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Are Wales currently better than England at rugby?

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Glas a du
Morgannwg
Super D Boon
offload
mckay1402
maestegmafia
Impossible Standards
Portnoy
miteyironpaw
rodders
Triangulation
ChequeredJersey
Chunky Norwich
Luckless Pedestrian
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler
eirebilly
Biltong
englandglory4ever
Taffineastbourne
Knowsit17
dummy_half
SecretFly
kiakahaaotearoa
TycroesOsprey
majesticimperialman
idris
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Are Wales better than England at rugby?

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Post by idris Wed 29 Feb 2012 - 19:42

First topic message reminder :

There are a million threads at the moment ranging from topics such as:

"It was a try"
"It wasn't a try"
"England are rebuilding"
"Wales will only be good if they can beat the SH teams"

A lot of these points myself and other Welsh posters agree with. Wales still have a long way to go in this championship, but at least for now, we can be very happy that Wales are better than England at rugby.

A cave dwelling nation of about 4,000 people who only learned to play rugby in 1962 and lost but all it's industry 3 decades ago. It feels great.

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Post by SecretFly Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 13:19

ChequeredJersey wrote:
SecretFly wrote:Respects to both sides...but us outsiders saw stalemate and a draw would have suited as a conclusion.

Of course you would. it would deny either side the slam!

Well now nobody ever called me dumb, correct. I was hoping for a draw for clearly selfish reason of course - you thought I'd deny it?

But I didn't say I was a neutral - none of us are in these games, no matter how we protest the latter. I was an outsider, and I still state clearly that Wales didn't deserve a loss but neither did England. A draw would have been perhaps the fairest result this 6N has had so far if it had occured! Wink

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Post by Biltong Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 13:19

maestegmafia wrote:Ha ha ha...! Well those are the stats and facts. Wales are a better team than 12 mo this ago. England appear to not be so good.
Wink
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 13:25

Triangulation wrote:I think you'll find that England actually completed more passes than Wales did. I think we were attacking you more/more effectively than you were attacking us.

How effectively can you have attacked us if you only amassed twelve points?

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Post by mckay1402 Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 13:27

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
luckless_pedestrian wrote:
Triangulation wrote:In many respects England were the better side.

Which respects were those?

Starter for 10 :

Lawes managed to put your center away with an offload, something Roberts had failed to do all game.

This is by far the best comment I've seen on the match so far. Well done you
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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 13:56

Yep - without Roberts or Lawes available for Wales, I wonder how they will find the linking play to score against Italy?
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Post by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 14:14

Maybe Wales could select Bergamsco at Italian Scrum Half? Hes a great provider of try scoring opportunities.

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Post by offload Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 14:46

I think you're forgetting Strettles contribution - he couldn't have held that ball up a second longer. I have him on the right with North on the left.
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Post by maestegmafia Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 14:49

luckless_pedestrian wrote:
Triangulation wrote:I think you'll find that England actually completed more passes than Wales did. I think we were attacking you more/more effectively than you were attacking us.

How effectively can you have attacked us if you only amassed twelve points?

Not just in the Wales match, England have failed to conjure any more than a lucky charge down in three games.

They have the worst attack of the tournament, the worst record for converting attacks into tries. They were very lucky to win the first two games, and you would need to construct a very objective article to convince anyone that they stand a chance against ireland, who are as good as Wales at the moment, or France in Paris.

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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 14:49

It's looking like they'll also be without Barnes or Walsh and I just wonder if they'll be able to stem the flow of quick ball to the opposition without them?
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Post by offload Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 14:54

miteyironpaw wrote:It's looking like they'll also be without Barnes or Walsh and I just wonder if they'll be able to stem the flow of quick ball to the opposition without them?

Mitty your on a roll. Laugh
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Post by TycroesOsprey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:09

Triangulation wrote:In many respects England were the better side.

but your living in the land of insania which is ruled by Mr Mad and his dad, Madder than Mad McMad. Wales munched your scrum, had more territory, more posession, made more linebreaks, made less erorrs, won more rucks, conceded less penalties, beat more defenders scored more tries oh and won the match. Thats playing badly with 14 men, a fruitcake at 10 and a dysfunctional lineout. thumbsup

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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:12

TO, "made fewer errors", rather than "made less errors".

thumbsup
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Post by TycroesOsprey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:20

miteyironpaw wrote:TO, "made fewer errors", rather than "made less errors".

thumbsup

Doh thumbsup

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Post by offload Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:22

miteyironpaw wrote:TO, "made fewer errors", rather than "made less errors".

thumbsup

I thought we were the better team when we made less errors. Now I know that we made fewer errors too I can't believe it was so close. Wink
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Post by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:30

So youre saying that England had better tactics and better players, but made a few errors in execution which cost them the game?

I guess on their day they could beat anyone then.

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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:35

We certainly gave them a good scare, eh PSW? They weren't expecting that.

We so very nearly won it.

I think I wasn't alone in that most England fans so this game as a huge positive.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:39

Mitey, if by 'they' you mean the Welsh team, then actually yes, they were expecting a tough game at Twickenham. Only a fool would have expected anything less.

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Post by mckay1402 Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:46

I don't mind admitting that I thought it would be much easier for Wales than that.
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Post by Super D Boon Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:47

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Other related threads:

Is red the new black? Is white the new black?

Which stadium is better? Twickers or Lenners?

Is Wales at their best better than England at their best?

Is Wales at their worst better than England at their worst?

Which song gets you more pumped? Swing Low? Bread of Heaven?
In answer to your question Wales is better but it´s very close.


You know this is what bugs me. Swing Low isn't even an English song, it spawns from America. It's an old folk song sung by black people in the early 20th centurey. What the feck is that to do with England? Typical, you can't write any decent songs of your own so you have to steal someone elses!

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Post by Triangulation Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 15:54

Flower of Scotland was written....

by an Englishman.

And all the welsh used to be gingers.....but we did so much canoodling with welsh women that we turned ginger hair into darker hair...so if that's a fact tell me am i lying?

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Post by Guest Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:05

Have you noticed how things have changed since last Saturday?

Straight after the game, England fans were saying it was a game that they nearly won - could have won - bitterly disappointed to have lost. Fair enough.

But now the myth is well and truly established - it was a game in which England were the 'moral victors' - the 'real' winners despite the score-board. Apparently, it's France who'll give England the 'real' test as Wales did not.

I think the French probably feel that it's Wales who will give them the 'real' test - away in Cardiff.

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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:06

optimist wrote:Have you noticed how things have changed since last Saturday?

Straight after the game, England fans were saying it was a game that they nearly won - could have won - bitterly disappointed to have lost. Fair enough.

But now the myth is well and truly established - it was a game in which England were the 'moral victors' - the 'real' winners despite the score-board. Apparently, it's France who'll give England the 'real' test as Wales did not.

I think the French probably feel that it's Wales who will give them the 'real' test - away in Cardiff.

Frustrating isn't it optimist? laughing
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Post by Guest Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:12

miteyironpaw wrote:
optimist wrote:Have you noticed how things have changed since last Saturday?

Straight after the game, England fans were saying it was a game that they nearly won - could have won - bitterly disappointed to have lost. Fair enough.

But now the myth is well and truly established - it was a game in which England were the 'moral victors' - the 'real' winners despite the score-board. Apparently, it's France who'll give England the 'real' test as Wales did not.

I think the French probably feel that it's Wales who will give them the 'real' test - away in Cardiff.

Frustrating isn't it optimist? laughing

Not so much frustrating as mildly amusing.

To misquote the All Blacks skipper, Graham Mourie, after they beat Wales in 1978 : "You never beat England, you just score more points than them".

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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:18

It's rare for we England fans optimist, and it's something we learned from our neighbours in Wales, who are undefeated in 100 years of rugby.
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Post by Triangulation Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:21

I'm not sure that i have seen any evidence of so called moral victories being claimed on here.

Certainly not by me.

What i have said several times is - Well done Wales you deserved your win. You were the better team on the day. What i have also said is - we'll get you next time!

If you do look at the stats (for what it is worth) i think Tycroes did earlier on. They are remarkably even. Much like our head to head actually 56-55 with 12 draws. Its incredible!! Must be the closest rivalry in any sport in history over such a period of time and over so many matches.

In fact i challenge anyone in the world to better our rivalry statistically speaking.

But i digress. The stats are even and my overall impression of the match through my red rose spectacles admittedly was that we were hammering on the door pretty loudly certainly by the end in spite of wales vaunted fitness. Wales had the better of the opening 15 minutes and after that it was pretty damned even.


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Post by majesticimperialman Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:24

optimist wrote:
miteyironpaw wrote:
optimist wrote:Have you noticed how things have changed since last Saturday?

Straight after the game, England fans were saying it was a game that they nearly won - could have won - bitterly disappointed to have lost. Fair enough.

But now the myth is well and truly established - it was a game in which England were the 'moral victors' - the 'real' winners despite the score-board. Apparently, it's France who'll give England the 'real' test as Wales did not.

I think the French probably feel that it's Wales who will give them the 'real' test - away in Cardiff.

Frustrating isn't it optimist? laughing

Not so much frustrating as mildly amusing.

To misquote the All Blacks skipper, Graham Mourie, after they beat Wales in 1978 : "You never beat England, you just score more points than them".

Yes that is true.

But the post says are Wales a better team than England?

Well at the moment they are.

They did beat England at Twickenham. And they are for the first time in a long time above England in the IRB world rankins.

So what is every bodys problem? It is no use saying what if this had happend, or what if that had happend. The Fact is that it did not Happen how "MANY ENGLISH FANS" inclding myself, wished it to happen.

England lost. end of.

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Post by Guest Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:29

miteyironpaw wrote:It's rare for we England fans optimist, and it's something we learned from our neighbours in Wales, who are undefeated in 100 years of rugby.

Not quite true. I remember an English mate in 1962 saying "Come on England, teach 'em how to play rugby" and they did. Wales were well-beaten, and he's still a mate.

Maybe over 100 years Wales has learned some good habits from England whilst England has picked up bad habits from us! Smile

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Post by Morgannwg Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:32

Oh dear. I think the five delusional Englishmen that voted NO need to step forward. It's time to be hung, drawn and quartered.
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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:34

Morgannwg wrote:Oh dear. I think the five delusional Englishmen that voted NO need to step forward. It's time to be hung, drawn and quartered.

Possibly they didn't want to play along with the "I desperately need positive reinforcement" game that a few of the Welsh posters here are playing?

"Stop discussing the game, and just tell us how good we are!...squeeak, squeeeeeeak".

Tiresome.
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Post by Triangulation Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:35

Amazing isnt it. 90+ % agreeement in the poll and still the wels carp on!

Smile

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Post by majesticimperialman Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:35

Morgannwg wrote:Oh dear. I think the five delusional Englishmen that voted NO need to step forward. It's time to be hung, drawn and quartered.

Name and shame them, thats what i say.

Right Morgannwg. thumbsup

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Post by ChequeredJersey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:37

Morgannwg wrote:Oh dear. I think the five delusional Englishmen that voted NO need to step forward. It's time to be hung, drawn and quartered.

I'd suggest they were not all English and were mostly people who realised that the whole point of this thread was to be smug and deliberately disagreed with the premise of it out of what I belive is called "conscienscious objection"
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Post by Morgannwg Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:38

Indeeed, name and shame. Then hang, draw and quarter.
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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:40

Morgannwg wrote:Indeeed, name and shame. Then hang, draw and quarter.

So now anyone who doesn't pay homage to the great invicible Wales should be punishable by gruesome tortuous death? Crikey, lucky you guys never really win anything.

And you had the gaul to call us arrogant for merely producing a bit of a premature video.


Last edited by miteyironpaw on Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:40; edited 1 time in total
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Post by ChequeredJersey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:40

Morgannwg wrote:Indeeed, name and shame. Then hang, draw and quarter.

Are we allowed to do that? Isn't that only done for High Treason, such as regicide?
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Post by Glas a du Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:46

I read that the first time as Hugh.

Doh

Poor Hugh.
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Post by miteyironpaw Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:47

I think it's fair to say at the moment Wales are more effective at taking their chances.

England need to find a way to turn the kind of dominance they displayed last weekend in all facets of play into points.

Even if the referee is having a bad day.
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Post by Glas a du Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 16:48

clap

That's one of the better posts I've read today.
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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 17:39

Super D Boon wrote:You know this is what bugs me. Swing Low isn't even an English song, it spawns from America. It's an old folk song sung by black people in the early 20th centurey. What the feck is that to do with England?

You might not want to know why England fans started singing it.

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Post by mystiroakey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 17:42

yes you are better 'currently'

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Post by english warrior Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:09

Oh dear, dear , dear me Wales, the Bubble is rising and expanding and eventually all that hot air has got to burst, and when it does, we won't remind you 'Principality dwellers' what a load of 'Fools Gold ' this Welsh side is. Lower in the rankings than England, 4th last year and 4th overall average in 6 nations, with a very lucky WC campaign thrown in and , Alacazam!!! Wales are top 3 material. No you aren't and never will be.


Ride your Luck and B.S. all you like, but the Welsh are the only people taking it in! thumbsup

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Post by thebluesmancometh Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:15

Wales are above England in the rankings though.

I'm going to ride our luck, BS, wave of euphoria, or even delusion all the way to a GS, if that's ok with you.

In exactly 9 days I'm going to write to Nike to see if they will start printing Wales GS 2012 shirts.

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Post by mystiroakey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:23

why wait 9 days?

why not just get them printed now, and whilst your at it why not get one that reads wales are above england in the rankings.

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Post by thebluesmancometh Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:24

I thought after last year it was customery to wait until round 4 until GS shirst were asked to be printed?

I do have one where a Dragon is taking a wee on a Bulldog censored

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Post by kiakahaaotearoa Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:25

The trick is to do what the Scottish did. Don´t put the year. Then when you do win, they´ll be collector´s items and you´ll be able to sell them for a fortune.

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Post by beshocked Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:25

Currently, Yes. Will it last though?

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Post by mystiroakey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:28

lol. naughty boy!

but why would a welsh dragon urine on a 'british' bulldog!!!!

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Post by mystiroakey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:29

urine- huh did i say that Are Wales currently better than England at rugby? - Page 2 848982

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Post by thebluesmancometh Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:37

I did ask that too, but since the Bulldog is wearing a white shirt with a George cross I thought it would do a job, that way I could wear it for any sport...

EVEN BADMINTON!

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Are Wales currently better than England at rugby? - Page 2 Empty Re: Are Wales currently better than England at rugby?

Post by mystiroakey Thu 1 Mar 2012 - 19:41

ok lol- just had my 3 lions beat up a dragon thread taken down- not surprised.

but anyway- fact is whilst playing skrim earlier- 3 lions randonly attacked a dragon and ripped it to shreads- i thought everyone on here should know about it! tis all.

so therefore even though your dragon is better than a bulldog- it isnt better than 3 lions so Are Wales currently better than England at rugby? - Page 2 2115032417

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Are Wales currently better than England at rugby? - Page 2 Empty Re: Are Wales currently better than England at rugby?

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