Mid year internationals - what are the hopes and expectations

This is taken from a Wiki page, I hope its accurate. These are the upcoming fixtures.
Mid-Year international matches/tours -

England -
Play the Baabaa's at Twickenham, 2 SA Baabaa sides and 3 tests against SA
I'm excited about this tour, a young squad. We could get hammered or we could win 1 or 2 tests - either way, if we can show development from the 6N then it will be a worthwhile tour, especially if we can find out about some of these youngsters. With a massive squad this could almost be a development tour.

Wales -
Play Baabaa's at home, 3 tests against Oz, and ACT Brumbies
I feel that Wales must win in Oz. Players and fans shouldnt expect anything less than a series win. No major injuries, they are going out there with a lot of expectation.

Ireland -
Play Baabaa's at home, 3 tests against NZ
This is a really tough tour with no mid week games to develop youngsters. If Ireland can win 1 test it will be a successful tour. Will DK take out the strongest side? Could be a tour from hell but I hope not.

Scotland -
Play OZ, New South Wales Tahas, Cook Islands, Fiji, Samoa,
4 test matches for the Scots, should have at least 3 wins there. Will Fiji and Samoa have their stongest sides? I hope so. Scots need to put in a really good performance against OZ in order to climb back up the IRB rankings.

France -
2 tests against Argentina
A real rivalry there, should be a very good match. Scots won the series last season, France should be aiming to do the same.
Argentina will be gearing up for their inclusion in the revamped 4 nations competition.

Italy -
Play USA, Canada, Argentina
Replacement fixtures for the Churchill cup teams. Italy should do well in N.America and the Italy v Argentina match will be very interesting. I'm hoping this will be televised.

Whats your thoughts and expectations on the upcoming matches?

For us (Wales) then a win against the Baa Baas is a must, no excuses and likewise the Brumbies.

In addition I hope we can win at least one of the tests (happy if more) against Australia

Morning Bedford.
I'm surprised, I would think that most Wales fans would be expecting a series win. I think if I were in a similar position with a similar squad that would be mine. GS winners, a very strong and settled squad with no major injuries and a real chance to break into the top 4 IRB rankings - Wales should really go for it, even if Gatland doesnt travel!

England- Win both mid week games and give plenty of fringe players a go. Win at least one test against the Boks, seeing as we can't even beat them at Twickers one win away from home would be massive. We should be aiming to build a little depth and getting the backs on form too.

Scots tour is interesting, will the Cook Islands game be televised? I hope it is! Could be a little bit of this...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhyxfmoSxOA

My expectations are pretty low for Ireland to be honest.

The provinces are on fire but the National side and set up is a shambles right now and can't see that changing in time for the tour, or indeed ever under Kidney and Smal.

Maybe the lower expectation might bring out the best in the side after a disasterous 6N but this is the worst Ireland side I've seen in 12 seasons.

3-0 to the Allblacks and probably a loss to the Baa-baas too.

Wales I would expect to win at least 1 game but I think England and France may struggle.

Wales do have some major injuries, No Roberts possibly no JD2 (thats the mid field gone already) Sam Warburton and the head coach is also out of the tour.

I think The welsh are hoping they can win one out of the three test against Aus.

England SA in my mind is the hardest to predict IMO. SL has a big decision to make on who plays at FH either Farrell or Flood. England have also lost Croft and Lawes in the Pack. SA have lost a few keys players since the world cup to retirement and to Japan and also have a big choice to make at FH. If England pick flood and manage to get some front foot ball i can see them winning one or two of the tests. If they pick Farrell I cannot see them being able to beat SA at 10 man rugby.

As for Ireland I would be surprised if they manages to win any of their tests against the AB's. I feel the AB's are much stronger in too many departments even without Kanio and Thorn i think they will win physical battle and once NZ get front foot ball it is only a matter of time before they score a try.

Wow - good clip Yappy.
I do hope that all the games are televised - I dont know who has the rights though.
England games will probably be on SKY maybe with the mid week fixtures on Sky extra or online.

I would hope that BBC would pick up the Wales and Scots games.

If Samoa can field their strongest side then would love to see more of this -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suRPW4bqTKQ

Sorry ieuan- wasnt aware that Roberts and JD2 were possibly out.
Scott Williams is good cover for one of those though. And Ryan Jones seems to be motoring again.
It will be a tough ask for any NH teams to get a win in the SH, but I think Wales have the best chance of the lot.

Scrum should be a real weapon for Wales - it was worth 3 penalty tries when England toured there last.

It's okay its all most impossible to keep up with rugby injuries these days. Scott Williams is also a doubt with a shoulder injury.

The scrum will be a weapon but Australia seem to do very well even if they scrum is going backwards. They completely go against the old saying of forwards win you the game, the backs determine by how much.

The breakdown is going to be the key if Wales can nullify Pocock then i think they can win the series but if he is allowed to turn the ball over Wales will get hammered.


England i think have got the best chance of winning a series for the NH, even with the injuries. SA are going to be a team in flux first test match since the world cup with a new coach, whereas SL has has a 5 test head start to build a squad and some team spirit. England have a talented back line capable of scoring tries from anywhere on the pitch and if the pick a Flood I think they can win

My hope is some younger players who have shown more willingness to attack with greater variaty, my expectation is mre of the same interspersed with some game time for a few of the younger generation.

Either way I expect a close enough series.

I would like to say I am confident that we will beat england in all three tests, but the preparation time is virtually negated for Meyer, and hence I doubt there will be any exciting stuff from the springboks.

ieuan wrote:England i think have got the best chance of winning a series for the NH, even with the injuries. SA are going to be a team in flux first test match since the world cup with a new coach, whereas SL has has a 5 test head start to build a squad and some team spirit. England have a talented back line capable of scoring tries from anywhere on the pitch and if the pick a Flood I think they can win

I really don't see it happening. You talk about this potent England backline but they didn't score too many tries in the Six Nations. Their best performance was in Paris but you can expect the 'Boks to be much tougher defensively than France were that day.

bedfordwelsh wrote:For us (Wales) then a win against the Baa Baas is a must, no excuses and likewise the Brumbies.

In addition I hope we can win at least one of the tests (happy if more) against Australia

+1

propdavid_london wrote:Morning Bedford.
I'm surprised, I would think that most Wales fans would be expecting a series win. I think if I were in a similar position with a similar squad that would be mine. GS winners, a very strong and settled squad with no major injuries and a real chance to break into the top 4 IRB rankings - Wales should really go for it, even if Gatland doesnt travel!

Prop,

I would love a series win but was taking into our account that we still have poor record against the SH sides especually in their own back yard

bedfordwelsh wrote:For us (Wales) then a win against the Baa Baas is a must, no excuses and likewise the Brumbies.

In addition I hope we can win at least one of the tests (happy if more) against Australia

Didn't realise the Brumbies were on the card.
This is interesting. At the time of this match the brumbies will no doubt be in a position where they may need to win sxv matches to qualify top of their conference. That means they could give this game away a little more easily than theyd like too.

But like Munster, who often have a better record against touring teams (the AB's for e.g) the Brumbies will be one well conditioned unit in terms of team combinations, accuracy and just general all round cohesion. A tight knit group thats been playing tough matches since Feb.

And Jake White will certainly want another international scalp.

For these reasons my opinion is of all the matches, this is the most likely Oz win. Wales wont field their strongest and part of it will be whether the Brumbies do depending on their sxv situation.

Would have loved to see the Crusaders playing Ireland!

bedfordwelsh wrote:

propdavid_london wrote:Morning Bedford.
I'm surprised, I would think that most Wales fans would be expecting a series win. I think if I were in a similar position with a similar squad that would be mine. GS winners, a very strong and settled squad with no major injuries and a real chance to break into the top 4 IRB rankings - Wales should really go for it, even if Gatland doesnt travel!

Prop,

I would love a series win but was taking into our account that we still have poor record against the SH sides especually in their own back yard

I agree but times have to change, Wales is changing and really learning how they will fit in the future of modern rugby. Strong academies and a focus on the National team makes us competitive in the NH, constant improvement ill make us competitive in the south too.

Good news is that JD2 is likely to be fit, and Gatland will be there in a back seat role.

Being realistic I will not be happy if we lose to the Baabaas, or the Brumbies. I think one win would show that we are improving, and still have a way to go.

I think the worst case scenario would be a series win, as we still have room for a lot of improvement, and I think we would, as a nation (maybe not he players) get too cocky and be lined up for a painful fall.

No, the worst case scenario would be a series whitewash with heavy defeats in all three Tests. I'd prefer us to come home overconfident and 'lined up for a painful fall' than to come back completely demoralised having already fallen.

Luckless - yeah I see your point, but for some reason I can deal with the being down due to a loss far more than I can deal with the over-optimisum of international-only fans when we scrape a win.

Oh, we'd be nailed-on certs for the next World Cup if we sneak a series win against the Wallabies, no question. But that over-optimism is a small price to pay for actually having the series win!

I think it should be a close series. I have faith that Wales aren't going to Australia without a hope in Hells chance, they stand a good chance.

But that said this is still a very youthful side with a long way to go before they reach their potential. They show good promise and are winning most of their games.

I respect the Wallabies though and any win Wales get over there, even if some Wallaby stars are injured will be a huge bonus for Wales.

I would like to see all NH teams do well this summer. England made better progress in the 6ns under Stuart Lancaster thean i thought they would.
Would like to see a good performance from England against SA.

Wales although a bit like England a young team, they have been together as a team longer the than England. So should be a beable to give Australia a tough game.

Ireland in New Zealand? that is going to be a tough, tough game.

Are Ireland even looking for a backs coach? Or is our defence coach going to keep covering two jobs? And is Smal back or is it Foley still coaching the forwards? I haven't heard.

It really is a bit of a shambles.

The only positive in this situation is that it looks like the IRFU might be letting Kidney run out his time and will allow a new man to make his own appointments.

Scotland - hope? Robinson gathers some integrity and resigns

Expectations - he will continue with his Poopie selections and we will continue to be Poopie

TJ wrote:Scotland - hope? Robinson gathers some integrity and resigns

Expectations - he will continue with his Poopie selections and we will continue to be Poopie

All appears ver similar to the intrinsic problems faced during his tenure with the RFU.

Scotland:

A. Hopes

1. Tim Visser continues to score an explicable bucketload of tries, making something out of nothing every time he touches the ball.

2. All of the deadwood (Scotland fans know who that is) is left at home.

3. Scotland develop a midfield that is creative and actually works - Matt Scott, NDL, Ansbro, Dunbar, MEvans and possibly even Bennett if he can put the rusk down and stop watching Barney the Dinosaur long enough to get on the plane - should all realise that this is their chance.

4. AR stops playing Barclay at tighthead, scrum half and wherever else he happens to choose by throwing darts at a series of playing cards marked with positions.

5. Scott Johnson turns out to be a valuable and LISTENED to member of the coaching staff, helping AR realise that he is an appalling selector.

6. AR will not mess around with 10 and put Laidlaw in at the start with Weir on the bench.

B. Expectations

1. Gregor Townsend will bring out his first coaching manual: "Why Scoring Tries Doesn't Matter: A Defensive Approach To Attack".

2. Robinson will take Kellock and actually play him.

3. Robinson will agree with Sean Lineen that Hogg should be wasted as a centre.

4. Three wins at least. Or we're really in the doo-doo.

5. Robinson will bring on Rooray J to miss a pressure kick at the last moment.

GC and TJ +1 in every respect.

Absolutely no excuses permitted for this tour. Assuming the Aussies put out a second string side, we MUST win every game. No more "positives" to be taken from defeat. I don't care if we make a million linebreaks and complete more passes in one game than Gregan and Larkham combined in their careers, if we don't win I don't care.

I also hope that AR doesn't dress this up as some experimental tour thus giving himself some pre-determined excuse for failing. It shouldn't be an experimental tour, it should be all about winning. The young crop coming through just so happen to be the best players. Picking Welsh, Harley, Denton, Scott and Hogg is not an experiment, it is picking the best players available. Were we playing the World Cup final tomorrow those are the players I'd pick to give us the best chance, not Jacobsen, Strokosch, Barclay (at 8), Morrison and Rory Lamont. Experience comes a distant third to ability and form.

Predicted win margins for New Zealand v Ireland:

First Test: New Zealand by 40+ points

Second Test: New Zealand by 50+ points

Third Test: New Zealand by 30+ points


Predicted win margins for South Africa v England:

First Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Second Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Third Test: South Africa by 15 points



Predicted win margins for Australia v Wales:

First Test: Australia by 15 points

Second Test: Australia by 20 points

Third Test: Australia by 10 points

BeachBoy2012 wrote:Predicted win margins for New Zealand v Ireland:

First Test: New Zealand by 40+ points

Second Test: New Zealand by 50+ points

Third Test: New Zealand by 30+ points


Predicted win margins for South Africa v England:

First Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Second Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Third Test: South Africa by 15 points



Predicted win margins for Australia v Wales:

First Test: Australia by 15 points

Second Test: Australia by 20 points

Third Test: Australia by 10 points

Not "Picking up Good Vibrations" there?

There is no way all 3 series will be white washes in that manner.

I agree geoff - BeachBoy is having a bad day I suspet!

Realistically there is a good chance of 1 or 2 test wins for Wales.
1 test win for England is not impossible, series win would be amazing.
I can't see Ireland winning a test though, although that is more of a reflection on the AB's rather than Ireland. (I dont think that England or Wales would fare much better in New Zealand).
Scotts should expect to beat all the island teams and mid week fixtures. Cant see them turning over Oz though, unless they put out a weak side.

You think it will be worse Geoff? Maybe!

I am having a bad day actually. Anyway I stand by my predicitons. I hope we can have a conversation on here after the three tours!

BeachBoy2012 wrote:You think it will be worse Geoff? Maybe!

I am having a bad day actually. Anyway I stand by my predicitons. I hope we can have a conversation on here after the three tours!

That sounds like a good time to plug the 606v2 Summer Tours prediction pool on SportGuru. It's free and handy for bragging rights (as a rule, if you beat BathBTGOG you're doing well). Just click here:

http://www.sportguru.co.uk/summertours/pool.asp?p=10017058

Pool name: 606v2
Pool code: grubskua

maestegmafia wrote:

BeachBoy2012 wrote:Predicted win margins for New Zealand v Ireland:

First Test: New Zealand by 40+ points

Second Test: New Zealand by 50+ points

Third Test: New Zealand by 30+ points


Predicted win margins for South Africa v England:

First Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Second Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Third Test: South Africa by 15 points



Predicted win margins for Australia v Wales:

First Test: Australia by 15 points

Second Test: Australia by 20 points

Third Test: Australia by 10 points

Not "Picking up Good Vibrations" there?

Guess you are all a generation too young for that joke then...?

maestegmafia wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

BeachBoy2012 wrote:Predicted win margins for New Zealand v Ireland:

First Test: New Zealand by 40+ points

Second Test: New Zealand by 50+ points

Third Test: New Zealand by 30+ points


Predicted win margins for South Africa v England:

First Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Second Test: South Africa by 30+ points

Third Test: South Africa by 15 points



Predicted win margins for Australia v Wales:

First Test: Australia by 15 points

Second Test: Australia by 20 points

Third Test: Australia by 10 points

Not "Picking up Good Vibrations" there?

Guess you are all a generation too young for that joke then...?

Nah, it just wasn't funny.

maest, need to try harder

ieuan wrote:
England i think have got the best chance of winning a series for the NH, even with the injuries. SA are going to be a team in flux first test match since the world cup with a new coach, whereas SL has has a 5 test head start to build a squad and some team spirit. England have a talented back line capable of scoring tries from anywhere on the pitch and if the pick a Flood I think they can win

Yes i totally see this English side with such a remarkable backline scoring from their own 22 against the Springboks at Ellis Park You conveniently left out the part where England didnt score many tries in the 6Nations ,in fact they were as dour as is traditional for English teams.And just because Chris ashton scores from his own 22 against the aussies 2 years ago does not mean England have the capability of doing it at will jee

OzT wrote:maest, need to try harder

Note taken

Ha ha ha...!

[

propdavid_london wrote:I agree geoff - BeachBoy is having a bad day I suspet!

Realistically there is a good chance of 1 or 2 test wins for Wales.
1 test win for England is not impossible, series win would be amazing.
I can't see Ireland winning a test though, although that is more of a reflection on the AB's rather than Ireland. (I dont think that England or Wales would fare much better in New Zealand).
Scotts should expect to beat all the island teams and mid week fixtures. Cant see them turning over Oz though, unless they put out a weak side.

He might be having a bad day, but his predictions are more likely than yours. What basis is there for predicting English and Welsh success in the SH (we will leave Ireland out of this as that series could be a nightmare for them). Wales have been beaten comfortably by Aus twice in the past 6 months, once at home and other neutral. Why would that change because we won a GS in which a very ordinary England side pushed us all the way.

If something happens to Adam all this talk of beating up the Aus scrum is just nonsense. When he was injured in the WC Aus had the better of us at scrum time. We have done well in the last 12 months and are clearly twice the side we were at this time last year, but winning in Aus, I think not. Not yet anyway.

How exactly are England going to beat SA. They have no offensive threat, so unless they plan to convert 7 or 8 penalties every game, I just don't see how they will accumulate enough points to win a match. They won't get hammered but they will come up short.

So Mr BeachBum may end up being right, even with the scores, because one thing the SH boys do very well is beat you up if they get a chance. Any fall off in concentration or committment could well end up in a hiding for all our sides.

Hope I'm wrong, but that's how it looks to me

I GUARANTEE that at least 1 NH team will come within 10 points of defeat in at least one game of the 9, and a win is possible.

The claim is that that will not occur.

geoff999rugby wrote:I GUARANTEE that at least 1 NH team will come within 10 points of defeat in at least one game of the 9

You mean a "moral victory" is on the cards? You can usually rely on Scotland to get one of those, to go with several pants down beastings.

Dragonbreath - fantastic contribution.

You would say that he agrees with you !!

Yeah but he did call me Mr BeachBum!

BeachBoy2012 wrote:Yeah but he did call me Mr BeachBum!

Whoops genuine error

BeachBoy2012 wrote:Yeah but he did call me Mr BeachBum!

Whoops genuine error

If I were being 100% impartial I'd expect South Africa to come out with a series win, but I hope we can overturn them, and it is certainly not impossible.

Our last away tour to the Southern Hemisphere (not including the World Cup) was where we picked up a 1-1 series draw in Australia, winning 1 midweek game and drawing the other one. For me the midweek games are scant consolations if you get stuffed in the main series, the test series against South Africa is my sole focus.

I've got to feel that England need to win something meaningful and tangible. A real feel good feeling when we won against Australia in 2010, but that was tempered by how awful we were in the first test. AIs 2010 and having lost to NZ we picked up a good win against Australia before putting in a poor showing against SA, to leave us no better than okay.

2011 Six Nations we managed to win, but fell at the last Grand Slam hurdle. We had a decent time of it in the WC warm-ups, especially the win in Dublin, but then the World Cup was painfully average before going out with a whimper against France.

This year we had a decent Six Nations, but again we didn't win. We need something that is better than the average-to-decent showings we've put in in the last 5/6 series. If we lose 2-1 it will be another average return and we won't have moved forward at all. I hope for a series win, because nothing else will show progress.

No worries Dragonbreath, it made me laugh!

Robbo - I'd expect 3 heavy defeats if I were you. Save yourself some dissapointment.

BeachBoy2012 wrote:No worries Dragonbreath, it made me laugh!

Robbo - I'd expect 3 heavy defeats if I were you. Save yourself some dissapointment.

Even if I did expect 3 heavy defeats, I wouldn't be able to help hoping for more.