England v Wales - who wants it more and why?

First topic message reminder :

In the 6 Nations the margins between all teams are fine. Wales with their excellent passing game, world class back row and backline bohemoths are favourites to beat England on 25th but upsets do happen.

Sometimes I believe that games are decided in favour of the side showing more desire or even desperation to win. I'm sure that we can all think of examples of this down the years - unfavoured sides with powerful motivation who trump their more vaunted opponents and the odds in the process.

I genuinely believe that motivation can make a difference to the outcome of the match particularly if the scores are close in the last lungbusting minutes of the match.

Which of Wales or England want and is prepared to harder work for victory more and why?

Wales

1. Young hungry side, playing for Wales. Enough said.
2. Playing for Triple Crown (sacrilege to say this possibly - but I don’t think that is much of a motivating factor. Beating France is important)
3. Playing to stay in the hunt for a Grand Slam ( a big motivating factor) - anciliary prize - 3rd Slam in 6 years
4. Playing to beat England ( a perrenial big motivating factor - but lessened for this match I feel )
5. Residual feeling of injustice at RWC tiptacklegate quarter final loss to France. (Warburton himself has recently gone into print calling for changes to the way refs deal with this. Gatland is on record saying that because it was a QF it should've been dealt with differently)
6. Cash win bonuses (big motivating factor?)
6. Any particular personal motivating factors for individual players?


England

1. Young hungry side, playing for England. Enough said.
2. If the players are to be believed they're playing not only for themselves but for Lancaster and staff to keep their jobs. In Farrell's case for his Dad's job!
3. Playing to stay in the hunt for a Grand Slam ( a big motivating factor)
4. Redemption after RWC fiasco. ( the most powerful motivating factor I can think of)
5. At home in front of home supporters ( big motivating factor)
6. England are clear underdogs. (big motivating factor)
7. Cash win bonuses (big motivating factor? yes if Easter's alleged gallows humour has grain truth to it)
8. Any particular personal motivating factors for individual players? (see 2 and 4 in particular)


All in all there are powerfull pyschological forces at work for both sides in this game.

I'm biased but I say that England are going to be consdierably more pumped up for this one. They will be full of the rage of the damned and are at home.

That doesn’t necessarily translate into anything more than 100% commitment but I will say this….

IF England are in this match at the end I'm backing them to come home to win on a wave of desire backed by vocal crowd support.

So if that's a fact. You tell me - am i lying?

Miteyironpaw - are you real?

What is this garbage about the Lions' front row? Is this the lions' that were taken to the cleaners by SA? Thought so.

Wales's win against Ireland was hardly convincing either was it? Scotland imploded. Spectacularly, it was 3 all at half time. Scotland, 'one of the worst teams in the tournament' made Wales look distictly average for 40 minutes.

I would say this match is 50/50 as of this moment.

England were losing to Italy at half time and looked like losing the game untill a well made charge down.

Italy.....

Equo Troiano wrote:Miteyironpaw - are you real?

What is this garbage about the Lions' front row? Is this the lions' that were taken to the cleaners by SA? Thought so.

Wales's win against Ireland was hardly convincing either was it? Scotland imploded. Spectacularly, it was 3 all at half time. Scotland, 'one of the worst teams in the tournament' made Wales look distictly average for 40 minutes.

I would say this match is 50/50 as of this moment.

Hey! Don't look at me! I didn't bring up the Lions front row. I merely responded to a claim that the Welsh would win because of their "lions front row". Which did make me chuckle, but I didn't want to antagonise the poster I was discussing it with, so I just left it at "the lions haven't been named yet", rather than bring up the humiliation of the mostly Welsh front row in South Africa.

Mitey, you still have not explained where England are far superior to Wales and given your reasons for your choices, are you basing you comments on facts or are you that full of optimism that you cannot see anything bar a slamming for Wales ? If it is the latter I seriously think you are either a WUM or a very deluded person, and before you start I am not making personal insults it is just the way you are coming across on this site.

Facts and history LordDowlais, facts and history. It should be an entertaining game to watch. Perhaps we should agree to disagree and then compare predictions when the outcome is known.

miteyironpaw wrote:I didn't bring up the Lions front row. I merely responded to a claim that the Welsh would win because of their "lions front row". Which did make me chuckle, but I didn't want to antagonise the poster I was discussing it with, so I just left it at "the lions haven't been named yet", rather than bring up the humiliation of the mostly Welsh front row in South Africa.

You shouldn't need me to tell you that the Lions' front row in the first Test - when it was penalised time after time - was two-thirds English.

Yes, it's amazing how you can be let down by just one weak link!

munkian wrote:England were losing to Italy at half time and looked like losing the game untill a well made charge down.

Italy.....

Yes, Italy, the team Wales lost to a few years back. Can't remember when England lost to them...

England scored 17 unanswered points in the second half. A chargedown is still a chragedown and indicative of the pressure that England were putting on the Italian defence. Don't tell me Wales wouldn't take a 'lucky' chargedown to beat england on the 25th? Course you would, so do wrap up son.

This bickering is pointless.

And strangely became more dominant when Adam Jones replaced Vickery...

miteyironpaw wrote:

Equo Troiano wrote:Miteyironpaw - are you real?

What is this garbage about the Lions' front row? Is this the lions' that were taken to the cleaners by SA? Thought so.

Wales's win against Ireland was hardly convincing either was it? Scotland imploded. Spectacularly, it was 3 all at half time. Scotland, 'one of the worst teams in the tournament' made Wales look distictly average for 40 minutes.

I would say this match is 50/50 as of this moment.

Hey! Don't look at me! I didn't bring up the Lions front row. I merely responded to a claim that the Welsh would win because of their "lions front row". Which did make me chuckle, but I didn't want to antagonise the poster I was discussing it with, so I just left it at "the lions haven't been named yet", rather than bring up the humiliation of the mostly Welsh front row in South Africa.

Firstly, I did not say Wales would win because of our front row, I responed to a quote that you said along the lines of your front row smashing ours, also watch the Lions tour again, the Springboks only pushed us back when Phill Vickery and Mears were there, as soon as it was changed to the all Welsh one the Lions were in the driving seat, look I am not ggoing to get into a Holly Wilaboobie for tat over this, but like it or not Gethin Jenkings, Matthew Rees and Adam Jones were the first choice lions front row by the end of the tour, and will be there or ther abouts during the next one I should imagine. This was a decent debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction.

Equo Troiano wrote:

munkian wrote:England were losing to Italy at half time and looked like losing the game untill a well made charge down.

Italy.....

Yes, Italy, the team Wales lost to a few years back. Can't remember when England lost to them...

England scored 17 unanswered points in the second half. A chargedown is still a chragedown and indicative of the pressure that England were putting on the Italian defence. Don't tell me Wales wouldn't take a 'lucky' chargedown to beat england on the 25th? Course you would, so do wrap up son.

This bickering is pointless.

Wrap up son ?

LordDowlais wrote:

miteyironpaw wrote:

Equo Troiano wrote:Miteyironpaw - are you real?

What is this garbage about the Lions' front row? Is this the lions' that were taken to the cleaners by SA? Thought so.

Wales's win against Ireland was hardly convincing either was it? Scotland imploded. Spectacularly, it was 3 all at half time. Scotland, 'one of the worst teams in the tournament' made Wales look distictly average for 40 minutes.

I would say this match is 50/50 as of this moment.

Hey! Don't look at me! I didn't bring up the Lions front row. I merely responded to a claim that the Welsh would win because of their "lions front row". Which did make me chuckle, but I didn't want to antagonise the poster I was discussing it with, so I just left it at "the lions haven't been named yet", rather than bring up the humiliation of the mostly Welsh front row in South Africa.

Firstly, I did not say Wales would win because of our front row, I responed to a quote that you said along the lines of your front row smashing ours, also watch the Lions tour again, the Springboks only pushed us back when Phill Vickery and Mears were there, as soon as it was changed to the all Welsh one the Lions were in the driving seat, look I am not ggoing to get into a Holly Wilaboobie for tat over this, but like it or not Gethin Jenkings, Matthew Rees and Adam Jones were the first choice lions front row by the end of the tour, and will be there or ther abouts during the next one I should imagine. This was a decent debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction.

Ancient history, the Lions tour I'm afriad. A bit embarrassed that you brought it up, unless you've forgotten, we lost.

Over there in Wales you might go on tub thumping about "moral victories" or what-not, but here in the land of world cup winning legacies, only victory is treated as a success.

debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction

Please stop with the personal insults. Just as you don't agree with me, is not reason for me to be moderated. I refer you to Kiwireddevil's article on behaviour. I'm entitled to my opionion and I'm just expressing it. You are the one getting personal and upset. Suggest you wrap up.

miteyironpaw wrote:


Ancient history, the Lions tour I'm afriad. A bit embarrassed that you brought it up.

then

here in the land of world cup winning legacies

priceless

completely agree with you on the front row issue mitey, the lions is almost 3 years ago now and the game has moved on the front row battle will be interesting,

but please anwser me this (not divert the point of debate as you have done with every other point put towards you) how do england have a GRANITE defence when they conceded two tries against Italy and suffered 2 line breaks against scotland?

thanks for poitning out his contradiction chunky norwich i missed it

GavinDragon wrote:completely agree with you on the front row issue mitey, the lions is almost 3 years ago now and the game has moved on the front row battle will be interesting,

but please anwser me this (not divert the point of debate as you have done with every other point put towards you) how do england have a GRANITE defence when they conceded two tries against Italy and suffered 2 line breaks against scotland?

Read the thread, I've answered that one already.

As for the childish RWC v Lions point being made by the other two. I said "legacy" next to RWC. All I'm saying to clarify, is that we here in England don't treat losses and near misses as defacto victories as you seem to in Wales, and it's because we've tasted real sweet success and near-misses and failure are sour and bitter by comparison. One day you might know what I'm talking about.

I think you're clutching at straws here Triangulation - both sides will be hugely motivated and I really don't think you can claim an England advantage there.

To all those Englishmen harking back to Wales record a Twickers and (bizarrely) England and Wales' respective records against Italy, quite frankly if you can't recognise that Wales are the better team, playing the better rugby at the moment then you've got your head up your rrrs and could be in for a rude awakening in a week or so's time.

That said, all those Welshmen who are predicting a slaughter should remember that bragging rights aren't awarded till the win is in the bag....and whilst Wales are favourites on form, it's definitely not a foregone conclusion.

People forget that things change pretty quickly. England won in Cardiff last year. Not so long before that this 'worldbeating' Welsh side were on a run 8 straight defeats, or whatever it was. There are no grounds for cockiness on either side at the moment, so I wish people would wait till after the game before giving it the big one...

P.S - miteyironpaw, this is only my opinion so please assume it is well-meaning debate: you're an embarrassment to England fans....pipe down mate

yes i read you said something about bounce of the ball, still two tries and two linebreaks therefor its not a granite defence, to my mind a granite defence is a team who have not conceded tries and rarely concede line breaks

as for england id say its 50/50 and if morgan dickson tuilagi and flood start i will be slightly more nervours than if they dont start, still heres hoping for a good game,

and mitey i read earlier that if wales win you will be on these boards explaining the reasons why ENGLAND lost....you realise that this is implying that this game is and always is England's to lose as opposed to Wales' to win....would i be correct in the assumption that this is how you view this fixture? and then if wales do win it will be nothing to do with wales winning on merit or being the better team, it will be to do with Englands shortcomings?

Adam totally agree well said!

Wales'll probably end up grinding this one out. Nowadays it's never far away from a 10-point final margin when these sides meet. If Wales are at full strength I can see greater physicality and motivation (Triple Crown awarded immediately afterwards if we win ) shining through, if not then there's cause for concern.

We mainly need to get Warbs and Tipuric back to take their respective places starting and on the bench. North would also be a big boost.

Adam wrote:I think you're clutching at straws here Triangulation - both sides will be hugely motivated and I really don't think you can claim an England advantage there.

To all those Englishmen harking back to Wales record a Twickers and (bizarrely) England and Wales' respective records against Italy, quite frankly if you can't recognise that Wales are the better team, playing the better rugby at the moment then you've got your head up your rrrs and could be in for a rude awakening in a week or so's time.

That said, all those Welshmen who are predicting a slaughter should remember that bragging rights aren't awarded till the win is in the bag....and whilst Wales are favourites on form, it's definitely not a foregone conclusion.

People forget that things change pretty quickly. England won in Cardiff last year. Not so long before that this 'worldbeating' Welsh side were on a run 8 straight defeats, or whatever it was. There are no grounds for cockiness on either side at the moment, so I wish people would wait till after the game before giving it the big one...

P.S - miteyironpaw, this is only my opinion so please assume it is well-meaning debate: you're an embarrassment to England fans....pipe down mate

With all due respect, I'm entitled to my opinions and entitled to express them. There's enough hot air blowing in from the Valleys and it seems to have been overlooked that England are the reigned champions, playing at home. We have yet to play well despite comfortably winning our opening matches, under a new coach, with a young team, in difficult conditions. When I look at the names on the team sheet I feel that when this side clicks, there won't be many sides in the world who can stop us. I just don't see Wales in that list. Wales are a brittle team, currently living on confidence born from some fairly lucky wins in the last couple of weeks from (1) a now acknowledged refereeing error versus Ireland and (a) A blatantly incorrectly disallowed Scottish try. Yes Scottish try. Think about that before you start questioning other's defences.

I am a proud English supporter and I'm not going to be bullied into silence by some cocky Welshmen dining out on a couple of narrow victories.

be proud mite and please answer my post theres a good chap

miteyironpaw wrote:England... have yet to play well despite comfortably winning our opening matches

How can you possibly come to that conclusion?!

miteyironpaw wrote:

Adam wrote:I think you're clutching at straws here Triangulation - both sides will be hugely motivated and I really don't think you can claim an England advantage there.

To all those Englishmen harking back to Wales record a Twickers and (bizarrely) England and Wales' respective records against Italy, quite frankly if you can't recognise that Wales are the better team, playing the better rugby at the moment then you've got your head up your rrrs and could be in for a rude awakening in a week or so's time.

That said, all those Welshmen who are predicting a slaughter should remember that bragging rights aren't awarded till the win is in the bag....and whilst Wales are favourites on form, it's definitely not a foregone conclusion.

People forget that things change pretty quickly. England won in Cardiff last year. Not so long before that this 'worldbeating' Welsh side were on a run 8 straight defeats, or whatever it was. There are no grounds for cockiness on either side at the moment, so I wish people would wait till after the game before giving it the big one...

P.S - miteyironpaw, this is only my opinion so please assume it is well-meaning debate: you're an embarrassment to England fans....pipe down mate

With all due respect, I'm entitled to my opinions and entitled to express them. There's enough hot air blowing in from the Valleys and it seems to have been overlooked that England are the reigned champions, playing at home. We have yet to play well despite comfortably winning our opening matches, under a new coach, with a young team, in difficult conditions. When I look at the names on the team sheet I feel that when this side clicks, there won't be many sides in the world who can stop us. I just don't see Wales in that list. Wales are a brittle team, currently living on confidence born from some fairly lucky wins in the last couple of weeks from (1) a now acknowledged refereeing error versus Ireland and (a) A blatantly incorrectly disallowed Scottish try. Yes Scottish try. Think about that before you start questioning other's defences.

I am a proud English supporter and I'm not going to be bullied into silence by some cocky Welshmen dining out on a couple of narrow victories.

...I'm English mate

Adam wrote:

miteyironpaw wrote:

Adam wrote:I think you're clutching at straws here Triangulation - both sides will be hugely motivated and I really don't think you can claim an England advantage there.

To all those Englishmen harking back to Wales record a Twickers and (bizarrely) England and Wales' respective records against Italy, quite frankly if you can't recognise that Wales are the better team, playing the better rugby at the moment then you've got your head up your rrrs and could be in for a rude awakening in a week or so's time.

That said, all those Welshmen who are predicting a slaughter should remember that bragging rights aren't awarded till the win is in the bag....and whilst Wales are favourites on form, it's definitely not a foregone conclusion.

People forget that things change pretty quickly. England won in Cardiff last year. Not so long before that this 'worldbeating' Welsh side were on a run 8 straight defeats, or whatever it was. There are no grounds for cockiness on either side at the moment, so I wish people would wait till after the game before giving it the big one...

P.S - miteyironpaw, this is only my opinion so please assume it is well-meaning debate: you're an embarrassment to England fans....pipe down mate

With all due respect, I'm entitled to my opinions and entitled to express them. There's enough hot air blowing in from the Valleys and it seems to have been overlooked that England are the reigned champions, playing at home. We have yet to play well despite comfortably winning our opening matches, under a new coach, with a young team, in difficult conditions. When I look at the names on the team sheet I feel that when this side clicks, there won't be many sides in the world who can stop us. I just don't see Wales in that list. Wales are a brittle team, currently living on confidence born from some fairly lucky wins in the last couple of weeks from (1) a now acknowledged refereeing error versus Ireland and (a) A blatantly incorrectly disallowed Scottish try. Yes Scottish try. Think about that before you start questioning other's defences.

I am a proud English supporter and I'm not going to be bullied into silence by some cocky Welshmen dining out on a couple of narrow victories.

...I'm English mate

TycroesOsprey wrote:

Adam wrote:

miteyironpaw wrote:

Adam wrote:I think you're clutching at straws here Triangulation - both sides will be hugely motivated and I really don't think you can claim an England advantage there.

To all those Englishmen harking back to Wales record a Twickers and (bizarrely) England and Wales' respective records against Italy, quite frankly if you can't recognise that Wales are the better team, playing the better rugby at the moment then you've got your head up your rrrs and could be in for a rude awakening in a week or so's time.

That said, all those Welshmen who are predicting a slaughter should remember that bragging rights aren't awarded till the win is in the bag....and whilst Wales are favourites on form, it's definitely not a foregone conclusion.

People forget that things change pretty quickly. England won in Cardiff last year. Not so long before that this 'worldbeating' Welsh side were on a run 8 straight defeats, or whatever it was. There are no grounds for cockiness on either side at the moment, so I wish people would wait till after the game before giving it the big one...

P.S - miteyironpaw, this is only my opinion so please assume it is well-meaning debate: you're an embarrassment to England fans....pipe down mate

With all due respect, I'm entitled to my opinions and entitled to express them. There's enough hot air blowing in from the Valleys and it seems to have been overlooked that England are the reigned champions, playing at home. We have yet to play well despite comfortably winning our opening matches, under a new coach, with a young team, in difficult conditions. When I look at the names on the team sheet I feel that when this side clicks, there won't be many sides in the world who can stop us. I just don't see Wales in that list. Wales are a brittle team, currently living on confidence born from some fairly lucky wins in the last couple of weeks from (1) a now acknowledged refereeing error versus Ireland and (a) A blatantly incorrectly disallowed Scottish try. Yes Scottish try. Think about that before you start questioning other's defences.

I am a proud English supporter and I'm not going to be bullied into silence by some cocky Welshmen dining out on a couple of narrow victories.

...I'm English mate

I wasn't calling you Welsh. I was suggesting that I wouldn't be bullied by Welshmen. The thought directed at you was that you were out of order to call for me to stop expressing my opinion. The majority of those already claiming victory for Wales here, are Welsh.

id still like a reply to my post clarifying your opinion

miteyironpaw wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

miteyironpaw wrote:

Equo Troiano wrote:Miteyironpaw - are you real?

What is this garbage about the Lions' front row? Is this the lions' that were taken to the cleaners by SA? Thought so.

Wales's win against Ireland was hardly convincing either was it? Scotland imploded. Spectacularly, it was 3 all at half time. Scotland, 'one of the worst teams in the tournament' made Wales look distictly average for 40 minutes.

I would say this match is 50/50 as of this moment.

Hey! Don't look at me! I didn't bring up the Lions front row. I merely responded to a claim that the Welsh would win because of their "lions front row". Which did make me chuckle, but I didn't want to antagonise the poster I was discussing it with, so I just left it at "the lions haven't been named yet", rather than bring up the humiliation of the mostly Welsh front row in South Africa.

Firstly, I did not say Wales would win because of our front row, I responed to a quote that you said along the lines of your front row smashing ours, also watch the Lions tour again, the Springboks only pushed us back when Phill Vickery and Mears were there, as soon as it was changed to the all Welsh one the Lions were in the driving seat, look I am not ggoing to get into a Holly Wilaboobie for tat over this, but like it or not Gethin Jenkings, Matthew Rees and Adam Jones were the first choice lions front row by the end of the tour, and will be there or ther abouts during the next one I should imagine. This was a decent debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction.

Ancient history, the Lions tour I'm afriad. A bit embarrassed that you brought it up, unless you've forgotten, we lost.

Over there in Wales you might go on tub thumping about "moral victories" or what-not, but here in the land of world cup winning legacies, only victory is treated as a success.

debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction

Please stop with the personal insults. Just as you don't agree with me, is not reason for me to be moderated. I refer you to Kiwireddevil's article on behaviour. I'm entitled to my opionion and I'm just expressing it. You are the one getting personal and upset. Suggest you wrap up.

mitey, you are being out of order on this forum, I suggest that you wind your neck in for a few minutes, you cannot come here questioning the ability of a side and claim that your side is far superior, then dismiss facts shown to you as being in the past, and you need to stop claiming this personal insult malarkey when you like, as I have not seen anybody say anything different to how you come across on this forum, I was having a good debate with people on here about the up and coming game and then you came on here dismissing the ability of the Welsh team and trying to persuade us about some hair brain scheme England have to beat Wales which you have no doubt concocted in your head, I have asked you to explain your views so perhaps I can understand you better but you just come back with arrogant quips and remarks, which with them, brings other posters like you onto here who just like looking for petty arguments, this is not the first thread you have ruined and it will probably will not be the last, but I an tell you this, I will not rise to your arrogant, single minded posts any more because I just come on here to talk rugby, but I will give you one last chance, why do you think this England side is so superior to the current Welsh one, and can you please back your answers up with a reason ?

id still like a reply to my post clarifying your opinion .

In the unlikely eventuality that Wales win, I'll be here to congratulate you and admit you must have been the better team on the day.

ok thank you for clearing your position does come across as arrogant but at least it is a genuine position, let the best team win

this is so boring. Will there ever be a time when we can have a discussion about a Wales v England match without it becoming like this?

LordDowlais wrote:

miteyironpaw wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

miteyironpaw wrote:

Equo Troiano wrote:Miteyironpaw - are you real?

What is this garbage about the Lions' front row? Is this the lions' that were taken to the cleaners by SA? Thought so.

Wales's win against Ireland was hardly convincing either was it? Scotland imploded. Spectacularly, it was 3 all at half time. Scotland, 'one of the worst teams in the tournament' made Wales look distictly average for 40 minutes.

I would say this match is 50/50 as of this moment.

Hey! Don't look at me! I didn't bring up the Lions front row. I merely responded to a claim that the Welsh would win because of their "lions front row". Which did make me chuckle, but I didn't want to antagonise the poster I was discussing it with, so I just left it at "the lions haven't been named yet", rather than bring up the humiliation of the mostly Welsh front row in South Africa.

Firstly, I did not say Wales would win because of our front row, I responed to a quote that you said along the lines of your front row smashing ours, also watch the Lions tour again, the Springboks only pushed us back when Phill Vickery and Mears were there, as soon as it was changed to the all Welsh one the Lions were in the driving seat, look I am not ggoing to get into a Holly Wilaboobie for tat over this, but like it or not Gethin Jenkings, Matthew Rees and Adam Jones were the first choice lions front row by the end of the tour, and will be there or ther abouts during the next one I should imagine. This was a decent debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction.

Ancient history, the Lions tour I'm afriad. A bit embarrassed that you brought it up, unless you've forgotten, we lost.

Over there in Wales you might go on tub thumping about "moral victories" or what-not, but here in the land of world cup winning legacies, only victory is treated as a success.

debate until miteyironpaw spoiled it again, I wish the mods would take him to one side as all he causes on here is friction

Please stop with the personal insults. Just as you don't agree with me, is not reason for me to be moderated. I refer you to Kiwireddevil's article on behaviour. I'm entitled to my opionion and I'm just expressing it. You are the one getting personal and upset. Suggest you wrap up.

mitey, you are being out of order on this forum, I suggest that you wind your neck in for a few minutes, you cannot come here questioning the ability of a side and claim that your side is far superior, then dismiss facts shown to you as being in the past, and you need to stop claiming this personal insult malarkey when you like, as I have not seen anybody say anything different to how you come across on this forum, I was having a good debate with people on here about the up and coming game and then you came on here dismissing the ability of the Welsh team and trying to persuade us about some hair brain scheme England have to beat Wales which you have no doubt concocted in your head, I have asked you to explain your views so perhaps I can understand you better but you just come back with arrogant quips and remarks, which with them, brings other posters like you onto here who just like looking for petty arguments, this is not the first thread you have ruined and it will probably will not be the last, but I an tell you this, I will not rise to your arrogant, single minded posts any more because I just come on here to talk rugby, but I will give you one last chance, why do you think this England side is so superior to the current Welsh one, and can you please back your answers up with a reason ?

I'm not out of order at all LordWhatever, I'm expressing my opinion in the face of rabid Welsh overconfidence. You are out of order in suggesting I should cow-tow and bow down to the eminent greatness of Wales destined for Grandslam glory or whatever over-egged folly you currently subscribe to. And please, why on earth must we tolerate personal insults from predominantly welsh posters calling us "arrogant" every time we are confident in our team's chances of winning? Why must Welsh fans have a monolpoly on confidence and exclusive rights to predicting a victory? You are the one who should his neck in.

GavinDragon wrote:ok thank you for clearing your position does come across as arrogant but at least it is a genuine position, let the best team win

Quite, Gavin. And good luck for the day.

lord he honestly believes that england are superior to us and that england will win comfortably let him think that, i for one think it could go either way and do not like how we are being hyped up for this one but thats just me, but i think its his genuine opinion an you cant argue with his opinion...even if the way he is putting it across is rubbing you up the wrong way....he reminds me of austin healy little bit

I did say several posts ago "let's agree to disagree and come back to this after the game".

I merely think that England have been keeping their powder dry due to the conditions and opposition and I think this proxy comparison approach of comparing results under different circumstances is misleading.

I think the potent English backline will come into play much more at Twickenham and from what I've seen from Wales so far, you won't be able to counter it. There are too many weaknesses in Wales at the moment, mostly your lineout is a giant achillies heel. You can't fix that - it's a selection issue. Change your selection, and you compromise your structure.

England will kick for the corners and territory, put pressure on the lineout and then attack with multiple phases within the Welsh 22, also using the driving lineout which has been used sparingly so far.

Wales will spend the entire game trying to attack from deep, or kicking the ball in field to our potent back three, who will cut you up as Scotland did but have the composure and skill to finish.

The obsession with the scrum is entirely an irrelevance whomever formed the Lions front row three years ago. This is product of the modern laws and debacle at the engagement. It's largely 50/50 in most games whoever has the best technical scrum.

Yes Gavin, I agree with you, but if he bothered reading through this article I have said that the two teams are evenly matched and home advantage should swing it, not once have I said that Wales will win the grand slam, and not once have I said that Wales will beat England. Also he still hasn't answered my question.

No, go ahead, talk about me in the third person as though I'm not here.

My opinion is a spanking for Wales, as I've said. That's my opinion. Not sure why you think my prediction has to match yours.

If you're bored of reading miteyironpaw's comments and can't help yourself just put him on ignore. That way you can choose whether to bother reading them.

And I've already told you Dowlais, Wales are going to win

Uh lads, wasn't there a bickering thread set up for this exact purpose? If it's full then by all means write another one, just if you're going to spend your day snapping at WUMs then it'd be time better spent on a banter thread than in open discussion.

I don't think the matter of who wants it more can be contemplated yet, it'll only become clear on the day, during the game. But that's not even necessarily the deciding factor.

I personally think it'll be a close exchange, possibly very cagey, a war of attrition. Wales need to keep patience and not start sweating if we haven't scored two or three tries by the 20-min mark but at the same time we need to exert the same pressure that saw us by Ireland and Scotland and keep the scoreboard ticking.

I think we're well capable. I think we'll win.

Cymru Am Byth

HammerofThunor wrote:If you're bored of reading miteyironpaw's comments and can't help yourself just put him on ignore. That way you can choose whether to bother reading them.

And I've already told you Dowlais, Wales are going to win

How arrogant of you.

How do you do that Hammer, I am not going to do it, but it would be nice to learn something new.

its not your opinion thats the problem its the way you justify it and your tone puts people up the wrong way, i thought you may have been a WUM but can see now your not its your opinion and your totally entitled to it but i am baffled by the way you come to it. But you have said that whoever wins will be the better team on the day im happy to not try and put you down for it. Im just telling my fellow compatriots to not get too wound up by you and let you state your opinion

What tone? It's text. How do you know what tone I'm speaking in? That makes no sense. I think LordoftheDance is getting upset because I won't say that Wales are a better team who may be robbed of actual victory but at worst will score a moral victory.

Ignore button ? Diolch

I think England will win Also my user name is LordDowlais.

Sorry, must have misread that as LordoftheDance, don't know why. Appologies.

So you think England will win, and yet you call me arrogant for saying England will win? I don't get it. Please explain.

I think England will win because both teams are evenly matched but home advantage will swing it, not because England have a far superior ability in every possible way.

Ok then, let's agree to disagree. And see what happens after the game. I've just been feeling a big score blow out coming on, and I'm pretty sure next weekend will be it.

I'll happily stick by my prediction and will be here for humble pie should I be wrong.

Good luck

My own personal opinion is that this game is to close to call 50/50.
It will in my opinion depend alot on who the teams are on the day, Wales last week had a few injuries to top players, will those players be ready for the game?

England have had a totaly different team since England last played(RUGBY WORLD CUP) They may not have set the world alight with their flash playing rugby, the conditions that they played did not allow for that, but they did manage to win 2 from 2.

Now it is a well known fact that every team always ups their game against England. Every team wants to beat England even if they dont beat any one else. England though will have to raise their game when they play Wales at twickenham.

If both teams put out a FULL strenght teams, then it could well be the game of the tournament.

Best of luck to both teams and may the best team win(England of course)

Does anyone really think there is one team who wants this one more than the other? To me that really is inconceivable.

This is the Six Nations.
England v. Wales (or Wales v. England if you prefer). That's all the motivation any player should ever need.
If any player is running at anything less than 100% pure desire, than he should be thrown off the Severn Bridge with concrete overshoes.

Both teams want this as much an any match they will ever play. To think otherwise is shocking. I hear the "who wants it more" stuff at a lot and I simply don't get it. And frankly, I think its wrong.

To me the team which will win is the team which is.........better.
Better coached, better prepared, better conditioned, perhaps with better players. But not who wants it more. These boys will give their all. Its silly to think otherwise.