L.Halfpenny (much better on the wing than FB. has'nt really performed that well in the 15 jersey IMO)
15. Byrne

PNM,

I actually think that will be the back 3 but have to dis-agree with you about Halfpenny at XV, during WC he didn't look out of place there once and for me should start at XV but like I said I think your back 3 will be what gatland will pick.

by **rodders** Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:54 pm

A flip not this O'Brien v Warburton craic again.

I agree Warburton fits the bill more as the stereotypical 7 more and is the best around in this respect.

Every so often a player comes along and breaks the mould like Wallace or O'Brien. O'Brien doesn't quite have all the skills at 6, 7 or 8 but what he does he does exceptionally well. His ball carrying is phenomenal, he picks great lines, can pass, kick and as Rory says he is actually incredibly strong on the deck.

Saying who is best is pointless as you aren't comparing like for like.

by bluestonevedder Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:56 pm

I agree, this sort of evolved from a comment made by myself, and it unwillingly turned into this. I apologise.

by maestegmafia Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:05 am

[quote="bedfordwelsh"]

Pot Noodle Miner wrote:
14. L.Halfpenny (much better on the wing than FB. has'nt really performed that well in the 15 jersey IMO)
15. Byrne

PNM,

I actually think that will be the back 3 but have to dis-agree with you about Halfpenny at XV, during WC he didn't look out of place there once and for me should start at XV but like I said I think your back 3 will be what gatland will pick.

I agree with Bedford

And I wasnt a massive fan of putting Halfpenny at 15, feeling he was being thrown in the deep end. But very happy that he proved he was a world class swimmer during the RWC.

Halfpenny is a very good Fullback.

by gowales Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:42 am

[quote="bedfordwelsh"]

Pot Noodle Miner wrote:1. Jenkins
2. Rees
3. Jones
4. Davies
5. Evans
6. Lydiate
7. Warburton
8. Faletau
9. M.Phillips
10. Priestland
11. North
12. Roberts
13. J.Davies
14. L.Halfpenny (much better on the wing than FB. has'nt really performed that well in the 15 jersey IMO)
15. Byrne

PNM,

I actually think that will be the back 3 but have to dis-agree with you about Halfpenny at XV, during WC he didn't look out of place there once and for me should start at XV but like I said I think your back 3 will be what gatland will pick.

I agree that he did look very good in the world cup and i don't think PNM was disputing that. But he hasn't looked that comfortable there for the Blues this season.

by wales606 Sat Jan 14, 2012 3:03 am

Umm, he has only played there a few times, and hasnt done anything wrong and done some things excellently.

by gowales Sat Jan 14, 2012 3:23 am

Orighty then.
I still think that he should play on the wing for the first game though, not because i don't rate him there in fact i think hes very good. But because i don't want Cuthbert or Brew to play against Ireland.

by bedfordwelsh Sat Jan 14, 2012 4:20 am

go,

I think you will be right, Byrne has been on form so a back 3 of Halfpenny Byrne and North will be seen as the safer bet to Cuthbert Halfpenny North

by Glas a du Sun Jan 15, 2012 7:57 pm

Liam Williams again looked a cut above the rest at Parc Y Scarlets yesterday.

by bedfordwelsh Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:03 pm

Glas,

Do you think so I thought he had a shocker in the 1st half and was moved to wing in the 2nd.

Not doubting his talent or potential but thought he looked bit out of depth yesterday, still one to stick with though.

by Glas a du Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:18 pm

No. The lack of impact (if thatcounts as a shocker) was caused by our terrible centres. They really don't go together, far too similar, neither wants to pass, they are believing their own hype. He made a mistake in thinking hecould pass to Davies in his own 22 and he would have a clue what to do. What I like about him is that he puts himself about. I think North is playing himself out of the team. The best wings are Halfpenny and Brew, but halfpenny is also the best full back. I'd love to see Barry Davies with them but know it won't happen.

by bedfordwelsh Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:22 pm

North just seems to want to do something special all the time at the moment which you can't fault but sometimes you just need to do it simple and that has as muh as an affect.

Byrnes form will see him get nod with Halfpenny and North on the wings I reckon.

Williams will be in squad I have no doubt and the experience will add to his development.

by maestegmafia Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:27 pm

Im intrigued to see why they haven't tried to play north at 13 yet at senior level?

Thought williams played well, strong aggressive runner and tough defender.

by Glas a du Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:28 pm

Yeah I know. Depressing isn't it? We don't have a footballing centre except Beck and he's competing with all the bosh bosh boys.

by eirebilly Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:29 pm

Regardless of the Welsh provincial performances in the HC, they will have a very good strong team for Ireland. I cant wait for it as i think it will be a cracker. A very close match but i feel that Wales may just edge it.

by maestegmafia Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:33 pm

Glas a du wrote:Yeah I know. Depressing isn't it? We don't have a footballing centre except Beck and he's competing with all the bosh bosh boys.

Beck isn't that different in style to JD2 less strength more guile maybe. Though I thought JD2 played well yesterday. Kicked a few poor kicks but ran well.

by bedfordwelsh Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:33 pm

I know I ahve banged on and on and will continue to but this is yet again why we need our A Side.

The 6 Nations by nature is not the place to try to many experiements unless injury forces you to but the two form centres are Hughes and Beck.

If our A Side was competing then at least these guys and some different combinations could be tried out before getting to the 6 Nations.

by Glas a du Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:42 pm

Beck is very different to JD2 as he looks for the pass. JD2 only passes if there's nothing on for him. You can't deny he's a strong runner, but in my eyes that just puts him as Roberts' understudy at 12 not a 13.

by munkian Sun Jan 15, 2012 9:05 pm

I'd love to see Hughes in a Welsh shirt one day , just think Six Nations is possibly a bridge too far just yet

by bedfordwelsh Sun Jan 15, 2012 9:06 pm

Summer tour possibly for him and Thomas.

by munkian Sun Jan 15, 2012 9:12 pm

Yup Yup , sounds good

by TycroesOsprey Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:41 am

Glas a du wrote:Yeah I know. Depressing isn't it? We don't have a footballing centre except Beck and he's competing with all the bosh bosh boys.

ahem we do have he who shall not be named as a footballing centre but clearly its too soon for him Whistle

by bedfordwelsh Mon Jan 16, 2012 12:43 am

Tycroes,

Didn't show much at centre yesterday but then again with Parks at 10 most would struggle.

by Glas a du Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:51 am

TycroesOsprey wrote:
Glas a du wrote:Yeah I know. Depressing isn't it? We don't have a footballing centre except Beck and he's competing with all the bosh bosh boys.

ahem we do have he who shall not be named as a footballing centre but clearly its too soon for him

by bedfordwelsh Wed Jan 18, 2012 2:00 am

Welsh squad announced tomorrow according to BBC Wales ahead of the Poland trip.

by Glas a du Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:04 pm

15-9 Halfpenny, North, Roberts, Henson, Brew, Jones, Phillips
1-8 Jenkins, Rees, Jones, Davies, Evans, Lydiate, Warburton, Faletau

16-22 James, Hibbard, Ryan Jones, Tipuric, Williams, Priestland, Beck.

by maestegmafia Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:34 pm

Glas a du wrote:15-9 Halfpenny, North, Roberts, Henson, Brew, Jones, Phillips
1-8 Jenkins, Rees, Jones, Davies, Evans, Lydiate, Warburton, Faletau

16-22 James, Hibbard, Ryan Jones, Tipuric, Williams, Priestland, Beck.

Henson is not ready to play twelve for Wales. His defence is a liability, he hasn't got his attacking play working either. Beck, Roberts or Davies would be better bets.

I would, if there was room take Henson in the squad, as I think he will hit form faster with wales than with the blues playing lv= matches.

by Glas a du Wed Jan 18, 2012 7:52 pm

The guys a star. Can you imagine the impact on the Irish dressing room of his name being on the team sheet?

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