wales are only great team when they win against australia, south africa,allblacks.

First topic message reminder :

Wales in my view good upcoming team but they need to beat Australia,south Africa,and new Zealand home and away. welsh people think they lose to south Africa, France, Australia twice then beat Ireland, Scotland and England there the worlds best.
when they play southern hemisphere sides, they lost game before they walk out on pitch there mentality needs to change.

The importance of IRB ratings as the seedings now is apparent,but one questions doing it nearly 4 years before the next one.Surely 2 years would be adequate for them.?

Cymroglan wrote:But don't England need to beat these sides again if they want to be considered great or is doing it years ago considered enough.?

Cymroglan, England beat Australia home and away on the last two meetings. What do you mean "years ago"? If Wales had done that you'd have two new national holidays and we wouldn't be able to think for the deafening sound of bleating.

miteyironpaw wrote:

Cymroglan wrote:But don't England need to beat these sides again if they want to be considered great or is doing it years ago considered enough.?

Cymroglan, England beat Australia home and away on the last two meetings. What do you mean "years ago"? If Wales had done that you'd have two new national holidays and we wouldn't be able to think for the deafening sound of bleating.

Nah,it's NZ we want...

Wales are far from a great side. They play some wonderful rugby and they are winning most of their games, even high tension ones like last weekend, through skill and endeavour.

They look the best team in the six nations at the moment but they have played two of the weaker teams, beat France and Italy and then they will be looking for the Australians in the summer, hoping for a series win.

I expect Wales to beat italy, I rate Italy as a decent opposition they are a good team.

France will be a huge test even though it's in Cardiff. The French and Irish are the two toughest opponents in this competition, they have the most ability, their players know each other well and they can both play superb rugby. We did well to beat Ireland, we will be doing exceptionally well if we can take the Grandslam.

I still am not convinced we will but as any rugby fan watching this tournament will tell you, we have a bloody good chance.

Australia will be tougher still, they have played this welsh team twice and won by a small margin. They will be in great form at home after the super 15.

Wales will hopefully take a first choice squad down there.

Personally I would be happy to see Wales at least get one win in oz.

Yeah but they don't play in the 6 nations. One thing at a time yeah?

maestegmafia wrote:Australia will be tougher still, they have played this welsh team twice and won by a small margin. They will be in great form at home after the super 15.

Maybe individually the blokes will be fit but combination wise we're usually pretty awful the first few games of the international season. That shambolic effort against Samoa last year springs to mind where we suddenly forgot how to catch and pass. As you say, the last few meeting have been close (a couple of late tries by Wales helped to 'closen' things a bit more) but the games were essentially pointless exercises to begin with. At least this time there's something at stake.

There's a long season of super 15 between now and then and we only need a handful of injuries before our team looks second rate. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wales take a game. Oh, and since we've finally got rid of Giteau we won't be handing out wins like we did against England the last time they were out here.

It is good to see South Africa is escaping the radar of the Welsh team. Perhaps they have also given up to beat us after getting so close on the last 3-4 occassions.

On a serious note, Maesteg is correct ( and there was no stats this time) Wales should see off Italy, the same as when France played Italy, they can compete at the breakdowns but Italy does not have the pace in their back line to stop North, Cuthbert, Halfpenny and Davies.

A lot will be learn't from the real form of France this coming weekend, they have the three toughest opponents left, and Ireland will be a stern test.

Wales will also be able to see what France does next weekend against a (resurgent?) English team.

It might be a tough match against france, but what Wales must do against Italy at home is amass 50 points, then if Fracne do lose any match from here on in, points difference will give them the trophy, and hey, they might still beat France and take the grandslam.

They certainly are in poll position.

Australia will be a different kettle of fish.

The last time Wales beat Australia was just after Deans took over and he then started to select a lot of youngsters.

There was no Will Genia, James O'Connor, David Pocock, Berrick Barnes, quade Cooper, so australia has moved on from then.

Although the last three encounters ended within 9, 3 and 6 points respectively, in each of those matches the game was effectively done and dusted with 10 minutes to go, only late scores by Wales in all three of those matches, belied the actual dominance of australia.

Wales have too moved on from there. They have a new look back line with roberts the only survivor, a new look back row.

So it is really an unknown quantity from when Wales last beat australia, except for those pescy little results in between then and June of this year.

Oz will also have a pacier albeit smaller backline than Wales so the backs battle will be interesting. Still think any teams best chances against Oz is in the front row.

I agree with you, Biltong, and are also able to do that in the absence of those evil statistics.

Obviously, I'd have to rate Wales with a terrific shot to win the 6 Nations.

Regarding playing Australia, I think the Wallabies are in a position somewhat similar to Wales, but one year further advanced. They blooded a number of young players who started to come into their own one year before Wales did. I think they are still finding their way a bit and are still developing. And, similarly, are still just a bit unsure if their out half is the real deal or is the right one. Should be a fun series.

Although Australia are vulnerable in the scrums, wales showed weakness in the line outs, so you would argue from an attacking perspectvie and the ability to win a ball at the back of a line out to use as an attacking platfrom, it could make a big difference and I would suggest advantage to the Wallabies.



See, not one statistic used there. Damn.

I still have this feeling that both Ireland and England will beat France but that they will turn up for the final match and deny Wales a GS.

I have absolutely no basis for this thoery, its just a feeling

doctor_grey wrote:I agree with you, Biltong, and are also able to do that in the absence of those evil statistics.

Doc, the true measure of a man is to have the innate ability to reason or debate with or without statistics.

Only the truely knowledgeable of technical aspects, the nous of attacking play and a deep seated ability to analyse and combine the two, will master the art of intellectual debate.

ps. As an Afrikanes I used some complex grammar in this piece(trying to impress the hell out of you) and might have incorrectly used the English Language.

Your use of polysyllabics is impressive, young Jedi.
However, you used the word 'nous' and 'intellectual' in the same sentence. Not sure the significance, but we will have to keep an eye on you.

By the way, don't tell anyone, but I enjoy stats from time to time. Usually in the middle of the night, like it is now. I know its a terrible vice, and I keep it from my wife, kids, and neighbors. Oh, the shame if they found out...........

If your wife is anything like mine, she would be impressed just to see figures and graphs.

biltongbek wrote:

If your wife is anything like mine, she would be impressed just to see figures and graphs.

Wow, really?

Yep, not a numbers person.

My wife actually had a finance background. But for some reason made a clean break from the number side of life since then.

biltongbek wrote:Yep, not a numbers person.

So you can lie to her about averages then

Nope, I first have to explain what average means.

You've got it made then biltong

I am just joking, but my wife doesn't care about sport, so no matter what match statistics, records or any history I supply her, she gets that glassy expression in her eyes and changes the subject to something else.

biltongbek wrote:.....no matter what match statistics, records or any history I supply her, she gets that glassy expression in her eyes and changes the subject to something else.

Our spouses are related, then.

Mine has'nt a clue either which is fine until she starts asking me bucket loads of questions during important moments

So Doc, your wife also has her own TV?

Not exactly, but she takes over mine though.

eirebilly wrote:Mine has'nt a clue either which is fine until she starts asking me bucket loads of questions during important moments

Not just that, with my boy now playing cricket, my wife still calls "runs", points.

and I have explained that to her a number of times, the concept of ODI's vs Tests are just not sinking in.

Most famous questions asked during sporting season.

Her "134/7 that is bad isnt it?"
Me " No, not really because they are only chasing 135."
her " Huh?"

First innings during a cricket match. no matter the score.

Her "who is leading?"
Me ' No one, it is the first innings"
Her "huh?"

Bless them, they havent a clue but then i have no idea about her interests as well so it evens itself out.

Best thing i ever did was get a second TV

Biltong,
I swear I must have had that exact same discussion with my wife, numerous times. I could have heard mine and her voices as I read what you typed. Doesn't get the idea of leaving the radio or tv on when a match is going, just so I can come in the room, take a quick peek or listen and get on with my business.

Billy, I agree, TVs should be sold in pairs. The pronlem is still that my wife will come into the room where I am sitting and turn on what she likes. Whichever room I am in.

Doc, that is where rules must be established.

I set up my whole system in my house the way it works for me.

Between 6-8 every evening we will watch television as a family.

Unless there is sport. Then everyone goes to their own televisions and watch their stuff.

I tolerate no interference when it comes to sport, apart from the odd question which leaves them pondering my answer for a day or two.

Perhaps you should knock a Lion out with an uppercut and then turn around to your family explaining to them the consequences of interfering with your sport.

I need you to come over and explaing things. If I tried to put my foot down, I'd probably need to ask permission first.

Actually, all my kids are pretty good when it comes to tv. And my lads will watch the sport, so there is no problem there. It really is just my wife.

By the way, I love the notion of knocking out the lion. I would have to go to the zoo to do that.

But, here in New Jersey we do have black bear wandering through the yard from time to time. Will that work?

Absolutely, in fact standing toe to toe with a bear at full reach would open up nicely for the uppercut.

I will let you know how I do..............

Gotta sleep for a bit now. I got in from work at 1:00 this morning, my time. Its almost 3:00 now and I have to be back in at 6:00. Was so keyed up when I got in I couldn't sleep. Even put the Blues-Chiefs match on.

Have a good nights rest, doc, thanks for the chat.

My wife quite likes rugby - knows the diff between a ruck and a maul. In fact she plays and watches a fair bit of sport. cricket eludes her but not bad for a Chinese girl. too bad she hates cleaning

nganboy wrote:My wife quite likes rugby - knows the diff between a ruck and a maul. In fact she plays and watches a fair bit of sport. cricket eludes her but not bad for a Chinese girl. too bad she hates cleaning

You can't have it all mate.

Its just as well women cant operate the internet or they might get offended by some of this.

nganboy wrote:My wife quite likes rugby - knows the diff between a ruck and a maul. In fact she plays and watches a fair bit of sport. cricket eludes her but not bad for a Chinese girl. too bad she hates cleaning

Maybe she just picked up the final bad habit from looking at men. Avoid cleaning by pretending to like sport.

"Sorry, love - can't clean out the garage this weekend, I'll be watching the Supertrucks Slalom Championships on Sky before heading out to KBLC Heineken WilkinsonSword Egg and Spoon Final."

Are you kidding, 'er in doors can shop on the Internet in two languages. Doing so right now in fact

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Its just as well women cant operate the internet or they might get offended by some of this.

I read these posts to my wife over breakfast this morning, she nearly fell of a chair from enjoyment.

doctor_grey wrote:I will let you know how I do..............

Gotta sleep for a bit now. I got in from work at 1:00 this morning, my time. Its almost 3:00 now and I have to be back in at 6:00. Was so keyed up when I got in I couldn't sleep. Even put the Blues-Chiefs match on.

How good was Nanai-Williams? I wonder if he has any Grandparents we should know about.

He's looked good for a couple of years now but not much chance of going any further in NZ

Full Credit wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Australia will be tougher still, they have played this welsh team twice and won by a small margin. They will be in great form at home after the super 15.

Maybe individually the blokes will be fit but combination wise we're usually pretty awful the first few games of the international season. That shambolic effort against Samoa last year springs to mind where we suddenly forgot how to catch and pass. As you say, the last few meeting have been close (a couple of late tries by Wales helped to 'closen' things a bit more) but the games were essentially pointless exercises to begin with. At least this time there's something at stake.

There's a long season of super 15 between now and then and we only need a handful of injuries before our team looks second rate. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wales take a game. Oh, and since we've finally got rid of Giteau we won't be handing out wins like we did against England the last time they were out here.

Ha ha ha,

I imagine a stern test even if the wallabies take a few games to get up to pace.

Wales will likely be struggling with injuries as the players have barely had a week or two off rugby in 24 months.

Why does it always come back to an Eng v Wales debate?

England don't pretend to be great anymore, but on are day we can compete with anyone and always will, move on guys!

Wales talk the talk but they need to start walking the walk, and that means consistent wins against SH teams, plus the BIG one they really need to beat the All Blacks.

As do England HERSH. It´s been a while. Or SA.

It´s all very well to say on our day we can compete with anyone and always will but that day was 10 years ago so the always will is being stretched a little thin.

Well Kia, Wales (as they keep telling us) are the best team in the world at the moment (on their day), so if England can be a poor referees call away from beating them, then that is "competing" in my book, and so assuming Wales would simply wipe the floor with everyone else, it puts England in pretty good stock.

Would say the bok's side of 95 could be class great. Took a while for them to lose a game, plus having a RWC in their pocket.

Wallabies of 99 and England of 2003 were great sides. I can't think of the kiwis as having a great side, they're just up there all the bleeding time, winning too many games!!!

HERSH wrote:Why does it always come back to an Eng v Wales debate?

England don't pretend to be great anymore, but on are day we can compete with anyone and always will, move on guys!

Wales talk the talk but they need to start walking the walk, and that means consistent wins against SH teams, plus the BIG one they really need to beat the All Blacks.

Brilliant! 'On our day England can beat anyone'. Heard that line somewhere before, but can't quite put my finger on it.........!

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:As do England HERSH. It´s been a while. Or SA.

It´s all very well to say on our day we can compete with anyone and always will but that day was 10 years ago so the always will is being stretched a little thin.

It hasn't always been that way at all. England had a period of ten years where they had some exceptionally talented players and could compete with the top teams. Before that they rarely did anything of note for thirty years.


All the NH teams always struggle against the SH who have a better youth system, better organised fixture list and have lead the way in every development in the game from coaching to professionalism.

In the North we are all just playing catch up.

Drawing with them rather than beating them mate.

Anyway just engaging in some banter with our good friend HERSH. Don´t take seriously what I´m saying.

Which leads me to you OzT!

All those sides were great you mention. Including the NZ ones.